During Yokai watch event, make fate bosses immune to Doom please

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

Running away to leash hunt mobs is a tool everyone has available, too.

I'm not talking about the people who do this once or twice, maybe by accident or just to see if it works. I'm talking about the people who consistently do it over and over specifically to troll.

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Except one has already been confirmed by SE to be griefing, and the other one has been a thing since BLU came out and SE didn't state or "fix the issue" at all whatsoever.

Guys, just play BLU
If you can't beat 'em join 'em
No need to get salty just because the meme job is dabbing on you

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Originally Posted by BelegErkhten

Guys, just play BLU
If you can't beat 'em join 'em
No need to get salty just because the meme job is dabbing on you

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Exactly, I joined the meme today, and it’s actually a lot of fun

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Originally Posted by BelegErkhten

Guys, just play BLU
If you can't beat 'em join 'em
No need to get salty just because the meme job is dabbing on you

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Heck, just join a BLU party! I've been leveling GNB and watching my exp shoot up with every fate completed.

I love reading some of them oversizing this problem as if 100% of the fates were bosses when the world is full of multiple enemy fates.

And I think they knew perfectly well that this would happen because it is something that has been done since class left in Stormblood and if they have not changed it even knowing that the event was coming, it is because they know that this would happen but how people are exaggerating with this problem appears to be a bug when it is not.

And I say exaggerating because I have received teels of people angry because I use Dragon Voice and I go flying to another fate. Yesterday in South Shroud a person was complaining about the aoe of the Blue Mage, if this had not happened now people would be complaining about the speed with which the fates are completed, something similar to the Hunts in Heavensward

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

Running away to leash hunt mobs is a tool everyone has available, too.

I'm not talking about the people who do this once or twice, maybe by accident or just to see if it works. I'm talking about the people who consistently do it over and over specifically to troll.

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Running away and leashing hunt marks and BLU using BLU skills is comparing apples to oranges. While I may not necessarily agree with certain BLU skills being used, even I can see that.

Well, I guess I shouldnt be surprised.

Look, BLU has been in the game for a long ass time, and doom and other skills have been around. It's now only a problem because how the class was designed makes it easier for people with a BLU who took the time to learn said skills to do said content?

Lets just cut to the chase. Lets just make it so you cant get credit while on BLU. Cause after you cant use missile and similar skills, itll be "Rams Voice to strong and unfair and is finishing fates to fast. Nerf please."

Instead of complaining about how a class was designed, why dont you take the time to level that class. And before someone gives me "Think of the sprouts" feedback, most people here arent concerned with sprouts doing this event. Theyre concerned with getting credit as fast as possible to get done with the grind. Nothing wrong with that, mind you, but at least be honest and forward about it.

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Originally Posted by Melichoir

Well, I guess I shouldnt be surprised.

Look, BLU has been in the game for a long ass time, and doom and other skills have been around. It's now only a problem because how the class was designed makes it easier for people with a BLU who took the time to learn said skills to do said content?

Lets just cut to the chase. Lets just make it so you cant get credit while on BLU. Cause after you cant use missile and similar skills, itll be "Rams Voice to strong and unfair and is finishing fates to fast. Nerf please."

Instead of complaining about how a class was designed, why dont you take the time to level that class. And before someone gives me "Think of the sprouts" feedback, most people here arent concerned with sprouts doing this event. Theyre concerned with getting credit as fast as possible to get done with the grind. Nothing wrong with that, mind you, but at least be honest and forward about it.

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Here's what you gonna do

Take a job like ninja/monk/dragoon or a caster like black mage and do the event alone

Come back and tell us how much you like no getting any fates done or only getting bronze at most because blues are obliterating fates

just make it so blu can't get medal

I've been playing BLU for this event, because why not. And yes it is extremely frustrating when other Blue's use Missile/Tail/Doom whatever...

But, I either changed zones because there are 3 for each Yokai, or skipped the Fates they were at and went to others and tagged them first, its not exactly hard to use ANY instant attack in the game as ANY job to tag/create enmity, you just have to adapt. So if I see unfair BLU's I just go to a different fate or a different zone. I have only 3 weapons left.

Edit: I havent been using insta death attacks just for clarity

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Originally Posted by Miminming

just make it so blu can't get medal

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That's a legitimately terrible idea.

