So now contest prizes can be bought?

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

Of course I can't see all the subscribers in my time playing this game.

However, I've been playing on Balmung (the most populated server by a large margin) since around 2.1. I'd find it hard to believe that no one on Balmung managed to win any of the contests over the past years.

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Not on balmung, but I actually have used the scarf regularly on a character I have on Excalibur. I’ve actually been wanting it for my main for a while.

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Originally Posted by Doozer

So I saw this news and I'm kind of cheesed that there's at least one item that was/is a contest prize that you can just buy with an insignificant amount of gil. Doesn't that kind of ruin the point of having it be a prize altogether?

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No .... /10char

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

Of course I can't see all the subscribers in my time playing this game.

However, I've been playing on Balmung (the most populated server by a large margin) since around 2.1. I'd find it hard to believe that no one on Balmung managed to win any of the contests over the past years.

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I actually won a contest. :3

Link to the picture:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post1703924

Link to contest winners:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...%29-Winners%21

All I got was a crummy necklace that I'm pretty sure I tossed out. lol ;) I'm not one for accessories.

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

I actually won a contest. I believe it was one of the contests held around christmas time. Give me some time and I can find the post :p

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Here it is. ;)

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

Here it is. ;)

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Dang, you're fast! You beat my edit ;) Those were simpler times.

I won the Scarf of Wondrous Wit at the end of 1.0, when GMs would come to you personally to give it to you, while having a little chat with you about the contest and the game. It was something.

I've been using it since 6 years primarily on Miner glamour, it fits the job perfectly, and despite what some said here, it's a very nice good looking scarf, on par with original Tanaka medieval-fantastic artistic direction of the game.
Every time I see someone wearing it, it's the start of a conversation about which contest they won, what kind of work they did and the efforts they put into it. I made some artists friends in the game thanks to that, and I'm since following their work.

It's a prize from competition contests outside the game, and to me, from the country I come from, from its meritocracy model culture I've been raised in, it makes no sense to hand over prizes like this, but then again, I might come from a different culture.

At best, to please people who can't participate to those contests for reasons outside of their reach, handing over Replicas would have been again the right move.

This marks the end of those random encounters and their stories sharing I've been praising from this game. This was a very pleasant way to interact and met new people, just like it was with the White Raven.

I've been doing those community contests for many pleasurable reasons, but when you remove any one of those reasons, it's not engaging enough any more.
Knowing prizes will be handed over like this from now on, kills the motivation. The same way it kills the motivation of people right now about tackling Ultimate, because they have the legit feeling they'll get defraud in the end.

FFXIV needs more incentives to pull people up, to motivate players into engaging themselves in challenging contents, and this works against that, this only comfort people into their torpidity attitude of "I'll wait for the nerf, unsync, echo, or events to get those prizes for free, etc.".

So much potential wasted.

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Originally Posted by Amiral_Benson

I've been doing those community contests for many pleasurable reasons, but when you remove any one of those reasons, it's not engaging enough any more.
Knowing prizes will be handed over like this from now on, kills the motivation. The same way it kills the motivation of people right now about tackling Ultimate, because they have the legit feeling they'll get defraud in the end.

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I feel like that will depend on the person. I've never actually got around to entering any of the competitions, but I've intended to, and the prize wasn't a motivator at all. Maybe if there was a prize I actually wanted it would remind me to get around to it, but as it was, I'd be entering just because I had a good idea for an entry and wanted to show it off.

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

Of course I can't see all the subscribers in my time playing this game.

However, I've been playing on Balmung (the most populated server by a large margin) since around 2.1. I'd find it hard to believe that no one on Balmung managed to win any of the contests over the past years.

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That doesn't mean anything, we have 3 data centers and how many servers? You could be on the largest server but if people are wearing it on another server, what does being on the largest server really mean? Especially if the item was rare at the time.

SE still hasn’t learned and this is just another example of it.The encentive and community is gone and now it’s become cash shop / everyone gets a participation trophy wow clone. Good job SE , I see a lot more players post about leaving the game in your future ;)

There's nothing for them to learn. Contest winners enjoyed a period of exclusivity and they still have their names preserved on the news pages devoted to revealing the winning entries. That should be more than enough.

