Bunny outfits for men, not a cryptid!

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

It's the truth. Now that they actually did it, watching all the people shocked at what they got and desperately trying to make a version attractive to and will be worn by straights is pretty humorous. I think its perfectly fine they did it the way they did it. I do think a lot of people got a bit of an education in what happens when you ask for something, though.

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Okay, let's take a moment to review why what you're saying is not okay.


There are plenty of masculine gay men out in the world with absolutely zero interest in wearing women's clothing. Saying this is "the gays" is painting with too wide a brush.

Calling people "straights" is literally no better than calling people "gays", you're assuming common ground across a sexuality that you just aren't going to find all the time.

You're needlessly offending people and not making any points. You're contributing nothing to this discussion. You're spreading ideas that frankly don't need any more traction than they already have. You're derailing the topic. Stop, please, this mess doesn't need to be worse and it certainly doesn't have to broaden to drag in irl lgbt issues.

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Originally Posted by Lilseph

The mandatory "blame Balmung" post.

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Yes, and?
https://i.imgur.com/A9rTdOk.jpg

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

Well, then you are going to have fun telling me who exactly wanted this bunny suit now that I am wrong, since everyone seems to be horrified it exists, lol. As for contrarian voices, eh no one wants those.

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The people who kept asking for it? They're out there. Those requests didn't come from nowhere. Other people didn't want it and don't like it, which is true of basically everything except the Carbuncle slippers. (those things are weaponized adorable)

The idea that it was "the gays" is foolish. We have no way of knowing that, and no community that size is homogeneous enough to have a single opinion on anything.

Well this devolved quickly. Whoo boy.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

It's especially jarring when you consider pieces of gear like the coliseum chestpiece. That does a good job at showing off the male form in a way that is sexy and conventionally attractive. I'd also point to games such as Overwatch and Soul Calibur as examples of fan service done well for male characters. McCree's lifeguard outfit is very easy on the eyes and shows off a lot of his physique. In one of the recent trailers for Soul Calibur 6, meanwhile, Mitsurugi loses more and more of his armour during battle and he's, uh, packing in his loincloth...and his muscles are shown off pretty nicely.

I'm tired of so much focus being placed on feminine gear/hairstyle options for male characters in FFXIV.

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As a Soul Calibur fan: YES! Like don't just study other games to figure out the combat mechanics and QoL stuff you want in the game. Study other games to check out their take on character designs!

I mean...even within Final Fantasy games themselves, the men have always rode that line between macho and traditional effeminate beauty. But they still look masculine. I mean look at the Dissidia design for Cecil: despite being beautiful enough to put women to shame, there's no denying he's a man. Now look at men like Jecht, Sephiroth, or even some of the good guys like Snow, Squall, etc. There's already examples from the franchise of varying degrees of masculinity that all work that many men and women find highly attractive. Use those ideas as inspiration.

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Originally Posted by MoroMurasaki

Okay, let's take a moment to review why what you're saying is not okay.

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No, it's not okay because at this rate we're just going to erase the people who actually wanted this in favor of everyone else who is horrified they actually did it, because it's not attractive to them. I'll try to use blander language, but if you were serious about wanting an actual male bunny suit, you had to know that implementing it would tend to the drag and the camp. These concepts simply aren't attractive to the mainstream of people. The bunny archetype is probably one of the least male-friendly ones out there in a mainstream sense; I only know of a handful of male characters who even use it, one ridiculous (rabbit from zodiac wars) and one who just has bunny ears tacked on (the rabbit character from Alice in the land of Clover, who wears a full suit with ears on the hat.) Use it in the same way as the suit; many just essentially would have made it into the equivalent of a moogle or pig suit, i.e. stuffed animal. The mainstream really doesn't seem to link this archetype with men in the same way it does with women, which leads to dissonance when some do.