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Originally Posted by Miminming

just make it so blu can't get medal

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Honestly that might just stoke the fire and cause blu players to retaliate and grief harder.
These people know and are enjoying the fact that they are an obstacle to other players.

Why hate on BLU overworld content is like one of the few things they excel at.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Why hate on BLU overworld content is like one of the few things they excel at.

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Imagine going into a savage raid extreme trial where your static insists on bringing a black mage.
And in this scenario xenoglossy does 50% of the bosses hp so you don't even get to see most of the fight.
And only the blackmage gets the book each week totem, and you can only roll greed on drops where the blackmage can roll need whenever.
You're told "just find another static" so you do.
Every static has this setup because it's meta.

That's this.
and the answer to it is "don't play the videogame, or switch to a job you aren't interested in to not play the videogame harder, and we can't fix this because not playing the videogame is this job's identity"

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Originally Posted by Kamome-chan

Here's what you gonna do

Take a job like ninja/monk/dragoon or a caster like black mage and do the event alone

Come back and tell us how much you like no getting any fates done or only getting bronze at most because blues are obliterating fates

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You fail to understand that I know what the complaint is, and my response is "Level the class your witching about instead of demanding it be changed cause you couldnt be bothered to level it yourself."

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Originally Posted by Roda

Imagine going into a savage raid where your static insists on bringing a black mage.
And in this scenario xenoglossy does 50% of the bosses hp so you don't even get to see most of the fight.
And only the blackmage gets the book each week, and you can only roll greed on drops where the blackmage can roll need whenever.
You're told "just find another static" so you do.
Every static has this setup because it's meta.

That's this.
and the answer to it is "don't play the videogame, or switch to a job you aren't interested in to not play the videogame harder, and we can't fix this because not playing the videogame is this job's identity"

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Imagine comparing an item that is taken out once a week with fates that spawns every 5 minutes with 3 zones to do.
With the Hunt understand the complaints of the early pulls but with fates?

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Originally Posted by Roda

Imagine going into a savage raid where your static insists on bringing a black mage.
And in this scenario xenoglossy does 50% of the bosses hp so you don't even get to see most of the fight.
And only the blackmage gets the book each week, and you can only roll greed on drops where the blackmage can roll need whenever.
You're told "just find another static" so you do.
Every static has this setup because it's meta.

That's this.
and the answer to it is "don't play the videogame, or switch to a job you aren't interested in to not play the videogame harder, and we can't fix this because not playing the videogame is this job's identity"

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There is nothing to imagine because it's not a savage fight with weekly lock outs. It's FATEs.

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Originally Posted by Nayout

Imagine comparing an item that is taken out once a week with fates that spawns every 5 minutes with 3 zones to do.
With the Hunt understand the complaints of the early pulls but with fates?

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Imagine being told not to completely trivialize content for everyone using a small handful of spells that remove the ability to participate for other players, and instead use a different handful of spells to trivialize content for yourself AND be able to leave content available for others to participate in, and then comparing that request to people coming for your very lives.
Stop pretending to be oppressed when others ask for basic courtesy and consideration.
I used the content that's relevant to my interests. I personally care more about doing the fights than I do about the loot, we can shift the comparison to ex trials if it would make you feel better. The effect would still be the same. Going in to participate in a thing, and someone immediately ending it before I can even get what I want out of it.

I'm utterly bemused.

The community complains that BLU is pointless and lacks utility in present day content.

And then when they finally have their time in the spotlight - they want to immediately rob them of it.

What?

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Originally Posted by Roda

Imagine being told not to completely trivialize content for everyone using a small handful of spells that remove the ability to participate for other players, and instead use a different handful of spells to trivialize content for yourself AND be able to leave content available for others to participate in, and then comparing that request to people coming for your very lives.
Stop pretending to be oppressed when others ask for basic courtesy and consideration.
I used the content that's relevant to my interests. I personally care more about doing the fights than I do about the loot, we can shift the comparison to ex trials if it would make you feel better. The effect would still be the same. Going in to participate in a thing, and someone immediately ending it before I can even get what I want out of it.

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I agree with you but if you are going to use an example do it right.
I do not care exactly the situation with the Blue Mage compared to many people who do not stop crying and over exaggerate a problem.

