Sorry, but Content deal finder again.....

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Originally Posted by Sephrick

Funny thing is, even Gifthorse thinks he's acting like Gifthorse.



http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com...entry?e=330404

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saved for future generations

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Originally Posted by Sabaku_Usagi

I remember setting up many parties just to disband at 4/6 because people had to go to sleep.

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Oh yes I remember similar situations.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

As I said in the other threads now is not the time to be complaining about this stuff, SE are focusing most of their time and money on developing 2.0.

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I understand the concept of saving the open world stuff for 2.0 but the lack of news on what we will actually see in 2.0 for content is just concerning. I pray as 2.0 draws closer we see or even hear of what we will see for the game.

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Originally Posted by viion

That is lucky for you, maybe it is different on your world, maybe your world is more active around your timezone.

For me? I have to PL myself, otherwise its just near impossible to level, took me 1 week just to get 43 to 50 Thaumaturge because no one was PTing. I would sit in a PT for ages, almost ready to go, but no Healer or people begin dropping out before it started.

Takes way to long very often.

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One week to solo 7 levels is stupid fast and thats just one more problem with this game.

So yeh back to topic, Content Finder for Instanced stuff is good, EXPing/Dungeons (which are instanced anyway) is good.

Strongholds are not instanced, they open world, not like it would make much difference anyway if they were instanced or not. But they would still exist, we have seen that in the v2.0 context, so stop crying ya eyes out about open world nonsense.

The content finder is a welcome addition to the FF series, especially when you consider how long it took to do anything in XI. Even starting a group in XIV is still challenging (not nearly as so).

The content finder from WoW does degrade the cohesiveness of the community, but it is such an important mechanic to modern MMOs that it cannot be left out.

There are ways to balance the content finder. New dungeons (as deemed "new" via one to two patches) could be present in a "server only" content finder for the duration they are deemed "new". After a patch or two, these dungeons then go to the normal "all server" status.

Furthermore, since WoW is a relevant example for this explanation I will include it here. I very rarely use the content finder on WoW, why? Because I have guildmates who want to do dungeons when I want to. I'd much rather opt to do guild runs any day over running a content finder pug. With that being said, I appreciate the fact that content finder is there to provide ACCESSIBILITY to those who don't have the luxury of being in an end game guild such as the one I am in. I see the immense value in the content finder and I am willing to accept the lack of cohesiveness of the server community for accessibility of content.

Finally, the above example shows that you really don't have to use content finder if you don't want to. It is simply another means of increasing the accessibility of content for everyone -- and that is generally always a good thing.

But how would that work for like a grind party? You go to the other person's server or vice versa temporarily? lol

I mean, SWTOR has this thing where there are separate instances of the same area on the same server, and if you party with someone in the other instance you transfer to theirs....but i haven't heard anything about that being implemented for 2.0. And still, cross world o.0?

I can't say i'm against it, but....inb4 failed implementation.

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Originally Posted by Chardrizard

You are like, it is drifting away from the crap FFXI was. Thank God for that.

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Your a tool.

People keep saying that dungeon finder ruined WoW, well I can tell you the community wasn't that great to begin with so its not like it made a massive change.

I would suggest the addition of reputation system like these forums have the like ups etc, so you can get some idea who you are playing.

Another great addition to the game. Not having to wait a week to do stuff can only be a good thing and if you need to restrict our contact with other servers to save the 'community' within our actual server then the 'community' can't be that great can it? Tl;DR cutting off contact from the outside world is what creepy other halves do x.x

No one else is in a panic about this Rokien and no we will not think of the children D:

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Originally Posted by Jinko

, well I can tell you the community wasn't that great to begin with

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Why am I not surprised that you are here telling us that a community of 5,000,000+ people aren't that "great"?

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Originally Posted by ThePatriarch

Why am I not surprised that you are here telling us that a community of 5,000,000+ people aren't that "great"?

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5 Million+ Mostly ages 13-17 that is. FFMMO is for real men! :P

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Originally Posted by Tibian

The content finder is a welcome addition to the FF series, especially when you consider how long it took to do anything in XI. Even starting a group in XIV is still challenging (not nearly as so).

The content finder from WoW does degrade the cohesiveness of the community, but it is such an important mechanic to modern MMOs that it cannot be left out.

