Diadem Gear > (Alex Norm / Savage, Crafting, PVP, VA, Extreme primals, tome) gear?

I am not against Diadem or the 210 grindfest. I am against the RNG which affect to that gear.
In my opinion as raider, the loot involved in Diadem would be the same as savage/esoteric or a bit inferior.

http://i.imgur.com/FBNFi3D.png

Check this Body. Mistbreak body > eso body > gordian body.

If you overcapped Accuracy, that body is better than esoteric and a4s. If you need accuracy, you could use an accesory to replace the acc lost and still get better stats.

A raider dragoon spent 2 months to get eso upgrade or get gordian body. A diadem dragoon farmed did one lucky run and got that. A raider dragoon had to learn fights, learn about rotations and rotate upgrades to improve gear. A diadem dragoon, well, went to a few island avoided a few aoes and the RNG bless him.

I get the raider's perspective that bashing your head against a wall for a piece of candy only to have that candy "given" at random to players would suck. But I don't think it's Diadem's fault though as this is the catch up patch, Alex Savage was so poorly designed to focus on world firsts that the work/reward ratio was imbalanced for general raiders. Even if the challenge was brought down or rewards increased, Savage had very little to experience and lust after. Normal only needed to have the story to fill the requirements of the community, the gear and boss designs should have been entirely different.

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Originally Posted by rappa

I am not against Diadem or the 210 grindfest. I am against the RNG which affect to that gear.
In my opinion as raider, the loot involved in Diadem would be the same as savage/esoteric or a bit inferior.

http://i.imgur.com/FBNFi3D.png

Check this Body. Mistbreak body > eso body > gordian body.

If you overcapped Accuracy, that body is better than esoteric and a4s. If you need accuracy, you could use an accesory to replace the acc lost and still get better stats.

A raider dragoon spent 2 months to get eso upgrade or get gordian body. A diadem dragoon farmed did one lucky run and got that. A raider dragoon had to learn fights, learn about rotations and rotate upgrades to improve gear. A diadem dragoon, well, went to a few island avoided a few aoes and the RNG bless him.

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Raider dragoon could have gotten either eso upgrade item, or gordian body, or both, in one try, if RNG bless him.
A diadem dragoon can spend months and never see a suitable piece.

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

Raider dragoon could have gotten either eso upgrade item, or gordian body, or both, in one try, if RNG bless him.
A diadem dragoon can spend months and never see a suitable piece.

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I like this post.

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

Raider dragoon could have gotten either eso upgrade item, or gordian body, or both, in one try, if RNG bless him.
A diadem dragoon can spend months and never see a suitable piece.

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The good gear is not nearly as rare as some seem to make it out to be. I210 stuff with better than eso/savage gear is not uncommon and even more so as more hard modes are being unlocked.

Not only that but there are no lockouts for this stuff while the lockouts for inferior gear is still in place. The whole situation is just silly.

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Originally Posted by rappa

A raider dragoon spent 2 months to get eso upgrade or get gordian body. A diadem dragoon farmed did one lucky run and got that. A raider dragoon had to learn fights, learn about rotations and rotate upgrades to improve gear. A diadem dragoon, well, went to a few island avoided a few aoes and the RNG bless him.

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Man, who cares though? On some real levels, Savage is okay, but it isn't that fun or imaginative. They're so unsure if they over-tuned it or not that they're hoping all of this new gear pushes the clear rate higher (for NA). There's not much satisfaction to be gotten other than the bragging rights of beating a raid that a lot of people agree was poorly designed. Bragging rights which you already had for months now if you even had any 210 gear left side. I was surprised to see how few people hadn't even gotten 210 accessories this deep into the patch.

Not to mention, we need more variance in the game, that actually feels rewarding. Right now, the most rewarding battle content we've got is Savage, and... what, EX Primals? I'm all for another thing that I can do to get gear, aside from boring tome grinding or beating the snot out of Savage once a week. This is content that has potential to have longevity in some sense, and I couldn't possibly understand why anyone would be against having more ways to get gear they want.

Oh, and I even forgot the fact that this content is coming at a time where we're about to have a major change in gear. Diadem gear is going to be garbage once materia slots are on raid/tome gear. I seriously doubt they're going to go through the effort of making materia slotted gear in 3.3 Diadem. If they do, then MAYBE people have an argument on their hands. If not, a Diablo like system in an MMO is GREAT.

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

Raider dragoon could have gotten either eso upgrade item, or gordian body, or both, in one try, if RNG bless him.
A diadem dragoon can spend months and never see a suitable piece.

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And you are defending diadem loot why? Should the most powerful gear in the game be left to the worst type of RNG?

I am agree we need variance. At this moment, Diadem is the best way to equip your char with the best gear. Also you have access to materia V, crafts materials, raw and other kinds of stuff.