I hope that SE does not change anything, the class works perfectly and everything is perfect, the problem is the people and not the systems. If this event lasts only a week, it would be upsetting, but there are still 3 months to do an event that with Blue Mage problems does not take more than 2 days. Do you think I'm going to ask for nerfs or cry for something that can be done in 2 days when there are still 3 months to do it?

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my response is "Level the class your witching about instead of demanding it be changed cause you couldnt be bothered to level it yourself."

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Yes, we clearly need more people playing the swift-dead roulette, that will make things better and not ever lead to more nonsense.

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Originally Posted by Nayout

I agree with you but if you are going to use an example do it right.
I do not care exactly the situation with the Blue Mage compared to many people who do not stop crying and over exaggerate a problem.

I hope that SE does not change anything, the class works perfectly and everything is perfect, the problem is the people and not the systems. If this event lasts only a week, it would be upsetting, but there are still 3 months to do an event that with Blue Mage problems does not take more than 2 days. Do you think I'm going to ask for nerfs or cry for something that can be done in 2 days when there are still 3 months to do it?

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In my naivety I forgot that people only see raiding as a means to the ends of bigger number, instead of experiencing fights my bad but let's be able to take a positive out of my grave crime and say that this is excellent practice for people to think about other players' experiences in an mmo. Not everyone enjoys or experiences games the same way, and it's fine to experience games in a way that you find fun, but you have to consider whether or not your experience is actively harming how other people play the game and if there is any compromise that can be found. The compromise here, is obviously, if you don't actually want to play the game, just mightyguard and whitewind your party and move to the next fate while other people do the work for you. Other people get credit, you don't have to play the game, you get a constant stream of fate credit without having to wait until the map can catch up with spawning fates.

I very much disagree that everything is working perfectly. This situation is exactly why emergency patches / hotfixes are a thing. It's why they put the timer on being out of combat to switch jobs. It's why they're trying to figure out how to fix level 80s powerleveling blus. It's why they fixed ungarmax. Not every function they put into the game works perfectly as intended. Yes, people are being completely selfish and inconsiderate jerks, but it's also on SE for basically giving people the tools to be jerks.

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Originally Posted by Roda

Imagine being told not to completely trivialize content for everyone using a small handful of spells that remove the ability to participate for other players, and instead use a different handful of spells to trivialize content for yourself AND be able to leave content available for others to participate in, and then comparing that request to people coming for your very lives.
Stop pretending to be oppressed when others ask for basic courtesy and consideration.
I used the content that's relevant to my interests. I personally care more about doing the fights than I do about the loot, we can shift the comparison to ex trials if it would make you feel better. The effect would still be the same. Going in to participate in a thing, and someone immediately ending it before I can even get what I want out of it.

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Imagine taking the time to level and play a class, use its skills as designed by the devs, and then be reprimanded by other people for playing that class as intended cause you can do things they cant due to class mechanics and that bothers them.

If they actually decide to nerf/change BLU due to this, then they are capable of balancing it and turning it into a normal job.

You either have unbalanced and limited.
Or
Balanced and normal job.
SE pick one.

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Originally Posted by Melichoir

Imagine taking the time to level and play a class, use its skills as designed by the devs, and then be reprimanded by other people for playing that class as intended cause you can do things they cant due to class mechanics and that bothers them.

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Oh my god. "Repremanded?" You know it's ok to feel remorse when people inform you that you've been making their experience worse right? Like it's a totally healthy response to that kind of social interaction.
No one is jealous. I'd be pissed if my preferred job could oneshot things too.¯\_(ツ)_/¯ (of course, it wouldn't be my preferred job then 'cause I don't quite enjoy not playing the game)

Also, come on, if it was "intended" for blus to be able to interact with random people using their full overpowered kit, they'd be allowed in duty roulettes. Y'all pls.

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Originally Posted by Roda

Imagine going into a savage raid extreme trial where your static insists on bringing a black mage.
And in this scenario xenoglossy does 50% of the bosses hp so you don't even get to see most of the fight.
And only the blackmage gets the book each week totem, and you can only roll greed on drops where the blackmage can roll need whenever.
You're told "just find another static" so you do.
Every static has this setup because it's meta.