There are ways to balance the content finder. New dungeons (as deemed "new" via one to two patches) could be present in a "server only" content finder for the duration they are deemed "new". After a patch or two, these dungeons then go to the normal "all server" status.

Furthermore, since WoW is a relevant example for this explanation I will include it here. I very rarely use the content finder on WoW, why? Because I have guildmates who want to do dungeons when I want to. I'd much rather opt to do guild runs any day over running a content finder pug. With that being said, I appreciate the fact that content finder is there to provide ACCESSIBILITY to those who don't have the luxury of being in an end game guild such as the one I am in. I see the immense value in the content finder and I am willing to accept the lack of cohesiveness of the server community for accessibility of content.

Finally, the above example shows that you really don't have to use content finder if you don't want to. It is simply another means of increasing the accessibility of content for everyone -- and that is generally always a good thing.

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This man speaks the truth and has a great suggestion.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

5 Million+ Mostly ages 13-17 that is. FFMMO is for real men! :P

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I'm afraid the true FF MMO experience that most of us know, will never be experienced again. I can't say I like any of the changes that FFXIV is bringing, but I will give them a shot.

I mean this is just my opinion, so bash it all you want. But with content finder, there are good aspirations I agree. Make content easier to get into for the casual crowd. Got it.

But when all content is made accessible by a content finder, and even the most casual of players can enjoy the hardest, and most time consuming of dungeons with groups of random people, everything loses it glimmer. No one will be excited to level up and find a great LS, or group of friends to do things with because you can just get PL'd, hop on the content finder and BAM! you are in.

In prior MMO's, I had to work on leveling. And when I saw groups of higher level guildmates doing their best to clear a new dungeon or raid; It made me work that much harder to get to the max level so that I can participate in that content with them.

Now I can get PL'd to 50 in quick form (under a week) and join a group of randoms to smash out content deemed "relatively difficult". Where is the excitement? Where is the lasting appeal?

ramble ramble grumble grumble blah blah.

This could seriously be a deal breaker for me. I won't freak out yet though, as I will wait for more information to come out. But if it turns out like WoW, where you never even leave the city and just get ported to some instance (EVEN FOR LEVELING), I don't think I will enjoy the game anymore. I hated that about WoW, and it's the reason I can't ever seem to get into that game for more than a week or so at a time.

People keep comparing the system to PSO, but it isn't really the same. In PSO, the whole world outside town was an instance. It's kind of like Guild Wars actually. You still played on your server and you had to look for groups within your server. This was a core design decision, and further content development hinged on it. This is my understanding of PSO at least, feel free to correct if I am mistaken...

Furthermore, people knew what they were signing up for. FFXIV, on the other hand, I do not think was ever originally advertised as being a mostly instanced world. But if you can use cross-server Content Finder, again EVEN FOR LEVELING, a mostly instanced world is what we will have. It's understandable that people, who did not expect this game to go in that direction, are upset.

And people, the whole "just don't use it" argument is sooo flawed. As I've seen Rokien himself mention many times, if a feature becomes the standard, you will be forced to use it or make no progress. You seriously think we will be able to find open-world leveling parties by shouting in Ul'dah, when people can queue up for an instance in a fraction of the time?? Of course not, it simply will not happen. Content Finder instance runs for XP will become the new standard, and if you don't like it you will simply have to find a new MMO. Which would be sad because, at least speaking for myself, I really love Final Fantasy and I want this game to be my home for a long time to come...

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Originally Posted by Riv

But how would that work for like a grind party? You go to the other person's server or vice versa temporarily? lol

I mean, SWTOR has this thing where there are separate instances of the same area on the same server, and if you party with someone in the other instance you transfer to theirs....but i haven't heard anything about that being implemented for 2.0. And still, cross world o.0?

I can't say i'm against it, but....inb4 failed implementation.

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Create 5 unique zones, dont need to be too big as they can be instanced, that have mobs to level between a range, infact 4 zones enough, can do 1-10 normally.

Zone 1 - 10-20
Zone 2 - 20-30
Zone 3 - 30-40
Zone 4 - 40-50

Or if easier, 1 big zone that has mobs ranging from 10-50 as its instanced your wont have competition, you can then go there to level. If you prefer the open world you can do that, but this is for those who would prefer to level with anyone.

