At this rate it'll take ages for me to 200-210 my relic.

Casually got my 2nd relic while leveling my other classes up to 60 in less than 2 months
-main scenario
-50R gives poetics for non lvl 60s
-expert for my weekly lore
-beast dailies for xp + relic item
along with other stuff i did on my main. didnt grind or anything.

IF YOU WANT IT FAST, then you gotta 'grind'. Sounds fair. nothing to complain about.

Let some of the veterans tell you about grinding your Dynamis Relics in FF11 back before the level caps where raised from 75. You were looking at years of work by an entire group of people to get these things built.

Square is in this game for the long haul, and they want everyone else to be too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Xandos

Let some of the veterans tell you about grinding your Dynamis Relics in FF11 back before the level caps where raised from 75. You were looking at years of work by an entire group of people to get these things built.

Square is in this game for the long haul, and they want everyone else to be too.

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You sir win this thread.

I personally had one relic and two empys before I quit xi and those were a massive Fucking grind.

So to all of you crying about animus relics being hard there a cake walk compared to xi super weapons.

I am actually pleased with how fast is going, I do daily:

Beast Tribes - Vanu and Vath (as on alt I have just those two) (on main I also did Amaljah and Shagins)
ALL the roulettes that give tomes.... ALL..
+ CTs they gave 100 poetics each AND if there is bonus, you arrive to 50 more for each

and every 6 days i get 3 of each of the items....

Am almost done with my alt's relic, im at 19 19 17 17 (in 4 days i should be finished) and from HQ im missing just the cake, cose my culinary firend isn't online <o<;

I re-subbed in April and bought Heavensward. The moment i hit 60 I started getting materials I needed for it. On Tuesday after I received my fifth Aether Oil I completed my Monk relic. I spent about 3 weeks, perhaps a little more (as I needed Esoterics at first to actually gear up my jobs) doing my roulette's, , the odd Gordias, beast tribes, every hunt I could get too, the odd treasure map and siphoning some new player bonuses off fellow FC members.
I came from ARR with only one pre-expansion beast tribe maxed and a Zeta also. I certainly didn't no life this and tbh the bulk of my progress was just dailies.
Take from my story what you will.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Xandos

Let some of the veterans tell you about grinding your Dynamis Relics in FF11 back before the level caps where raised from 75. You were looking at years of work by an entire group of people to get these things built.

Square is in this game for the long haul, and they want everyone else to be too.

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Originally Posted by kazzel120

You sir win this thread.

I personally had one relic and two empys before I quit xi and those were a massive Fucking grind.

So to all of you crying about animus relics being hard there a cake walk compared to xi super weapons.

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^ Both of these.

Thing is though, XI relic/mythic/empy actually lasted forever and were pretty much the best, depending on your job.

Relic in XIV gets obsoleted kind of quick, even sometimes next update by weapons you can get just from doing your daily expert and then come expansion, they're trash :/

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

Darn scholar relic being the only good weapon for the job. :/

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Midan Metal Codex is currently better than relic. Soooo no clue what your talking about there

Currently is the word
And if you look at how easy the the relic is to have compare to the midan codex

The relic win
(But yeah the midan is gorgeous)

Once the 3.3 will be set the relic will take back the first place thanks to custom stat step

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Originally Posted by Nekotee

Currently is the word
Once the 3.3 will be set the relic will take back the first place thanks to custom stat step

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It really depends on the stats you can assign. I'm closer to getting the Midan book than the Relic, and except for Accuracy that I personally don't care for the new relic as a Scholar (There I said it) unless the next stage can have more crit than the Midan weapon I wouldn't personally find it better.

