Please don't harass people for ignoring/disliking the story

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Not really. You just come across as bizarrely defensive in response to someone exercising their right to post here, in all honesty. You're not "calling" anything out. You're just complaining about the fact that he posted an opinion you disliked, and not entirely unprompted, but also not in a thread where it's off topic. Let's not kid ourselves here as to what's going on here.

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Wtf are you even talking about? Are you just going out of your way to misinterpret what I say as a reason to get angry?

Y'all can have this conversation lol

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Originally Posted by Striker44

We both know he's not telling it "like it is."

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In the bizarro fantasy world of your construction, perhaps, but in reality? Sorry, nope.

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Heck, around here it's effectively the opposite - say you actually like the story (or anything about this game) and watch the little cabal of negativity go to town. Case in point - when IS came out there were the usual posters with the whole "IS is terrible" threads. There was onethread from someone talking about what they enjoyed about it - and within the first several comments were several someones (I won't name names, but notably present in this thread, too) either straight-up going after them or passive-aggressively saying they were "wrong" for liking it. They're so bitter they can't even stand the thought of someone else being happy. It's sad, really.

Frankly, there's only two cases I see where people get criticized for commenting negatively on the story here. One was already taken care of by the OP - the people who skip the story and then complain about it. The second is people who act as if they're the arbiters of what is "good" and "bad," rather than just offering an opinion on something. They tend to directly and personally attack the dev team (and other players who are having a good time), and when it comes down to it, it basically amounts to a very immature "they didn't write the story I wanted, therefore it's bad" philosophy. So yes, it's a natural human response when you (a proverbial "you," not you personally) effectively harass people by claiming they're wrong for enjoying something, to get flak in return.

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Yes yes, let me load up your usual script: the forum is unlike reddit - usually a cesspit of negativity btw (source: striker), - Twitter, youtube comments, blah blah blah, that all just wub wub wub the game and don't accept any negative comment (totally not cult-like in that respect, but anyway), we are just grains of sand against the striker majority tidal wave tsunami of righteousness.

If you're referring to threads that pretend to be positive but then insert not-so-subtle digs at people critical of various aspects of the game and that is challenged? It's not really a cabal of negativity. Nonetheless, I was specifically addressing comments that try to justify harassing story skippers. I do find it silly if they try comment on the story in spite of skipping it, but equally that ignorance makes it all the easier to shrug it off - much like specious claims about "majorities".

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Originally Posted by Knot_D

> "My love will be forever with yours, my dearest children."
> VENAT HATES EVERYONE BUT HERSELF!

cherrypicking.jpg

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Well yeah, you are cherrypicking. Plenty of people do bad things to others claiming it's out of love for them. Narcissistic mothers are a thing, after all.

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

One needn't watch the cutscenes to understand the story. There are any number of lore repositories available at this time, many of which provide ample proof of accuracy. Is it better to watch them? Yes, but choosing not to does not automatically disqualify someone from the conversation.

The above aside, while I will agree with you on the point of people needing to know what they're talking about before trying to tear the story to shreds, more than a few of the people coming out against it do know what they are talking about.

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As I said, it provides no shortage of amusement to me that the people typically bellowing "omg cutscene skipper!" tend to be some of the most ignorant on matters of the story and usually just narrate back to me some garbled interpretation of said story, laced with their own headcanon.

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Originally Posted by Knot_D

> "My love will be forever with yours, my dearest children."
> VENAT HATES EVERYONE BUT HERSELF!

cherrypicking.jpg

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#venatdidnothingwrong

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Well yeah, you are cherrypicking. Plenty of people do bad things to others claiming it's out of love for them. Narcissistic mothers are a thing, after all.

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Yep. Each to their own, people can like who they like and all that though it is bizarre when the very same poster who has called people 'psychopaths' for wanting character deaths and consequences in the game's story then goes on to endlessly praise one of the characters with the highest kill count in the setting. Some consistency would be nice, though throughout all of history many have been led astray by a pretty face and vague promises of 'love'.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Yep. Each to their own, people can like who they like and all that though it is bizarre when the very same poster who has called people 'psychopaths' for wanting character deaths and consequences in the game's story then goes on to endlessly praise one of the characters with the highest kill count in the setting. Some consistency would be nice, though throughout all of history many have been led astray by a pretty face and vague promises of 'love'.