The zone will be on its own server, so it would just port you there, the technology is easier, a "Server" is no longer a limit anymore, take DCUO for example, doesnt even have servers XD Everyone plays on 1 big world (or universe!).

You'd port over and likely get a name tag with ur name "Premium Virtue (Gungnir)" to avoid same name conflictions.

Alternatively, if they hired some skill or and didnt make a fob job of everything, they could have it like DCUO where you dont have servers, when you party everyone is "phased" together, its like automatic seamless channel switching.

This would mean I could just join content finder, and then join you and i would seamlessly transfer over to your server to hang out, removing the limit of what a "server" is and going to a phasing setup.

If you can't spend more then 30min online in anything, i don't think you should be playing anything at all



People who can't spend more then 5 minutes doing something win again :/

I've got no issue with content finder used for dungeons as well as leveling. If there's one thing I HATE about MMOs, it's spending any amount of time looking for a party or trying to assemble one at odd hours of the night. If this helps with that, I'm all for it.

For leveling, why not just implement LFG and level sync like in FFXI (within server)? Add in suggestions for party areas (e.g., zones that have level ranges, monster types common of a level range, etc) and I think you will have a strong system.

If they implement cross server dungeons, I want there to be reputation rankings so players have accountability regarding their behavior. In my experiences playing with players on your server makes a name for yourself (good or bad) and you have to live with those consequences. But I do see the allure of having servers of people available to dungeon with as it will reduce sitting around. Its all in the implementation.

hey, i'm going to be giving you guys all this extra freedom to do all this extra shi...oh wait what? you don't want more freedom and shit? ah...well, okay i guess i'll just...h'mmm...

Woot! This sounds awesome! Add in level sync with this content finder and talk about awesome sauce. Can't wait to see it in action. :)

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Originally Posted by Gidonoidon_Sur

For leveling, why not just implement LFG and level sync like in FFXI (within server)? Add in suggestions for party areas (e.g., zones that have level ranges, monster types common of a level range, etc) and I think you will have a strong system.

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I very much agree with this. The weird thing right now about our LFG tool is we specify what zone we want to look for members in, instead of what zone we want to group for. The system should find people who want to do the activity/go to the zone/whatever else it is that you specify, wherever they may be. I just think its sort of backwards as it stands.

Side note, yes I would want this tied into the lore, maybe even a quest. An adventurers linkshell or something like that would work just fine...

My main qualm with content finder is being paired with idiots. I say idiots respectively...

When you join up with a group and start, all of a sudden you have 2 people afk and 1 of the random people left because he wants to go to speedway to buy cigarettes.. drives me nuts

I did play WoW for a short time, never used dungeon finder cause I was soloing, however I wouldn't be opposed to it.

May I ask an honest question...

Why are people against something like this? Just curious.

rokien can you seriously not

for just one day



just

one

day

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Originally Posted by Gidonoidon_Sur

For leveling, why not just implement LFG and level sync like in FFXI (within server)? Add in suggestions for party areas (e.g., zones that have level ranges, monster types common of a level range, etc) and I think you will have a strong system.

If they implement cross server dungeons, I want there to be reputation rankings so players have accountability regarding their behavior. In my experiences playing with players on your server makes a name for yourself (good or bad) and you have to live with those consequences. But I do see the allure of having servers of people available to dungeon with as it will reduce sitting around. Its all in the implementation.

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LMAO Reputation!? you think anyone is remembered for their "Reputation".

I haven known many people now who on Besaid did very bad things, and word got around, then after a month its like "who what now?" and they get away with it.

lol reputation, doesn't exist. The game just isnt that much dramatic.

IF the content remains "hard," where it takes an average skilled person to complete in a few weeks or a month, then this is a welcome feature... Why? Because nobody would use the finder to do the content at the risk of wiping over and over again. Would people use the finder to do Ifrit the the first day it came out, our moogle? I don't think so.

Fast forward 5 months later, where there have been two patches of content. Someone just joining the game wants to do Moogle or Ifrit, in order to experience the content. They will have better crafted material available to make the encounter easier, and they'll have the content finder to find group members across all servers. Most people will not want to do moogle after doing it for 100 times 5 months prior.