It's true that if you're close to have it
The midan is better the ilevel/mag atk/mind gain is better than the crit gain from the relic
(Even if the relic has higher cap than other weapon)

Otherwise on progress sch the relic is a must have
(Same goes for the AST if i'm not wrong)

Saving my beast tribe tokens just in case they can be used to buy the Stat Increasers for the next anima stage. Also trying to hold onto my Lore and most of my Eso and Poetics. We don't know what will be used to buy items for the next stage, so I may as well try to be prepared in various ways.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nekotee

Otherwise on progress sch the relic is a must have

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Yep that is why I am trying my best to rush the step so I can get my i230 but it's really eating my soul bit by bit... I am with OP on this. I hope they do something about it.

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Originally Posted by TheGrimace

Also trying to hold onto my Lore .

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I highly doubt Lore will be used. Since the fact it's on a weekly lockout, and the amount of items needed I would think it would be poor taste for them to use it, but things like Poetics, and Esoterics all the way

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CuteWhisper

Yep that is why I am trying my best to rush the step so I can get my i230 but it's really eating my soul bit by bit... I am with OP on this. I hope they do something about it.

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They said they looked at the data, and found that most people were stuck on the crystal stage, and decided to nerf that. They didn't confirm a nerf for the uni item stage.

Still, I can't be certain, and I have no immediate need for Lore now, so I feel safe holding onto a little bit of it while we wait for the patch.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lambadelta

Snip

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I know what they said. I still think they should nerf it

I'll tell you what I told my FC mate, don't turn the game into a second/third job, get it when you get it

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Originally Posted by Jamillion

I'll tell you what I told my FC mate, don't turn the game into a second/third job, get it when you get it

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This advice falls on deaf ears all too often cause they want it now.

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Originally Posted by AsteriaStarfall

I like how so many mentioned beast tribes...well many new players have not been able to get all them to the highest rep. And that my friends is one big flaw in this game. Very little catch up abilities for new players. They want all this time and effort to go into this end game relic but then dont realize that every new player is so far behind being able to enjoy any of this.

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You don't have to play catch up on the HW beast tribes. Both Vath and Vanu Vanu reward tokens from the start of their dailies. -_- You won't get unidentifiables at a rapid rate just with them, but they're very easy access and add up with other methods to acquire.

Will personally refrain from commenting on a lack of catch up methods. I have too many complaints of my own in regards to that. ^_^

The beast tribes are great content. The content that isn't too good at the moment is the End game savage and EX content due to the difficulty of accessibility post patch launch. Basically, SE has to decide who they want to cater the game towards: Old veteran gamers that don't have as much time as they once did to run raid content regularly but still want a challenge, or some new younger generation of pvp and hardcore grinders that want and have the time to spend during the down periods between patch updates to the storylines to want to do the kind of content they are releasing. Right now the majority of players probably want more content that can always be accessed regardless of when they hop back in, and so far that just isn't happening. My hopes lay with the newer stuff they are bringing out, but I'm not holding my breath.

Wrong, in many cases even lore is better then Relic atm. Next step may be better because of customized stats but i do not think it will be anywhere near as customizable as previous Relic.
Perhaps each update to Relic quest they will allow us more and more to customize? Not sure

At the moment only half of lore weapon could outbeat the relic

No scholar would pass on the tetrabiblos
Blm is half half depending of your spellspeed meld
AST is Deneb all the way

Merely it depend of how you build your stuff and meld it
A heavy spellspeed melded black mage will like the relic, because the lore would give him even more (SS is good in single target but deadly in aoe)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nekotee

At the moment only half of lore weapon could outbeat the relic

No scholar would pass on the tetrabiblos
Blm is half half depending of your spellspeed meld
AST is Deneb all the way

Merely it depend of how you build your stuff and meld it
A heavy spellspeed melded black mage will like the relic, because the lore would give him even more (SS is good in single target but deadly in aoe)

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There isn't much point to even discuss relic beating lore weapons because the effort needed to get a lore weapon puts it well outside the bounds of any sane individual. Not to mention stat tweaking gear is near pointless in this game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Colt47

There isn't much point to even discuss relic beating lore weapons because the effort needed to get a lore weapon puts it well outside the bounds of any sane individual. Not to mention stat tweaking gear is near pointless in this game.