And this mainstream is very much in this thread pointing out why it is not attractive to them. This is okay, because everyone has that right. But we apparently can't even say who did mostly find this attractive enough to push for it, and who will wear it in game. This is going to lead to "oh, everyone is horrified it exists, delete balmung." It reminds you that you really exist on the sufferance of the mainstream community, who despite not wanting this and not finding it attractive, is trying to push for things that will be that way.

This bunny suit is fine, the audience who asked for it will enjoy it and like it. The people who don't, well, next time you want something attractive to you, don't try to hitch onto something that by nature isn't, ask for your own things.

I, for one, am extatic about this outfit finally being available for men and I will happily grind MGP for my male characters to wear it. Cheers!

Well, I'm glad they finally made something after so much time.
Since they weren't going to change the design I'm puzzled they didn't just release the ears earlier to appease people while they worked on the rest of the outfit since I doubt that would have taken much time in modeling adjustments.

Earliest reference to the male bunny suit being worked on I could find is a Japanese interview from 2016: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...5217-MAN-BUNNY
Some races were confirmed to be done sometime in 2017: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-Bunny-Outfit
And the fan requests have been around since the female outfits were added in 2015: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-Boys-Please-3

Even if it was a side project it's crazy how long this took to get done.

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

No, it's not okay because at this rate we're just going to erase the people who actually wanted this in favor of everyone else who is horrified they actually did it, because it's not attractive to them. I'll try to use blander language, but if you were serious about wanting an actual male bunny suit, you had to know that implementing it would tend to the drag and the camp, which favors a certain audience. This audience finds things attractive that it isn't popular for the mainstream.

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I feel like I need to put "I don't care about the bunny suit" in my signature for the duration of this thread. Not your fault I know, I'm just tired of typing it.

My only problem is that you're still trying to make this an issue that has it's roots in a certain sexuality. It isn't. The more typically masculine glams like the ones Miste put up or the pictures of buff, shirtless men appeal to anyone into buff, shirtless men. That includes a lot of gay men but also a lot of straight women.

This isn't a matter of you using 'spicy' language but rather of you trying to pawn off the interest in this on gay people. We have seen even in this very thread people from multiple demographics dissatisfied with the bunny suit that came out, some people intending to use it for humorous purposes and some people who are fans of it. I'm willing to bet not all of any of those camps belong to one combo of gay man or straight woman or whatever.

Different people like different things. Implying gay people like men in womens clothing is like saying straight men like women in feminine clothing - sure, some do. Some like tomboys. Some women like women in feminine clothing too. There are lots of different groups of people who have a stake in this. That is the point I'm trying to make you see.

Stereotypes are dumb.

Did they really put clothing that was molded for female shape and jsut slapped it on male body? is this some kind of delayed April fool prank?

*looks for official announcement*

Edit:
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/
didn't find anything

Am I???? The only one??? who actually prefers that the male bunny suit is exactly the same as the female version??? To me it actually looks like something attractive and I feel like if they'd changed it to be more masculine then it would look ridiculous... Though at the same time I happen to find men in feminine clothing attractive so who knows.

Now when do the guys get dresses? Gimme. Now.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Did they really put clothing that was molded for female shape and jsut slapped it on male body? is this some kind of delayed April fool prank?

*looks for official announcement*

Edit:
https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/
didn't find anything

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It's footage from PAX East.
Here's the front look, by the way:

https://i.imgur.com/OnPNn8b.jpg

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Originally Posted by Moomba33

Well, I'm glad they finally made something after so much time.
Since they weren't going to change the design I'm puzzled they didn't just release the ears earlier to appease people while they worked on the rest of the outfit since I doubt that would have taken much time in modeling adjustments.

Even if it was a side project it's crazy how long this took to get done.

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The obvious answer is that for a while they didn't want to. At some point they changed their minds, but it never became a high priority item. Guess someone had time to work on it.