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Godwin's law being tested again maybe.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Yep. Each to their own, people can like who they like and all that though it is bizarre when the very same poster who has called people 'psychopaths' for wanting character deaths and consequences in the game's story then goes on to endlessly praise one of the characters with the highest kill count in the setting. Some consistency would be nice, though throughout all of history many have been led astray by a pretty face and vague promises of 'love'.

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Would the person with the highest kill count be me? I'm well past the 250,000 dead achievement and they stop keep count. I think I've killed the population of Solomon Islands.

Some people like X game for Y reasons, and some people like Y game for X reasons...
Some people only play for X reasons, while others only play for Y reasons...
-at the end of the day it really doesn't matter!

The world is super crazy right now, and we as gamers should stick together and we can get through this!
We all enjoy playing games, and thats what matters :)

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Originally Posted by Nikki

Thats what i did with shadowbringer. Skipped away to try new jobs. Then grabbed myself a nice cup of coffee and watched the story on YouTube. Watching someone else narrate story in 20 mins videos while i can kick back and relax is much more enjoyable and i didn't miss a thing. I play ffxiv for combat, glam and trying new classes. Will do the same with Endwalker.

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That just seems terrible to me (especially when FFXIV's combat really isn't all that great), but to each their own.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Yep. Each to their own, people can like who they like and all that though it is bizarre when the very same poster who has called people 'psychopaths' for wanting character deaths and consequences in the game's story then goes on to endlessly praise one of the characters with the highest kill count in the setting. Some consistency would be nice, though throughout all of history many have been led astray by a pretty face and vague promises of 'love'.

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Theodoric...are you alright? Who hurt you?

There's very little reason for me, if any, to seek out interactions or discussions with those who are fans of Endwalker's story. More often than not it appears that its defenders seek out those of us who took issue with it in attempts to prove themselves the correct and moral ones because they "understood" the story's true message and could somehow sympathize with the likes of Hermes.

We explain our grievances, get painted as bad guys ourselves or have other strange accusations like some of the ones in this thread tossed our way, and then the current defenders of FFXIV are mystified as to why the playerbase keeps dropping and why they continue to receive pushback from more and more sides.

I believe that quite a lot of issues could be solved by the following: by setting Yoshi free to work on other games and for Ishikawa to move on to other projects within CBU3. Of the remaining team, future main story writers should be selected from the sort that produced the quality of writing we saw in 6.2's Pandaemonium quests, as well as the more mature storytelling of Ivalice and Bozja's settings.

Endwalker was an expansion that operated on feels more than substance - I propose that tide be directly turned as soon as possible, lest the game continue to self select for the sort of players that would otherwise be more taken by games outside the fantasy genre than a mainline FF title.

This... isn't entirely related to the topic on hand, but this thread made me think of it - some friends of mine really adored EW's story, like, a LOT, and say stuff like YoshiP was trying to send a message to the players through the story, like a moral that we need to learn or we're doomed as a species or something. I'm just a bit uh... confused on what that point is, and I watched and read everything related to the MSQ. Is it just that we need to be careful not to become stagnant as a civilization? Or something else? The way they talk I feel like I missed some sort of big revelation.

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Originally Posted by Zebraoracle

This... isn't entirely related to the topic on hand, but this thread made me think of it - some friends of mine really adored EW's story, like, a LOT, and say stuff like YoshiP was trying to send a message to the players through the story, like a moral that we need to learn or we're doomed as a species or something. I'm just a bit uh... confused on what that point is, and I watched and read everything related to the MSQ. Is it just that we need to be careful not to become stagnant as a civilization? Or something else? The way they talk I feel like I missed some sort of big revelation.

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Yoshi needs to stop trying to "send messages" and focus moreso on telling entertaining fantasy stories. When I write things the last thing I focus on is any specific "theme" I'm more concerned with the plot of what I'm trying to put out. Themes can arise naturally as a reader takes in the story without me spoonfeeding them the way Alphi did to us at several junctures in EW.