The Content finder is a good idea.... IF AND ONLY IF the content remains challenging. If it becomes watered down like WoW, then there is NO INCENTIVE to form a group of people from your own server, or LS mates, other than to hang out. My other worry is that Content finder completely devalues world exploration.

As it stands now, in order to do Ifrit, you and your group must port to Broken Water. For Moogle it's Turning Leaf, etc etc. If they have a content finder, from different servers, the only way it's possible is to teleport you directly to Ifrit (the instance), or alternatively, make Broken Water a separate server (Channels 1 - 15, ala guild wars). Both appear to be a fundamental change to Teleport mechanic and FFXIV in general.

I'm really ambivalent about this "addition." My person experience with WoW dungeon finder was a mixed bag. When it was first introduced, it was great, because I was casual and I didn't have time to devote to forming groups. I left wow for 10 months and came back. I used the dungeon finder, and the first thing I was told by a group member in the best gear.... "Man your gearscore is really low, I can't believe I have to carry this F'in Group."

Careful what you wish for.

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Originally Posted by LillithaFenimore

Why are people against something like this? Just curious.

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While I don't like it, I'm not against it. If it makes alot of people happy... why not.

In my opinion though, it makes everything way to easy to experience. I myself (I know, I'm a dying breed) enjoyed looking at content that I was not able to experience yet, and think "wow, I can't wait till I can get to a point where I can do stuff like that".

For instance dynamis: I remember being level 50ish in FFXI and read about dynamis on ffxi.allakhazam.com (lol alla), and I was obsessed with getting to level 75 to clear that kind of content.

I finally got to max level, and then had to find a good group. There was no content finder to make things easy for me.

But when I finally stepped into Dynamis-Sandoria for the first time, my mind was blown. I was so excited I almost couldn't contain myself. Holy shit, AF drop. I wasn't even able to obtain anything for the first couple runs, but I was there till the very last second of that run because it was just absolutely mesmerizing. To be there, along with people who had been doing Dyanmis for a while, seeing their gear, just made me want to play more and become better. It was a landmark point in my MMO career.

While content finder is cool, and has great intentions, I think it will take away from the anticipation of certain content. You won't have that longing to get the a certain level and find a group to participate. You can just get PL'd and join a random group of people whom you have never met before, etc etc. Ramble ramble.

I know, it helps casuals, etc etc

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Originally Posted by ThePatriarch

Why am I not surprised that you are here telling us that a community of 5,000,000+ people aren't that "great"?

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Well my actual point was that the community didn't change much, but whatever :D

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Originally Posted by viion

Create 5 unique zones, dont need to be too big as they can be instanced, that have mobs to level between a range, infact 4 zones enough, can do 1-10 normally.

Zone 1 - 10-20
Zone 2 - 20-30
Zone 3 - 30-40
Zone 4 - 40-50

Or if easier, 1 big zone that has mobs ranging from 10-50 as its instanced your wont have competition, you can then go there to level. If you prefer the open world you can do that, but this is for those who would prefer to level with anyone.

The zone will be on its own server, so it would just port you there, the technology is easier, a "Server" is no longer a limit anymore, take DCUO for example, doesnt even have servers XD Everyone plays on 1 big world (or universe!).

You'd port over and likely get a name tag with ur name "Premium Virtue (Gungnir)" to avoid same name conflictions.

Alternatively, if they hired some skill or and didnt make a fob job of everything, they could have it like DCUO where you dont have servers, when you party everyone is "phased" together, its like automatic seamless channel switching.

This would mean I could just join content finder, and then join you and i would seamlessly transfer over to your server to hang out, removing the limit of what a "server" is and going to a phasing setup.

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This is what I am hoping for, the fact that SE are calling it a worldless server woudl suggest exactly this.

Hopefully SE have the ambition and tech to pull this off.

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Originally Posted by viion

LMAO Reputation!? you think anyone is remembered for their "Reputation".

I haven known many people now who on Besaid did very bad things, and word got around, then after a month its like "who what now?" and they get away with it.

lol reputation, doesn't exist. The game just isnt that much dramatic.

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If Rokien was on your server it might change your opinion >.>

I feel this is how its going to go:

Definition of Content Finder: A system wherein a person can find a particular content within a MMO game.

