Developer lack of communication

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Originally Posted by Belhi

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I would prefer that they plan to have the appropriate staff available when they make a decision that is probably iffy. I swear for all the "I love online games. I play online games. I am a gamer" They have very little touch on things that are going to go bad. Hunts a mob the whole server can get credit on. That isn't going to turn pout poorly. X amount of houses to be released on servers that have 10 times the amount of players and a login server that can't handle the stress. Houses open for reclamation over Xmass. Diadem giving raid level items in random drop. These aren't even balance issues. They are awesome game design that is going to cause the player base to be upset. In fact they should also have more GMs on when introducing this type of content.

Instead of all this promo pre SB. A launch job guide made by the dev team would have been way better. Because we needed SE to spend the money and time putting on 3 fanfests with so much info. The media tour the time spent at E3. Maybe work on game release game promo after.

Also the fact other games have ptr limits some of the crap that goes on in the forum. Might be time to evaluate why that works so well for other games. But oh no the lore. Heaven forbid someone knows someone dies. As if they aren't coming back two patches anyway. I swear people need to think about what quality story telling is. This is no better then those soap operas that used to air.

The devs have a marked habit of telling people a tad too much and then the community comes back and bites their head off as thanks for being included. Seriously, people overreacting is terrible... Next time they shouldn't show anything at all until release, so that we can avoid these frankly ridiculous issues.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

I am saving this for when the next housing fiasco gets ignored on the forums so I can link back to how awesome communication is. Also maybe for the next Diadem because that has been pure gold so far. Or maybe when the bots are rampant in N than leveling rdm/sam to 70 and that gets ignored.

It is easy to say they communicate. Any little info or gesture can count.

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Again, nothing to do with communication. Housing and Diadem are implementation problems, they heard but what they were able to do is limited. just because they can't fix everything the way we want them to doesn't mean they don't listen. and they often don't respond because there's nothing good to say.

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Originally Posted by SendohJin

Again, nothing to do with communication. Housing and Diadem are implementation problems, they heard but what they were able to do is limited. just because they can't fix everything the way we want them to doesn't mean they don't listen. and they often don't respond because there's nothing good to say.

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So basically when the game has problems silence is the answer? Then this is pointless. They can create problems and because they can't fix them and they know they are bad they can just ignore them? Then we have no point having anything from the dev team or asking for anything. They can create a problem and move on. And I don't mean a player can't keep his blm buff up because he doesn't have the perfect positional. I mean stuff we can see miles away. Open world housing, open world mobs, random raid drops from almost fates, gating content behind story, I could go on.

Maybe you are right and they just think we should live with it. Even if we can't see why they would make such poor decisions. Which actually has been the sort of go to move.

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Originally Posted by Welsper59

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You sort of missed my point, my point was SE HAD new builds out for the classes, instead they showcased an old build. Why would you show off something old, when you have a revised version that is more up to date? SE created this discrepancy by not using current build gameplay, and they're the ones who are ultimately at fault for allowing the "Delete WHM" threads to spring up. Had Yoshi not mentioned about a different build then this post and much of the outcry over WHM would likely have never of happened.

Look, to setup the tests and demos for the videos and such, you need to prepare them. By the time that was done, the devs had tweaked things. What do you do, stop and re-do everything using the new build? But if you do that, you'll never get done and then you can't show off anything. It's even possible the folks setting up the demos don't even have access to the new build. Work on the game is continual. When you want to show something off, a cut-off must be done. But work doesn't stop in the background.

I think you're being unreasonable here, and frankly this is common sense.

Sorry for the sass but I really am just sick of whiny entitled lil brats today so here we go...

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Originally Posted by Felis

Someone could say that Zhexos is not a dev, but a forum rep.
So, let write more pages into this thread until a dev write something in japanese ^^

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Because responding to the community's many demands is a great use of the developers talents.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

I am saving this for when the next housing fiasco gets ignored on the forums so I can link back to how awesome communication is. Also maybe for the next Diadem because that has been pure gold so far. Or maybe when the bots are rampant in N than leveling rdm/sam to 70 and that gets ignored.

