How many people have multiple houses?

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Originally Posted by Scenic

I've heard you can still get houses even in high pop servers if you camp the boards but there is a lot of contradicting information.

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I can only speak abut my experience on Adamantoise. From what I saw when I was looking to buy a plot and have seen as I take walks around the various wards, plots become available often enough that you shouldn't have to camp full time to get one. My lot in the Lavender Beds had been on the market a couple of days when I bought it. It even has a nice view of a waterfall and stream. I've seen others last a couple of days before being sold as well. I'm not trying to say you can walk in anytime you want but over a couple of weeks of random dropping in you have a good chance of finding something. I also think some of the problem is with the Mists being considered the preferred area folks tend to spend more time looking there as opposed to the other two open housing areas. I know of no way to fix this other than being open minded about where your house is.

28 homes on one account...they wonder why people are upset at them?

lol

This reminds me when Martha Stewart bought up every house in a neighborhood once.

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Originally Posted by Annah

28 homes on one account...they wonder why people are upset at them?

lol

This reminds me when Martha Stewart bought up every house in a neighborhood once.

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https://media.tenor.com/images/0da1c...cac8/tenor.gif

I knew, one day! This gif would be useful.

In response to the OP, I don't own multiple houses. I think purchasing multiple plots is disrespectful, personally. Note that while I don't have access to a FC house, I don't begrudge people who have access to two (one a "public" FC house that they may or may not be the owner of record for, and one a personal house). Beyond that, though? Pure disrespect.

A couple of other things.

1.) One of the typical responses to the Mateus incident is that the plots lay vacant for ages, so why should people care? That's hogwash. SE didn't time their transfer windows for a quiet mid-expansion cycle; they timed it for an expansion launch. There were countless returning players, freshly interested in FFXIV, who were likely also freshly interested in housing. Now, they don't have options anymore, on Mateus at least. That's ridiculous. If it were six months into Stormblood, I think this line of defence would be valid, but given the timing of SE's incentives, it's not applicable.

2.) The blame for all of this shouldn't fall on the players. Are they disrespecting others and being self-centered? Yeah, sure - but welcome to life. That's their right. They fully deserve criticism over it, but unlike real life, FFXIV is a completely manicured environment - and it is SE at fault here, as usual. They should have locked houses to one per account, possibly one per account per server - or better yet, not offered limited f*cking housing in the first godsdamned place. Every other MMO has managed it, why can't they? They also should never have disrupted the population levels of smaller servers like Mateus so quickly and thoughtlessly. Keep in mind here, SE had years to react to the overpopulation of servers like Balmung. Despite this, they couldn't even be bothered to lock those servers to transfers, or completely shut down character creation. They couldn't be bothered to upgrade their server hardware when moving data centres so that they could handle the larger worlds. Now, because of their delay in addressing overpopulation, and their sh*tty implementation of houses, we have this scenario. They caused it. They should fix it.

^This about 2nd statement.

I hope people have been asking in the Live Letter thread for Saturday: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...g-Patch-4.0%29

So that people can actually throw in many Housing related question and discussion in there, and devs/translators would be notified that people are seriously concerned about housing and be addressed this upcoming Saturday.

I think the worst part of that tumblr post, for me anyways, was the attitude with which those two approached the few neighbors they had - like any house not decorated by them and in their private theme was an eye-sore that they needed to grab and re-build so that everyone on their server could come in and take tours of the pretty ward... or some such. I just don't understand that mentality.

Thing is, though, these players only got what they had access to. Even if they had to work around character-based restrictions to get all those houses, SE did supply them with the means to do that. And we all know that if there is a means to something, there are players who will pursue it regardless if you think it's right or wrong, or it's SE's original intent or not, doesn't matter. I'm just hoping that the publicity that article has given this entire situation will prompt change so that at least new players who are just becoming interested in housing can have an equal chance to the rest of us.