That's this.
and the answer to it is "don't play the videogame, or switch to a job you aren't interested in to not play the videogame harder, and we can't fix this because not playing the videogame is this job's identity"

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I get where you are coming from, but the reality is overwod content is a FFA so to speak nor much structure or focus on team play unlike other forms of content that focus on the group aspect.

in short overworld content structure imo should be a free for all. If you are a capable of doing something then do it. You have no obligation to wait for others. The answer is simple do not like being left behind wait or join. Do not a
try to make it so you caanot be left I n the dust. Overworld is not meant to be fair.

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Originally Posted by Roda

Oh my god. "Repremanded?" You know it's ok to feel remorse when people inform you that you've been making their experience worse right? Like it's a totally healthy response to that kind of social interaction.

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Feeling remorse would imply I feel like I did something wrong, like Ive hurt someone or made a mistake and Im sorry about that. I havent. Im playing the game using a class that has certain skill sets and people are complaining about how 'unfair' it is. It would be unfair if only certain people could play the class, but anyone who has a character above 50 or 60 can make one. If youre a sprout, you have more to complain about than anyone who has an 80. And like I said before, dnot give me the 'think of the sprouts' line if youre an 80. Most of you have an issue with it cause BLU 'impedes' your ability to clear the event at the speed you want. It's only a problem cause youre not getting it done as fast as BLU.

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Originally Posted by Roda

No one is jealous. I'd be pissed if my preferred job could oneshot things too.¯\_(ツ)_/¯ (of course, it wouldn't be my preferred job then 'cause I don't quite enjoy not playing the game)

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Im skeptical, but lets say ok. You dont want to one shot. You want everyone to have a fair stab at the fates. Ok. So are you going to a fate and waiting for everyone to show up and then start? Or are you chain pulling? Cause Ive been through a few zones, (azim steppes included where you dont have BLU), and you know what I see? Chain pulling. People dont wait for people to arrive. They just start immediately.

If its about letting everyone have an opportunity at the fates, then you should be waiting so people can maximize silver and gold ratings. But this isnt happening. So its not about that, is it. It's about speed. It's about grinding this event fast. Getting your medals and rewards. And there's nothing wrong with that. But dont advocate to put the breaks on classes that do it better than your preferred class. You want to play DRG or PLD or what not, fine. Go for it. Just understand that people who play BLU are gonna plow through fates faster than you using the skills as they are designed in their kit.

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Originally Posted by Roda

Also, come on, if it was "intended" for blus to be able to interact with random people using their full overpowered kit, they'd be allowed in duty roulettes. Y'all pls.

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There are mechanics pre-built into the game that prevent you from Dooming a target and killing it instantly. They couldve easily applied this to all fates but didnt. Why not? Oh, it's cause they built the class to do just that - kill fates and things rapidly and efficiently.

Imagine complaining that people are playing a job the way it was designed, and what it was designed for.

So far, at least in my experience, most BLUs are using Ram's Voice and Dragon's Voice, usually to the benefit of their party members. I haven't seen anyone "snipe" a Fate yet. I'm sure it is happening somewhere, but I have yet to see it. Still though, I knew that BLU and other jobs would conflict when this event was announced. If they want to keep spamming those 2 moves though? They can go for it. I love the collect fates when there's at least 2 BLUs in the group and you can turn in like, 30 plants, boxes, etc in about 20 seconds. lol

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Originally Posted by Pomelo

If they actually decide to nerf/change BLU due to this, then they are capable of balancing it and turning it into a normal job.

You either have unbalanced and limited.
Or
Balanced and normal job.
SE pick one.

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My thoughts exactly. It's extremely agitating that they'll balance it just to take fun away from it (brush with death lul) but not consider turning it into a real job.

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Originally Posted by Pomelo

If they actually decide to nerf/change BLU due to this, then they are capable of balancing it and turning it into a normal job.

You either have unbalanced and limited.
Or
Balanced and normal job.
SE pick one.

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I love they did balance it but didn't balance it but say they didn't want to but then we have issues where they maybe should. Its just this hilarious jump rope.

Gotta give players the original unbalance they say, then they give players the worst angel whisper in the history of FF games, gotta be balanced for content they say so they add trinity content (mimic spell) and add even more immunities to spells than what the job started with.