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Originally Posted by zosia

And you are defending diadem loot why? Should the most powerful gear in the game be left to the worst type of RNG?

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Because it's an alternative to raid gearing.

If people are ALREADY complaining with a lot of RNG, imagine what they would do if SQUEX removed the RNG.

To the people defending the 210 gear in The Diadem, why do you need this gear? Is it going to help you clear A3S/A4S? If it is great. I highly doubt that's the case for most people though, so why dilute current 2.0 BiS with The Diadem RNG system?

Not to mention the main focus of doing hunts now in 3.1 is to get Eso upgrades for 3,000 seals. What's the point of doing that when you could probably get a i210 piece in Diadem that is as good or better than i210 Eso gear in the same amount of time?

I'm all for having Void Ark give out Eso upgrades, gear in the game really doesn't matter anymore. On the other hand since gear doesn't really matter anymore, do you really need this gear? Does it have to be amazing? Is it worth keeping this loot system and making Alex Savage gear,Eso gear, the new Void Ark gear, Crafted Gear worth that much less?

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

Raider dragoon could have gotten either eso upgrade item, or gordian body, or both, in one try, if RNG bless him.
A diadem dragoon can spend months and never see a suitable piece.

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A raider dragoon only has ONE chance in 7 days for RNG blessing/Tome lock out.
A diadem dragoon can "Spam" Diadem all day 7 days a week

Raider also has to actually learn fights and perform tee hee hee.

They probably should fix this by actually buffing raid gear with set bonuses and stuff.

Im sorry to OP, i just got i210 caster with total 216 secondary stats (57 acc, 86 crit rate, 41 det, 32 spell speed), yeah its pretty OP.

but its my 1st i210 after 12 run, i even got my pegasus before i got any i210, thanks to RNGesus.

Day 1 in Diadem
~2 runs
~replaced my esoteric necklace
~replaced my savage bracelets

I'm liking this especially since I potentially get better gear. Also the drop rate is really good, it's very easy to farm, and the rng isn't that bad haha

If I have to be honest i think diadem needs to be scaled back a bit because it was kinda sad that the first day I went into diadem i replaced my upgraded eso ring in just a few minutes. Raid gear should always be at the top of all gear in the game simple as and anyone defending diadem are just foolish and don't want to work to get good gear and SE is just supporting that and I wonder why so many people are so bad at the game and doing this just encourages it. In order for me to get an upgraded eso ring I needed to beat AS2 for the upgrade item but now i can just fly around hit a star mob/V then get a 210 with no effort put in. People can give the argument that the stats won't always be good but from looking at how things are right now i see quite a few people with the best stats you can get.

People are rolling in gear better than raid gear from just hitting a mob and this annoys me a little bit. The concept of diadem is good but they need to scale back 210 a bit or buff raid gear. So far SE hasn't given any reason to do raiding because they throw 210 at you anyway.

The ones saying the loot doesn't matter are deceiving themselves here. Despite the RNG, the mere possibility of getting superior gear (through minimal effort at that) is why people are doing Diadem (it offers little else of worth really). If you don't care about the gear, then why are you bothered that people want to see it changed so its more balanced?

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Originally Posted by Remus

If I have to be honest i think diadem needs to be scaled back a bit because it was kinda sad that the first day I went into diadem i replaced my upgraded eso ring in just a few minutes.

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Omg, they should totally have made Atmas drop more rarely, because there was some dude who got all twelve atmas in one day! D:

*cough* Just because a few people (statistically) can upgrade some of their i210 items after just a few runs, it doesn't mean everyone can. Some people can (in theory) farm the Diadem for the entire patch cycle without getting a single piece that's on par or better than Eso/AS gear (and if they do, you can bet it's for a job they don't even have at 60 yet).

@Remus and Feliaiko, yes stats matter and yes it is easier to get better than savage gear in diadem for less effort. I understand how you feel just changed out my gordian belt for some pink gear, and I would have had issue if diadem dropped at the same time as Alex savage. It did not and we are no longer in Alex savage patch we are in the catch up patch, the new gear is for people who don't raid and for people who do raid who want that extra edge to clear the rest of Alex. That is why they give out twine and coats, We have to let it go as raiders, we have had better gear for 5 months, now everyone can have better gear. Mmos are not static they grow and progress more levels better gear, it's the natural cycle. :)

Don't see why people are looking at Diadem as 'catch up content'. Catch up content is when loot lockouts are removed (Alex), new ways to get gear are provided (VA), raid-exclusive items become available outside of raid (Hunts, VA). Diadem is a different matter, and so shouldnt be lumped as catch up content because of the patch it made its debut in.