It's always been my opinion that we should have a hard server/account-based limit on the number of houses that a player can have at once, and that fc's should be required to have at least three separate characters with membership and active subscription to the game at any given time in order to obtain and keep FC housing. I'm hoping we'll eventually have a limit of one fc and one personal house per account per server, but I'll admit that it would cause players who have a small handful of alts with a couple or so personal houses on one server and no intentions of hoarding anything to themselves to have to suffer the same consequences as the greedy, and that would be kind of unfair to those people. I certainly don't agree with the "we got to it first so we evidently worked much harder than you did and deserve everything more than you do" point of view - IMO that's nothing but an excuse.

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Originally Posted by Vhailor

1.) One of the typical responses to the Mateus incident is that the plots lay vacant for ages, so why should people care? That's hogwash. SE didn't time their transfer windows for a quiet mid-expansion cycle; they timed it for an expansion launch. There were countless returning players, freshly interested in FFXIV, who were likely also freshly interested in housing. Now, they don't have options anymore, on Mateus at least. That's ridiculous. If it were six months into Stormblood, I think this line of defence would be valid, but given the timing of SE's incentives, it's not applicable.

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I don't support the idea of players owning an entire ward. But waiting for a free transfer does not excuse the people complaining from their own laziness or priorities, if you want a house and know plots are free on another server then move. Don't wait for a free transfer move then gripe cause plots are no longer open.

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Originally Posted by Claviusnex

I can only speak abut my experience on Adamantoise. From what I saw when I was looking to buy a plot and have seen as I take walks around the various wards, plots become available often enough that you shouldn't have to camp full time to get one. My lot in the Lavender Beds had been on the market a couple of days when I bought it. It even has a nice view of a waterfall and stream. I've seen others last a couple of days before being sold as well.

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When did you buy your house? This is promising information but depending on how long ago it was it may no longer be true. From my understanding you are basically waiting on plots to be abandon and with large amount of people coming back to the game for the expansion the turnover is going to be a lot lower. Also you will have a lot more people looking to buy so houses wont stay up for long.

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Originally Posted by Hakuro89

What exactly constitutes an 'unusually high price' to the point it's not allowed and reportable?

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They would never gice an exact number. By keeping it vague it gives them leeway to make the decision, if they said "more than double the price is against the rules" but then someone put double -1 gil then they aren't breaking the rules.

By being vague intentionally it gives them more room to navigate what they think is too high.

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Originally Posted by Khalithar

They would never gice an exact number. By keeping it vague it gives them leeway to make the decision, if they said "more than double the price is against the rules" but then someone put double -1 gil then they aren't breaking the rules.

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This never made sense to me. If they don't want people selling houses, make the game mechanics work to prevent it. If they don't mind it up to a certain point then just tell us what that point is. Being vague is not helpful on either front, all it does is create more work for the GMs because we don't know what is and isn't reportable, so report everything and more frustration for us the users because when we don't know the exact rules it feels like everyone's breaking them and getting away with it.

A game that forces a sub fee that doesnt give enough space for all players to own a home is absolutely despicable. I am all for sub fees, btw. That isnt the issue

You'd have to go back and limit housing to one per account, strip extra houses from people who have multiple and reimburse them for the plot and lost furniture. Would cause a lot of drama but could be done. Then you'd have to do something about flippers directly like making it so you can't give up your plot for X amount of months after purchase. This would prevent people from snatching a plot just to resell it.

I know of at least one FC that owns 4 total houses on Balmung. They've bought out other FC's and put either alts or family members in charge of the other houses with the leader having alts in each FC.

I have four houses on Mateus. Three normal houses, and one FC.

Yeah, I agree with the idea of limiting the houses to 2/account (FC house+personal house) + 1 apartment.

I dunno about this one I never thought I would say this but I side with the girls. On the one hand you had plots that were empty for years YEARS and two friends came together and put the time, effort and gill in, to buy them up and kit them all out and this was totally fine for a long period of time. This was their right and they have done nothing wrong. Then you have an influx of people who chose originally to join what has been known to be an overcrowded server for also years, suddenly show up and be like "where's ma house". I think at the end of the day the issue is that FF housing is desirable because it is rare and expensive and while I sympathise emplicitly with FC's trying to get a house (it took ours a year till a small plot finally opened at 4 am on a Monday morning and you can't imagine how excited we all were) they paid for them with blood, sweat and tears and they deserve those houses just as much as anyone else would.