In FFXIV case I feel the following is going to happen:

A) If you haven't been to X place then you can't use Content finder for that particular place in question.
B) Only Dungeons/Primal/PvP will fall under the Content finder.

content finder is a great way to be a quasi anonymous asshole. rather be more aware of my own server than a sea of nobodies, but i won't complain if it's implemented. people that feel the same and i can stick to our own if we want. it's a plus that the FF community is sliiightly a notch above other MMO's.

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Originally Posted by Pistolere

content finder is a great way to be a quasi anonymous asshole. rather be more aware of my own server than a sea of nobodies, but i won't complain if it's implemented. people that feel the same and i can stick to our own if we want. it's a plus that the FF community is sliiightly a notch above other MMO's.

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As opposed to now? Where you can still be an asshole, steal, etc and get away with it. Especially with the merge just passing XD.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

I feel this is how its going to go:

Definition of Content Finder: A system wherein a person can find a particular content within a MMO game.

In FFXIV case I feel the following is going to happen:

A) If you haven't been to X place then you can't use Content finder for that particular place in question.
B) Only Dungeons/Primal/PvP will fall under the Content finder.

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I'm pretty sure WoW used to require you to at least use the entrance to a dungeon before it would teleport you there, for some strange reason they removed that requirement though :(

i guess it depends on your memory. of course i'm not sure how content finder will work, but i imagine it's harder to keep up with the entire game's population rather than the server's.

How about if the content finder prioritised/grouped you with people from your server first and then filled the missing roles from other servers.

Surely that would be a compromise.

Instead of people saying "DO NOT WANT" how about coming up with idea's that would make the function better.

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Originally Posted by Pistolere

i guess it depends on your memory. of course i'm not sure how content finder will work, but i imagine it's harder to keep up with the entire game's population rather than the server's.

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idk... we all know "Gath", we all know "Gifthorse" from the forums, the forums are viewable to all, at once viewable to those who didnt play.

Whats any different from getting a reputation here or in game?

Doesnt matter about memory tho, there has been many people on Besaid who got major negative reputation, either from stealing ls banks or being a general dick in shouts or w/e, then couple weeks later, no one remembers it. Because in the end most of the "dick stuff" you can do, only affects a small amount of people, a small LS, a party, etc. If someone ninja lots now on something in a dungeon, wont matter only those in the PT will really care and remember, and likely forget after a few weeks.

Not adding this system because of reputation is laughable, people are dicks now, the system wont spree up a bunch of people who finally go "yes i can be an ahole", they will just be one regardless....

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Originally Posted by Jinko

How about if the content finder prioritised/grouped you with people from your server first and then filled the missing roles from other servers.

Surely that would be a compromise.

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yes, this idea, or/along with being able to form a partial group in home server first and filling in the slots is good. maybe also a sort of 'content finder friendlist' or something. you could friend or highlight active people from other servers that you enjoy cross-server adventuring with.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

I'm pretty sure WoW used to require you to at least use the entrance to a dungeon before it would teleport you there, for some strange reason they removed that requirement though :(

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I'm sure Content Finder, will be different, then people think it will be.. when people hear Content finder, they automatically think WoW's Content Finder. When I'm pretty sure Content Finder will be implemented differently.

Final Fantasy is all about Exploration, Yoshi-P knows this, and I'm sure it will be implemented differently.

I just don't understand why people would think this is a bad idea. It is nothing forced upon you and if you are a casual player, it is a major convenience tool, and you still play with other people. I find it hard to believe that people rather /shout in Ul'Dah all day to get "random" people in an EXP party together than just use the content finder and get one in no time at all.

And yes, WoW did require you to physically travel and enter the dungeon before you could use it in dungeon finder.

Final Fantasy XIV's original concept was to make an MMO for the casual players. This tool helps cater to the casual player without harming the hardcore audience at all.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

I just don't understand why people would think this is a bad idea. It is nothing forced upon you and if you are a casual player, it is a major convenience tool, and you still play with other people. I find it hard to believe that people rather /shout in Ul'Dah all day to get "random" people in an EXP party together than just use the content finder and get one in no time at all.

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Probably same people who refuse to talk to tourists lol.

Mind boggles me in-game "I like to join random people on my server, but not random people from another server, no no those outsiders are EVIL!"