I'm curious, though...is anyone really going to quit the game over this or is it a hollow threat?

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I'm curious, though...is anyone really going to quit the game over this or is it a hollow threat?

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Over this exactly? who knows?

But it is a part of a bigger problem and I do believe that it is one that many players do in fact leave the game over even if many don't actually say it on the forums. That problem is the general lack of reward or satisfaction from playing the game. It has a trend of destroying the significance of any trophy's and achievements players do earn by essentially handing them out to everyone and that in turn destroys any sense of value they have. You start giving trophies out to everyone and they become worthless junk in a game where everything else is already worthless junk and that all adds up to an overall unrewarding experience and ultimately pushes players away.

It's also bad for the game because as has been said before it does not entince players into improving themselves (and as a result improving the community as a whole) in an effort to earn whatever rewards they may desire when they know they'll basically get handed them at a later date for basically nothing.... So instead of helping players rise up and overcome challenges this game basically says "don't worry here you go.." and it destroys the satisfaction or the sense of accomplishment that comes from earning them. I genuinely believe that's a big reason why the games has so many issues keeping players subscribed.

It's been said so many times on the forums and elsewhere that one of the big reasons players don't take on the challenges in the game is because the rewards aren't worth the effort and they know they'll be nerfed to hell and the rewards will be significantly easier to get in a couple of patches... Players might want a mount but why bother with the ex primal? we can wait a month they'll add echo or even another month and we can over power it. or even unsync it...

I also think its a big part of why no matter what the devs try to do to reduce the huge skill gap they're always trying to close it only gets wider and wider, because the devs do it the worng way.. What they try and do is instead of bring the bottom players up through content they try and bring the top players down.

But the top players just smash the roof literally and continue to climb up. It's what they did with savage. You can argue participaion is up but that's because rather than help players improve they instead made savage easier and by making it easier they also made it feel less rewarding to clear. Which in turn makes the game less satisfying and again if players don't find it rewarding or satisfying they simply don't stick around for the most part...

4.4 isn't far away and you can bet that when it lands players will have roflstomped there way through all its content in a single day cleared alphascape effortlessly and generally be left feeling is that all we got..... wow this patch sucks...

They really not to stop with the handout policy and actually let trophies and rewards actually mean something. Rather than just basically hand em out to everyone.

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Originally Posted by Amiral_Benson

FFXIV needs more incentives to pull people up, to motivate players into engaging themselves in challenging contents, and this works against that, this only comfort people into their torpidity attitude of "I'll wait for the nerf, unsync, echo, or events to get those prizes for free, etc."

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QFT if people want the rewards or trophies they should go out and get them instead of waiting to be handed them for basically nothing

People acting like others really care about their "exclusive" items.
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/e4/c6...f276abbb43.png

Once again... I'm going to quote the Yoshida post from the White Raven thread...

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Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

-snip-

- Plans for the Future
Although some players were of the opinion that the reward was not an issue, many others voiced their disappointment. And the fact that these players came forth is evidence that we failed to give the matter due consideration.

Our legacy players have memories that are tied to that earlier time─I was reminded that the excitement and pride they experienced in acquiring the White Ravens is bound up in the item itself, regardless of its stats or appearance. I, myself, am the sort of person who separates the experience from the physical reward, but that doesn't excuse the failure to consider those who feel otherwise. I intend to learn from this lesson moving forward, and continue to develop FFXIV as a game that everyone can enjoy.

-snip-

FINAL FANTASY XIV Producer and Director, Naoki Yoshida

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To re-iterate...
I have won multiple in-game contests and I am not offended, disappointed, disapproving (or any other negative word) of the inclusion of the Scarf of Wondrous wit in the inventory of the Itinerant Moogles.

These contests are meant to be fun, and they help to break up the monotonous schedules that many players (including myself) can sometimes fall in. I can look back at each of my winning entries and distinctly remember the scenarios involved in setting each of them up.