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People still love to stat tweak because a lot of mmo players love to theorycraft and min-max.

Personally my Tetrabiblos will become (123 piety, 114 critical) --> (120 critical, 108 celerity) with the 228 stats to put (i think it will remain ilvl 230).
And i think after this, we will have a quest to upgrade the weapon to ilvl 240.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Snipped - Original Post

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Yep... been chipping away at it slowly and I still only have less than half. Oh but hey Im only 2 shy of the aether oils for the next phase... If I ever reach it.... -___-;

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Maero

Wrong, in many cases even lore is better then Relic atm. Next step may be better because of customized stats but i do not think it will be anywhere near as customizable as previous Relic.
Perhaps each update to Relic quest they will allow us more and more to customize? Not sure

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It'll be just as customizable as the previous relic, as it's pretty much the same as the novus step. If the 3.3 anima upgrade ends up being i240, which is very likely, then it wouldn't surprise me if the majority of the anima weapons end up being better than the upgraded lore ones.

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Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

Just because it doesn't fit your definition of fun Doesn't mean it isn't. Not every piece of content is for everyone.

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Does anyone actually have fun with this mindless grind? Sorry, hard to believe.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FabricioRF

Does anyone actually have fun with this mindless grind? Sorry, hard to believe.

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The fact I'm working on three relics proves otherwise. I like having long term goals to work towards though. :3 I don't like it when everything's easy to get.

Actually planning on a fourth and a fifth too! Dark Knight and bard need their relics.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

The fact I'm working on three relics proves otherwise. I like having long term goals to work towards though. :3 I don't like it when everything's easy to get.

Actually planning on a fourth and a fifth too! Dark Knight and bard need their relics.

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To each thier own, I guess.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FabricioRF

Does anyone actually have fun with this mindless grind? Sorry, hard to believe.

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I personally can only stomach doing one relic, but I know others who are on their second and third. I may do another once they nerf quest requirements.

Sorry, but purely for the sake of keeping my word, I'm giving this one a fair chance as I promised before Heavensward launched. I however have already twice seen reason to just drop it and never bother again with any relic.

This relic grind is based on our desires. This is what happens when we get what we want. They will reduce the difficulty all we want. All we have to do is ask. After all, they do want you to keep playing.


One thing they won't change is how long it takes to get the one of the best items in the game. Would it do them (or you) any good if you got the relic the first day and stopped subscribing/playing?

Why does it take somewhere around 4 to 8 weeks to finish the relic you ask? Good question! Did you notice you can get a lore weapon of nearly equal quality in the same exact amount of time for a lot less effort?

Their equation I understood was based on a few factors (This is just what I glean to reading interviews and stuff. I could be wrong of course):
1)Using the home JP audience as the base for their equation. (I mean why not right? If the game was made in USA you can be darn sure we'd do the same.)
2)Assuming you had one person who raided(test group) and one person who didn't(control group) but both averaged to get a base amount of time played.
3)Figure out when the average serious raider in JP was getting the weapon.
4)Use the average time played between the two to figure out how many random relic tasks the non raider would have to do and how long they'd take each to get a similar weapon.

It makes sense when you figure in this is a subscription game doesn't it?

The only thing that will make the time it takes shorter is how easily people are clearing midias... At the moment it still looks like the relic grind is gonna take a while, for a while longer at least.

If they only make one change, which won't completely undermine the grind, they should just add unidentified items to largescale leves.

To Cherie,

The problem is that they don't need to make things so time consuming to keep people playing. If the only reason people are playing is to get a single item and not even care about the content they are doing anymore, they are not playing a game: They are showing symptoms of being on a mouse wheel and suffering from a compulsion. The entire point of the game is to have content we enjoy doing with the reward being something we get at the end as a pay off. Hence, it's about the journey, not the destination.

