Seeing Square Enix in a new light. I am grateful for this game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

(...)

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Of all the examples you choose to give for Tera you picked the ps4 port which from what I heard did horrible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LU4mAsR2v0 would be a better example (take note SE tank with shield and lance just saying :3)

4.3 coming out, I see SE in a new light for sure
15 dollars per month +21 dollars per month (P2W, or pay for advantage, w/e be nit picky what win means but your paying for an advanage)+ microtranction fees for feeding P2W further. (also the sub on top of the sub fee locks a basic UI feature, retainer to retainer item movement)
so FFXIV as of 4.3 is F2P that is locked behind a base sub.

Tera may be a bad port to PS4 but do they have this level of shadyness?

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Originally Posted by Sarynth

Of all the examples you choose to give for Tera you picked the ps4 port which from what I heard did horrible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LU4mAsR2v0 would be a better example (take note SE tank with shield and lance just saying :3)

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Considering my example was specifically to point out how bad Tera''s PORT TO CONSOLE was i made the correct example choice lol.

It's been a bumpy ride to say the least but I keep staying for some reason, so OP has a point in saying they're doing at least something right. I however also feel the team might be sitting on their laurels a bit in terms of innovating and actually changing things for the better like they did for 2.0.

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

Considering my example was specifically to point out how bad Tera''s PORT TO CONSOLE was i made the correct example choice lol.

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Fair enough, I'll give se props for how well they did bringing 14 to ps4

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

I myself have ranted and raved before, while i do still hope for them to better things even further after my recent experiences with Tera i feel like i should not be as negative as i used to be. I really appreciate what i have because at the least its better than most others out there, and i know for a fact it is well worth the 14 dollars a month to be a part of Final Fantasy 14. It really is something special to be a part of.

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14 dollars a month? What 14 are you paying?

14 where?

14.99 for characters
+2 PER RETAINER.
+5 for premium app.

At least Tera doesn't have the audacity to be pay to play while still sucking money out of my pocket like a vacuum cleaner. Pick one square enix.

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Tera may be a bad port to PS4 but do they have this level of shadyness?

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What's your opinion on loot boxes?

Redherb, I'm not sure about Mizu, but I only pay 11.99 per month for FFXIV (9.99 legacy + 1 retainer so I can have one of each DoL). Also Tera has plenty of loot boxes that you get as monster drops but the only way to open them is to buy keys on the cash shop.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sarynth

Also Tera has plenty of loot boxes that you get as monster drops but the only way to open them is to buy keys on the cash shop.

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And the items you get from the boxes are all purely RNG if I recall (unsure if entirely cosmetic with mounts included, or if end game items are included as well), so also sitting in gambling territory. That would have me extremely disappointed in SE if they brought something like that into FFXIV.

@ Mizunoko, yes and i clearly stated it was my opinion i will not argue here. And you clearly do not view as such but having played FFXIV over 4 years now and Tera maybe a month and for me i feel the rewards are better in Tera and the combat is more exciting.
Rewards in FFXIV are tied behind a really bad rng system and will be made worst now with the All Greed nonsense.
@ Sarynth The loot boxes in Tera having to buy keys in the cash shop is not 100% accurate as i have received free keys before and i have not spent anything .

With this all said i still love FFXIV and it is clearly the better looking, and better performing game. But we are also talking about one game that was ported while the other was created to run on console and PC...
Anyhow i have stated what i wanted to so carry on people

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Originally Posted by RedHerb

At least Tera doesn't have the audacity to be pay to play while still sucking money out of my pocket like a vacuum cleaner. Pick one square enix.

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Yeah, explain their Elite Status though. It's just the sub without a true sub. It's like ESO that was P2P then went down another F2P + Bonus if you "sub"



Regardless the point everyone seems to be missing is there is far worse out there than FFXIV and their questionable decisions.
We still have support, regardless what the naysayers and doomsayers say.

Oh dear a positivity thread on GD? Nope OP let me tell you why your feelings are wrong. Jeez this forum has become the biggest dumpster fire in the last month or so.

