Forbidden Materia

^agreed...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheVedis

att+ can only go in mrd and gladiator weapons i think

but yeah, 2 materia of anything in a weapon is uber

---

Lancer as well if I remember right, and some armor slot, maybe gloves.

So people are complaing they can't be over powered for free yeah that makes sense lol... If they make the rates any higher might as well phase out all rare gear.

3 materia is really viable, and with the time i think 4 is also

This system is good because it will always clean the stack of underpriced gear , keep it high , so people can go farm to get their gear if they dont have money

Middle Crafter will still have money to make and then continue their grind


Just a question :

If they kept the same pourcentage of success and only allow up to 3 materia by slot , who would complain about this system ?

Everyone is bitching because they re frustrated they will never make it to the top

I think its a good philosophy because we (i am also) are too obsessed by the TOP

Paradoxaly, if you are the uber player ( hardcore) with other same people , then the game difficulty begin to fall down

This system is pretty good, need some tweak of course, but let the player free.

Spot on Zedd, three materia seems perfectly fine for the majority of us who either don't have time or endless pockets to shove more materia into our sockets.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gramul

Good. That means Materia imbued items will be extremely rare and valuable.

---

Now employ those 1000s of RMT past and we have ourselves an MMO!

Quote:

---

In an idea situation, I'd love to see a Materia System where each slot you gained to attach was the result of your Hard Work and Effort

---

RNG has nothing to do with achieving the best results. Hard work is the only thing it takes. Luck plays no role.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kiara

Well said Raikki.

Overall, I like many aspects about the Materia System, but I'm a bit disappointed that the rare "best of the best" gear is left up to a Random Number Generator (i.e., "did you roll successfully against 20% chance of success?" and continuing on till you get to the Final Slot "did you roll successfully against a 2% chance?" etc.).

In an idea situation, I'd love to see a Materia System where each slot you gained to attach was the result of your Hard Work and Effort, and in a meaningful way. For example:

• Materia Slot 1 - Free
• Materia Slot 2 - Complete a semi-hard Quest / Challenge to gain access to slot a 2nd Materia.
• Materia Slot 3 - Complete a Quest Chain (of maybe 2 - 4 interesting, challenging adventures / challenges) to gain access to 3rd Materia Slot.
• Materia Slot 4 - Complete an even harder challenging series of Quest / Adventures that takes you across Eorzea that may take players weeks to ovecome with strategy, planning, etc., to gain the 4th Materia Slot.
• Materia Slot 5 - Defeat a super hard Dungeon and beat an Uber Boss (that's orders of magnitude harder than Hyper Ifrit) to gain access to the final Slot.

Ultimately it'd be nice to see players striving to earn their additional Materia Slots while being entertained and engaged (like with interesting, unique Quests / Content / Adventures) with Cinematics, rather than just blind grinding out Materia, go back to town and just sit and pray that the Random Number Generator allowed you to attach more Materia to your Weapon / Armor / Item.

It's certainly cheaper / more cost-effective to do it this current way (and it keeps the player base busy), but it's not as rewarding and satisfying as, say, visiting the Temple of Shiva, defeating her acolytes and beating Shiva herself to gain a blessing to get Materia Slot #2.

Here's to hoping for future improvements. :)

---

Kiara's right they really need to fix this its just crazy how low the chances of success are they need to atleast make something help the melding process.

^^ i do agree. I mean, it IS possible to create a few monsters in this game that are rarely if ever beaten. I point to the level of Absolute Virtue and upwards in FFXI. Or in the case of a lot of hard grinding, the relic weapons. I'm sure they'll have it here, but it would be great if there could be an item as rare as the relic weapon that works to make a 4th or 5th materia on ONE of the seven gear slots more manageable. It would be more interesting than just saying, go ahead and get 100,000 pieces of materia so you can grind breaking them for a few months until it succeeds.

ithink this is fair i dont want to see a bunch of gear clones i myselfe havnt had any matieria add but im only lvl 40 im waiting till im fifty why enhance gear im not gona be wareing in 10 lvls anyway
\

Considering how powerful materia can make someone with just 1 materia slotted in each piece, I'm perfectly fine with the success rate.

i'd liked something like: nq craft have 1-2 "socket" hq 2-3 for example (and if in future rare/ex gear will be meldable too, normal mode gears same as nq, and hard mode gear same as hq) I like the risk vs hard encounter.. not the risk vs random things that will pay ppl that have almost capped gil at the start of the game by boosting everyvraft with bots...

up i'd like to listen more opinions..

I like how the system works.

I am tried of everyone having the same stats and the same gear. This at least adds a bit of flexibility.

It should be risk vs reward, and I have no problem with the current difficulty.

Overtime you will see pieces with 3 materia slotted, but they will be rare and sought after as they should. Can we please not dumb down another part of the game because people cant have 5 slotted gear a few weeks after it's implemented...

I've seen people with 3, IV materia slotted into some gear. It can't be all that terrible of a success rate. Or maybe its a loaded percentage where 15% even 4% is higher than you would believe.