Memories of Eorzea Screenshot Contest (NA) | Winners | My Entry
** This was the first Screenshot contest I participated in. The Gold Saucer GATEs were the first experience I had with jump puzzles in FFXIV... and I was really bad at them at the time. I've gotten way better at them since then (I finished all the current sightseeing log entries and got most of the way up the recent Moonfire Faire tower).

Cartographers and Seekers Contest (NA) | Winners | My Entry | My Answer | My Seeker
** I had a lot of fun with the set up for this contest. First with coming up with location, and then seeing the result. The person that deciphered my map also won a prize. I have never met or communicated with this player in game, our sole interaction was through this contest. However, through some bizarre osmosis they also featured the exact same emote I used when taking my answer photos (which I had taken at the same time that I took the photos for my map).

Airship Components: Research and Development Contest (NA) | Winners | My Entry
** Another contest I had a lot of fun with despite my initial hesitance about the "creative writing" aspect of it. It also took a deceptive amount of time since I was using the Unending Journey to get some of my pictures. Theres no way to fast forward or rewind within cutscenes, so I had to repeat each of them many times to get the exact frames I wanted to use (plus extra options jic...).


I have also failed to win just as many contests as I have won, yet I can even look back at those failed entries and recall the process fondly. In fact, many of my "failed entries" are bit more memorable to me as many of my friends were involved in those, some of which have retired from FFXIV since (one friend has even passed away).

"Do You Even /Pose?" Showdown! (NA) | My Entry
** This was a spur of the moment idea that came to me while pondering what I would do for my entry. Wulgaru just happened to spawn, and since the contest allowed for multiple players to win prizes on each entry I thought I would try to include some of my close S Rank hunting allies in my entry for fun. Lek forgot to unselect Wulgaru before emoting and Kata hadn't completed the event yet... Lek also called it so I had a limited amount of time to take pics before the horde descended upon the position and killed tree...

Bright-Eyed Superstars Contest (NA) | My Entry
** Another entry where multiple people could have won a prize. I decided to make this into an FC affair and included my sister and Ark in my entry. I don't know Ark in real life, only in game, but he was typically more serious and had a "macho" persona. He got our FC's Workshop up to date (crafted mats for 3/4 airships all by himself) back in HW. Then suddenly he just disappeared... to this day I have no idea what became of him. Hopefully he just decided to set the game aside to focus on school/work... That is why I'll always remember this time I made him put on a foofoo outfit so I could take "pehtures for contest!"

And... Action! Screenshot Contest (NA) | My Entry
** If there was one contest that I was actually "bitter" about losing it would have been this one. Most of my screenshots would probably considered gravure... but I attributed that to difficulty involved with taking clean screenshots of battle abilities. I often requested this feature before it was finally added to /gpose... so this was supposed to be my moment to show off... However this loss inspired me to keep at it and to push my action shot ideas even further...


Thus...
Other players having access to the items can never devalue the experiences I had when participating in these contests. I am absolutely fine with a period of exclusivity of in-game items. My hope is that this will mean that the scarf is retired from the prize pool after this and some new shiny is added to chase after in the future.

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Originally Posted by Nariel

People acting like others really care about their "exclusive" items.

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It’s not exclusive though. It was always available. If you entered any contest here on the forums you literally could have won it.

I doubt the people who care about this care as much about exclusivity as you make out. It’s like what was said above; if you can eventually get the item you want by just waiting until it’s handed to you, why put in the effort. It’s a larger problem with the game’s current direction as a whole.

As someone who has a few item's that are supposed to be exclusive i would agree with the OP it would kinda piss me off if they just started reselling things that shouldn't be resold. They already rereleased a moogle hat (i wasn't too upset about that one since they changed the pom color to yellow while the pre-order one like i have has a red pom), but i will say if they rerelease the cait sith minion i have, or the mandragora necklace i got from a contest i would probably be pretty pissed off and i would guess there would be at least a little backlash at SE over it. Regardless SE does what it wants so all we can really do is hope they don't do what we each don't want them to do. At the end of the day i will keep playing because i love how cute my lala looks and i love glamouring and relic grinding and those are things that will always be a part of the game.