I feel like a gremlin that was fed after dark. Just shower me in water now. Hit me with that aqua breath.

In terms of some construction to my salt lol, beyond what I think is a decent concept of 'both' (is both limited and a normal job)- I think the limited side could use further restrictions on FATEs. Such that Blue Mage can destroy FATEs when areas are not overly populated, that the immunities FATEs experience might be increased during high population but will revert on lower population (allowing a blue mage to rofl stomp even major FATE bosses if no one is around, exception to something like Behemoth though).

When back seat driver/shower thinking on blue mage I thought of blue mist as a fun way to lore that concept in. Such that blue mist is rather toxic to those untrained to imbibed and such that the job has a toggle to go from limited to normal based on certain criteria (like not in huge FATE dog piles), such that the blue mage when alone or with other blue mages or 'friends' you can go beast mode but you wouldn't second hand blue mist someone you can't protect. Adding to the carnival aspect in that blue mage is able to show off their skills when they're on the stage and the audience is at a distance, making them good at that concept and adding some baked in job mechanical lore to that idea. So their popularity would be limited if you thought to randomly sprinkle through your army if you didn't trust each blue mage to be very cognizant of their potential friendly harm.

Of course in more detail I think they could use with a mix of limited and normal and the job could have been better designed to allow interesting gameplay sooner (majority of my optimal play of the job has been one or two spells, far more simplistic and less interesting mechanically than actual jobs and that stays true until you get many PF skills) and as it is most often you read 'oooh I'm having so much fun thanks to blue, where in the pinnacle of my play is casting missile over and over and over- i'd hate this super spammy content if I couldn't run it so fast'.

Which to me reads as an example of an issue with old FATE events and how old jobs work with FATEs (just like old dungeons and old jobs), insult to blue that so much hype of the job is around getting to spam a gimmick (hype on that one spell I guess) and that the particular job's hype is coming from acceleration which is in particular an issue because I bet you'd see far less blue mage for things like moogle tomestones or these FATEs if you gave the power to another job to go equally as fast. Which is to say it's not blue mage, it's the speed blue mage provides that is interest for many (from readings why many appreciate/use it). If you made magitek gundam suits that went just as or faster than blue mage I guarantee you (especially if it was faster, even if only slightly) most would be using that then instead (most, not saying all).

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Originally Posted by Melichoir

Imagine taking the time to level and play a class, use its skills as designed by the devs, and then be reprimanded by other people for playing that class as intended cause you can do things they cant due to class mechanics and that bothers them.

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Just like when the servers were melting due to overpopulation the direction of ire should be at SE mostly, can scoff at the players but honestly they're just doing what the system allowed (even in some ways encouraged). The gods of the land that design mechanics rather than those who use what was made for pretty much intended purposes. So in a sense agreeing, but in so much that I think simply issues be redirected to the true source rather than at players doing what the job was designed to do.

It would be nice if players tried to have some awareness of others enjoyment and work as a sort of community but that's never going to happen at a large scale, we've hardly the culture for it like maybe Japan servers.

"My fun over your fun, community be sent to the styx if need be." Also why I liked that quote made earlier about developers having to protect their players lol. Like never assume a player isn't going to do something silly to your interface.

Sometimes there is nothing that can be done but ruin the fun for all, so have to be careful with that of course- there is such a thing as one person ruining for the bunch. Which is why I thought if they are going to make things immune for this event they only do so temporarily.

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Except one has already been confirmed by SE to be griefing, and the other one has been a thing since BLU came out and SE didn't state or "fix the issue" at all whatsoever.

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Because there's been no real reason to do so until now. Original Yokai event was before BLU, as far as I remember.

This hasn't really been brought into the spotlight until now, because now it's actually affecting other players to the point topics like this have gotten made.

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Running away and leashing hunt marks and BLU using BLU skills is comparing apples to oranges. While I may not necessarily agree with certain BLU skills being used, even I can see that.

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If you think something can't be used to intentionally troll just because it's part of someone's skillset, I don't know what to tell you. Haven't you seen all the topics here complaining about Rescue?