+60 Vitality to a body piece is pretty crazy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RemVye

I've seen people with 3, IV materia slotted into some gear. It can't be all that terrible of a success rate. Or maybe its a loaded percentage where 15% even 4% is higher than you would believe.

+60 Vitality to a body piece is pretty crazy.

---

The success rate IS very low actually. Those people just have lots of money to burn to keep trying. Not that there is anything wrong with that. :D

this system is seriously flawed when it takes no skill to obtain materia and it solely relies on whos pocket book is bigger to obtain the better gear w/ more materia socketed into it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wynn

The success rate IS very low actually. Those people just have lots of money to burn to keep trying. Not that there is anything wrong with that. :D

---

Yea that's true. I know people who have broken a dozen items or more and got 2 x IV materia slotted. I guess this is a successful gil sink since only the wealthiest players can afford to drop 20 million to get one piece of gear (between all the breaks and buying new stuff).

1 materia is what you really need, anymore is just seperating hardcore from casual.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hikozaemon

this system is seriously flawed when it takes no skill to obtain materia and it solely relies on whos pocket book is bigger to obtain the better gear w/ more materia socketed into it.

---

So instead it takes skill to attain wealth and dedication to keep going past short-term results?

"Playing the game" can mean many things.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hikozaemon

this system is seriously flawed when it takes no skill to obtain materia and it solely relies on whos pocket book is bigger to obtain the better gear w/ more materia socketed into it.

---

I don't know, I recall buying the majority of materia I had in FFVII as well as spending a bit of gil and time on a golden chocobo to get the ones I didn't buy that I didn't find in easy to reach locations in dungeons.

It's not supposed to take 'skill' to convert gear honestly. If materia was crafted that's a different story.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hikozaemon

this system is seriously flawed when it takes no skill to obtain materia and it solely relies on whos pocket book is bigger to obtain the better gear w/ more materia socketed into it.

---

you are missing the point. materia is sposed to be a gil sink. its a way to keep the economy alive. if the rich had nothing to spend the gil on. money would become worthless

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hikozaemon

this system is seriously flawed when it takes no skill to obtain materia and it solely relies on whos pocket book is bigger to obtain the better gear w/ more materia socketed into it.

---

The first materia attachment is 100% success and, really, that is all you need to have great stats. The additional materias can make a player super powerful, but there is a huge risk and they will pay through the nose to achieve that.

Your average player isn't going to want to or even need to go through the extra attachment process. The materia system is the perfect gil sink. It gives min/max hardcore players something to strive for, fuels the economy, keeps crafters busy...

Good system indeed. Keep the Hardcore players busy and long term goal to work on.
Materia can easily make you overpowered otherwise. Pretty insane stats as it is. You shouldn't have to get 7 materia on a piece, but if you like to, by all means! For hardcore players, they have some use to their gil now and their 60-70 hours of game time a week.

I say smart move by SE.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hikozaemon

this system is seriously flawed when it takes no skill to obtain materia and it solely relies on whos pocket book is bigger to obtain the better gear w/ more materia socketed into it.

---

Well said Hikozaemon.

While I agree that adding more Materia should be difficult (that's fine), adding Materia #2 - 5 per item is based totally on a Random Number Generator / Luck than anything else.

If Square added in a Quest (or series of Quests) that were entertaining required some player skill / rewarded player *effort* and it boosted Melding Materia for #2 or #3 meld, even if it was only, say, +5%, that'd still feel better and allow some meaningful contribution from the player, rather than standing around waiting for a "dice roll" to happen or not. As an example, we could get a quest to overcome some trials / challenges to gain a blessing by one of the Twelve (Menphina, Byregot, etc.) for the attachment chance increase.

Quote:

---

While I agree that adding more Materia should be difficult (that's fine), adding Materia #2 - 5 per item is based totally on a Random Number Generator / Luck than anything else.

---

It is purely based on statistics, not luck.

Luck only plays a role in the excuses of people who just don't have the dedication it takes.

So after a few weeks with the system in place i can say this

attaching 1 materia to everything = a HUGE bonus to you
attaching 2 to everything....takes a bit of effort and money(not imposible) and you are now overpowered

anything more and its retarded overpowering and the checks and balance in place are needed in such a huge way to keep people from becoming a bit on the invincible side

I was curious to learn the english's point of view about the forbidden materia system.
So, as the french one, the majority of people who participate love the hardish mode ; o ;


Personnaly, this could be a reason to leave.
I hate this forbidden system ; o ;


I would prefer to keep/save the stuff and materias already added, and only loose the current materia we're trying to add.
For me, the risk is already prsent with the one maetria @2000k as atk+, critical+, healing magic +.
some price are downing, but, some are staying high, and with stratgy, will maybe up.

If i failed 3 times a 2m materia, could I keep it ?

If getting 5 materia slotted was easier then everyone would be able to do it eventually and they would need to balance end game around having 5 materia.

You might see one person ever with 5 materia and that item will be worth 999,999,999 gil. It's hitting the lotto of FFXIV. That person will feel such a sense of accomplishment, some of which by luck, trial and error, and most of all perseverance to keep playing, farming, and attempting such an insane feat.