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Originally Posted by MuseTraveller

You could no longer obtain the earrings through any means. The contest prizes can be won through occasional contests. It's not really the same case. But if gloating makes you feel better, go ahead.
Unless they make all contest prizes available and show new prizes items for next contests, this feels like an error they made. But still as someone who had won contests before, I honestly don't care as much. I don't think it's right but I won't throw a fit cause someone bought a fancy item for 50 gil that I've had for over a year. I had my thrill for winning, I had my fun by participating and I enjoyed and still enjoy the item I won.

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I both agree and dissagree with you. I think they need to leave it in a way that the people who actually worked or won their item can still prove that it was obtained that way. Kind of like how the reselling of the pre-order moogle hats had different color poms. It allows people who werent there to get it finally obtain it now, but at the same time it didnt entirely ruin it for the people who liked the feeling of being an owner of an exclusive item. there's no reason they can't do things like that to keep both sides happy and there is no reason what that shouldn't make both sides happy simply because the color is different or something.

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

Yeah, the Itinerant Moogles have shown up periodically, previously selling the Bomb, Slime, and Cactuar earrings. And I think maybe something else.

Greater point, tho, is nothing is guaranteed permanently exclusive. And, frankly, if you're putting such a huge amount of significance on having a game item that other people don't, maybe you're taking the game a little too seriously. Other people having items that you have does not have any impact on the game for you. Play the game. Enjoy the game. Quit worrying so much about what other players do or have.

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Not that i don't agree with what your trying to say or that i care extremely about the rarity of my items to the point that i would ragequit, however i think the part where you say "does not have any impact on the game for you" is incorrect as you cannot determine for other people what impacts the game for them. Everyone plays games for different reasons and have fun in said game for different content or reasons. Meaning if someone does actually have fun or like the game alot because of rare item collecting than that in itself impacts the fun and gameplay for them. That in itself can mean everything to someone. As i said, you cannot dictate what is and isn't for other people. Only yourself.

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Originally Posted by Doozer

It's funny that you say "play the game, enjoy the game" when what's fun for me is having an item that I earned with a skill that I have outside of playing the game that shows that I was able to win something. It's not about them not having it, it's about it not having the same worth and having someone look at my character with it and go "oh wow they must've won a contest". Now it's just another item. Rarity and uniqueness has value.

The same would apply if my real life accomplishments were given to everyone as well. I was chosen to have one of my real life photos on a soda label recently, which only less than 1% of submissions ever get. Over a million photos have been submitted in the past, and mine was one of the ~1,000 or so ever chosen. That's a big deal to me because it means my entry must've been noteworthy, which is a reflection of my skill. If every entry was used it wouldn't be an accomplishment. The same applies to the prizes I win for screenshot (and creative writing) contests.

Taking prizes and making them purchasable by anyone defeats the purpose of entering at all, if you can just buy it in a few months or a year anyway.

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I 110% agree with you on this, The guy you are quoting (Hasrat) seems to me like one of those people who think everyone should get a participation trophy and no one should get a trophy for actually winning because they worked harder than others and practiced or had skill. Nothing has meaning in this world anymore if everyone is handed the exact same things in life, and it amazes me that people cannot understand this as it should be common sense. Not everyone plays for the same reasons as they do. I play mostly for glamour, relic grinding, and rare item collecting, and because i love that aspect about the game and put in the extra effort to do that kind of thing i have something to show for it. When SE starts taking that away from me and giving it to everyone at basically no work or cost to them, then how would people or SE expect me and people like me to feel? The answer should be obvious really.

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Originally Posted by Zephanoa

I am of the thought that everyone should be able to enjoy all things in the game at some point or another. Digital exclusivity doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me but I am from a different era of folks. This happened before and will continue to happen.

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Even if i didn't care, which i do. I still think what is mostly wrong here is that they SAY something is exclusive and then go back on that later. That in itself is wrong in principle. It's like false advertising just to get customers in the door in a way. I play game's mostly because i like rare items, and looking shiny. When SE advertises the possibility of that to me in their game and i play their game, then they go back on that. I believe that is called a bait and switch or something along those lines. I don't believe it's right for everyone to be handed the same exact thing in life regardless of how much more or less they worked. Just because you and/or others don't have issues with this kind of thing, does not mean that people who think on the oposite side of the spectrum from you are invalid or unjustified in their own opinions as well.