What you are stating is that the developers care nothing about the journey and just want to make the destination an irresistible mouse trap so people will inevitably waste hours of time burning themselves trying to get the highest powered item. Developers on FFXIV don't want that: they care about making an enjoyable game and want to hear positive feedback from the people playing. A major problem they are having is that the small hardcore audience doing hard content want to be the soul owners of the highest level gear. They are competing with the masses and want to stand over them with something to show for it. In turn, it is their own demands that are determining how those who can't join raids can get the same level of gear.

Ultimately, to make a better game the developers have to decide if they want to keep pleasing this smaller hardcore group of ground pounders or support the larger mid-core vanguard that played these games back in the early 2000s and want to keep enjoying the game on a more limited budget of time. They can't please both groups as that strategy has been tried before. It just doesn't work.

Edit: Also, the developers are in a situation where if they want to change Anima, they can't change the existing ones because then it invalidates all the time and hours people put into it already. The best the FFXIV Development team can do is move forward and have the next one be less demanding.

Colt47, the issue with what you said - while valid and accurate to a degree - is that SE is trying to level a playing field that isn't level.

I'm sorry, this is not me being elitist or hardcore or anything when I say this but; if you're not raiding, then you don't need a raid-level or near raid level weapon. Even if it takes longer, even if it's grindier/pricier/etc. You don't need it. I mean, why? What are you going to use it for? With that in mind, trying to make relics match, if not edge out raid weapons is foolish design. I've used the metaphor many times, but if there was a million dollar prize for reaching the top of a mountain, and one man climbs the mountain while another leisurely walks the longer-but-easier trail, who really deserves the prize? I can only speak for myself, but I never enjoyed, nor felt validated receiving a participation award. And if a participation award held the same prestige/value as a first place one, then why bother at all?

This is NOT me saying "people who don't raid don't deserve good gear!" No. It IS me saying what would be the relevance of having top-notch gear if at best you simply run dailies/roulettes? If/when SE realizes that trying to play to the lowest common denominator doesn't really help, we may see not only a positive change, but it may in fact motivate some players. I said it before: why relic if the stats aren't that great and the requirements are more tedious than necessary? And as the other side of that coin, why challenge ourselves to raid or work any harder if sub-raid level gear will be on par with or even possibly better than raid rewards?

That's the trap. Gear level is not about "What is needed to clear content", it's about having the best gear and reaching the exit condition for the activity of gear grinding. People want to achieve having the best gear for each patch, period. It's never been about getting gear to take down content.

That's unfortunate, but true. However work/life is starting to make me a little more practical about it. I had to sit out this raid tier (awesome new job, but at the cost of time/normal-people sleep habits), so I've been satisfied with having just baseline i230 gear (mostly) and a Lore wep (better stats than the MCH relic, at least for now). Before that, I'd been breaking my neck to clear Seph Ex and gear up (plus melds *eyeroll*) to the point of near burn out.

It's good vs good enough, and as much as it pains me to say it, so long as SE keeps the current approach they do, unless I start raiding again, I'll be fine with "good enough". I have no shortage of skill to accommodate any lack of gear.

This is why I just farm the weapon that's "Not" relic. Faster and less dedication at; mind numbing, uncreative-relic gathering.
The team is out of ideas or they're just lazy.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Colt47

The problem is that they don't need to make things so time consuming to keep people playing. If the only reason people are playing is to get a single item and not even care about the content they are doing anymore, they are not playing a game: They are showing symptoms of being on a mouse wheel and suffering from a compulsion. The entire point of the game is to have content we enjoy doing with the reward being something we get at the end as a pay off. Hence, it's about the journey, not the destination.

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^
this!

The main Problem with how Square Enix currently designs timesink/gilsink is that you grind for a "single" piece of item. They have long before lost the global view and are missing in details...

They have reduced this content to what it is because people couldn't handle titan HM and they weren't happy with the numbers of people who stopped the relic at that point. So now we have stupid long and pointless grinds instead of interesting and fun trials BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE BABIES and throw tantrums. Oh wait isn't that happening AGAIN NOW?