Monk should it be "Nerfed" ?

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Originally Posted by MaelleRiou

Buffing the jobs that are behind wouldn't really do that since there's enough jobs already doing that level of DPS. If it was like, just monk and black mage up at the top and everyone else was around the same then nerfing would make more sense.

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Except it was only those two, and DRG who were dominating. Now NIN joined the party while five other jobs remain at the absolute bottom and Samurai wonders what it will take to actually get meaningful buffs.

I say yes but still buff other jobs. Atm MNK is too OP as it shouldn't be pulling higher numbers then BLM.

Imo the order of highest to lowest should be as followed.

BLM, SAM, MCH, DRG, MONK, SMN, BRD, RDM, NIN, DNC

And idk if this is good but I feel like there should only be a 100 point difference between each job.

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Originally Posted by Reilyn

1: People care about it because it's doing too much damage for what it brings to the group outside of its own damage.
2: Job DPS should never be balanced around something as subjective as complexity. That line of thinking will have you justifying RDMs remaining where they are; unwanted.
3: SAM mobility isn't earning it preferential treatment when there's a job that does more dps, and buffs others to do more dps. You really think people making statics sit there thinking "I want a SAM for the group instead of the MNK because it has a backstep"?

We get it. You're clutching pearls, but can you not make such assertions with silly arguments, or that reek of the feeling like you're owed this?

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DPS should never be balnced around complexity? Really? so i guess NIN and SMN are A okay and everyone is just exagerating, right? They are not complaining about having to press 50+ buttons (and doing mecahincs) do less DPS that a class that has to press 2, nah that is just an exageration.

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Originally Posted by AvenoMatt

I say yes but still buff other jobs. Atm MNK is too OP as it shouldn't be pulling higher numbers then BLM.

Imo the order of highest to lowest should be as followed.

BLM, SAM, MCH, DRG, MONK, SMN, BRD, RDM, NIN, DNC

And idk if this is good but I feel like there should only be a 100 point difference between each job.

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Ok why should DRG by higher than MNK?

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Except it was only those two, and DRG who were dominating. Now NIN joined the party while five other jobs remain at the absolute bottom and Samurai wonders what it will take to actually get meaningful buffs.

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Hey, you know what other class said that for 2 expansions? MNK huh...how peculiar is to be on the other side for once....

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Originally Posted by reyre

DPS should never be balnced around complexity? Really? so i guess NIN and SMN are A okay and everyone is just exagerating, right? They are not complaining about having to press 50+ buttons (and doing mecahincs) do less DPS that a class that has to press 2, nah that is just an exageration.

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Ninjas and Summoners are complaining because they're contributions were/are incredibly lackluster. It doesn't matter how complex or not the jobs are if they feel like garbage. Balancing around complexity just leads to the same issues we're already seeing. Case in point, Samurai. It is arguably the easiest DPS in the game yet also one of the least popular in Savage. Why? Dragoon and Monk utterly demolish it rDPS wise. And it isn't like either are significantly harder to figure out. One might argue Dragoon is just as easy.

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Originally Posted by reyre

Hey, you know what other class said that for 2 expansions? MNK huh...how peculiar is to be on the other side for once....

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And? You don't make a job overpowered to compensate for bad design.

Unless content was somehow always meant to be tuned around 4x a seemingly overpowered class, yes, it would have to be nerfed for us to have job balance without also having power creep.

Monk deserves a sensible, intuitive, cohesive, and balanced kit. At present it has none of those things.

Edit: To be clear, it doesn't matter a bit what MNK's pDPS is or that it's competing with BLM at present, only that its (and BLM's) rDPS are so above all but DRG's. With the new buffs, SAM and NIN may close the gap with the top 3, but that still leaves half the roster as second-class jobs. It's best that we just pick a target rDPS and bring jobs up or down to that point, with only faint nudges based on other significant attractors such as Verraise, to that rather than arguing on a basis of "rDPS-heavy" vs. "selfish" classes. The distinction between the two is absolutely irrelevant to balance. Only their rDPS, i.e. their total contribution or how much they bring to a given fight, actually matters.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Ninjas and Summoners are complaining because they're contributions were/are incredibly lackluster. It doesn't matter how complex or not the jobs are if they feel like garbage. Balancing around complexity just leads to the same issues we're already seeing. Case in point, Samurai. It is arguably the easiest DPS in the game yet also one of the least popular in Savage. Why? Dragoon and Monk utterly demolish it rDPS wise. And it isn't like either are significantly harder to figure out. One might argue Dragoon is just as easy.



And? You don't make a job overpowered to compensate for bad design.

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Dragoon is a lot more complex than monk is to play currently.Sure the rotation may seem simple enough.But there is a lot to the timing and lining up buffs and high end use of the likes of elusive jump to maximize dps potential.Dragoon is massivly punishing for making a single mistake in rotation or having jump animations delay combos ever so slightly if timed wrong which can have a snowball effect.
Monk is currently just easy mode especially with so much of a crutch for hitting positionals with the 2 charges of true north that regenerate so fast.It's doing way too much damage for minimum effort.

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Originally Posted by reyre

Ok why should DRG by higher than MNK?

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MNK as Brotherhood on a 90s cooldown that may only boost physical dmg by 5% but it's a straight up dmg boost compared to Battle Litany that is only 10% crit chance boost which also has double the recast time of 180s.

MNK also has Mantra which though isn't a dps buff it buffs healing by 20% and is on a 90s cooldown. Drug's other buff may be a dmg buff of 5% but it only effects one other party member and is on a 120s cooldown. MNK buffs are more frequent and reliable while one of DRG's only helps with crit rng and the other only boosts on party member both of which have long cooldowns.

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Originally Posted by Metalwrath

Dragoon is a lot more complex than monk is to play currently.Sure the rotation may seem simple enough.But there is a lot to the timing and lining up buffs and high end use of the likes of elusive jump to maximize dps potential.Dragoon is massivly punishing for making a single mistake in rotation or having jump animations delay combos ever so slightly if timed wrong which can have a snowball effect.
Monk is currently just easy mode especially with so much of a crutch for hitting positionals with the 2 charges of true north that regenerate so fast.It's doing way too much damage for minimum effort.

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Like I, and others said before, I don't care about the effort it takes to play a MNK.

I care that its existence in its current form creates the perception that SAM is a redundant discount MNK, and isn't a priority when a number of people are seeking players for groups.

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Originally Posted by reyre

Hey, you know what other class said that for 2 expansions? MNK huh...how peculiar is to be on the other side for once....

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Another pearl clutcher who feels like MNK is owed this.