Often something takes little time to do but just never gets high enough on the queue to get any work put in because management doesn't consider it important. (One of the reasons Google had that famous policy of staff using 20% of their time to work on whatever they wanted wa to get ideas that otherwise would never see the light of the day a chance to get prototyped.)

Well, uh, thanks SE. At least I can make something close to what I really want to see with the ears and some existing gear I guess.

I don't want to sound bratty or spoiled, but... do they not have Chippendale's in Japan...?

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Originally Posted by Zathurain

Am I???? The only one??? who actually prefers that the male bunny suit is exactly the same as the female version??? To me it actually looks like something attractive and I feel like if they'd changed it to be more masculine then it would look ridiculous... Though at the same time I happen to find men in feminine clothing attractive so who knows.

Now when do the guys get dresses? Gimme. Now.

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I honestly don't mind getting this variant. Truthfully the reveal shot showing the Highlander copping a feel on not one, but two of his fellow man bunnies made me grin like a Cheshire cat.

I don't think anyone is denying that there's people who like the feminine design. The issue is that most people conform to conventional beauty standards and want male characters to look and act like conventionally attractive men. This is pretty standard and even accounting for some male NPC's being very feminine the vast majority are distinctly masculine - either classically handsome in their looks or more on the rugged side.

Obviously the developers can't please everyone. Yet it's pretty disappointing that they keep pushing feminine/androgynous hairstyles and gear designs on male characters.

I only ever remember people requesting the bunny suit for males, and being pretty outraged it wasn't a thing. Now that it is... People are outraged!?

And like miste said, you can already have a bow, no shirt, and glossy black pants in game, now. Why would they add that again?

People are so unreasonable sometimes...

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

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In other words, you don't really have a stake in the fight or any knowledge of the long string of disappointments where male glamour options are concerned yet you can't help but rush at the chance to make a snide comment. It's very telling that the vast majority of the posters belittling the concerns raised about male glamour options don't even seem to play a male character themselves...at least not as their main character. Interestingly enough, many of those same individuals also post as Au Ra and Miqo'te women - which just so happen to be the two of the more popular and 'fan service' options available where glamour options are concerned.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

I only ever remember people requesting the bunny suit for males, and being pretty outraged it wasn't a thing. Now that it is... People are outraged!?

And like miste said, you can already have a bow, no shirt, and glossy black pants in game, now. Why would they add that again?

People are so unreasonable sometimes...

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I think you are the only unreasonable one, always just posting negative comments to people's criticisms.

You expect no one to comment on this lazy shoe horn, okay...

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Originally Posted by Theodric

In other words, you don't really have a stake in the fight or any knowledge of the long string of disappointments where male glamour options are concerned yet you can't help but rush at the chance to make a snide comment. It's very telling that the vast majority of the posters belittling the concerns raised about male glamour options don't even seem to play a male character themselves...at least not as their main character. Interestingly enough, many of those same individuals also post as Au Ra and Miqo'te women - which just so happen to be the two of the more popular and 'fan service' options available where glamour options are concerned.

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exactly +1, they are just here to defend SE in any waking moment possible.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

It's footage from PAX East.
Here's the front look, by the way:

https://i.imgur.com/OnPNn8b.jpg

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that is so lazy attempt to "just give players what they are asking for"
I can't even...

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Originally Posted by Theodric

In other words, you don't really have a stake in the fight or any knowledge of the long string of disappointments where male glamour options are concerned yet you can't help but rush at the chance to make a snide comment. It's very telling that the vast majority of the posters belittling the concerns raised about male glamour options don't even seem to play a male character themselves...at least not as their main character. Interestingly enough, many of those same individuals also post as Au Ra and Miqo'te women - which just so happen to be the two of the more popular and 'fan service' options available where glamour options are concerned.

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I don't usually play miqo actually, I'm normally a hyur. But thanks for assuming, and why does this even matter to begin with? Why does what race a person plays in game matter as to their glamour preferences? And I don't even like most of the female glamour, I tend to wear more conservative stuff (not the case atm, but I just can't find anything I like)

And you know what, I don't play a male character because I don't find males attractive. There, you happy? Why should that even matter at all, if this is about equality. I think there is double standard shit going on here.