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Originally Posted by Darrcyphfeid

It's all digital anyway, no point putting in any sort of work. No point paying $30 for that mount, $18 for that outfit, spending $13 a month on that dress-up simulator.

Right? Right?

This argument is old, it's tired and it's dumb. If everything from community contests to the highest echelons of raids mean nothing, where's the carrot that makes people stay?

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You sir, hit the nail on the head! ^_^

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

If you don't agree with it, you don't have to buy it. It's optional. Isn't the the excuse so many SE white knight fan boys like to trot out whenever something controversial is released by SE?

Same thing regarding these items. If it offends your sensibilities so much, don't buy them. But it's not your place to tell other people what they should or should not enjoy.

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"If you don't agree with it, you don't have to buy it. It's optional." <-----if everyone took that advice from you then i would assume theres a chance SE would loose a good portion of profit from it. Be careful what you suggest to others ;)

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Originally Posted by Dzian

It has a trend of destroying the significance of any trophy's and achievements players do earn by essentially handing them out to everyone and that in turn destroys any sense of value they have.

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Has this gotten players to do Feast? (exclusive things as rewards over nine seasons) no.
Is it getting them do to Hunts? (exclusive mount) No, I come across a-ranks unmolested whenever I gather.
Ex trials and Savage? (exclusive weapons, gear, mounts.) Not particularly in large numbers. Most people would argue its something you do ins pite of rewards really.
Ultimate? No.

I mean, the bigger problem is rewards as incentives in general don't work, not that they hand them out like candy. You do stuff in this game more as something to do, more than they value the rewards. And they have no real value anyways, in fact the rarer the uglier they often are.

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Originally Posted by Hazmick

I can see where people are coming from with regards to NOT wanting these things to be available to everyone, but I also think the Goobbue earring is absolutely adorable so I'm happy to hear that I'll be able to get one ^_^

The best way to ease the heat on the topic would be to give the non-prize items a different name to the prize items, just so people who've won a contest can display that fact while others get to wear cute clothes that make them happy.

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Exactly, and theres no good reasons for anyone to dissagree with this. So what if the name is slightly different or color is. I mean if you still have an issue after that, then to those people wanting it apparently they lied and it wasn't simply about having the item, it was about ruining its exclusivity to the people who worked for it. In which case i will say this "get off the forums trolls"

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Originally Posted by Sakuraluna

It’s not exclusive though. It was always available. If you entered any contest here on the forums you literally could have won it.

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Yup, they where gifts, bonus reward with a certain emotional value to the winner.

Won't cry a river if someone buy a coffee cup I eventually win in "whatever random contest", its still a cup I win and he/she will have a cup he/she find nice.

All I can see its people complaigning about items they probably will never notice on somebody else cause they don't care more than others care about an earring cause you barely see them at all. Its about personal emotional value they put in it. Sooooo... Whatever, let people have their cute little item and brag about how you get it as a prize.

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

Has this gotten players to do Feast? (exclusive things as rewards over nine seasons) no.

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False. It did get people to do the Feast. When they made the two minions (Faepup and Hellpup) available again via achievements, people did Feast then too. When they released Garo, people did Frontlines and Feast in droves. Some people are still plucking away at Garo stuff, or at the very least still running around with the titles equipped.

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Is it getting them do to Hunts? (exclusive mount) No, I come across a-ranks unmolested whenever I gather.

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False. Many fights have arisen over the hunts, and there was (still is on some servers, probably) trolling/poaching happening because of the Centurio Tiger.

Do people care so much about SB A Ranks that, if nothing else, take longer to kill outside of hunt season? Probably not.

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Ex trials and Savage? (exclusive weapons, gear, mounts.) Not particularly in large numbers. Most people would argue its something you do ins pite of rewards really.

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Way, way false. The only reason people do EX Primals is because of the mounts, with a select few doing them for desynth or Gil (craft material) purposes. Hunting the ARR horses was one of the main attractions in the downtime leading up to HW release.

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You do stuff in this game more as something to do, more than they value the rewards.