This game does a lot right, it does a lot wrong, and it tries to innovate in that weird SE way that's akin to a baby animal trying to walk for the first time. I haven't tried the PS4 port of Tera yet but I have played it on PC and honestly it was fine but meh. Also wasn't a fan of their style of cash shop (really? I'm spending money to roll a dice?). There are far worse and far more predatory games out their than XIV and I'd encourage naysayers to give them a try and see if that's more their speed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RedHerb

14 dollars a month?
At least Tera doesn't have the audacity to be pay to play while still sucking money out of my pocket like a vacuum cleaner. Pick one square enix.

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I pay 11.99 myself (Legacy + 1 retainer) and that's all I need. If someone wants to spend the money on all those retainers purely to play Capitalism, Ho! then they are free to do as they wish. But none of them are needed to enjoy the game or make money. Five dollar for premium features on an app with the bonus of more inventory? XI kinda did it first with the security token bonus of the Mog Satchel and it cost twice as much as Premium will if I remember correctly. Hell they even charge money for 2 more Mog Safes in XI and that game is inarguably more intensive and focused on inventory due to gearswapping and could be construed as an advantage over non-paying players (but then they also have myriad free inventory as well).

And no Tera doesn't ask for a sub but it does ask for Elite status and offers PLENTY of perks for it that can be considered p2w or pay for advantage (p4a?) in the rhetoric being painted lately and it has the audacity to ask you to pay for lootboxes that are literal gambling as opposed to the mog station giving you exactly what you pay for.

Honestly... grumpy as I get bitchy as I get I still rather enjoy the community for the most part. the gameplay is amaze too but it's really the people that keep me vested in the game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

If that framerate issue was on ff14 SE would be making a public apology and fixing it day 1 regardless of the difference in profit/team size, because they have a sense right and wrong.

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Just to touch on this, SE has a Mac client that was/is a meme not only because of how bad it was, but how little it was supported. They even charged you separately for it, which was not only ironic given how awful it was, but it also went against industry standard.

Why did you mention profit/team size? Maybe I missed the context of relevance since I'm responding to a post not directed at me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KaldeaSahaline

Just to touch on this, SE has a Mac client that was/is a meme not only because of how bad it was, but how little it was supported. They even charged you separately for it, which was not only ironic given how awful it was, but it also went against industry standard.

Why did you mention profit/team size? Maybe I missed the context of relevance since I'm responding to a post not directed at me.

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Mac games are always the red headed step child tho....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KaldeaSahaline

Just to touch on this, SE has a Mac client that was/is a meme not only because of how bad it was, but how little it was supported. They even charged you separately for it, which was not only ironic given how awful it was, but it also went against industry standard.

Why did you mention profit/team size? Maybe I missed the context of relevance since I'm responding to a post not directed at me.

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Too bad it's not the mac client i'm talking about :). SE would be smart if they dumped (maybe they did idk and i don't care to know) that thing since imo mac is uncompatible junk. Again just my opinion :).

This game isn't perfect... but no game is... no game ever will be... everyone has their own personal preferences... I like my single player rpgs turn based many others prefer action based combat... i think this game has a little something for everyone... there's literally always something to do... not alot of games can say that

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Originally Posted by Okamimaru

This game isn't perfect... but no game is... no game ever will be... everyone has their own personal preferences... I like my single player rpgs turn based many others prefer action based combat... i think this game has a little something for everyone... there's literally always something to do... not alot of games can say that

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I agree. 100% agree.

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

Too bad it's not the mac client i'm not talking about :). SE would be smart if they dumped (maybe they did idk and i don't care to know) that thing since imo mac is uncompatible junk. Again just my opinion :).

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The point is that you're being hypocritical. I'm all for praising SE for the things they do right, but you're lambasting TERA (a game I have 0 cares about) because of an awful console port while simultaneously praising SE for doing it right. Completely neglecting the fact that SE's had their own shares of porting issues to which I gave an example (one significantly more egregious than your TERA one) and you outright dismiss it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SilverObi

Oh dear a positivity thread on GD? Nope OP let me tell you why your feelings are wrong. Jeez this forum has become the biggest dumpster fire in the last month or so.

