[Housing] 1 House Per Service Account. 1 FC Per Service Account.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

Actually not on Materia, i left around 6 months ago after wasting 9 months of my life in that dead datacenter.

Currently playing on NA servers and it is a major issue when somebody can just buy up 300 houses and use them for the sole purpose of making 999m/month.

The server i currently play on is having multiple people buy out wards to themselves using the 16 service account trick. (Allowing them to purchase 60 houses per server with 16 accounts, there was a long post about how to do it a while back).

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Do you realize that 16 service accounts costs $210 dollars a month? If they can afford 210 dollars a month hats off to ya. I live on Materia and we are not dead. There are ques waiting lines at 3am honey.

FC houses should be taxed weeky with the FC currency.
A normal active FC should not have a problem to earn enough for their house while the shell FCs not.

They would have to start to use bots and that would increase the chance of getting banned.

Any sort of player number or activity requirements is putting small family FCs that may have some people not playing all the time out in the cold. Not everyone just wants to be a number in a large FC. Others are looking for a more laid back style and someplace that will be there when they occasionally log in instead of kicking them because they're overly concerned about numbers. I don't know what SE could do at this point without hurting some legitimate players and it's pretty bad that so many of you are okay with doing that.

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Originally Posted by Curisu

FC houses should be taxed weeky with the FC currency.
A normal active FC should not have a problem to earn enough for their house while the shell FCs not.

They would have to start to use bots and that would increase the chance of getting banned.

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This.

A single player, playing (Actually playing, not just logging in and afking) for a few hours a day can easily generate 300-400k company seals a week by themselves.

If having a requirement of 1m/month is too much of a burden for somebody to upkeep, then I'm sorry but you don't really play the game to begin with.

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Originally Posted by sagacious

Do you realize that 16 service accounts costs $210 dollars a month? If they can afford 210 dollars a month hats off to ya. I live on Materia and we are not dead. There are ques waiting lines at 3am honey.

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People do. One is on Gilgamesh. I wish I had that sort of disposable income because it certainly wouldn't be going to 16 service accounts per month lol.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

If having a requirement of 1m/month is too much of a burden for somebody to upkeep, then I'm sorry but you don't really play the game to begin with.

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As I replied earlier which you ignored, that would leave 109 fcs with a house on my server while the rest would be deleted including two of my former fcs with more than 100 members. Not to mention the fcs based around a minority language or a niche.

Tell me, how many company credits does one get from savage prog? What about ex trials and unreal? New 24 man raid? Criterion? I guess those are not "playing the game".

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

Actually not on Materia, i left around 6 months ago after wasting 9 months of my life in that dead datacenter.

Currently playing on NA servers and it is a major issue when somebody can just buy up 300 houses and use them for the sole purpose of making 999m/month.

The server i currently play on is having multiple people buy out wards to themselves using the 16 service account trick. (Allowing them to purchase 60 houses per server with 16 accounts, there was a long post about how to do it a while back).

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Pretty sure I've seen you in the Dynamis PF, are you talking about there?

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Originally Posted by Reinha

As I replied earlier which you ignored, that would leave 109 fcs with a house on my server while the rest would be deleted including two of my former fcs with more than 100 members. Not to mention the fcs based around a minority language or a niche.

Tell me, how many company credits does one get from savage prog? What about ex trials and unreal? New 24 man raid? Criterion? I guess those are not "playing the game".

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They're simply out to turn the game into a job. It's not the first time they've voiced this. Not many people have been on board with that idea though.

Any reqs that force people to log in to complete a quota is ridiculous. Let's not turn the FC system into one that forces expectations on their members like a credit quota or a gil quota, that's how they become jobs. People want to play the game, not stress over meaningless tasks.

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

They're simply out to turn the game into a job. It's not the first time they've voiced this. Not many people have been on board with that idea though.

Any reqs that force people to log in to complete a quota is ridiculous. Let's not turn the FC system into one that forces expectations on their members like a credit quota or a gil quota, that's how they become jobs. People want to play the game, not stress over meaningless tasks.

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Its a disgusting idea and shows they don't care if innocent players get caught in the cross fire.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

Its a disgusting idea and shows they don't care if innocent players get caught in the cross fire.

