New Live Letter: YoshiP Comments on Housing Prices

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Originally Posted by Tweedle_dee

Someone overreacted now didn't they? I merely said it's not a lot to do and if you wouldn't jump the gun and assume am being a dick you'd learn that I can understand where he comes from. If you wanna start a e-peen war about how much many you can make with someone who mentioned how much they make. Maybe you should go back to WoW and do it there.

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1st point I don't play WoW.

2nd point who is the one that point fingers at ppl being lazy and started talk how much they can make.

So.. he's saying that he thinks I make 20k a day? I don't sh*t gold bricks. 6-a-day Levequests certainly don't give even 1k. Hell, farming mobs doesn't give that kind of money.

I'm going to take a guess to say that levequests aren't going to start suddenly handing out 1k in cash (6 a day?). For all the categories of "incentivized random dungeon one-a-days", I certainly don't believe THOSE will hand out 1k apeice. I also don't believe for a minute that vendors will start magically acknowledging that dragon testicles are worth more than 1 gil.

Time to fire yoshi. I'm tired of apologies.

Ah well, and there i thought that Yoshi would tell everyone that the prices for the FC housing was changing.

Guess not.

even before 2.1, a group of skilled players could speed-run WP 3 times/hour and get around 12k gil each. add to this all the new quests and the money from that + treasure hunting and you'll make way more than 20k gil per day just as a battle class

Don't worry guys doifnero rifnojke said send him a tell. He will help you out for low low low. 100% handwork.

[QUOTE=Juran;1672552] snip

You mean new forms of under cutting? Regardless of what he adds in 2.1 everything will be under cut to the point it isnt worth doing. Everything is already dirt cheap, yes you can make some gil but still the markets crash from item to item everyday.

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Originally Posted by Wowa

Don't worry guys doifnero rifnojke said send him a tell. He will help you out for low low low. 100% handwork.

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I love low handwork.

It's a good job these housing prices are purchased with FC Points and not gil eh, guys? Guys..?

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Originally Posted by Zourin

So.. he's saying that he thinks I make 20k a day? I don't sh*t gold bricks. 6-a-day Levequests certainly don't give even 1k. Hell, farming mobs doesn't give that kind of money. [....]

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Originally Posted by Velev

Ah well, and there i thought that Yoshi would tell everyone that the prices for the FC housing was changing.

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My guess and hope is that the Yoshi-P is hinting that in 2.1 there will be more ways to make money, rewards will increase, etc. Hopefully 20k/day is a minimum with dailies and/or a random dungeon or two.

However... As has been pointed out before, even if some worlds have more gil in circulation (higher house prices), the game itself pumps in money only at the same rate across all worlds. This 20k would need to be increased to match the 5x and 10x house prices on legacy worlds or it is an almost meaningless gesture there.

Ignoring the mathematical specifics... it seems the intent is that it will take a FC three months of continuous gil farming at 100 percent to afford a house.

No thanks.

Sounds like more artificial grinding barriers because they can't produce content or handle the content they have. I was on the fence, but the stated design intent for it to take that long has pushed me to cancel. They just can't develop content at a reasonable pace, nor can the content pushed live be handled with the infrastructure they have. It's a beautiful rework of a bad game, unfortunately, they simply aren't equipped to manage it properly.

My payment just processed, so I will get to see the patch and CT... then I will check back in a year. Hopefully by then, there will either be more playable and accessable content... or the game wont be here. I am hoping they will be successful. I'm just not going to pay to beta this version anymore.

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Originally Posted by HumsterMKX

1st point I don't play WoW.

2nd point who is the one that point fingers at ppl being lazy and started talk how much they can make.

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1. Then act like it. =3

2.When you read what he said, it comes off as lazy. But after he said why it's not easy for him, it was cleared up and understandable.