If Endwalker demonstrated anything is that his view on things is too different from my own for me to want to endure such preaching, from the forge ahead nonsense to brownie points scored by removing the gender lock from gear hardly anyone buys or wears. Appeals to virtue mean nothing to me, especially when such real-world morals have little place in what used to be a game set in a fantasy world and time period.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

#venatdidnothingwrong

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#zodiarkdidnothingwrong

#1.0didnothingwrong

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Originally Posted by Cithaerias_pyropina

#zodiarkdidnothingwrong

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I almost feel for zodiark, just a pathetic shell that ended up doing nothing. Total letdown. It'd be like Kefka just tripping and falling off the floating Island and dying. womp womp

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

There's very little reason for me, if any, to seek out interactions or discussions with those who are fans of Endwalker's story. More often than not it appears that its defenders seek out those of us who took issue with it in attempts to prove themselves the correct and moral ones because they "understood" the story's true message and could somehow sympathize with the likes of Hermes.

We explain our grievances, get painted as bad guys ourselves or have other strange accusations like some of the ones in this thread tossed our way, and then the current defenders of FFXIV are mystified as to why the playerbase keeps dropping and why they continue to receive pushback from more and more sides.

I believe that quite a lot of issues could be solved by the following: by setting Yoshi free to work on other games and for Ishikawa to move on to other projects within CBU3. Of the remaining team, future main story writers should be selected from the sort that produced the quality of writing we saw in 6.2's Pandaemonium quests, as well as the more mature storytelling of Ivalice and Bozja's settings.

Endwalker was an expansion that operated on feels more than substance - I propose that tide be directly turned as soon as possible, lest the game continue to self select for the sort of players that would otherwise be more taken by games outside the fantasy genre than a mainline FF title.

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That's because your opinion is completely invalidated. You constantly harp about stupid things like the female characters not constantly being damsels in distress and god forbid there's a lite scene where someone is eating a hamburger. Your takes are garbage and its why people don't take you seriously.

I think I've seen far more meltdowns over people criticising the burger scene than criticism of the burger scene in question at this point.

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Originally Posted by Zebraoracle

This... isn't entirely related to the topic on hand, but this thread made me think of it - some friends of mine really adored EW's story, like, a LOT, and say stuff like YoshiP was trying to send a message to the players through the story, like a moral that we need to learn or we're doomed as a species or something. I'm just a bit uh... confused on what that point is, and I watched and read everything related to the MSQ. Is it just that we need to be careful not to become stagnant as a civilization? Or something else? The way they talk I feel like I missed some sort of big revelation.

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There was good discussion on the "themes" (such as they are) here and also here. I don't think it's quite so deep as him sending a message directed at us lest we fall prey to some "doom" as it is the writers playing with themes that they struggled to execute well in tandem with squashing two future intended expansions into one and thus producing a rather muddled hodgepodge that is inconsistent in parts with some of the game's own prior themes.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

I almost feel for zodiark, just a pathetic shell that ended up doing nothing. Total letdown. It'd be like Kefka just tripping and falling off the floating Island and dying. womp womp

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Yes, minus keeping the star alive for some 12k years and counting...

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I think I've seen far more meltdowns over people criticising the burger scene than criticism of the burger scene in question at this point.

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It's ironic, really. I don't recall ever reading a post I'd consider even remotely thought provoking from the poster just above you. He was going to come back and "educate" certain other posters on the Japanese script in the past but never really came back on that. Possibly because it was little more than hot air.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

That's because your opinion is completely invalidated. You constantly harp about stupid things like the female characters not constantly being damsels in distress and god forbid there's a light scene where someone is eating a hamburger. Your takes are garbage and its why people don't take you seriously.

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Your complete misinterpretation of my positions is why I usually do not give those on your side a response. Why bother when you're just going to make stuff up to paint me as a bad guy? Enjoy the current state of FFXIV, because there are 2 paths from here.