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To them you're only an FC deserving of a large if you have 500 people active at a time funneling millions of credits into it. Everyone else can stuff themselves into smalls and be happy about it.

/s but its not untrue lol

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

Its a disgusting idea and shows they don't care if innocent players get caught in the cross fire.

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Not going to happen. The extent to which some people will go to try and remove houses from people. Relative to the abuse why should those following the rules have to pay a price because of those who don't. SE needs to deal with the problem but hurting innocents who follow them isn't the solution.

Every service account is entitled to whatever that account brings. What SE needs to do is to stop the abuse of one service account buying/owning 8 FC's per server by limiting it to one FC per account period. They've done it with personals and need to do it with FC's. Hurting others isn't the solution.

Just also throwing out that Dynamis still has like 13000 houses across all the servers. If OP is worried about the housing there then maybe help encourage more people to join instead of trying to set quotas that RMT/bots will still be able to fill regardless due to the size of their wallets.

If anyone still really wants a house and be able to acquire one with no trouble, come on over lol. We got plenty of room.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

SQE need to flat out restrict what people can own per service account.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

People that own Multi FCs/Personals should be made to choose ONE of each

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

Remove the ability for people to own hundreds of houses.

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I can sign up for 50 subscriptions, pay for 50 subscriptions and under your terms, still be allowed to own in excess of 3 wards with my one FC, one personal house per subscription.

For something remotely able to cut this problem, one house per human being, validated per government issued ID during subscription set up. Or how else would you know this isn't another sub from the same person?

Then think about it for a split second: would SqE brace the legal ramifications of asking everyone, under aged included, for their IDs? Would SqE be willing to store a massive trove of PII in the age of data breaching being as profitable as ever? Would SqE be willing to lower their profits by not letting same human being to pay multiple times for all benefits of one subscription? If your answer was "no" to any of these three, then you know this is a lost cause.

And yes, I understand everyone's frustration.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Every service account is entitled to whatever that account brings. What SE needs to do is to stop the abuse of one service account buying/owning 8 FC's per server by limiting it to one FC per account period. They've done it with personals and need to do it with FC's. Hurting others isn't the solution.

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But how? They already head it off at the actual acquisition point, far as I'm aware, no? The trouble is that does nothing about the other main way that one would get 8 FC's per server, i.e., by having another service account (or friend) who doesn't have FC land purchase the house, and then pass FC Master over to the hoarder.

Even if you lock that out, FC succession could be gamed in order to pass the house on to someone otherwise ineligible and I'm not sure how that could be limited without risking real FCs losing their homes over time (particularly in RP heavy FCs where alts are much more common), either because there is no eligible successor with that limitation, or because the only eligible successors are untrusted low-rank members who could suddenly gain control over the house.

Unless you're going to forbid people with alts from having characters in multiple housed FCs at all - which is what some people initially thought these restrictions meant when they were first put together in 4.2.

But I think the two of us in particular know how dire even the thought of such a restriction being implemented could be. It had effects even then and the memories are still sad even now.

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

To them you're only an FC deserving of a large if you have 500 people active at a time funneling millions of credits into it. Everyone else can stuff themselves into smalls and be happy about it.

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To be fair, my own FC could easily afford the 1m/month, and we're not that big; we've got a core of about 40 active-ish players currently, of whom I'd say about 20 are on more or less daily and doing stuff.

But I also know a lot of FCs that are much smaller, where they're like 6-7 active folks. And while they could honestly probably afford a 1m/month tax on housing ownership when everyone's active, that would require them to be active always... not the "well, we're in the content lull, I'll log on to do a roulette or two with friends this week and check on some stuff, but otherwise I'll go get caught up in that other MMO I play / catch up on my Steam single-player backlog / whatever" behavior that many of us engage in.

And an FC losing a house is a problem, because an FC must own a house in order to have access to the company workshop.

This is why I've said before that I think we should do away with FCs having housing in the wards; when an FC hits a certain rank, give them an instanced airship. You can build inside the airship (housing interior) and have an 'outside' garden on the top deck. You can have the company workshop on board, and have personal rooms on the airship for FC members. This way, no FC is getting locked out of the company workshop crafts or the submersibles.