This game does a lot right, it does a lot wrong, and it tries to innovate in that weird SE way that's akin to a baby animal trying to walk for the first time. I haven't tried the PS4 port of Tera yet but I have played it on PC and honestly it was fine but meh. Also wasn't a fan of their style of cash shop (really? I'm spending money to roll a dice?). There are far worse and far more predatory games out their than XIV and I'd encourage naysayers to give them a try and see if that's more their speed.



I pay 11.99 myself (Legacy + 1 retainer) and that's all I need. If someone wants to spend the money on all those retainers purely to play Capitalism, Ho! then they are free to do as they wish. But none of them are needed to enjoy the game or make money. Five dollar for premium features on an app with the bonus of more inventory? XI kinda did it first with the security token bonus of the Mog Satchel and it cost twice as much as Premium will if I remember correctly. Hell they even charge money for 2 more Mog Safes in XI and that game is inarguably more intensive and focused on inventory due to gearswapping and could be construed as an advantage over non-paying players (but then they also have myriad free inventory as well).

And no Tera doesn't ask for a sub but it does ask for Elite status and offers PLENTY of perks for it that can be considered p2w or pay for advantage (p4a?) in the rhetoric being painted lately and it has the audacity to ask you to pay for lootboxes that are literal gambling as opposed to the mog station giving you exactly what you pay for.

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Actually the Mog Safes are free with your Mog House it's the Mog Wardrobes 3 and 4 that you pay extra for & you can only store weapons and gear inside them. For the Mog Satchel you really don't pay extra for it per se you just attach a security token to your account and you get it automatically. A security tokens depending where you buy it isn't that expensive either.

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Originally Posted by KaldeaSahaline

The point is that you're being hypocritical. (snip)

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Tera ~ an awful console port of an unoptimized or cared about PC game, which is the perfect example of what a game company should not do, and shows how bad business decisions affect a game.

FFXIV MAC edition ~ one of the many games redone to fit Mac systems and one of the many that are, well...badly done for it. I wouldn't put full blame on SE for the issues with that port however (given how the PC version runs). Apple has been behind in the tech dept for their hardware/software for gaming for years. However they have made recent strides to make it better. Still, SE has tried to make it work. But sometimes there's things even they can't work around until the hardware can catch up. It's like them dumping PS3 for limitations. That they haven't fully dumped Mac, is nothing short of amazing.

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Originally Posted by silverlunarfox

Tera ~ an awful console port of an unoptimized or cared about PC game, which is the perfect example of what a game company should not do, and shows how bad business decisions affect a game.

FFXIV MAC edition ~ one of the many games redone to fit Mac systems and one of the many that are, well...badly done for it. I wouldn't put full blame on SE for the issues with that port however (given how the PC version runs). Apple has been behind in the tech dept for their hardware/software for gaming for years. However they have made recent strides to make it better. Still, SE has tried to make it work. But sometimes there's things even they can't work around until the hardware can catch up. It's like them dumping PS3 for limitations. That they haven't fully dumped Mac, is nothing short of amazing.

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Tera: “I put the full blame on the company because of bad company decisions”

XIV: “I don’t put the full blame on the company even though this port exists only due to bad company decisions”

cmon my guy. They're both awful ports that exist solely as cashgrabs. SE should have known that macs are shit for games. They went through anyway because they wanted to dip their fingers in more pies.

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Originally Posted by Rokke

Tera: “I put the full blame on the company because of bad company decisions”

XIV: “I don’t put the full blame on the company even though this port exists only due to bad company decisions”

cmon my guy. They're both awful ports that exist solely as cashgrabs. SE should have known that macs are shit for games. They went through anyway because they wanted to dip their fingers in more pies.