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Originally Posted by Ricky

He is saying if we farm 7 days a week for 3 months and give 100% of our gil to the FC we can maybe afford the nice houses... who is actually ok with that

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Quoted for eternal truth. And that would be IF every FC member gave 100% of their gil away AND repair costs didn't actually exist. Throw in an extra week or so because of those.

I wanna know the dev team is smoking, cause they're imaginations are going wild, man.

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Originally Posted by Lafiele

You know, you started off ok then at some point it just went horribly wrong. Not to mention that you're using the maximum price.

To save you some face and all the likes on your post too, I'll give you a hint. An FC has more than 1 person.

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Umm, maybe if you went back and read my post you'll see where I stated it would take 1,000 members 1 year to purchase the most expensive property, or do you consider an FC of 1,000 people too small to warrant the largest property? Did you also miss the bit where I pointed out it would take an FC with 10 members 6 months to get the 40m house? Did you totally miss the fact I didn't state once in my post about 1 person saving up that amount of gil? You must have.

Taking into account a 50% reduction, it would take 1,000 members 6 months to obtain the best property, 500 members would take a year, it's simple enough.

The gil rewarded is increasing in pretty much everything, plus daily activities(beastmen quests and duty roulette).
I'll tell you what even, those 20k seem to consider that people will only do the daily repeatable content, so that value, 20, is probably given with the "casual" in mind.

Also 20k per person on a lets say a 10-manned FC(this is a really small one by the way) amounts 200k a day, again just from the repeatable content probably. Which adds up to 1.4M a week, again just from this repeatable content.

Over the course of a month the amount will have added up to around 5.6M.
So yes that doesn't buy a house in all servers, but people already have money and 1M to have been gathered by the same 10 man FC is a safe assumption(since everyone seems to want housing that bad).
So with that in mind in the first 3 server housing tiers( WHICH IS OVER 80% OF THE GAME SERVERS) the cheapest house becomes easily available to a 10 man FC(with the daily price decrease over the course of 30 days being considered).

Considering a decent FC has around 20+ this is easily farmable in 2 weeks just through repeatable content. Is this seriously excessive for you(anyone reading this lol :D)?

Also all this assumptions take in mind that you have not been saving up for this(not more than 100k).. which if you haven't would strip away any argument concerning: "Why can't I get this NOW?".

What's most ironic about this, is that even once an house is bought, i doubt everyone in a given FC will have access to explore it fully(change everything in it), also most of you crying "THE SKY IS FALLING" will probably get bored of it in 1-3 weeks after obtaining the thing.

This was never going to be solo-farmable(NOR SHOULD IT BE) it's an FC endeavor, it's an object representing your FC, giving it a place to be proud of or status or just some new fun activity to do as a group, do some of you also want to solo one-click-kill twintania?!
Think about how much better you'll feel about that piece of digitally-stored house once you took at least 2 weeks to get it!

In a finishing note i do feel for people who went and started new characters on the last 2 tiers(legacy), yeah you guys get to complain(only you guys though ;)).
40M for the cheapest is way too much for someone who started 3 months ago.

On a happy note for you the prices probably won't stay that high, since it's main purpose seems to be to even out the economies across all servers.
Once that is done(probably in next patch time window) I'm betting they'll be reduced. Otherwise the high starting price wouldn't make any sense, and the devs definitely know this(i think anyway <.<).

Anyway sorry for the long post/wall of text.
As a note I'd like to add that i'm not attacking anyone, nor am i "desperately defending" this game(which i would never do, since i have no gains from this game success/demise), just trying to put some perspective into the whole issue.

TL DR: In over 80% of servers the situation is acceptable, and for those in legacy it's pretty bad, but it only makes sense that it'll all even out eventually.

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Originally Posted by Lexxuk

Taking into account a 50% reduction, it would take 1,000 members 6 months to obtain the best property, 500 members would take a year, it's simple enough.