1. the game gets back on track, people come back, things improve to fit mine and others' standards when it comes to story and content while those who play regardless of such things will continue doing so.

or

2. the game continues this misguided trajectory, the playerbase keeps dropping and the fall of WoW quite literally repeats itself. I get remembered as one of the few people who fought against it, while others are not.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

I almost feel for zodiark, just a pathetic shell that ended up doing nothing. Total letdown. It'd be like Kefka just tripping and falling off the floating Island and dying. womp womp

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I think it's partly the odd pacing of EW and then trying to shove so much into it, and partly that, like... For all intents and purposes, Elidibus was Zodiark. The same way Venat is Hydaelyn. We already fought "Zodiark" in Shadowbringers, the shell on the moon was just the husk left behind after the fact. At least that how I view it.

The moon fight was hugely anticlimactic, but that's partly because it wasn't a fight with Zodiark at all...it was a fight with Fandaniel. Who I found utterly uninteresting as a villain outside of the slight change in pace from "woe is me behold my tragic backstory that pushed me to villainy..." (Not to say I don't absolutely love the Ascians, BUT, that's the trend of like every other villain we've had recently except Zenos "fight me bro" Galvus)

Bit of a ramble there, but, yeah.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

There was good discussion on the "themes" (such as they are) here and also here. I don't think it's quite so deep as him sending a message directed at us lest we fall prey to some "doom" as it is the writers playing with themes that they struggled to execute well in tandem with squashing two future intended expansions into one and thus producing a rather muddled hodgepodge that is inconsistent in parts with some of the game's own prior themes.



Yes, minus keeping the star alive for some 12k years and counting...

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Thanks, I'll have to give those a read.

Edit: How did my quote make up a line in your post? "Yes, minus keeping the star alive for some 12k years and counting..." where did this even come from? Am I blind?
Re-Edit: disregard, I didn't refresh my page... I need sleep lmao

This one thinks he'll be remembered. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

couple minutes too slow. oh well :p

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Originally Posted by Zebraoracle

Thanks, I'll have to give those a read.

Edit: How did my quote make up a line in your post? "Yes, minus keeping the star alive for some 12k years and counting..." where did this even come from? Am I blind?

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You probably hit quote just as I was done adding something in.

Anyway, there's countless other threads on this stuff but you may also find this one of particular interest since it touches on a quest chain that sort of expands on the themes they were working with in EW. They're very large threads, so happy reading if you do go through them... unfortunately I didn't make note of any posts specific to the themes as such, but I am sure you will find a few just through skimming.

Give me that gaelicatnip you've been sniffed on because holy moly, I don't think we're playing same game buddy! It's like a Tumblr/Wattpad version you've played there :eek:

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Narcissistic mothers are a thing, after all.

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The only "narcissistic mother" we have in this story is Yotsuyu's mother after all :)

And again the Zodiark cults are easily summoned with this kind of thread...

- Saying things like "this game is 90% story"
- Thinking is praise

Jesus Christ.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

The amount of baseless headcanon I encounter in this community, including amongst the very people who sneer "omg stop skipping cutscenes" or who fancy themselves as lore 'hawks', is legend. Comprehension of the story, as written, is really not widespread in this community. Headcanon is the currency of much of its lore commenting.

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You know how, when you invite your friends to watch your favorite movie/tv show and they can't stop fidgeting in their seats and checking their phones and don't calm down until the explosions or the hot girl shows up? I'd bet my inexistent fortune that most "story enjoyers" are kinda like that. The fanaticism is just social media-fueled groupthink and/or streamer worship doing their thing.

well time to leave this dumpster fire of a topic good luck to all who stay here.

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Originally Posted by Knot_D

Give me that gaelicatnip you've been sniffed on because holy moly, I don't think we're playing same game buddy! It's like a Tumblr/Wattpad version you've played there :eek:



The only "narcissistic mother" we have in this story is Yotsuyu's mother after all :)

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No, on the contrary, I think it is a perfectly valid reading of her personality, her actions and her "love" considering all she did and what her "children" in fact are - the remaining fragments of her people after her genocide of them. These actions may be justified in your mind, but I am simply labelling them what they are and pointing out these kind of claims of "love" are meaningless in isolation and not dissimilar to those a narcissist may utter to those they claim they're benefitting out of "love".

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Originally Posted by Cach

- Saying things like "this game is 90% story"
- Thinking is praise

Jesus Christ.