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Nah man, ain't nobody doing 90% of the stuff in this game for the stuff in the game. They're doing it for what rewards they get - Tomestones, minions, mounts, glamours, gear.

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Originally Posted by Darrcyphfeid

False. It did get people to do the Feast.

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Nope, Feast has been hardcore dead even with Garo. Garo only required Feast participation for one mount, with 20 wins. Most of the rewards were gotten easier with Frontlines.

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Do people care so much about SB A Ranks that, if nothing else, take longer to kill outside of hunt season? Probably not.

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...you need 3000 A ranks to get the tiger. Also it's all A-ranks, I been gathering in ARR zones too.

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Way, way false. The only reason people do EX Primals is because of the mounts, with a select few doing them for desynth or Gil (craft material) purposes. Hunting the ARR horses was one of the main attractions in the downtime leading up to HW release.


Nah man, ain't nobody doing 90% of the stuff in this game for the stuff in the game. They're doing it for what rewards they get - Tomestones, minions, mounts, glamours, gear.

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The mounts are just pallete swaps. None of them have any added functionality, even compared to holiday mounts, and virtually every ex primal's participation quickly tapers off in 2 weeks. Even unsynced, you're still not seeing a lot of people doing them for the mounts. To expand though, I mean the mounts and exclusive haven't been a real draw to populate the mode. Even the exclusive God Kefka fight hasn't really increased desire to do it I think; i notice in PF the pug requests have been more or less consistent in number all of SB. There's rarely a time when they get up to 3 pages in Primal for example.

As for tomes...its literally something to do. You can do just about anything as a casual with crafted armor or the initial tier armor; the highest tome stuff is not going to really help anything. The tome armor actually isn't useful in any real sense; even now I can just use my augmented 360 armor as a tank in most casual content, and be fine. the 10 ilvl really isn't a carrot, because its gains are so modest that they may as well not be there for some. The only real exception are crafting and gathering armor.

I mean, you play the things more because you find them fun. This is Pagos in a nutshell, isn't it? The rewards aren't enough. The Boss Fates for example are the same, they all give nice rewards but no one does them.

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Originally Posted by Nariel

Yup, they where gifts, bonus reward with a certain emotional value to the winner.

Won't cry a river if someone buy a coffee cup I eventually win in "whatever random contest", its still a cup I win and he/she will have a cup he/she find nice.

All I can see its people complaigning about items they probably will never notice on somebody else cause they don't care more than others care about an earring cause you barely see them at all. Its about personal emotional value they put in it. Sooooo... Whatever, let people have their cute little item and brag about how you get it as a prize.

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Your previous statement was that people were upset over an exclusive being made unexclusive. I was correcting you; it’s not exclusive and has been available for years. You’re thinking of this in the same mindframe of the white ravens where their release is diminishing their worth as an exclusive shiny that only those who had it from x moment in the game’s history should ever have access to it, while I view it as closer to players doing recently-added content, some even hardcore content, only to wake up the next morning to find it being sold on a moogle for 30 Gil (The scarf was even set to be distributed to the newly-announced winners of the most recent contest). Not the same thing obviously, but imo a bit more similar in value.

Realistically, you’d eventually start to think, what’s the point. I can either put in the effort now, or spend the 30 Gil in a day or so, and in a game that is already designed around steep vertical progression, it not only diminishes the value of the item, but it diminishes the value of gameplay itself. I don’t think it would have mattered at all if the playerbase were made aware of these reward changes far enough ahead of time, and/or if the moogle sold a “replica” of the item. They definitely shouldn’t have left current contest winners scrambling to select a different reward. That just seems disrespectful to the player base.

It’s not about the item. It’s not about the exclusivity. It’s about taking a reward that people were actively working toward and without warning, handing it out to everybody for minimal cost and effort.

I assume the scarf is on there because almost no one picks that as a reward when entering contests.

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Originally Posted by Lissandra

I assume the scarf is on there because almost no one picks that as a reward when entering contests.

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You know, I'm beginning to think likewise... almost every contest has the face scarf as a prize and it does not seem to be a particularly popular favourite.

are those contest prizes? I seem to have all of them but the moogle and never entered a contest

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Originally Posted by Nihility

are those contest prizes? I seem to have all of them but the moogle and never entered a contest

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The scarf is. It’s the only one for the time being.