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Hi Lexx! /1.0alpha brofist

Anyway talking Legacy servers, 625mil (the most expensive) after 90 days is 310mil (considering a 50.4% reduction - though obvs not sure if it's 50.4% or 50%, but w/e). So for a 100 (active) member FC that's 3.1mil each. That's 1mil per month which is 250k/week - that's not by any means a stretch. Give it six months rather than three if you're playing casually.

I do see the point that most of us exist in FCs that have substantially smaller headcounts (mine is 10 for instance). It annoys me that FCs have the functionality and the identity and that LSes are just chat channels - if it were reversed and the LSes had the identity and Actions, yet small LSes could join together under one FC banner, this whole thing would be a lot more palatable.

Also, for 155mil (price for large on my server after 90 days) I don't want a glorified tavern, I want a Twelve-damned castle with individual barracks rooms for each of the sub-groups of the FC, an armoury, a airship-landing bay, a shop, a stables, a war-chamber, a throne room and a sodding aetheryte crystal.

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Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour

How is it legitimate when they control the number of instances?

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drop the prices low to where everyone can buy 1st class large and no one will buy anything but large plots and they keep opening up more and more instances for people who want large but no small and very few medium have ever sold = empty space, waste of resources ...

prices are high, we work for it, some willing to work more than others = all size/class plots get purchased and optimal use of number of instances and such


Also: (edited from original post)

20k a day per player for just doing their daily roulette and such is likely going to be an easy number for most players to hit, many will far succeed this number per day making it quicker to obtain based on how hard you work. Most people who had any interest in housing have already set aside a chunk of gil so its obtainable sooner then the 3months or work. more gil incoming into server from dailies = more gil for people to spend who are not saving for housing = more gil you can make from those players = faster you can get to price of the plot. Yes it is kinda sad we cant all just go buy the plot and house we wanted right away, and maybe we were mislead that we would be able to, but its not like if you dont buy it in the first 12hrs after 2.1 you will never be able to get a house.

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

Hi Lexx! /1.0alpha brofist.

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Shh, we're under NDA about the fact we were the very first people in the world to play XIV! After the Japanese :P

Anyhow, if we don't move our mouse we'll get 40m gil faster >.> <.< MWAHAHAHAHA

You have to take into account this game is being developed by a Japanese company. Japan's society is based on collective values, they will naturally develop barriers that take teamwork to overcome.

I'm not saying prices aren't too high, but this is prime example of how a MMO (a multiplayer game) should bring people together to obtain a collectively desired reward.

It's like a relic weapon in XI, my LS farmed for 9 months to get 1 person their relic. Then another 6 months to get a 2nd.

At least with housing all members can enjoy the benefits equally.

So take a deep breath, let it out slow. Get together with your FC and come up with a plan on how you'll get your free company COMMUNITY house.

It's funny how 90% of the time, it's the people from lower 3 tiered servers (smallest plot priced 4-8 mil at max plot price) are the ones willing to work. Clearly most of the people on higher-cost servers (smallest plot 20-40 mil at max plot price) are lazy >.>

Stripped down to what Yoshi said, 20k earned daily via a battle class is the same for all people on all servers - plot prices, however, aren't....

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Originally Posted by ChiefCurrahee

You have to take into account this game is being developed by a Japanese company. Japan's society is based on collective values, they will naturally develop barriers that take teamwork to overcome.

I'm not saying prices aren't too high, but this is prime example of how a MMO (a multiplayer game) should bring people together to obtain a collectively desired reward.

It's like a relic weapon in XI, my LS farmed for 9 months to get 1 person their relic. Then another 6 months to get a 2nd.

At least with housing all members can enjoy the benefits equally.

So take a deep breath, let it out slow. Get together with your FC and come up with a plan on how you'll get your free company COMMUNITY house.

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Even the Japanese are Freaking out about the High Prices. This is not a cultural thing.

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Originally Posted by Wilbert

I'm old school MMO and I and others, seems very few, know that accomplishments take time.

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FFXI -
Mythic Weapon? Takes time, Accomplishment for a weapon that was tailored specifically for your job compared to Relic which was a nice weapon but also took time.
FFXIV -
Housing - You need to spend months to buy a lot of land to just BUILD a house....