If the FC is dead, the airship is not getting instanced (so isn't eating up a slot on the instance servers). If it's a shell FC... well, it's still not eating up space on the instance servers unless someone from the shell FC is logged in and teleported there. And then there's no way to engage in trickery and get more than one house in a housing ward by using shell FCs.

Something like that doesn't solve the problem of housing availability, but it makes it moderately less terrible... and it's probably more feasible than having fully instanced housing (e.g. doing away with the ward system) would be, on a "technical limitations of these servers" level.

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Originally Posted by HQuest

I can sign up for 50 subscriptions, pay for 50 subscriptions and under your terms, still be allowed to own in excess of 3 wards with my one FC, one personal house per subscription.

For something remotely able to cut this problem, one house per human being, validated per government issued ID during subscription set up. Or how else would you know this isn't another sub from the same person?

Then think about it for a split second: would SqE brace the legal ramifications of asking everyone, under aged included, for their IDs? Would SqE be willing to store a massive trove of PII in the age of data breaching being as profitable as ever? Would SqE be willing to lower their profits by not letting same human being to pay multiple times for all benefits of one subscription? If your answer was "no" to any of these three, then you know this is a lost cause.

And yes, I understand everyone's frustration.

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If you are going to spend 50 subscriptions a month just to deny other players from having a ward then I don't think the system should prevent that. It should prevent people from owning a whole ward or a significant number of houses on a single subscription. if you want to spend 600 USD a month on denying houses from other players then I guess no one can stop you.

TBH I'd suggested in the past an option to purchase a private airship from the Ironworks as a method of doing instanced housing while adding a gil sink to the game as players would start with an initial purchase of the base airship then pay ironworks for various upgrades and modifications.

@OP

I can't agree with this, SE should do something about RMT and bots but there's no need to punish legit players.

1 house and 1 FC house per server is fine.

RMTs must abuse the fact that one character per server can own up to 2 properties total (private/FC), so if we can have 40 characters under a standard subscription RMTs could have up to 80 properties total but that is everyone's right.

What SE should do is scrutinize suspicious accounts that make too much gil taking into consideration how long they play, no human can play 24/7 without rest.

I like the sound of one house or apartment and one FC but sadly unless they add proper instance housing or wards that you build with friends FC only its never gonna go away.

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Originally Posted by SigmaOZ

@OP

I can't agree with this, SE should do something about RMT and bots but there's no need to punish legit players.

1 house and 1 FC house per server is fine.

RMTs must abuse the fact that one character per server can own up to 2 properties total (private/FC), so if we can have 40 characters under a standard subscription RMTs could have up to 80 properties total but that is everyone's right.

What SE should do is scrutinize suspicious accounts that make too much gil taking into consideration how long they play, no human can play 24/7 without rest.

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It doesn't have to be punishment. Give players the gil price they paid for the extra plots back, and let them choose one to keep.

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Originally Posted by Raim

It doesn't have to be punishment. Give players the gil price they paid for the extra plots back, and let them choose one to keep.

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This would be more than fair, in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by Raim

It doesn't have to be punishment. Give players the gil price they paid for the extra plots back, and let them choose one to keep.

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Or they keep what they have and you take one of the hundred houses that are available but that are not "good enough" because it's goblet or empyreum.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Or they keep what they have and you take one of the hundred houses that are available but that are not "good enough" because it's goblet or empyreum.

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He's on Balmung, there are probably 0 houses left lol.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Or they keep what they have and you take one of the hundred houses that are available but that are not "good enough" because it's goblet or empyreum.

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My server has over 220 plots in personal/mixed wards in goblet ALONE, including some mediums and larges lmao
I think for most servers supply should no longer be a problem. Everyone can have something if they're not picky, but alas...

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Originally Posted by Raim

It doesn't have to be punishment. Give players the gil price they paid for the extra plots back, and let them choose one to keep.

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Under what rules? A personal and an FC per account? Why should people with a character with an FC on Aether not be allowed to start an FC on Dynamis, for instance? They're completely separate Data Centers.