As for it being there to give people 210 without raiding, that's what the upgrade items are for. As was the case in every previous instance. I have no issue with twine/coats being available outside of raiding, because you can still make a distinction between non-raiders' and raiders (as the former will be Eso 210, but the optimal build will come from mixing Eso and Gordian gear). Diadem though disrupts this whole balance. The best gear possible now can be achieved with less effort and with no lockout. Why even keep Savage on a lockout at this point then? Might as well remove that too.

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Originally Posted by FeliAiko

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I'm all for taking out Savage, if that's what you mean.

But on a serious note, for the first time this games looks like what a FF is about and people are complaining. If it's easier to get equips trough Diadem, go get'em.

Well, the gear sure did limit that hunt Zerg everyone was raging about for a week or so!

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Originally Posted by Fevelle

I'm all for taking out Savage, if that's what you mean.

But on a serious note, for the first time this games looks like what a FF is about and people are complaining. If it's easier to get equips trough Diadem, go get'em.

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By Savage I meant removing the restrictions that's currently on it. Savage can't really be sold as providing the best gear anymore, when Diadem exists, so no point in keeping the restrictions IMO. If Gordian weapon was i215 then that would provide some incentive to maintain it, but it's the same as Eso. On top of that, for some classes the Thordan has better secondary stats despite the ilvl difference, so it'd be better to just run that and replace it with the new Relic.

I can't see what Diadem provides that makes it look like 'what a FF is about'. What you do in Diadem you can do with FATEs and Hunts, since that is essentially what it is, with gathering nodes tacked on in an attempt to make gathering feel important (yet is viewed as a nuisance by the community at present). Exploration? What, you mean it wasn't possible to explore the different maps/zones already present in the game? I'm not seeing what is unique about this that isn't already provided elsewhere in some form, much less a reflection of what FF is about.

LoV, Triple Triad (albeit taken from VIII), those are unique additions to XIV that doesn't diminish existing content. Diadem makes doing dungeons pointless (since you can get Eso in far less time with less effort), Void Ark pointless (why go for i200 gear when i210 is available without restriction?), and Alex NM pointless despite removal of loot lockout (see Void Ark).

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Diadem makes doing dungeons pointless (since you can get Eso in far less time with less effort)

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Doing 1 expert a day is still faster than doing 2 Diadem a day. The difference is you can do 12 Diadems in a day (supposing you don't sleep or ever stop) and cap in a day.

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Void Ark pointless (why go for i200 gear when i210 is available without restriction?)

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To gear a 2nd job, because you probably didn't have enough eso to get i210 on 2 jobs from just 3.0, without doing Savage.

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and Alex NM pointless despite removal of loot lockout (see Void Ark).

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For story for those who haven't seen it yet. As well as getting up to i175 or i179 to do VA and Diadem. Also to get i190 for Thordan.

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Doing 1 expert a day is still faster than doing 2 Diadem a day. The difference is you can do 12 Diadems in a day (supposing you don't sleep or ever stop) and cap in a day.

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Diadem gives you Eso and a chance at i210 better than what said Eso would buy you. Roulette just gives you Eso. Diadem is still the better option.

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To gear a 2nd job, because you probably didn't have enough eso to get i210 on 2 jobs from just 3.0, without doing Savage.

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With the majority of players flocking to Diadem, there's less people to do VA, leading to far longer queues than usual. So then such people hardly get to do VA, if at all. Let alone enough times to see the drop they want. This is exactly what FATEs in 2.0 did to dungeons until SE had to boost the exp gains in 2.1 to entice people to go back.

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For story for those who haven't seen it yet.

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Which has nothing to do with why they removed the loot lockout.

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As well as getting up to i175 or i179 to do VA and Diadem. Also to get i190 for Thordan.

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Good luck to those trying to do Alex, because I imagine none of the good players are farming it anymore. Hence same scenario I outlined with VA currently also happening. Also I read that if you join as a FC premade in the Workshop you can bypass the ilvl entry for Diadem. If that's the case then it's Fresh 60 > Diadem for i180/i210 pieces, while gaining Eso along the way.

I went Void Ark, twice. Tuesday, Wednesday. Bet most people also did. I got my drop on the 2nd run, other healer got theirs on the 1st.

Hence long queue times now. But not on Tuesday.

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Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

I went Void Ark, twice. Tuesday, Wednesday. Bet most people also did. I got my drop on the 2nd run, other healer got theirs on the 1st.

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So the day 3.1 dropped, and the day after. Yeah, of course you're going to get people doing new content on the first 1-2 days it's released, when it's been 5 months since anything new has arrived. Not exactly a surprise there.

Also don't get what point you're trying to make here about when you got your drops. Do you think everyone running VA that's after a specific drop will always get what they want in 2 runs or less?

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Hence long queue times now. But not on Tuesday.

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Long queue times now because people discovered how Diadem works not long after and hopped onto that. I'm sure VA will get short queue times next Tuesday though. Can't lose out on the twines after all.

