1.20a tomorrow :D

So your saying archer is not a DoW?

I see her point as well, I simply disagree with it. There are 4 cross class abilities that can initiate a battle, do damage, or gain some aggro that require 0 TP. I could care less about if they are initially on all DoW or not. This game has the uniqueness of the armory system and the ability to use abilities cross class to better another class.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

I could be a right biotch and laugh at the irony of this, but I have no desire to embarrass you.

You might want to check the patch notes.

Light Shot is Archer exclusive. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that means it cannot be cross-classed.

Also, could you specifically cite the 4 other non-TP melee attack abilities? I wouldn't want to perpetuate misinformation.

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Why not take a shot to embarass me, you have post upon post of incorrect information and comment that embarass yourself.

Thunder (level 1)
Stone Ilevel 1)
Aero (level 4)
Fire (level10)
FLash (level 14)
Provoke (level 14)
Taunt (level 42)

All of which I believe generate TP as well.

Pierce is melee damage. Not my fault you lack the ability to grasp this. you have caster damage and physical damage. In this game DoW and DoM. Ranged or non-ranged is simply the distanced capability of the appplied damage not the "type" or "kind" of damage it is.

We are speaking about skills to get the enemy focus to start a battle without to use a TP skill or AA, right?

Throw Weapon, Flash, Provoke, Stone, Aero, Thunder, Fire

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Originally Posted by Coglin

So your saying archer is not a DoW?

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No, I'm saying Light Shot is just their regular attack.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

I see her point as well, I simply disagree with it. There are 4 cross class abilities that can initiate a battle, do damage, or gain some aggro that require 0 TP.

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Please, enlightmen me to which skills actually deal damage, requires 0 TP and no consumables. Gaining aggro also deals no damage and make no difference when solo or not tanking.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

I could care less about if they are initially on all DoW or not. This game has the uniqueness of the armory system and the ability to use abilities cross class to better another class.

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Quoted for truth

EDIT: Spells aren't skills and require MP.

EDIT2: What she wants to have in the game is cooldown only DoW attack skills to use while building up TP so there's more "active" ways to deal damage during battle instead of "waiting" for TP to start unleashing moves.

See, the battle system isn't broken...SE is just balancing it around the people at level cap because they're the ones crying the most. Even when I restarted I feel like the early and mid levels are SO SO SO MUCH BETTER than what it used to be. The battle system isn't an action system because this game is not an action platformer, however it's still very engaging because you actually DO more than just auto attack and WS. Look at the WS, look at lancer. You can easy do a Heavy Thrust combo to enhance the stun (longer duration), run to the left or right and pop off an impulse drive and if you still have TP, do yet another true thrust that will setup the combo even while the cooldown is ticking and you can pop it off on another mob if you're quick enough.

That's just around level 18. It's only "broken" if you're expecting an action game.

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Originally Posted by normalforce

Always sticking his tentacles where they're not wanted!

But ya, I'm not sure if that's a general statement about how no matter what SE does, people will complain about it ad nauseam or if it's a I know something you don't know.

I haven't messed with throwing weapons, do they generate much TP?

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They don't generate a whole lot of tp but there pretty decent for bridging small gaps when invigorate is on cool down. They don't seem to get in the way of the auto attack cycle either. It's kind of a derpy move not to have some kind of throwing weapon equipped on a melee class if you ask me.

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

EDIT: Spells aren't skills and require MP.

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But they require 0 TP, too and you can equip them as DoW.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

Thunder (level 1)
Stone Ilevel 1)
Aero (level 4)
Fire (level10)

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Spells? Seriously? So... PGLs and LNCs and so on should start becoming casters, now?

One thing I absolutely hated about the original combat system was that my CNJ had to spirit dart like a melee. As a caster, I wanted to play a caster. I'm sure melee would like to be melee.

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Originally Posted by Felis

But they require 0 TP, too and you can equip them as DoW.

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I agree with that. As you can see on the post above this, she doesn't.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Spells? Seriously? So... PGLs and LNCs and so on should start becoming casters, now?

One thing I absolutely hated about the original combat system was that my CNJ had to spirit dart like a melee. As a caster, I wanted to play a caster. I'm sure melee would like to be melee.

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Uh..yeah as a Lancer I do this:

Active mode > Approach mob > Poke mob > Destroy mob.

As a conjurer I do this:

Approach Mob/group > Cast on mobs > Kite mobs > Destroy mobs.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Spells? Seriously? So... PGLs and LNCs and so on should start becoming casters, now?