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You and others are taking this all out of context in the first place since this isn't about pc or mac or anything, It's ONLY about console. Simple fact is that tera on console turned out as complete crap ESPECIALLY optimization wise, and FFXIV with better graphics more populated events like hunts and 24 mans STILL runs smooth as butter in comparison to tera which doesn't. That is the point i am talking about. This is about how the dev team for Tera has bad priorities as far as fixing their game to even run the way a game should on a console. SE did right by this and Bluehole did not. That is a true and factual statement regarding console editions only. I don't care about pc or mac versions since it's not my topic. I appreciate the SE devs for actually trying and doing their jobs. What i don't appreciate is the Tera devs for allowing their game to release and exist in such a terrible state without getting on top of the issue and doing their JOBS to fix it. If SE released FFXIV in the same state on the same console as tera was, SE would be out making a public apology as well is fixing it ASAP. Bluehole/EME would not do that because they do not care about their PR or customers as much as SE does.

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

You and others are taking this all out of context in the first place since this isn't about pc or mac or anything, It's ONLY about console. Simple fact is that tera on console turned out as complete crap ESPECIALLY optimization wise, and FFXIV with better graphics more populated events like hunts and 24 mans STILL runs smooth as butter in comparison to tera which doesn't. That is the point i am talking about. This is about how the dev team for Tera has bad priorities as far as fixing their game to even run the way a game should on a console. SE did right by this and Bluehole did not. That is a true and factual statement regarding console editions only. I don't care about pc or mac versions since it's not my topic. I appreciate the SE devs for actually trying and doing their jobs. What i don't appreciate is the Tera devs for allowing their game to release and exist in such a terrible state without getting on top of the issue and doing their JOBS to fix it. If SE released FFXIV in the same state on the same console as tera was, SE would be out making a public apology as well is fixing it ASAP. Bluehole/EME would not do that because they do not care about their PR or customers as much as SE does.

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I played Tera years ago. It was a fun, albeit shallow game. In the end I quit because the things I didn’t like were piling up so high they began to overpower the things I did enjoy. Even still, I give Tera more leeway due to tera costing me a whopping $0.00 dollars to play across the 3 years I was there. I have played XIV for almost 3 years now. Excluding the costs of the base game + the expansions + the collectors edition upgrades + the extra retainers, it has cost me nearly $500.00 in sub fees.

Im glad you enjoy XIV, but comparing the two is like comparing my local pumpkin patch vs. Disneyland. I would hope that the people who run Disneyland put more effort into running the park when it costs as much as it does to go through the front gate.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nestama

What's your opinion on loot boxes?

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Nestama, my plan for the top 1% of gil holders. Rather than squander the surplus on a risky tax cut for the wealthy, I would put it in what I call a.. "loot-box."

I must say that in my plan, the "loot-box" would be used only for savage gear and extreme trials. This loot box will have two different locks. Now, one of the keys to the "lootbox" would be kept by yoshi P; the other key would be a software token owned by the player.

The "loot-box" would also be camoflauged. Now, to all outward appearances, it would be a Lalafallin stepstool. But it wouldn't be. It would be the "loot-box". Now I need to give out a warning to the enemies, or potential enemeies, of the eorzea: you may think you know the location of the "loot-box". Maybe you do. Or maybe that's a decoy. Or a dummy "loot-box". Only Yoshi P, myself and FFXIV CEO are gonna know for sure.

This is going to be a special "loot-box". Most of the time you are going to get marmot hides. Other times, maybe a savage gear. There will even be rarer gear, like giving gear and weapons that is 10 ilevels higher then anything you can get in the game. These special "loot-box" items will have sub stats completely randomized, like the pink stuff for diadem 2.0 during HW.

This is why it is so important to keep these "loot-box" secure. People will be flooding to log in the game that would end up being worse then during SB's opening. Everyone wants a chance at .01% chance of winning a rare item, even if each roll is 10 dollars each. In yoshi-P's words, look forward to it.

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Originally Posted by Krokov

Actually the Mog Safes are free with your Mog House it's the Mog Wardrobes 3 and 4 that you pay extra for & you can only store weapons and gear inside them. For the Mog Satchel you really don't pay extra for it per se you just attach a security token to your account and you get it automatically. A security tokens depending where you buy it isn't that expensive either.