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Originally Posted by Indefiinable

I dunno about this one I never thought I would say this but I side with the girls. On the one hand you had plots that were empty for years YEARS and two friends came together and put the time, effort and gill in, to buy them up and kit them all out and this was totally fine for a long period of time. This was their right and they have done nothing wrong. Then you have an influx of people who chose originally to join what has been known to be an overcrowded server for also years, suddenly show up and be like "where's ma house". I think at the end of the day the issue is that FF housing is desirable because it is rare and expensive and while I sympathise emplicitly with FC's trying to get a house (it took ours a year till a small plot finally opened at 4 am on a Monday morning and you can't imagine how excited we all were) they paid for them with blood, sweat and tears and they deserve those houses just as much as anyone else would.

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I don't think anyone denies they bought them up fair and square when the server was empty. I think it's more on SE's end where the fault lies for not limiting 1 personal house/1 FC House Master per account. This has been an issue on going since they implemented housing where people or FC's would buy up multiple houses.

I think making any brand new rules is a bit beyond SE's capability as far as current home ownership goes. But it's possible they could apply a "one per server per account" rule on just Shirogane or purely on all future purchases. I would like to see that, but doubt it will happen.

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Originally Posted by Texa

I think making any brand new rules is a bit beyond SE's capability as far as current home ownership goes. But it's possible they could apply a "one per server per account" rule on just Shirogane or purely on all future purchases. I would like to see that, but doubt it will happen.

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If they try to revamp or redo the whole housing system, it'd be something among the line of them sending all of their former furnishings back to the Housing Caretaker and giving 100% gil back to the NPC and change it into some instance or whatever.

So even if those two people with 28 housing would get the full refund benefit too regardless. Just they'll face with more house-less. But it doesn't mean they can't try the 8 FC house method as alternative.

The Devs should really consider trying out the FC's own ward with plots and extra wards for players to build a house in there, and have non FC members purchase in personal housing instead.

We don't ask people to be expelled without any kind of payback (as for houses cost than furnitures). The housing need a revamp.

One problem can be told that way : new FC are in competition with individuals and there is not enough houses plots for FC's, alts FC's, main individual and alts .

For main and alt, it sounds reasonable to say houses need to be shared. One house per server per account sounds fair (this said by someone who would be glad to have two or three houses but there is the reality : server capacity -hum? kinda doubt anyway-).

For new FC's when Kugane will be opened, if they don't lock FC's only, it will be first come, first served. It will be a problem in many servers for FC's.

If all people and FC's want mansion (and if not "want", at least "would be glad"), the reasonable way is to start little with expansion possibilities (in gils). Not all players will take time to build the whole mansion.

There is not that many datas needed for housing, the only problem is instances. But considering how empty wards are, instances for indivudal houses cost less capacities than wards (especially if we remember apartments and rooms : they are instances and yet exist, server capacity sounds rather like an excuse to not change than a real capacity problem for servers).

There are MMO that offer pretty much more. In one, you can almost buy ALL houses, in ALL cities and transform all of them as accommodation. It is mainly only a matter of time and motivation -whole day crafting-.

Technicaly, it is possible. Do they want? That is the real question. And the reply sounds like a "no".

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Originally Posted by Dustytome

This never made sense to me. If they don't want people selling houses, make the game mechanics work to prevent it. If they don't mind it up to a certain point then just tell us what that point is. Being vague is not helpful on either front, all it does is create more work for the GMs because we don't know what is and isn't reportable, so report everything and more frustration for us the users because when we don't know the exact rules it feels like everyone's breaking them and getting away with it.