One thing I absolutely hated about the original combat system was that my CNJ had to spirit dart like a melee. As a caster, I wanted to play a caster. I'm sure melee would like to be melee.

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Whats that got to do with the fact that you claimed such abilities did not exist?

All of the sudden there not valid? You got wise and demanded I share a few abilities that fit the pr-reqs YOU gave. I don't give a rats behind if you like them or not. Ths is the part were you say:

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Yes I hadn't played he game far enough to realize these fit my pre-reqs I mentionted to perfect detail, I am wrong.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Spells? Seriously? So... PGLs and LNCs and so on should start becoming casters, now?

One thing I absolutely hated about the original combat system was that my CNJ had to spirit dart like a melee. As a caster, I wanted to play a caster. I'm sure melee would like to be melee.

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As of now pgl is a darn good caster but only when fighting stuff solo, <.< and a game where you can equip other skills what is wrong with using magic on a melee i guess they should not use cure's either. I guess the melee's in the star wars mmo should not use magic either.

Firon, please, for the love of all that is holy, stop using common sense and logic, you will confuse the heck out of them.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

Whats that got to do with the fact that you claimed such abilities did not exist?

All of the sudden there not valid? You got wise and demanded I share a few abilities that fit the pr-reqs YOU gave. I don't give a rats behind if you like them or not.

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Most gamers will gravitate toward one of two kinds of classes, melee or magic. To find people that enjoy playing both isn't as common. It's not fair to expect all melee will want to level CNJ and THM to get a few spells as a workaround.

You know... sort of like all the people that were forced to level GLD to get sentinel for the Ifrit fight?

/seelastpost

/grabspopcorn

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Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

I seem to often read posts, by you, stating that you do not progress your character because you are so co-dependant you can only level with your boyfriend who isn't even interested in the game so, how can you comment on anything you haven't experienced?

Not only is your situation extremely saddening on a mental level, it completely voids your opinion because it's not an experience you even allow yourself to have. How on earth do you act like you are in the know enough to comment on this?

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Codependency is a real illness. You say that it is "saddening on a mental level" but you honestly have no idea. You're about as cool as someone making fun of a guy in a wheelchair. You think it's okay to make fun just because you can't physically see the problem?

The rest of your points may have been completely valid, but low ignorant blows are low and ignorant.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Most gamers will gravitate toward one of two kinds of classes, melee or magic. To find people that enjoy playing both isn't as common. It's not fair to expect all melee will want to level CNJ and THM to get a few spells as a workaround.

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I assume you can link the poll that every gamer took that allowed you to make this assumption? Or did you use the same crystal ball used to assume CNJ=BLM & THM=WHM?


Now your backpeddleing, because the subject was on how you were telling us the multiple abilities I mentioned didn't exist, and how your vast magnitude of experience with all the classes allowed you to determine this.

So you now aknowledge the fact that there are at least 7 abilities that initiate a battle and cost 0 TP?

If you don't like mixing abilities, traits, and spells, well by all means the game is horrible, worst game ever, you should log off th forums and the game right this very second, walk away from it all and never look back.

WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON?!

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

You know... sort of like all the people that were forced to level GLD to get sentinel for the Ifrit fight?

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Unfortunately, there are still ppl who believe that Sentinel is a requirement :(

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Originally Posted by Coglin

I assume you can link the poll that every gamr took that allowed you to make this assumption? Or did you use the same crystal ball you used to assume CNJ=BLM & THM=WHM?

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Uh... what? I picked CNJ because it was described on the official site before the game was even released as the healing class. I play a healer in every MMO, and a healer was all I wanted to be here. I only leveled THM to get Siphon MP. I was one of the people who were right about assuming CNJ would get WHM.

Whatever you're smoking must be some gewd stuff.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

Now your backpeddleing, because the subject was on how you were telling us the multiple abilities I mentioned didn't exist, and how your vast magnitude of experience with all the classes allowed you to determine this.

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I'm not backpeddling. We're talking about melee abilities. Not ranged. Not spells. Melee abilities.

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Originally Posted by Scherwiz

WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON?!

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Not even I know anymore.

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

Not even I know anymore.

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I think we finally agree. >.<

Almost forgot, mere hours away from 1.20a (grabs some popcorn and waits) :D

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

I'm not backpeddling. We're talking about melee abilities. Not ranged. Not spells. Melee abilities.