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Long queue times now because people discovered how Diadem works not long after and hopped onto that. I'm sure VA will get short queue times next Tuesday though. Can't lose out on the twines after all.

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Exactly, so nothing to complain about. Do it early in the week, get your drop while you can. It's not a significant source of eso for the time it takes.

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Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

Exactly, so nothing to complain about. Do it early in the week, get your drop while you can. It's not a significant source of eso for the time it takes.

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No complaining here.

So basically, VA is only worth running for the twine on reset then left alone until next reset? Yeah thanks for proving my original point, that there's no point running it for the gear thanks to Diadem.

If people haven't already, they will soon realize there isn't any point running anything except Diadem, especially once we get to the situation where the freshness of new content wears off and everything becomes a dull grind.

Why dull grind the expert roulette for 185 greens and a capped tomestone you can afford to trade in for at best one upgrade a week when you could just infini-farm a dull mob zerg grind for unlimited access to BiS 210s?

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So basically, VA is only worth running for the twine on reset then left alone until next reset?

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Got my very fashionable VA healer hat thank you. But once I got that drop, no need to run more.

I've been to Diadem 6 or 7 times now and I've seen two "really good" i210 pieces drop - and they're really only good because they offered a combination of secondaries otherwise unavailable. I would say farming Savage is still relevant, and if you can't get past AS3/AS4 going into Thordan EX is still a good way to spend time. Void Ark gives a few really good secondaries on pieces at i200 which is still a nice upgrade over some pieces & provides a guaranteed upgrade.

People certainly are blowing Diadem drops out of proportion - same with the shouts you see about "Dino"isle. If Square notices people flocking to certain content and certain methods of completing that content they're going to get a clearer picture of their playerbase. If they see a substantial number of people taking part in Diadem and continuing to avoid Savage Alexander, and they see people investing in Anima Relics over Gordian or Thordan weapons they'll know what the majority of players want content wise.

Even if you seem to have poor luck seeing good 210s drop (because both times I went in I saw marvelous 210s drop for whatever job/equip slot they rolled as) the fact that you have an infinite source of 210s at all is a huge shift in the meta. Also I have to wonder if people reporting "bad luck" in Diadem are even doing it efficiently/"correctly" to begin with.

Previously virtually everything was on lockout and unless you were in an Alex Savage static that had various floors on farm you didn't have access to any 210s whatsoever; with a Savage static you might get a 210 piece once a week if you were lucky but you could have to wait anywhere from 4 to 8 weeks to get a 210 depending on what you were looking for. We knew there would be alternate ways to get 210 eso stuff and we also knew that 210 aetherial gear would be a thing but we didn't know it would turn out quite like this.

So now you could gear every job in 210s of any variety (and since this game's stat weights are junk anyway if you don't have a 210 for that slot you might as well take it since the primaries on 210 will generally make it more attractive than the difference in secondaries compared to 200s -- not to mention Diadem is the only way to get BiS in the current patch) by just wasting your life in a mindless grind. It takes zero skill and very little coordination to have an effective diadem farm - go in with a premade that understands how full credit works (tag a mob to turn it red for full cred, burn down purples based on highest rank mob with most HP remaining to ensure full cred on stuff that matters, tag NMs if you can to turn them red or otherwise burn them for your gold coffer, repeat until the time runs out) and it's no exaggeration to say you could be rolling on 100 or more items per run, and if you're doing it on Hard mode more of them are going to be 210s and the 210s are going to be better (but even on Normal mode 210s still drop from gold coffers and still roll with better allocations than raid/tome 210s).

Hell, most groups don't even bother with objectives even though it could net them 40 "free" eso since eso is so worthless now; even if you buy an eso piece you still have to put in the effort to obtain an upgrade item (Void Ark giving you one once a week is nice but getting anything else requires either an investment in an even worse grind - Hunts - or being able to clear A2S/A3S and winning the drop on the coat/twine or saving up manifestos to trade in). Might as well spend the time it would take to complete the objectives on trying to pop and burn one more NM for another chance at a gold coffer.

Remember, sooner or later EVERYTHING is going to be a dull grind (again), but Diadem will be the only dull grind worth doing - meaning if you actually like something about other content, well, good luck finding people to run it.

It just begs the question of why anything else is on lockout.

I don't know about anyone else, but I like the mayhem that is Dino Isle, was a big fan of Diablo, so I enjoy the Random stats and chance to see some really sweet gear, and that I can farm titanium ore all day without having to proc hidden items on nodes. All in all Diadem rocks.

I agree that the chances of getting good gear is not that great its just a fun activity outside of raid I personally enjoy it. Got one pretty nice ring for my pld.

49 Vit 10 acc 21 crit 12 det skillspeed 15

Other than that everything has been crap. Mostly 1 stat with mains which 9/10 is accuracy.