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Originally Posted by ameliaw

My server has over 220 plots in personal/mixed wards in goblet ALONE, including some mediums and larges lmao
I think for most servers supply should no longer be a problem. Everyone can have something if they're not picky, but alas...

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You clearly haven't been on other servers then.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

You clearly haven't been on other servers then.

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It's the same situation all over Primal.

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Originally Posted by ameliaw

It's the same situation all over Primal.

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There's more than just Primal. I'm also skeptical that there are mediums and larges everywhere. There certainly won't be after the next round of bidding.

I have a question.

If I have my own personal house in, say, Twintania.

But I have a house on, say, Zalera. For Roleplaying purposes.

One is my personal house, which I decorate for myself, for my friends, to Gpose and stuff. But the other one, in a different datacenter, is a public venue for people to roleplay on. And I don't mean the "AFK while listening to music" thing, I mean actual roleplaying xD

Would you guys consider I had to choose one or the other? One is my own personal house, same as what you guys want. The other is made to be for an alt whose purpose is to roleplay, and whose space is open to the public for you guys to partake and interact.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

I have a question.

If I have my own personal house in, say, Twintania.

But I have a house on, say, Zalera. For Roleplaying purposes.

One is my personal house, which I decorate for myself, for my friends, to Gpose and stuff. But the other one, in a different datacenter, is a public venue for people to roleplay on. And I don't mean the "AFK while listening to music" thing, I mean actual roleplaying xD

Would you guys consider I had to choose one or the other? One is my own personal house, same as what you guys want. The other is made to be for an alt whose purpose is to roleplay, and whose space is open to the public for you guys to partake and interact.

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I wouldn't consider that an abuse of the system or blatant greed over a limited resource. It's others who gobble up 4-5+ houses at a time that I think are an issue.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

There's more than just Primal. I'm also skeptical that there are mediums and larges everywhere. There certainly won't be after the next round of bidding.

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Feel free to create an alt and check out. I'll also check other DCs later - I doubt that the miraculous abundance of small houses is exclusive to Primal and Dynamis.

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Originally Posted by ameliaw

Feel free to create an alt and check out. I'll also check other DCs later - I doubt that the miraculous abundance of small houses is exclusive to Primal and Dynamis.

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They will be gone too in short order once the mediums/larges are fully gone since that will be all that's left. Just because there's some open now, doesn't mean they will stay that way. Not with how the lottery works. A lot of what remains now are plots freed up from relocations. Mediums and larges are the most desirable plots. Smalls are consolation prizes. It was the same with Ishgard housing. Mediums and larges were the first to go, and then the following lotteries saw all the smalls get bought up.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

I wouldn't consider that an abuse of the system or blatant greed over a limited resource. It's others who gobble up 4-5+ houses at a time that I think are an issue.

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See, that's what I assume, and I understand the need for this thread. There is a supply and demand issue, and there are issues with the systems that have been put in place.

But if it obviously will be limited to 1 personal and 1 FC house, then yeah, it's going to be a bit more nuanced.

I don't own a venue house on NA, mind you. But I do want to in order to participate with RPing and make it a bit more believable (I want to roleplay as a fortune teller Astrologian, so the house would be an observatory\place of work). And I know several people are in such a situation.

But if that can be construed as an abuse of the system, then naturally I'll relent.

If it were all up to me:

-One house per account
-Those who currently own multiple plots will face an extremely high property tax that basically forces them to relinquish all but one house.
-Larges are FC only
-Additional large plots will be added to each ward
-Private owners who currently own a large will face an extremely high property tax, but can downgrade to a medium or small, and be refunded 80% of the difference
-FCs who own multiple plots will face an extremely high property tax on each plot owned, and FC privileges will be suspended until they relinquish all but one house of their choosing
-Auto demolish will never again be suspended
-Players who currently own just one small or medium on their account will not face a property tax
-FCs who currently do not own a plot will be given priority on larges. FC will need to have been established for at least 90 days
-Players who do not own a plot and have not been in a FC for 90 days will get priority in lotteries
-Relocation suspended during lotteries. Players and FCs who own plots cannot participate in lotteries
-Relocation will resume the week following a lottery. Assuming there are open plots for them to relocate to.
-Relocation will require FCs/players to purchase another building permit.
-All furnishings from relinquished homes can be recovered from the residential caretaker after the lottery ends. For convenience, the items will be segregated by furnishing category.
-50% of original cost of relinquished plots will be refunded.