Also, my comment wasn't meant to be taken as snide. I simply am going off what I recall from those threads. Maybe you should stop thinking anyone who plays a female character is against male glamours. I'm all for equality.

And as for star, you are stalking me now, and find fault with anything I say, please stop.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

that is so lazy attempt to "just give players what they are asking for"
I can't even...

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They asked for a male bunny suit, they got it. the problem is that bunny suits aren't attractive to most people when men wear them. The solution most here seem to have is "just give us the ears," which is telling. I don't think people realized what they were asking for.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Maybe you should stop thinking anyone who plays a female character is against male glamours. I'm all for equality.

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You ask people to stop generalizing...but that's only after you yourself came into the thread and generalized all the male glamour people as universally being outraged for the bunny outfit and then universally angry when it came out?

Shockingly different groups of people have different priorities and interests, and it's absolutely not contradictory at all for some people who want equal glamours to push for the exact bunny outfit female characters got, and a separate group of people who also want separate but equal (as in feminine gear for women, and masculine gear for men) to express dissatisfaction at the result. Doesn't mean either of them are wrong.

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Originally Posted by RiyahArp

They asked for a male bunny suit, they got it. the problem is that bunny suits aren't attractive to most people when men wear them. The solution most here seem to have is "just give us the ears," which is telling. I don't think people realized what they were asking for.

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I still stand what I said in claiming it was lazy. This is why they need people to actually talk to us and comment back if they are confused? Why couldn't they just put the bunny ears wearable for all a long time ago and see where it went from there? Couldn't they design something more fitting for males?

Instead of doing something nice, this just feels forced in, pandering, because people asked for it, instead of trying to molding it into something good.

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Originally Posted by Emstidor

You ask people to stop generalizing...but that's only after you yourself came into the thread and generalized all the male glamour people as universally being outraged for the bunny outfit and then universally angry when it came out?

Shockingly different groups of people have different priorities and interests, and it's absolutely not contradictory at all for some people who want equal glamours to push for the exact bunny outfit female characters got, and a separate group of people who also want separate but equal (as in feminine gear for women, and masculine gear for men) to express dissatisfaction at the result. Doesn't mean either of them are wrong.

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+1

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

And as for star, you are stalking me now, and find fault with anything I say, please stop.

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Stop stalking me, I posted before you.

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Originally Posted by Emstidor

You ask people to stop generalizing...but that's only after you yourself came into the thread and generalized all the male glamour people as universally being outraged for the bunny outfit and then universally angry when it came out?

Shockingly different groups of people have different priorities and interests, and it's absolutely not contradictory at all for some people who want equal glamours to push for the exact bunny outfit female characters got, and a separate group of people who also want separate but equal (as in feminine gear for women, and masculine gear for men) to express dissatisfaction at the result. Doesn't mean either of them are wrong.

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But the thing is, the original posts and requests were for a male bunny outfit, not a Chippendale outfit. So that's what the devs saw. I am stating that people (makers of those threads, which probably got the most likes and are therefore what the devs thought was wanted) were outraged there was no male bunny suit, so they made one. Now people are reacting to that saying they expected something else, when, from the devs eyes, they delivered what people wanted. But I digress, I am simply going to be taken as someone who is against male characters getting things because I play a female.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

But I digress, I am simply going to be taken as someone who is against male characters getting things because I play a female.

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Stop assuming and putting words in people's mouths. How can you sit here tell people not to assume on your behalf, then do that very thing yourself?

Where did the image come from?

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Stop assuming and putting words in people's mouths. How can you sit here tell people not to assume on your behalf, then do that very thing yourself?

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Except this isn't putting words in people's mouth, as it has actually happened already, in theodrics post, which you quoted.