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Lets just cut to the chase. Lets just make it so you cant get credit while on BLU. Cause after you cant use missile and similar skills, itll be "Rams Voice to strong and unfair and is finishing fates to fast. Nerf please."

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This won't stop the trolls. Immunity to the instadeath/chunk skills would.

Comparing these skills to Ram's Voice (which isn't even anywhere near as strong as you're implying) is a joke.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

Because there's been no real reason to do so until now. Original Yokai event was before BLU, as far as I remember.



If you think something can't be used to intentionally troll just because it's part of someone's skillset, I don't know what to tell you. Haven't you seen all the topics here complaining about Rescue?

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You are still comparing apples to oranges. BLU was designed to do exactly what it is doing, whether I agree with it or not. Rescue is also a useful tool that a very small minority might use for evil. Also, I have not seen all the topics complaining about Rescue. Actually can't recall seeing one in the last 6 months at least. Feel free to enlighten me though.

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You are still comparing apples to oranges. BLU was designed to do exactly what it is doing, whether I agree with it or not.

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And it's broken. Broken things should get fixed.

FATEs post-ARR are all given immunities to the offending BLU skills for a reason. This is an oversight, period.

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Also, I have not seen all the topics complaining about Rescue.

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Look harder; there's been several. Not going to do your homework for you.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

And it's broken. Broken things should get fixed.

FATEs post-ARR are all given immunities to the offending BLU skills for a reason. This is an oversight, period.

Look harder; there's been several. Not going to do your homework for you.

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I'm not saying that nothing shouldn't be done. I'm just saying that BLU is designed RIGHT NOW to do exactly what it is doing. Obviously some things could and probably should be tweaked.

Also, if you can't provide proof that I have not personally seen in at least half a year then you will have to forgive me if I don't take you seriously. If Rescue was such a problem then I would imagine the forums would be swarming with threads about it.

Laws of overworld content;
-you own nothing,
-you can do whatever is available to you as intended by the devs,
-you can pull what you want,
-you cannot purposefully reset mobs deleting contribution

Blu is not breaking any rules nor is its kit an oversight by the developers, remember before Blu could get to lv60 it could 1 shot things but it was less broken in ARR content than Rdm was, it had everything people are complaining about back then except 51-60 primal skills.

Is it unfair if I wanted to do fates in Asys Lla that I'm stuck at lv60 as Blu but every other job gets to be over lv60?

For the HW zones I used Blu because I could, i Doom'd when I was alone because I could I used my kit as much as possible because I like to try my best while having fun. Tough cookies if others cannot make it to fates I killed, they don't own them just like I don't own them, I am not breaking any rules nor am I being a jerk I'm just playing the game as designed, if others don't make it, oh well, not like I haven't been there before with ARR relic books or anything like that (Eureka cough cough), you just move on, it is less hassle, less drearysome, and far less salty.

Wanting to nerf Blu because it can be the most beneficial for something is stupid, may as well turn every job into a clone of another in its role because can't have a job be more beneficial than another ever can we /s.

Just let Blu have this thing it deserves something. You got 3-4 months plenty of time to get everything, smell the roses if the zerg bothers you.

People really upset that BLU is busted in content it was designed to be busted in. Seems legit. Overworld is BLU territory.

clearly most of the complainers never played ff11 blu on release, it was born to be broken XD

same goes to ff14 blu, hence it's a level limit job. Imagine lv 80 blu with lv 80 blu spells doing lv 80 content in a group of blu. The dream.

Finally, do you know that in some areas bosses are immune to Doom / etc? Find out what those areas are and go to complete fates in those areas.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

I'm not saying that nothing shouldn't be done. I'm just saying that BLU is designed RIGHT NOW to do exactly what it is doing. Obviously some things could and probably should be tweaked.

Also, if you can't provide proof that I have not personally seen in at least half a year then you will have to forgive me if I don't take you seriously. If Rescue was such a problem then I would imagine the forums would be swarming with threads about it.

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He's bringing up Rescue because he hates it and wants to pretend it's a bigger issue than it really is. Blantant case of an interested party tooting their own horn.

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Originally Posted by Nayout

Finally, do you know that in some areas bosses are immune to Doom / etc? Find out what those areas are and go to complete fates in those areas.

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That would be Stormblood as a whole (maybe with the exception of a small part of Fringes).