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Aye you're right they're called Mog Wardrobes. I call everything a safe in there lol

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Originally Posted by Rokke

I played Tera years ago. It was a fun, albeit shallow game. In the end I quit because the things I didn’t like were piling up so high they began to overpower the things I did enjoy. Even still, I give Tera more leeway due to tera costing me a whopping $0.00 dollars to play across the 3 years I was there. I have played XIV for almost 3 years now. Excluding the costs of the base game + the expansions + the collectors edition upgrades + the extra retainers, it has cost me nearly $500.00 in sub fees.

Im glad you enjoy XIV, but comparing the two is like comparing my local pumpkin patch vs. Disneyland. I would hope that the people who run Disneyland put more effort into running the park when it costs as much as it does to go through the front gate.

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It may have a sub but thanks to that sub the game has actual quality unlike tera. I would rather pay for something that is fun and quality and not pay for something that is junk and bores me. Your analogy is terrible anyway. Sitting on my butt all day doing nothing is free, but that doesn't mean everyone would rather do that instead of buying ps4 to play games instead. Besides if ffxiv did so much wrong then why are people still subbed and playing, why is ffxiv successful? It speaks for itself really. From what ive heard the tera port is blueholes way to get a final cashgrab before it bites the dust. The game is just crap imo even if it is free. I've played free games before that were farm more enjoyable than tera. Saying tera is free doesn't justify that the dev team has a job to do and instead of doing that job and trying to do a good job they basically just let the game go without important prioritization of it's updates and let it rot as far as its quality is concerns. SE and Bluehole both have a job to do and get payed, the only difference is SE actually tries/does a good job and knows how to prioritize important issues versus menial issues with its game, and Bluehole doesn't.

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

It may have a sub but thanks to that sub the game has actual quality unlike tera. I would rather pay for something that is fun and quality and not pay for something that is junk and bores me. Your analogy is terrible anyway. Sitting on my butt all day doing nothing is free, but that doesn't mean everyone would rather do that instead of buying ps4 to play games instead. Besides if ffxiv did so much wrong then why are people still subbed and playing, why is ffxiv successful? It speaks for itself really. From what ive heard the tera port is blueholes way to get a final cashgrab before it bites the dust. The game is just crap imo even if it is free. I've played free games before that were farm more enjoyable than tera. Saying tera is free doesn't justify that the dev team has a job to do and instead of doing that job and trying to do a good job they basically just let the game go without important prioritization of it's updates and let it rot as far as its quality is concerns. SE and Bluehole both have a job to do and get payed, the only difference is SE actually tries/does a good job and knows how to prioritize important issues versus menial issues with its game, and Bluehole doesn't.

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Issue, FFXIV is not exactly giving quality, that is what rokke means. The point is you think the quality be there in comparison of the cost, when it isn't. They been doing the same thing since 2.0 (generally, Palace of the dead is he only real big thing worth noting there is something different)

"difference is SE actually tries/does a good job and knows how to prioritize important issues" Put it simply, no they do not. They slacked off housing too much, only putting in real effort when outside media got a hold of it, makes a change to content 2 expansions old that very few want. They are making a change in 4.3 that is exclusively to pander to the Japanese audience. Finally they hardly even "try" when it comes to communicating with NA/EU player base. What about the maid attire promotions where most EU countries got thrown under a buss?

In the mist off that, overcharging the mog station items, adding extra costs to a basic UI feature that should been in the game at the launch of 2.0, but did not because they wanted rush it out, now they want to charge extra over their sloppy code

Server issues, having slow response such as:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ce#post4641999

The game.. has ... a lot of hidden problems.. that people look away and stay stubbed. Based on the Eureka threads "because things can be fun with friends" is likely the biggest reason stay subbed, because it is there, so on.

Also I believe this is fitting for "Besides if ffxiv did so much wrong then why are people still subbed and playing, why is ffxiv successful? It speaks for itself really"

The results of one thing they clearly stated with rushing out 2.0:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4565795

I think your only point is that you are glad it is not as bad as tera, but the thing is, there are games that do things better then ffxiv too...

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

wall of opinions

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didn't you unsub already? How much longer til we are rid of this nonsense?

/inhales

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

It may have a sub but thanks to that sub the game has actual quality unlike tera.