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Look up "melee" in the dictionary then come post its definition.

There is "physical" damage and "elemental" damage. Again you fail to comprehend the meaning of ranged. this if FF we have DoW and DoM. "ranged" simply referes to distance requirements, it has nothing to do with a spells damage type. There are both long and short ranged physical and magical attacks in game.

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Originally Posted by Murugan

I would rather have genuine strategic options during battle. If they could fit a no TP attack and balance it with the current availability of utility then I'm all for it. I imagine in the future as we get more abilities we will get new offensive abilities for all melee, but simply putting back in pre 1.20 basic attacks is no answer at all.

Spamming abilities does not make for fun combat. Adding in attacks without the proper balance does not add to anything, but instead takes away the usefulness of many other abilities (don't bother using ability X just mash 1). You say your husband "just sits there", and that is the problem. I have never felt that was necessitated by the current combat system, so I think he needs to adjust his playstyle to be more effective. His problem is not "I'm not doing enough damage" it is merely "I'm not doing enough things", and he could solve that by doing more things which would add to his overall contribution to the battle.

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Excellent set of points, Murugan. Above all, this:

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Spamming abilities does not make for fun combat.

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But we are dealing the the Hyperactive Generation, the one that can't pay attention to a film or TV shot, unless it has drastic camera effects every 2-3 seconds. Abhorrence of the lack of rush. And any dramatic pause is good for texting.

R

Page 1 and Page 2 of this thread promised boobs.

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Originally Posted by Scherwiz

WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON?!

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Well basically Rowyne and Advancedwind swore, garunteed, and promised us that there were no abilities in this game that cost 0-Tp that could be used to initiate a battle with a mob.

Some of use explained to them that these were:

Thunder (level 1)
Stone Ilevel 1)
Aero (level 4)
Fire (level10)
FLash (level 14)
Provoke (level 14)
Taunt (level 42)

then they started blathering and spewing some other crap trying to deflect the fact that they were proven 100% grade A, wrong. So know they are making some unintelligent attempt to skirt there afore mentioned incorrectness by making some irational issue as to how the debate should all of the sudden exclude some of the abilities because of the physical and elemental nature of the attacks.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Besides, I don't insult your linkshell and your utterly retarded signatures.

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Originally Posted by trinta

Codependency is a real illness. You say that it is "saddening on a mental level" but you honestly have no idea. You're about as cool as someone making fun of a guy in a wheelchair. You think it's okay to make fun just because you can't physically see the problem?

The rest of your points may have been completely valid, but low ignorant blows are low and ignorant.

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if we're going to be pc about this, the word "retarded" shouldn't be thrown around so carelessly either. but then again...

WELCOME TO FFXIV OFFICIAL FORUMS!

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Originally Posted by Coglin

Well basically Rowyne and Advancedwind swore, garunteed, and promised us that there were no abilities in this game that cost 0-Tp that could be used to initiate a battle with a mob.

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In my humble defense: I was just pointing out what she meant when she said that. In fact, I also disagree with almost everything she has posted thus far.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

It's not fair to expect all melee will want to level CNJ and THM to get a few spells as a workaround.

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Don't worry, you don't need to level CNJ or THM for the first 2 spells. Just put on CNJ and THM weapons once and that was.
And which melee have not CNJ level 2 for Cure and maybe CNJ level 6 for Protect?

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Originally Posted by Coglin

Well basically Rowyne and Advancedwind swore, garunteed, and promised us that there were no abilities in this game that cost 0-Tp that could be used to initiate a battle with a mob.

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Oh, good lord.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

Some of use explained to them that these were:

Thunder (level 1)
Stone Ilevel 1)
Aero (level 4)
Fire (level10)
FLash (level 14)
Provoke (level 14)
Taunt (level 42)

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The point was that melee classes no longer received their own resource-free melee attack abilities with which to initiate combat. The first four you listed are spells (and aside from the fact that they obviously aren't melee abilities, they cost MP), the last three aren't attacks so much as aggro-generating abilities (the last of which you don't even get until level 42).

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Originally Posted by Coglin

then they started blathering and spewing some other crap trying to deflect the fact that they were proven 100% grade A, wrong. So know they are making some unintelligent attempt to skirt there afore mentioned incorrectness by making some irational issue as to how the debate should all of the sudden exclude some of the abilities because of the physical and elemental nature of the attacks.