Since I don't crossdress, I guess I'll just take the bunny ears and try to make a glam out of that. Kinda was expecting a male bunny outfit, not a female outfit on a male body. Bummer, but not the end of the world.

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

Where did the image come from?

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PAX East, apparently.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

I still stand what I said in claiming it was lazy. This is why they need people to actually talk to us and comment back if they are confused? Why couldn't they just put the bunny ears wearable for all a long time ago and see where it went from there? Couldn't they design something more fitting for males?

Instead of doing something nice, this just feels forced in, pandering, because people asked for it, instead of trying to molding it into something good.

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And if they'd made something distinct, people would complain they still can't get the bunny suit. There is no pleasing everybody.

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Originally Posted by Emstidor

Shockingly different groups of people have different priorities and interests, and it's absolutely not contradictory at all for some people who want equal glamours to push for the exact bunny outfit female characters got, and a separate group of people who also want separate but equal (as in feminine gear for women, and masculine gear for men) to express dissatisfaction at the result. Doesn't mean either of them are wrong.

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You are right...and therein lies the problem. Did anyone ever say that they want this or that bunny suit?! I will admit that I never really checked the threads. I myself dislike the idea of the bunny suit being available to PC's at all, male or female alike, since I just dislike the idea of "for the heck" glamours. But that's besides the point.

Did anyone say that they want a masculine variation? Did anyone say that they want it but only the feminine variant? I am almost certain that no one did either. Not one side, the one that is now happy, nor the other, which is cringing under these news. Yet these people that never actually said that they wanted are complaining that the developers made it in the other way. What...are developers now supposed to be able to read peoples minds? Heck, it's not like they could actually win either way anyway. And what's worse here?! That the people that WANT bunny outfits but DIFFERENT than what they got are exactly as ignorant of there being ones with different opinions as some players here that are being complained about due to what they said, like RiyahArp.

I do not defend anyone. Ultimately everyone have their own ideas of what looks good and what not and all that jazz. And there are as many "styles" as there are people, in any combination of points in life, age, situation, living area, gender, sexuality etc. However, almost everyone here is guilty of the exact same thing, but since they are "one side" in this argument (pro-bunny, even if against this variation) it is completely ignored by "protectors" that come here and try to explain why someone said something wrong.


On a different note...Please, people...Stop bringing Chippendales into this...The only "bunny" that they are related is the Playboy...through one of the founders having killed a Playboy playmate that was his estranged wife.
They have nothing in common with the bunny outfits. They have entirely different job than the hostesses that wear the bunny outfits. The ONLY thing in common is that their job is to appeal to sexual interests of whoever is paying, but that's as much in common as they have with porn actors or dildos...And I don't think people here would argue that they wanted a dildo-looking costume?! Right?!
Clearly the people asking whether Square Enix ever even heard of Chippendales should actually look them up themselves. The bunnies in the business are Playboy ones, but those are strictly female.

i dont see a problem :? its not my thing, but a number of my friends have expressed interest in it. maybe you think its ugly, but some people think its good. youre not forced to buy, why be mad? :?

but ppl will always complain about things no matter where you go....;;

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Originally Posted by Rabbtit

i dont see a problem :? its not my thing, but a number of my friends have expressed interest in it. maybe you think its ugly, but some people think its good. youre not forced to buy, why be mad? :?

but ppl will always complain about things no matter where you go....;;

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At the very least you can still get the bunny ears even if you don't like the whole outfit. So there is a bright side.

It looks horrible, lmao. Would be nice if guys didn't have to wait years for an outfit only to get the leftovers from females. It's great for those who enjoy cross-dressing but I was hoping for something that would come across as sexy on a male form.

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Originally Posted by Deraj8

At the very least you can still get the bunny ears even if you don't like the whole outfit. So there is a bright side.