FFXI -
Sky/Sea/Einherjar/Delve/Voidwatch. Takes time to get what you want, feels like an accomplishment once you finish that set of armor or take down Odin and Odin v2 or Provenance Watcher.
FFXIV -
You need to spend months to buy a lot of land to build a house.....

I'm old school too..this isn't something that simply shouldn't be. I don't even like the "give it to me now!" mentality, but housing was the one content that was supposed to last once you worn out the supposed "300 hours" worth of content of 2.1.

Very easy way to show you don't agree with it.

Goto https://secure.square-enix.com/accou...n?cont=account scroll down to Select Service.
When that page loads click Cancel Automatic Renewal and follow instruction.

What could be more easier than that.

Does anyone know if these plots are tradable? Can you guess why I'm asking this? I'm going to assume that it's not since they have been keeping a tight lid on tradable items.

What I can't figure out is why they went with the Ultima Online housing module rather than what other MMO's use, the instance housing. It's much easier to manage, and cuts down on lag. Yes, rendering all those plots with houses on them will cause lag. I've been only playing for a month and someone can shed some light light on how all of this is going to take place. SE can be very tight lip with information. Thanks

I do hope that adjustments get made. I know that a few folks in my FC will be very disappointed. For me, I'm more looking forward to personal housing whenever that comes out.

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Originally Posted by Nuinn

It's funny how 90% of the time, it's the people from lower 3 tiered servers (smallest plot priced 4-8 mil at max plot price) are the ones willing to work. Clearly most of the people on higher-cost servers (smallest plot 20-40 mil at max plot price) are lazy >.>

Stripped down to what Yoshi said, 20k earned daily via a battle class is the same for all people on all servers - plot prices, however, aren't....

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Yeah this is true, as I said in my previous post, legacy people who started recently or even those who in 1.0 didn't care much for amounting gil are being punished too harshly for this.

The funny thing is that while it may be true that mostly only legacy people complain(and with this reason behind them), there's also a lot of people on non-legacy where houses are below 10M complaining, and not only is it not that hard to get it in those servers, as it is kind of insulting to the people who have it really bad I'd say.
Anyway hope the legacy situation eventually normalizes :).

The way i see it, its going to be like this:

few FC's will buy the cheep lands, and very few will buy the middle ones, the big houses will be for very rich few FC's.
2-3 weeks later they will drop the prices so another few FC's will buy houses, and then they will drop the prices once more when PS4 comes out and they implement new servers.

so in 2-4 month's the prices will be lowered where all small FC's can afford it.

For me, i was looking for it, but not any more.

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Originally Posted by Dragon_Lord

Does anyone know if these plots are tradable?

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I have a feeling they'll be tied to the FC and not items in of themselves:

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Originally Posted by Patch 2.1 Notes

Relinquishing Land
In order to relinquish a plot of land, you must first remove the estate hall and all furnishings. Once the plot is completely vacant, it can be relinquished from the Housing menu. Only free company members with the requisite authorization can perform this action.
* Gil will not be refunded upon relinquishing a plot of land.

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So looks like you can't sell/trade it, though you could get round it by inviting someone to the FC, giving them full leadership and then leaving them to it.

Building parts and construction permits, however, are a different matter.

Lets act as if the reason has nothing to do with the fact that SE dont have enough instance sever...

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Originally Posted by Drakzen1

Lets act as if the reason has nothing to do with the fact that SE dont have enough instance sever...