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Part of it has to do with Japanese culture. In Japanese society, it's considered offensive to outright tell someone "no" or making firm statements like that. So instead of being rude, they say things like "that may be difficult" or "we shall see". Combine that with the concept of "face" (roughly similar to honor, for us Western devils) where admitting fault is one of the worst things that can happen to you, and you get stuff like what happens with SE. They don't want to be rude by making firm statements, but they also can't risk losing face by admitting error. That's why pretty much the entire 1.0 team was either laid off or in the case of the previous executive in charge, resigned in shame when they shut it down.

But that's only part of it, I'm not saying that's all the reason, just that it plays a role.

So I have asked them this question on the liveletter thread (page 54). Would be nice to get some likes so that they might see it and get to know the problem.

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Originally Posted by Dustytome

This never made sense to me. If they don't want people selling houses, make the game mechanics work to prevent it.

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The game mechanics already work to prevent it. Personal plot ownership cannot be transferred and plots cannot be traded. The sellers ask for a ransom and then release the plot after which it's the buyer's job to buy it from the game. The only way to stop people from circumventing the restrictions is by removing face-to-face gil trading entirely.

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Originally Posted by Reinha

The game mechanics already work to prevent it. Personal plot ownership cannot be transferred and plots cannot be traded. The sellers ask for a ransom and then release the plot after which it's the buyer's job to buy it from the game. The only way to stop people from circumventing the restrictions is by removing face-to-face gil trading entirely.

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Actually if the house plot relinquished wen on a RNG based cooldown before becoming available to buy, say 12 hours +/- 1-12 hours based on RNG, it would completely break the ability to relinquish a plot to someone else for gil.

So what happens if a character (who owns a home) tries to purchase another one?

Tbh I am sort of glad these guys bought 28 houses on their own server. It's wrong yes, but it speaks very loud and draws the necessary attention to this problem that it lacked previously. Sometimes you need a necessary evil to push the envelope, and I think these guys did it, for better or worse.

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

Actually if the house plot relinquished wen on a RNG based cooldown before becoming available to buy, say 12 hours +/- 1-12 hours based on RNG, it would completely break the ability to relinquish a plot to someone else for gil.

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Personally I am not convinced that would be enough. I think a bigger variance is needed. You can quite easily stay awake for 24 hours (the max your idea suggests).

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Originally Posted by Paladinleeds

Personally I am not convinced that would be enough. I think a bigger variance is needed. You can quite easily stay awake for 24 hours (the max your idea suggests).

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Oh, I'm fine with a longer cooldown. Make is a week +/- 1-7 days and a random time after that. I'd just like to break the ability of players to effectively relinquish a lot to another player for a payment. Unless a third player happens to be right there are the moment they have no chance of obtaining the relinquished plot, and that's not very fair IMHO. But by forcing a cooling off period of undetermined length, it is much fairer to everyone.

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

Oh, I'm fine with a longer cooldown. Make is a week +/- 1-7 days and a random time after that. I'd just like to break the ability of players to effectively relinquish a lot to another player for a payment. Unless a third player happens to be right there are the moment they have no chance of obtaining the relinquished plot, and that's not very fair IMHO. But by forcing a cooling off period of undetermined length, it is much fairer to everyone.

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I was thinking more within the range of months. Say, a random time between 90 and 180 days maybe? I'm thinking that way you'll probably forget who you bought the plot from, etc. Which would ruin it even further by people not wanting to risk forgetting it because of the timescales involved. Or am I overdoing it there?

Anyway, on to the math and tech of how I think this should work. I shall use the 90-180 day relinquishment as an example here.
So, let's work out how many seconds there are between say 1st July and 1st October. Roll a random integer (behind the scenes), between 1 and 7'776'000 (that's how many seconds there are in 90 days). Whatever that number is that's rolled, that's in how many seconds after the 90 day marker is reached, until it relinquishes. Yes, I'm thinking of doing it by seconds. That would make it much more difficult to track. If you did it by hours, you could just check on the hour every hour, but seconds? You wouldn't be able to do anything else. Because at any second that plot could come up, and you might be in duty when it happens, and someone comes in and takes it.