Realize the hundreds of millions of gil it would take for this one piece of gear fully loaded... why would you want everyone to be able to achieve this? This is better than any relic / artifact / end game item.

Keep this the way it is.

Hummm. . .

I don't have all the stats to speak.but with:
25% for materia 2
10% (?) with materia 3
5% (?) with materia 4
0.5% (?) with materia 5
Is there not already an huge difficulty/risk/challenge?
Who could allow to keep stuff + materia already added?
And only lose the current materia?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AquaRyu

Hummm. . .

I don't have all the stats to speak.but with:
25% for materia 2
10% (?) with materia 3
5% (?) with materia 4
0.5% (?) with materia 5
Is there not already an huge difficulty/risk/challenge?
Who could allow to keep stuff + materia already added?
And only lose the current materia?

---

What would be the point of difficulty and risk if you lose nearly nothing from losing?

Hummm. . .Words searching. . .:p

I wouldn't call the lost of a 2.000.000 materia "Nothing" <.<'
It's true that I take the higher materia to argute :p

But let's take a materia @100k
that you fail 50 times @.@
can't we save this for the next step? :o

the point of difficulty is already in materia/gil gathering with the low sucess rate for me :o

I love this system.

My only concern is really that the level cap will one day be level 99.
I understand that the hardcore players might 'not care'.
It's just that in a system where the cap will continue to grow, when there may eventually be grade X materia,
it is a bit demotivating to spend 100 million gil or thousands of hours trying to be overpowered now when it'll be just okay later. I don't really have any good ideas to harmonise this though. Increasing the success rate isn't the answer. Keeping the materia would just flood the market.

Still, if someone gets to 4 materia on a gear piece, there should be some kind of thankful reward in place for when the cap is 50 levels higher. I mean, yes, the reward is the uber gear, but to sink such a ridiculous amount of time into something only to have it obsolete later. it's not good.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AquaRyu

Hummm. . .Words searching. . .:p

I wouldn't call the lost of a 2.000.000 materia "Nothing" <.<'
It's true that I take the higher materia to argute :p

But let's take a materia @100k
that you fail 50 times @.@
can't we save this for the next step? :o

the point of difficulty is already in materia/gil gathering with the low sucess rate for me :o

---

Not when the first materia socketed is 100% guaranteed. If you dare go past that, there will be risk.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NefarioCall

I love this system.

My only concern is really that the level cap will one day be level 99.
I understand that the hardcore players might 'not care'.
It's just that in a system where the cap will continue to grow, when there may eventually be grade X materia,
it is a bit demotivating to spend 100 million gil or thousands of hours trying to be overpowered now when it'll be just okay later. I don't really have any good ideas to harmonise this though. Increasing the success rate isn't the answer. Keeping the materia would just flood the market.

Still, if someone gets to 4 materia on a gear piece, there should be some kind of thankful reward in place for when the cap is 50 levels higher. I mean, yes, the reward is the uber gear, but to sink such a ridiculous amount of time into something only to have it obsolete later. it's not good.

---

That's an MMO? Constant change and upgrading. Gear will always become obsolete at some point, guaranteed. No ordinary player is going to spend 100 million gil to get 5 slotted materia. These are going to be the extremely hardcore who want the best of the best in slot and have time to do it. If the level cap raises, they will be more excited about getting to the new max and not really looking back at "man I wasted 100 million gil a 2 years ago to get the best item for 2 years".

Also, generally speaking when new expansions (level cap, gear, etc..) is added the rewards (such as gil / items / xp) is also increased to balance this out. Maybe you lost 100 million gil at one point being the first and only person to get 5 materia, but the rewards for quests has been increased to 100,000 gil per. That's not a huge deal really.

I'm all for the difficulty though I do think raising the probabilities a little might be nice. I mean whats the point of being able to socket up to 5 materia when the probabilities are harder than hitting the state lottery?
Current Probability of:
2 - 1 in 2 to 4 (25 to 40%)
3 - 1 in 25 to 8000 (5 to 10% of #2)
4 - 1 in 2500 to 800000??
5 - 1 in (why do we bother anyway)

The first person to get a full 5-materia (even a T1-only one) item should get a "Luck of Legends" or "Lottery Winner" title.

Do we know the basic probabilities beyond tier 2?

I think a good scale to use is to see whether anyone can make it to tier 5 using tier III/IV materia in the first place. If no... then it should be raised just enough for someone to make it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah

Do we know the basic probabilities beyond tier 2?

---

Think we can assume it is under 10%.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tymora

Think we can assume it is under 10%.

---

Sure, but there's still a rather substantial difference between 0% and 10%, with 2 tiers to go.

If it's 30%>10%>7%>5%, that's manageable. If it's 30>10>5>1-2, good luck.

Well...we've seen 7% for the 3rd...think about the worst we can get (assuming 1% is lowest) is about 1 in a million...haha

I think they'll add new melders and stuff to help with the probability but this number is rather discouraging...heh

i would love if they keep melding system as hard as its .. so we can have like super unique things .. like +3 item with 2 high stage or 3 stage melding .. which will make it hard for other for even try