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

Nope, Feast has been hardcore dead even with Garo. Garo only required Feast participation for one mount, with 20 wins. Most of the rewards were gotten easier with Frontlines.

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Garo is also more than two years old at this point! lol

That does not change the fact that all of what I said is true, that each of those things did initially, and for varying lengths of time, provide massive influxes of players. And not because they enjoyed PvP, oh no far from it, but because they wanted the rewards. EXP the biggest reward of all, more recently.

Rest in the spoiler tag since it has almost nothing to do with the contest prize topic itself.

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...you need 3000 A ranks to get the tiger. Also it's all A-ranks, I been gathering in ARR zones too.

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I'm well aware how many kills are required. I can only speak about my own server and what I've heard about other servers; I have no context for your gathering schedule or how frequently you do or do not stumble upon ARR and HW A Ranks.

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The mounts are just pallete swaps. None of them have any added functionality, even compared to holiday mounts, and virtually every ex primal's participation quickly tapers off in 2 weeks.

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Okay? The primal mounts are the most requested mounts to be able to fly by a wide margin too, pallete swap or no. And you know why? Because people like them. And because they play the music from the related Primals, presumably.

EX Primals have a large drop off after a couple weeks because the weapons are no longer the best available and the smell of "new content!" fades. They would drop off entirely and be completely dead if not for the mounts.

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Even unsynced, you're still not seeing a lot of people doing them for the mounts.

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Uh... Err. When's the last time you've looked at party finder, by chance? I still see tons of bird farms, and obviously wolf farms. I don't see very many pony farms by virtue of most of those being very easy solos, and that whole 6 or so month period where Wondrous Tails was all the rage.

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To expand though, I mean the mounts and exclusive haven't been a real draw to populate the mode. Even the exclusive God Kefka fight hasn't really increased desire to do it I think; i notice in PF the pug requests have been more or less consistent in number all of SB. There's rarely a time when they get up to 3 pages in Primal for example.

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Very few people are going to challenge an at-level raid tier for a mount or minion when they know they can unsync it and skip a lot of the more dangerous/annoying mechanics in the next expansion. That's kind of the argument being made here. More people, even if "more" is literally just "one person," may be inclined to at least try for them if they didn't lose value as quickly as the raid tier itself did.

There's also the bit where raiding in this game has a stigma associated with it.

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The tome armor actually isn't useful in any real sense; even now I can just use my augmented 360 armor as a tank in most casual content, and be fine.

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I assume by augmented 360 you mean the crafted gear turn-in stuff, which I must point out that the overwhelming majority of the community doesn't have access to/use that stuff. If they did, floors 1 through 3 of the NM raid would die after the first week because no one would need to farm the lenses, cranks, etc.

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I mean, you play the things more because you find them fun.

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This is an entirely different argument, though. One that I obviously don't disagree with.

The rewards - the mounts, minions, etc - exist to get people to try new things. If they like them, they may stick around after getting the thing they want just because they enjoy it. And they'll be more readily accepting of similar things. But to get them in the door, to get them interested, takes incentivizing. Likewise, removing the value of items can just as easily discourage them - even if it's something they like. You need look no further than the PvP community for that; why should they bust their ***es with little or no support from Square, even in crucial areas like cheating, if Square's just going to turn around and give their hard earned items away for nothing?

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

As for tomes...its literally something to do.

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It's a reward and thus the reason players do things. this would most recently be highlighted with the raid roulettes. i mean 24 man raids have always been "something to do" but noone ever did them and queue times were horrible..

add a raid roulette and throw people some tomes or a huge chunk of exp if they need it and queue times have shrunk massively. yet those 24 mans are still "something to do"

I'm pretty sure if you took away the tomes and exp rewards from roulettes queue times would be horrendous. those roulettes would still be "something to do" but without the rewards noone would touch them.

In the end, its not like they will take back YOUR prize to give it to someone, they are not erasing your name from the victory board nor they take your memory of you winning/doing the thing years ago, its not like you can actualy sell those for bazillion of gils or even real curency.