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Disneyland offers a higher quality theme park than a local pumpkin patch because Disneyland costs $money$. Thats was literally point my analogy was making. The sub fee ensures higher quality because we're all paying over a hundred dollars a year. If you were paying $15 a month and you weren't satisfied with the quality you'd stop paying, no?

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

I I would rather pay for something that is fun and quality and not pay for something that is junk and bores me.

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Thats fair and I never insinuated otherwise

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

Your analogy is terrible anyway. Sitting on my butt all day doing nothing is free, but that doesn't mean everyone would rather do that instead of buying ps4 to play games instead.

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I'd say my analogy was pretty on point if you agreed with it lmao

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

Besides if ffxiv did so much wrong then why are people still subbed and playing, why is ffxiv successful? It speaks for itself really.

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I never insinuated otherwise

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

From what ive heard the tera port is blueholes way to get a final cashgrab before it bites the dust.

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I literally said it was a cash grab in my post?

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

The game is just crap imo even if it is free.

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Opinions!

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

I've played free games before that were farm more enjoyable than tera.

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Good for you!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mizunoko

Saying tera is free doesn't justify that the dev team has a job to do and instead of doing that job and trying to do a good job they basically just let the game go without important prioritization of it's updates and let it rot as far as its quality is concerns. SE and Bluehole both have a job to do and get payed, the only difference is SE actually tries/does a good job and knows how to prioritize important issues versus menial issues with its game, and Bluehole doesn't.

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SE is quick to fix problems because if they do not they loose your monitory support. That is why they fix your problems. They are a multimillion dollar company running a cash cow MMO: They want your money every month. If they slip up, you will leave and if you leave they lose your $180 a year. From that point it snowballs: if they lose your $180 yearly sub, they also lose your $60 expansion cost, they also lose your $2 extra retainers, they also lose your $5 premium app sub, they also lose your $200 fanfest badge, they also lose your $90 orchestra tickets, etc. SE has every reason in the world to try to keep you hooked. Bluehole doesn't.

Honestly while I love the development team for this game, that same consideration doesn't extend towards the publisher. There's mismanagement aplenty at SE and one need look no further than the development debacle that was FFXV's ten year development cycle (the last two of which were spent scrambling to make a game after dumping eight years of work no less) and the original Tomb Raider reboot. All with a handful of games in between such as Hitman that suffered from nearly the same bloat and issues in spite of being decent games in the end. You can very much like a game and it's developer while holding irritation and issues with the publisher; and while SE isn't nearly as bad as EA or lord forbid Warner Bros and what they did to LoTRO that doesn't mean they're somehow a bastion of good intentions. Nor does it mean people can't take issue with the directions they're taken some of their favorite titles. They're a company, pure and simple. They want your money and while they understand how to keep their customers happier than most in the MMO scene that doesn't make them infallible or necessarily on 'your side'.

They didn't dump eight years of dev time on FFXV, work never really started on it, it was pretty much just a concept in Nomura's mind which made me very critical of him an anything he touches especially when I took into consideration KH and how they were unable to create a good gameplay after KH2

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Remedi

They didn't dump eight years of dev time on FFXV, work never really started on it, it was pretty much just a concept in Nomura's mind which made me very critical of him an anything he touches especially when I took into consideration KH and how they were unable to create a good gameplay after KH2

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Develo...nal_Fantasy_XV

It actually got much further than a concept. Nomura was mainly the chief reason the game stopped and restarted yes, but with several engine changes and then outright scrapping of materials I think it's a touch of an understatement to say that work never got started. I'll definitely agree with your assessment of KH however... The handling of that entire franchise is horrendous and I'm long past the point of legitimately caring about a resolution.

That entry states that the game never really took shape though, true you have to believe Tabata's word for it

Granted i have only played Tera for a few months but i do not see the SO Awful or crappy that you are stating @ Mizunoko
We are also talking about something that was just ported over and one that was basically made for both console (PS3 at the time and now PS4) and PC. And seen much optimizations.
Stormblood actually had a good amount of work done with PS4 (and PS4 Pro in mind) so compairing the 2 games when they should not be.