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Originally Posted by Reinha

The game mechanics already work to prevent it. Personal plot ownership cannot be transferred and plots cannot be traded. The sellers ask for a ransom and then release the plot after which it's the buyer's job to buy it from the game. The only way to stop people from circumventing the restrictions is by removing face-to-face gil trading entirely.

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That isn't a prevention though. People put all sorts of things on the market board to absurdly high prices with no restrictions. Since the devs dislike house selling, they should just lock it based on your account.

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Originally Posted by Coatl

Tbh I am sort of glad these guys bought 28 houses on their own server. It's wrong yes, but it speaks very loud and draws the necessary attention to this problem that it lacked previously. Sometimes you need a necessary evil to push the envelope, and I think these guys did it, for better or worse.

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I was thinking the same. If this doesn't scream "fix your awful housing system, SE." I don't think anything ever will.

I have been trying for a long time now and do not even have 1 :(
Still the system is largely to blame because they have not went with instanced housing like other mmos
When the new district opens up in SB i am taking a day as holiday damnit, lol

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Originally Posted by Reinha

The game mechanics already work to prevent it. Personal plot ownership cannot be transferred and plots cannot be traded. The sellers ask for a ransom and then release the plot after which it's the buyer's job to buy it from the game. The only way to stop people from circumventing the restrictions is by removing face-to-face gil trading entirely.

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As Kosmos said they could tack on additional time after it's relinquished. In addition they could make it so you can't purchase additional homes for a certain period of time after relinquishing an estate, unless moving servers. Once the moving system is in place you shouldn't need to relinquish the home first anyway unless you're doing something you shouldn't be like selling it. You'd have to lock down FCs as well so you can't be given ownership of an FC with a house if you already own an fc with a house, nor could you purchase a house for a fc if you're the leader of an fc with a house. There's then the choice Square would have to make to widdle down houses people already have forcefully, or simply apply the new rules and let it put a stop to further issue.

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

So what happens if a character (who owns a home) tries to purchase another one?

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If a character owns a personal plot and tries to buy another plot as a personal plot the system won't let them. In future, you'll have the option to move if the character already has a plot.

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Originally Posted by Hakuro89

That is absolutely disgusting. There is zero reason anyone should need or be able to buy any more than one personal house per server. And SE really needs to put limits on that, soon. These guys are just an example, there are others that buy up property en masse like that to gain a monopoly on house sales, something that fills me with dread thinking about the second Shirogane opens up.
In their case I see it as less 'we want to live in quiet' and more 'look how much more money we have than you, lolol'. It's pretty clear to me they're only doing it to anger people, and they definitely succeeded.

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Why is it always the players fault. Not enough houses (players fault), to big a que (players fault), players buy the houses (players fault), player doesn't have enough inventory (players fault), servers crash (players fault), not enough instances (players fault). Does the dev team ever make any choices that isn't the players fault?

I strongly dislike the current system. I have used other words in the past. But they have broken no rules. They did not cheat and gil is not hard to earn. Two to three hours a day doing simple timer stuff and ventures makes me a million a week. I would be sacred to see how much someone dedicated could earn weekly. They leveled within the rules and bought them. Again I do not like that they own the houses. If you support a system, I believe you must live with the consequences.

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Originally Posted by Scenic

When did you buy your house? This is promising information but depending on how long ago it was it may no longer be true. From my understanding you are basically waiting on plots to be abandon and with large amount of people coming back to the game for the expansion the turnover is going to be a lot lower. Also you will have a lot more people looking to buy so houses wont stay up for long.

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It would have been late last year so things could have changed with the new release bringing in more players. I also have no doubt that getting a house is near impossible on the high population servers. I guess the real question will be if the returning players that purchase housing are really long term or will they be gone once they've maxed everything out? I won't pretend to know the answer nor even attempt an opinion on it. I haven't taken a walk around for a while so maybe I will do that to see what things look like now that SB is out.