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I mentioned ranged because you were SO sure that the Archer-exclusive Light Shot should count, when it is a ranged attack that can't be cross-classed.

By the way, you might want to double check the spelling, grammar, and insults before you go tossing the word 'unintelligent' around. At this point, you're a little too desperate to be right.

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Originally Posted by Felis

Don't worry, you don't need to level CNJ or THM for the first 2 spells. Just put on CNJ and THM weapons once and that was.
And which melee have not CNJ level 2 for Cure and maybe CNJ level 6 for Protect?

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The random MRD tank I invited to a pick up group last week. ; ;

I believe he said "I'm not a mage, that's your job" then proceeded to wipe us everytime he got more than one mob since he couldn't gain aggro on anything else...

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Uh... what? I picked CNJ because it was described on the official site before the game was even released as the healing class. I play a healer in every MMO, and a healer was all I wanted to be here. I only leveled THM to get Siphon MP. I was one of the people who were right about assuming CNJ would get WHM.

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It's almost of shame that there isn't a test server were you could test drive, if you will, high level classes to get a feel for how combat changes as you advance Fighting at higher levels it so much more fun then the lower levels, especially when you gain access to all three tiers for both weaponskill combos and can start popping out enfeebles.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

By the way, you might want to double check the spelling, grammar, and insults before you go tossing the word 'unintelligent' around. At this point, you're a little too desperate to be right.

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Well, I never claimed to be a typist, your the only one making "claims" here. I am a design and production engineer, I have people like you to type and spellcheck for me.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

I mentioned ranged because you were SO sure that the Archer-exclusive Light Shot should count, when it is a ranged attack that can't be cross-classed.

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Again with the back peddling. You specifically claimed ther were no 0-TP attacks to initiate combat. You were wrong, this is a prime example. You smoke blowing exclusions were not part of your challenge for me to post an ability fiting your 2 and only 2 requirements. You never claimed it i display one that was cross class (although I posted 7 others that were) nor did you specify its range. Range being irrelavent because you can use it at 0 yalms or 25 yalms and everywhere in between. SO if by melee you mean close range physical attack, then pierce damage at 0 yalms is exactly that.

Several people have demonstrated how you have posted incorrect information, misinformation, or well, just lied. Every time instead of saying, oh, I didn't think of that. You make some bull crap reason you try to skirt the issue by changing criteria are some other form of evasion.

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Originally Posted by trinta

Codependency is a real illness. You say that it is "saddening on a mental level" but you honestly have no idea. You're about as cool as someone making fun of a guy in a wheelchair. You think it's okay to make fun just because you can't physically see the problem?

The rest of your points may have been completely valid, but low ignorant blows are low and ignorant.

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Actually, it's relevant due to the misinformation they spew and how it is obnoxious to see this misinformation while they openly reveal their illness. Which I don't have a problem with calling out. The only things I feel are too low are things people cannot change about themselves. Race, gender, sexual orientation. You can change your way of thinking under a mental illness with help. Might not be something people like reading, but I don't find it unreasonable to be said.

This thread ie irrelevent, the patch is not tomorow!

rabble rabble rabble

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Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

Actually, it's relevant due to the misinformation they spew and how it is obnoxious to see this misinformation while they openly reveal their illness. Which I don't have a problem with calling out. The only things I feel are too low are things people cannot change about themselves. Race, gender, sexual orientation. You can change your way of thinking under a mental illness with help. Might not be something people like reading, but I don't find it unreasonable to be said.

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I thought this thread was about the patch. But I only see 2 people discussing. Suddenly, I saw your avatars, and I realized how funny it is to see people with reindeer costumes discussing! ..Thank you SE, you made me smile! lol..

Lol *thumbsup* if you read this 'cause you were bored waiting for patch and actually felt like you were watching a soap! Too bad it didn't end with Rowyne learning some moral lesson about looking before leaping or something similar xP.

Copper

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

This thread ie irrelevent, the patch is not tomorow!

rabble rabble rabble

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Lol right, now it's today :D

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Originally Posted by Coglin

makes it hard to take anyone seriously who is max 25 in there highest class. Something anyone can literally do solo in an hour.

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OH BOY! My bullshit detector just went off!

The immaturity meter is off the chart in this thread. Give it a rest, people, and try to grow up a bit. I came here to read about the patch, and I end up with a bunch of troglodytes bickering at each other! Live, and let live. Try to understand that people can have opinions that differ from your own. Accept it, and move on.