It is easy to say they communicate. Any little info or gesture can count.

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If the devs stopped to address every single 'WAH I DONT LIKE THIS' issue, we would still be waiting for the first patch of ARR to come out.
YES they do communicate. Its just not always about the things you think are priority.

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Originally Posted by FaileExperiment

Look, to setup the tests and demos for the videos and such, you need to prepare them. By the time that was done, the devs had tweaked things. What do you do, stop and re-do everything using the new build? But if you do that, you'll never get done and then you can't show off anything. It's even possible the folks setting up the demos don't even have access to the new build. Work on the game is continual. When you want to show something off, a cut-off must be done. But work doesn't stop in the background.

I think you're being unreasonable here, and frankly this is common sense.

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I dont think half of the people complaining have a clue about what is involved with corporations, and how much work is put into any kind of fanfest/show before hand.

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Originally Posted by Vespar

Sorry for the sass but I really am just sick of whiny entitled lil brats today so here we go...

If the devs stopped to address every single 'WAH I DONT LIKE THIS' issue, we would still be waiting for the first patch of ARR to come out.
YES they do communicate. Its just not always about the things you think are priority.

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I am tired of the apologists and sycophants (is bootlicker a better word). If the devs took a second to think before they implemented open world content or took their hardware into consideration maybe we wouldn't have this discussion. I don't need a thousands of hours in game design to see that a mob where the whole server can get credit with random spawn is going to go over. Specially when we already had a fate system in place and know how that worked. Yet here hunts are. Here you are saying everything is ok and we should just let them be.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

I am tired of the apologists and sycophants (is bootlicker a better word). If the devs took a second to think before they implemented open world content or took their hardware into consideration maybe we wouldn't have this discussion. I don't need a thousands of hours in game design to see that a mob where the whole server can get credit with random spawn is going to go over. Specially when we already had a fate system in place and know how that worked. Yet here hunts are. Here you are saying everything is ok and we should just let them be.

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Okay. You've like entirely lost me. Everytime I make a comment, you spew off some other radical issue out of left field. WHAT DO YOU WANT?
I dont even know anymore lol. It's comical. Clearly you want them to stop and address every tiny little issue or flaw you can think of. Again... they have priorities, if they stop to talk to you every time you stub your toe we wont see another patch or expansion for 1000 years.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

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So your issue is devs not supossedly listening to hunt and FATE issues..?

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

This brings up a very important topic. Developer communication. During the Live Letter XXXVI the developers stressed that the numbers discussed "Weren't the final numbers". They KNEW during the live letter that everything discussed wasn't accurate and they had known it for at least 3 weeks. Why did they continue to broadcast information they KNEW was inaccurate?

THIS. NEEDS. TO. STOP.

We can only go forth trusting that the information the developers give us is accurate. If we can't trust that information, what is the point of the Live Letters? All they had to do is call up the Battle Design team a day or two before the presentation and get the proper numbers and abilities. I understand presentations are made ahead of time, and a quick correction to the presentation would be all that is needed.

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http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...48/129/538.jpg

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Originally Posted by Jetstream_Fox

You sort of missed my point, my point was SE HAD new builds out for the classes, instead they showcased an old build. Why would you show off something old, when you have a revised version that is more up to date? SE created this discrepancy by not using current build gameplay, and they're the ones who are ultimately at fault for allowing the "Delete WHM" threads to spring up. Had Yoshi not mentioned about a different build then this post and much of the outcry over WHM would likely have never of happened.

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Because that old build was customised for the media tour. As various articles mentioned, dungeons were removed, NPCs that were spoilers were removed, whole areas were blocked off and a good chunk of features were simply missing. So once the build was done and stable, it's isolated from future development, because why waste time backporting changes to a single snapshot release that will never be used again after the tour?