I'm not a house hoarder so have no issues with SE putting restrictions on the number of houses someone owns. I would be concerned if they don't allow some type of overlap for players that want to move to a new house. Let's say something like a 30 day window to decide which one you'll keep and which one you will release. I will say that even though it is the cause of all the problems I do like the neighborhood nature of the current housing areas. I understand this in not supportable for the large number of people that would like houses but hope they could be grandfathered in under any new housing scheme.

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Originally Posted by Dustytome

As Kosmos said they could tack on additional time after it's relinquished. In addition they could make it so you can't purchase additional homes for a certain period of time after relinquishing an estate, unless moving servers.

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There should be some mechanism to be able to relocate on the same server. Something like you own a house and are allowed to buy one more. Then within 30 days you have to pick one to keep and release the other or the system will return one back to the pool automatically.

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Originally Posted by Sakuraluna

I think the worst part of that tumblr post, for me anyways, was the attitude with which those two approached the few neighbors they had - like any house not decorated by them and in their private theme was an eye-sore that they needed to grab and re-build so that everyone on their server could come in and take tours of the pretty ward... or some such. I just don't understand that mentality.

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It's the sort of thing that might make people make their homes intentionally an actual eyesore (Dodo nests, cannons pointed at their snobbish neighbors, garish colors). Given that it's pixels and there isn't an homeowners association to complain to, it would make for a unpunishable gesture toward their snobbish neighbors.


I completely agree with the sentiment that it should be 1 personal house/account/server. It just makes sense if square is going to have this as a limited resource. Square should do something to correct this system that's been broken now since mid ARR.


(unrelated to anything you said in your post - general statement not directed at you)
As far as the homeowners themselves....yeah, the system let them do it, but that doesn't mean they should. People giving them grief? Tough. They chose to do something that any person would have found inadvisable and the court of public opinion is going to judge them.

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Originally Posted by Claviusnex

There should be some mechanism to be able to relocate on the same server. Something like you own a house and are allowed to buy one more. Then within 30 days you have to pick one to keep and release the other or the system will return one back to the pool automatically.

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That's coming with Shirogane's opening, whenever that may be. It's more immediate of course, you choose to move to the new plot, the old one is up for grabs.

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Originally Posted by Valinis

Why should someone have to spend every hour they play camping a crystal because some selfish person wants to RP with a limited commodity? Selfish, rude, greedy and inconsiderate. People like you are part of the problem.

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If someone wants a house, they will do it. I have sat at the crystal on the hour every hour for weeks on end, to get a friend a house. So, yeah. You can sit there, be lazy and complain that something isn't placed directly into your lap? OR, OR, you can DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Personally, when I want something, I go and I get it. I use all of my houses, I like all of my houses, and I'm glad SE let me have these houses. Some people like to collect minions, mounts, whatever, I'm happy with what I have.

It's a feature in the game that is purely optional, and I really enjoy it. Why shouldn't I get to enjoy it, because someone doesn't FEEL like putting in bare minimal effort?

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Originally Posted by Dustytome

That's coming with Shirogane's opening, whenever that may be. It's more immediate of course, you choose to move to the new plot, the old one is up for grabs.

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I was assuming you were talking under normal circumstances which is the I brought up the need to allow overlapping house ownership. While my thought is it would be rare you might not like the new location or it might take a few days to move items from your old place to new. I don't like the idea of an forced immediate move/relinquish on the same server.

I guess this is housing hello from ragnarok ... 30

http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...&house=&order=

:D

I have one personal house small and one medium house for my FC mates and I, aiming for a Mansion once Shirogane drops.

The speculation some people say that "housing wards that are coming will be a solution for those suffering" no - no they won't. I know that the two top d-bags on Excalibur are already poising themselves to buy new plots and have their level 50 alts all buy back the old plots that get released after the transfer. What sucks is that unless Square Enix decides to actually act on a solution to prevent these people from doing it, a lot of us are going to get royally screwed by this. Really need to push S-E to either find a solution before 4.1, presumably when the new wards drop, or hold back from releasing them until something is done to rectify this and to prevent housing going to more undeserving, greedy hoarders.