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thios is true!!! if all else at least they now have bunny ears so that is good (:

reading all the comments in this thread, ppl trying to make it a bigger issue than it is, honestly it doesnt matter HOW the suit came out in the end - some ppl would just have something different to whine about. not that theyre not allowed to, ofc ppl can complain, its just they will never be able to cater to anyone and debates over things like fashion seem fruitless xD

I wish they had changed the chest area for males a bit, right now it looks like they are trying to wear small push up bras lol. Oh well, at least males FINALLY get bunny ears.

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Originally Posted by kikix12

Did anyone say that they want a masculine variation? Did anyone say that they want it but only the feminine variant? I am almost certain that no one did either..

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Sorry for correcting on you this, but people actually asked for a male equivalent, and the chippendale's outfit was posted there too, years ago, when this was suggested. I participated in these threads.

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Originally Posted by Lilseph

but people actually asked for a male equivalent, and the chippendale's outfit was posted there too

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Just to try to understand though why would you want those chippendale's outfits?

My opinion on it is that those outfits are so generic that, as per my previous post, you can create something almost exactly like that with gear we already have in-game. Wouldn't that be bad? It wouldn't be anything new at that point...just barely different than stuff we already have now.

People are already mentioning criticisms of reused models and rehashed gear that isn't new or unique so I think in the end it would end up causing more of that.

Honestly, I was expecting it to be a copy-paste glamour, so I'm fine with that (especially the fishnet leggings. Was concerned those would be nixed). We can already make a sort of chippendales outfit, anyway (and if SE did take this route and it looked similar to what I could pull off, then I'd be pretty disappointed).

https://i.imgur.com/HRTIoSy.png

It is disappointing it took them 2 years to make a female-only glamour unisex, but maybe starting with this, they'll eventually work on making other female-only pieces unisex.

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Originally Posted by Lilseph

Sorry for correcting on you this, but people actually asked for a male equivalent, and the chippendale's outfit was posted there too, years ago, when this was suggested. I participated in these threads.

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You said "male equivalent" and that's what we got. I said "masculine" or "feminine". Sorry, but male equivalent is not the same as masculine.

And Chippendales have...nothing...to do...with...bunnies. Seriously. Nothing. Zero. Nada. People want their "outfits"?! No problem. I wouldn't actually care all that much about that, really. But it have NOTHING in common with this topic at all and the point of using it as example of a bunny outfit for male is just ridiculous. I went ahead and made a search just to find anything at all that connects them and bunny outfit. I found ONE photo, from backstage, where they clearly put bunny ears just for the heck of it. Nothing to do with their work.
Of course, they COULD use them in their work during the routines. Just like cowboy hats, police hats and a bunch of others I'm sure. Now they should be the stereotype of a cowboy?!

Really, I understand. Hostesses in bunny suits SEEM related. If people have zero factual knowledge about them AND the Chippendales, going only by random fiction and their "I think". Bunny hostesses are there for sexual appeal and these dancers are there for sexual appeal. Both are grabbing attention with their uncommon, tight-fitting costumes. But that's where the resemblance ends. Only fiction mixes their purposes like fiction tends to do.

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Originally Posted by Miste

Snip.

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...AND the chippendale. That's the keyword. Answering to you both, a male equivalent would be a remodel using the base design to create something that is appealing for men, not just transfering the whole outfit and stamp them on their bodies. You know, putting a biiiit of effort into it. Alternatively, yeah, the Chippendale's looks generic, if we use the pics posted as a comparison. You can even replicate it. But what about create an outfit for males using THAT outfit as a concept? Then add all the accesories and ornaments you want to make it look more Final Fantasy-ish. As it is now, it looks like a comedic relief more than anything.

In the end, I can see people complaining back and forth about this. You guys like it, great. Some people don't. At least you got the bunny ears, that was the item that people wanted the most anyway.

If they did end up making a male-exclusive Chippendales outfit and it doesn't look that much different to what I've created (which I'm pretty sure is unisex), then I'd be more disappointed about that than I would be with the copy-paste.