You know how, when you invite your friends to watch your favorite movie/tv show and they can't stop fidgeting in their seats and checking their phones and don't calm down until the explosions or the hot girl shows up? I'd bet my inexistent fortune that most "story enjoyers" are kinda like that. The fanaticism is just social media-fueled groupthink and/or streamer worship doing their thing.

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and the other group is the ones scoffing at the new Michael Bay movie, but keep paying to watch them with your friends, arguing about how it's awful during the whole movie. That social media-fueled groupthink you're referencing? what do you think you're doing here upvoting those that agree with you, and scoffing at the fidgeters? You're no different lol

Completely depends on their behaviour, them not caring about story is ok AS LONG AS:

-They arent moaning about it existing or that they have to do it and demand the devs cater to them.

This is an mmoRPG, i know WoW players would rather gut literally everything to turn this game into a boring raidlogging simulator like they did to wow but thankfully Yoshi is not a dev that will pander to a raiding minority at the expense of the majority of players.

So if they play an ff mmoRPG they should expect heavy story focus, if they dont want story they should just play wow

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

This one thinks he'll be remembered. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

couple minutes too slow. oh well :p

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Why are you spamming emojis?

https://images.emojiterra.com/twitter/512px/1f5ff.png

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Originally Posted by Lauront

No, on the contrary, I think it is a perfectly valid reading of her personality, her actions and her "love" considering all she did and what her "children" in fact are - the remaining fragments of her people after her genocide of them. These actions may be justified in your mind, but I am simply labelling them what they are and pointing out these kind of claims of "love" are meaningless in isolation and not dissimilar to those a narcissist may utter to those they claim they're benefitting out of "love".

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Nice opinion you have there, too bad it's still a wrong take.

And I won't elaborate why because you and the Zodiark cultist still find mommy a narcissistic :)

*walks into another thread treating the story as something super serious*
Yeah, I think Garrosh is going to be a horrible leader for the Horde. :^)

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Your complete misinterpretation of my positions is why I usually do not give those on your side a response. Why bother when you're just going to make stuff up to paint me as a bad guy? Enjoy the current state of FFXIV, because there are 2 paths from here.

1. the game gets back on track, people come back, things improve to fit mine and others' standards when it comes to story and content while those who play regardless of such things will continue doing so.

or

2. the game continues this misguided trajectory, the playerbase keeps dropping and the fall of WoW quite literally repeats itself. I get remembered as one of the few people who fought against it, while others are not.

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How "noble" of you

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Your complete misinterpretation of my positions is why I usually do not give those on your side a response. Why bother when you're just going to make stuff up to paint me as a bad guy? Enjoy the current state of FFXIV, because there are 2 paths from here.

1. the game gets back on track, people come back, things improve to fit mine and others' standards when it comes to story and content while those who play regardless of such things will continue doing so.

or

2. the game continues this misguided trajectory, the playerbase keeps dropping and the fall of WoW quite literally repeats itself. I get remembered as one of the few people who fought against it, while others are not.

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There's literally twice as many people playing this game now than t here was 2 years ago....And no I misinterpreted nothing. You straight up made an entire thread about Zero and how it basically should have been a male character because God forbid a female character has the characteristics she has.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

How "noble" of you

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Not an argument m8. Can you prove him wrong? Can you explain to him how the exact same issue that has killed off other MMOs won't kill this one off? I can wait. ;^D

Aveyond, one thing you seem to forget and this goes for anyone who thinks FFXIV is treading down the same downward path as WoW Cata-current needs to realize it isnt solely based on the game alone. Theyre were other huge factors that largely contributed towards WoW's decline:

1. By 2010 when Cata was released, the MMORPG boom that was started with WoW started to decline as technology advanced and many other mmos flooded the market which diluted the genre. Not only that but what used to be a very fun and covenient way for a lot of casual gamers who stuck with WoW as a means to communicate with their friends, found other avenues to interact with them.

2. Old Blizzard dev team had a very clear and obvious unhealthy "rock star" mentality that further got worse as their years go by. And there were some negative communication between them and their playerbase via the forums around the time concerning certain individuals. Yoshida's team, exhibit none of these qualities and they've been taken hits with grace ever since 1.0.