I guarantee the next time SE do this, they'll probably instruct every journalist that they are not to discuss, or take screenshots of tooltips and the potency numbers and simply write about how things look and feel. That's if they provide a playable build again, they will probably just stick with pre-canned trailers and a powerpoint presentation because the playerbase just do not understand how this stuff works (also see the datacenter move and the complaining around that)

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Originally Posted by Raiker

So your issue is devs not supossedly listening to hunt and FATE issues..?

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My issue is the lack of simple foresight and then follow up. Lets say dungeons are safe easy content. Short of some missed issue 4 players enter kill mobs and leave. Changing how cards are drawn is another safe fix and need to see how it turns out over a few weeks. Again not something that needs instant oversight. When you release content that A) upends current progression (being grind X something get new shiny, nerfed later get shiny faster) random shiny drops and laugh at others. B) involves whole server communities C) is something you think that might be seen as a design to force cash out of players (no this does not include emotes or gear) You should be prepared to answer a fair share of questions and have contingency plans in place. Or not implement that content.

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Originally Posted by RaideDuku

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...48/129/538.jpg

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^^
most open dev team in years and still suffers from lack of communication? lolk OP.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

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Ah ... so your issue is with the mechanics of the game itself! And the developers not being able to see the future players reactions to said mechanics...? So you don't want developer communication, you want developers to overhaul things. You're just really unhappy about things in general.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

My issue is the lack of simple foresight and then follow up. Lets say dungeons are safe easy content. Short of some missed issue 4 players enter kill mobs and leave. Changing how cards are drawn is another safe fix and need to see how it turns out over a few weeks. Again not something that needs instant oversight. When you release content that A) upends current progression (being grind X something get new shiny, nerfed later get shiny faster) random shiny drops and laugh at others. B) involves whole server communities C) is something you think that might be seen as a design to force cash out of players (no this does not include emotes or gear) You should be prepared to answer a fair share of questions and have contingency plans in place. Or not implement that content.

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How is any of this relating to lack of discussion as a whole? You seem to just spout off any and every issue (or non-issue) you can think of.
A) SE has been known to make content easier over time because it affords casual players the opportunity to catch up while still allowing the hardcore players a challenge before the content is nerfed. This has been the case since Final Fantasy XI.

B) The most recent whole server community issue I saw was the NA data center relocation which has indeed been responded to by the developers as they currently are trying to gather feedback on ISPs and players seeing out of the norm ping rates. Gathering feedback is still part of dev discussion. They are not going to respond with further information until they have some statistics and solutions to provide.

C) As for cash shop stuff. Square Enix is a business. They are in this for the main purpose of generating income. if vanity cash shop items can generate them income, then of course they are going to do it. What about that needs the playerbase's feedback? If you dont like the cash shop, then vote with your wallet by not buying their items.

Because they need to present SOMETHING.

They needed to create a somewhat "reliable", running version for the showcase. Do you want them to finish the version, polish it for 3 weeks before the presentation, and then completely stop any further development until the event is over?

They have a gazillion times said that THIS IS NOT THE FINAL VERSION AND THINGS ARE SUBJECT TO CHANGE.

They were crystal clear during the media events and live letter that every number and tool tip was not the final version.


If the community loses its shit with preliminary numbers with giant warnings, well thats on the community. As much as this community bitches about content hand-holding there sure are a lot of people whining.

You go to a cake shop owned by SE.

SE says "the cake isn't ready yet, all we have now is a plastic display model"

You don't listen, eat the plastic display model anyway, and get sick.

"SE gave me food poisoning, spread the word"

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Originally Posted by rjspencer4

You go to a cake shop owned by SE.

SE says "the cake isn't ready yet, all we have now is a plastic display model"

You eat the plastic display model anyway and get sick.

"SE gave me food poisoning, spread the word"

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Well they did say the cake wasnt ready. :P

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Originally Posted by rjspencer4

You go to a cake shop owned by SE.

SE says "the cake isn't ready yet, all we have now is a plastic display model"

You don't listen, eat the plastic display model anyway, and get sick.

"SE gave me food poisoning, spread the word"

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Ha ha! I'm stealing this!