I know some of these are quite harsh. Especially for owners of multiple plots. That's the price to be paid for greed. I do not abide by players not being subjected to these rules in previous days, and it has everything to do with making the system fair for everyone whether you're a current owner, or not. If you had a shred of common courtesy, compassion for your fellow subscriber, and decency, then these new rules do not affect you whatsoever.

*gavel slams*

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Originally Posted by Gemina

If it were all up to me:

-One house per account
-Those who currently own multiple plots will face an extremely high property tax that basically forces them to relinquish all but one house.
-Larges are FC only
-Additional large plots will be added to each ward
-Private owners who currently own a large will face an extremely high property tax, but can downgrade to a medium or small, and be refunded 80% of the difference
-FCs who own multiple plots will face an extremely high property tax on each plot owned, and FC privileges will be suspended until they relinquish all but one house of their choosing
-Auto demolish will never again be suspended
-Players who currently own just one small or medium on their account will not face a property tax
-FCs who currently do not own a plot will be given priority on larges. FC will need to have been established for at least 90 days
-Players who do not own a plot and have not been in a FC for 90 days will get priority in lotteries
-Relocation suspended during lotteries. Players and FCs who own plots cannot participate in lotteries
-Relocation will resume the week following a lottery. Assuming there are open plots for them to relocate to.
-Relocation will require FCs/players to purchase another building permit.
-All furnishings from relinquished homes can be recovered from the residential caretaker after the lottery ends. For convenience, the items will be segregated by furnishing category.
-50% of original cost of relinquished plots will be refunded.

I know some of these are quite harsh. Especially for owners of multiple plots. That's the price to be paid for greed. I do not abide by players not being subjected to these rules in previous days, and it has everything to do with making the system fair for everyone whether you're a current owner, or not. If you had a shred of common courtesy, compassion for your fellow subscriber, and decency, then these new rules do not affect you whatsoever.

*gavel slams*

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I can generally agree with some of these, but the main thing I absolutely do not agree with is implementing a priority system that excludes players just because they're in an FC. That's an unnecessary penalty for someone who might not even have any say in the FC house outside of their own small personal room in the FC house.

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Originally Posted by Zebraoracle

I can generally agree with some of these, but the main thing I absolutely do not agree with is implementing a priority system that excludes players just because they're in an FC. That's an unnecessary penalty for someone who might not even have any say in the FC house outside of their own small personal room in the FC house.

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I completely understand where you are coming from, and I considered that before posting. However, I kept it intact because they still do have access to their own personal room within the FC house. Players who do not have an FC or personal plot currently don't have access to anything. As such, I have given these players top priority in the lottery.

Instead of making large plots FC only and adding more large plots to wards which would result in the layout having to be redesigned why not create FC wards that only have large plots and a new size above large that would look more like a shopping district rather than a residential zone?

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Instead of making large plots FC only and adding more large plots to wards which would result in the layout having to be redesigned why not create FC wards that only have large plots and a new size above large that would look more like a shopping district rather than a residential zone?

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There is an element of unfairness there since the FCs that do not own any plots would get first dibs at the XX large plots in the new zones. However, I would not oppose placing all larges in FC only wards. That might even be necessary.

Honestly, if Square put Aetheryte Plazas in every housing district and made sure a marketboard, repair NPC, and maybe a poetics exchange and even old content vendors were all within close proximity, I wonder if YoshiP would get these "living neighborhoods" he imagines are real.

I think the point should be focused on RMT.
Why would any gil bot owners make such stupid mistake such as naming their FC with similar names? It's a huge flag for SE to investigate on.

If it's just a weird person who wants to own a whole neighborhood, SE could just contact the person and let them choose which one to keep.

I don't think putting more and more conditions for owning a house will get rid of RMT bots or solve the problem. It'll just limit players who can own a house.
I'm a legit player who doesn't care to do all contents to the current patch. I log in to enjoy the game and do what I want, not to be restricted like IRL. Sure, I can enjoy the game without a house, but more available contents mean more ways of having fun.