3. Activison-Blizzard came around the time the game started to decline during Cata. Need I go any further.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Aveyond, one thing you seem to forget and this goes for anyone who thinks FFXIV is treading down the same downward path as WoW Cata-current needs to realize it isnt solely based on the game alone. Theyre were other huge factors that largely contributed towards WoW's decline:

1. By 2010 when Cata was released, the MMORPG boom that was started with WoW started to decline as technology advanced and many other mmos flooded the market which diluted the genre. Not only that but what used to be a very fun and covenient way for a lot of casual gamers who stuck with WoW as a means to communicate with their friends, found other avenues to interact with them.

2. Old Blizzard dev team had a very clear and obvious unhealthy "rock star" mentality that further got worse as their years go by. And there were some negative communication between them and their playerbase via the forums around the time concerning certain individuals. Yoshida's team, exhibit none of these qualities and they've been taken hits with grace ever since 1.0.

3. Activison-Blizzard came around the time the game started to decline during Cata. Need I go any further.

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1. They are already using spaghetti code and an old framework as excuses (lol, nice helms hrothgar.)
2. Are you telling me that the current devs don't treat themselves like rockstars? Btw, check out that new music video that dropped on their youtube channel!
3. Yeah, you should go further. This game has a lot of issues that EA snuck into WoW like the cash shop and the sudden glut of FOMO injected into the game.

Either way, no point in arguing. I tried when EQ/EQ2 got big and SoE went full EA, I tried when WoW got scooped up by EA, I tried when games becoming a service was becoming a common place, tbh I am tried of trying to save a hobby when the new blood would rather blindly defend companies than use some simple critical thinking to see how a bad idea can ruin an IP. All I can say is, enjoy the game! Your mindset has won the day and all we can do is brace for the future and all it brings~!

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Aveyond, one thing you seem to forget and this goes for anyone who thinks FFXIV is treading down the same downward path as WoW Cata-current needs to realize it isnt solely based on the game alone. Theyre were other huge factors that largely contributed towards WoW's decline:

1. By 2010 when Cata was released, the MMORPG boom that was started with WoW started to decline as technology advanced and many other mmos flooded the market which diluted the genre. Not only that but what used to be a very fun and covenient way for a lot of casual gamers who stuck with WoW as a means to communicate with their friends, found other avenues to interact with them.

2. Old Blizzard dev team had a very clear and obvious unhealthy "rock star" mentality that further got worse as their years go by. And there were some negative communication between them and their playerbase via the forums around the time concerning certain individuals. Yoshida's team, exhibit none of these qualities and they've been taken hits with grace ever since 1.0.

3. Activison-Blizzard came around the time the game started to decline during Cata. Need I go any further.

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Quite the opposite, FF14 is trending because it is a game that tries to cater to everyone while not treating anyone as special, meanwhile wow is treating raidloggers as special and has gutted the entirety of the game to pander to them, WoW has nothing casual or solo left in it, just some quick garbage they make up to say they have a "story" or "solo content" but the quality is terrible because they only care about raiding, meanwhile FF14 has quality content for all kinds of players.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I will. It's a common take as well, just so you know.

It's like going to a place of worship and saying you worship nobody. It's trolling to press the fact you don't like story in a story game.

Everyone that I've seen press it in the novice network just came to the game because they wanted to troll and, ironically, harass people for liking the story. The majority of people who skip just don't make a big deal out of it like that.

Now they might mention that they skipped in a conversation, but what I mean is they don't make a big deal out of it usually and therefore don't stir up a heated debate like any troll does.

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Comparing a video game to a plce of worship LOL, take your pills already.

here let me break it down for you - you go to a place of worhship for 1 main reason, to worship. you play video games for multiple reasons, which arent limited to a story, ffxiv has A LOT of content, that can be enjoyed without the story.

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Originally Posted by Raoabolic

Not an argument m8. Can you prove him wrong? Can you explain to him how the exact same issue that has killed off other MMOs won't kill this one off? I can wait. ;^D

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Proving something that isn't quantifiable doesn't work like that lol. why don't you first show us proof what "exact issue" you're referring to and what mmos have been killed off? I can wait. ;^D (am i doing the snark right?)