So why do you care ? people aren't gonna love them as much as you do, most of people won't even wear them cause, lets be honnest fashion wise they aren't that good looking for the most part even the scarf look like you take it from one of the Dalton brother's.

Most people in game don't care much about contest, I don't even recall of people asking for them as much as you ask for them to stay your little ego token.

Oh and i'm sure if they don't offer any gift for a contest people are still gonna do it cause people like to win. People do in game fight for the prize cause winning over a old easy instance isn't worth as much as winning a one time contest.

People do sport even when they don't fight over the world cup aren't they ?

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Originally Posted by Nariel

People do sport even when they don't fight over the world cup aren't they ?

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I don't think the players would be happy if anyone could suddenly buy original World Cup trophies at a kiosk though, right?

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Originally Posted by Nariel

Most people in game don't care much about contest, I don't even recall of people asking for them as much as you ask for them to stay your little ego token.

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If no one wants them, then why is Square giving them away? Isn't that worse? :p

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People do sport even when they don't fight over the world cup aren't they ?

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We talking professional athletes here? 'Cause... they get paid money to play. And in the pursuit of becoming a professional player, people put up with a lot of crap (see: hubbub surrounding NCAA). They're also incentivized by things like scholarships.

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

I don't think the players would be happy if anyone could suddenly buy original World Cup trophies at a kiosk though, right?

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Buyer wouldn't earn it so why the bother ? He won't care for it as much as the player who won the championship do nor people enjoying the match, player would still be able to play the championship for the trophies and for winning over the others.

Trophies have no value beside the one you give to it, if seeing other buy trophies impact that much your love for your feat then it probably don't worth that much to you at all.

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Originally Posted by Darrcyphfeid

If no one wants them, then why is Square giving them away? Isn't that worse? :

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Dunno', i'm not part of the staff, its not even a new thing in the game.

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Originally Posted by Nariel

People do sport even when they don't fight over the world cup aren't they ?

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To use your World Cup example though;

Imagine that your team won the World Cup. You all put in a lot of sweat and tears this year and are proud of your achievement and excited to receive your award. But then right as you’re being awarded it is announced that every team who participated this year will have the opportunity to buy the same trophy stating that they won this year. Next year, the trophy will have a new design. How would you feel?

Now, imagine if the World Cup trophy had been redesigned and given a distinct appearance, and that everyone was aware of this new design ahead of time. Since your team won, you’ll be the first to receive the new trophy. Immediately afterward, the old design will be sold as a novelty. Would this be an issue?

That’s the point I’m trying to make. It’s not about the item. I don’t care if someone else has a scarf that looks exactly like mine. It’s not about exclusivity. The item has always been readily available to anyone who cared to enter a contest and request it as a prize. It’s continued to be available even right up until the moogle announcement. It’s literally about the way SE has handled the situation.

I mean, I don’t even know if we’ve been informed whether the scarf is being retired as a contest prize. I know the Cloud hair will be offered, but for all I know about the scarf, it could still be on the list for the next contest. I feel like any unhappiness about this could have been fixed by a little more transparency from SE from the get-go, as well as better planning on phasing out game content.

Why should I care if the other get a trophies if I win, I'm the winner, they get a trophie but still loose, they'll get to see this trophy et remember how I beat them that day, sweet sweet memories. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Annnnnd for the way they handle it I don't see the problem like... at all. But to be fair I don't care about prizes or upcoming contest.

I still have my old i95 allagan monk fists from turn 5. I've kept them ever since I got them on my first clear yeeeaaars ago when it was the only raid we had. Literally anybody can get them now, heck people can get Bette dyeable versions of them. I'll always hold on to mine though, because of the memories attached to them.

That's the important part, it's the memories, never the item.

You want to talk about 1.0 items and stuff, I'm a 1.0 player and I don't care if they gave everyone everything, chocobo, legacy mark, whatever. I still have my memories of playing it, I still love to share the experiences I had playing that really weird game, like not being able to clear a knee ledge.

I think people that heavily value items, that seek to use them to feel superior to others, have their priorities... misaligned. It's a cooperative game at it's heart, not a competitive one.