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Pretty much this. From the sound of things they're having a similar problem that they had at launch where they were having instance issues. I think the super high prices are more the result of them looking at how many FCs could buy houses and instead of being prepared with multiple instances or neighborhoods for people to buy land on they set up the high price as a barrier to make up for it. This is basically the housing equivalent of "We don't have enough room for more players so we're not selling the game anymore."

if this is a way to stop RMT's its just not gonna happen. RMT's start acquiring accounts that have FC housing access already (people sell accounts SE, its just a fact) they buy all the land with their infinite supply of gil. where are we now? Instead of having in game GM's that we can call or contact to bad a RMT which is clearly spamming, the account stays on a BL and nothing done about it so far. I get the whole "it might be a stolen account thing" but come on I'm sure player "asdfg hjkl" is not a hacked account or even his brother "qwerty uiop" isnt either. RMT is gonna stay until they start a massive ban wave of in game GM's. Hell I'll apply for a GM and clean this place up, where do I sign up.

So basically, he explained his bone headed logic, justified it, and promised to "look at it" and maybe we'll get some satisfaction in the vague future.
What a surprise. Well I'm done with this game. Wildstar is coming out soon, and that game does pretty much everything better than FFXIV.

what is a role bonus? how can i earn a role bonus?

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Originally Posted by Tweedle_dee

So you'll be lazy and not work on other ways to get money? I make 200-300k a day (Just about every day, sometimes 150k area just depends on what am selling and such)

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You do realize that with the housing being released, your profit margins will drop considerably. A lot of people will want the housing, but at the moment barely anyone can realistically afford it; What does this mean? It means that everyone will be attempting to -sell- to everyone, but the amount of buyers in the market will be severely reduced because they won't want to set themselves back days/weeks worth of Gil.

edit: sorry, realized i somehow double-posted.

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Originally Posted by Lexxuk

20,000g per day. So an FC with 10 members will make 200k a day, the cheapest house on Durandal is 40,000,000 . 40,000,000 / 200,000 = 200 days to obtain the smallest house. 30 days (roughly) in a month, 200/30 = over 6 months to obtain the cheapest house on Durandal.

20,000 per day, the most expensive house is 645,000,000, so it'll only take 32,250 days for that FC to obtain that, or with 100 members, 3,250 days, or with 1,000, a year.

"Let's introduce content that most people will not obtain"
"Why?!"
"Why not?"
"Oh, okay, let's go for it!"

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He did say good sized FC.
So if everyone makes 20k a day * 300 members * 90 days = 540,000,000 then you could buy a large house even on Riddill, with gil to spare after the 50% reduction, assuming noone buys it sooner.

Now if you have a a 300 member FC I don't see the above as even close to realistic.

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Originally Posted by Osirus

So many tears.

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Its happened with every major patch to every mmo ever. When it's all said and done some will leave, some will stay but complain forever, the rest will carry on like nothing happened.

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Originally Posted by ChiefCurrahee

You have to take into account this game is being developed by a Japanese company. Japan's society is based on collective values, they will naturally develop barriers that take teamwork to overcome.

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True - Except living in a house isn't this insurmountable challenge that's equivalent of slaying the embodiment of a Mother Crystal (Provenance Watcher) the first time no one knew what to do in XI.

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YoshiP is saying it was set this way so players don’t buy out all the lands right away and end up in situation where none is available.

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Is he seriously trying to tell us that they didn't design their system in such a way that, should they so choose, everyone could access housing? That is just...


... not entirely unexpected but still absolutely infuriating. Their incompetency with servers is staggering.

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Originally Posted by ChiefCurrahee

You have to take into account this game is being developed by a Japanese company. Japan's society is based on collective values, they will naturally develop barriers that take teamwork to overcome.

So take a deep breath, let it out slow. Get together with your FC and come up with a plan on how you'll get your free company COMMUNITY house.

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Hey look at the cultural expert! Its a Japanese thing! From someone who has no idea what the Japanese players are doing or saying.
and what's this? You're being patronizing about it too?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-in-agreement.

The Japanese thread this links to, the one that complaining about the prices? Has over 2000 'likes'.
The Japanese players HATE these prices as much as we do!

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Originally Posted by ChiefCurrahee

You have to take into account this game is being developed by a Japanese company. Japan's society is based on collective values, they will naturally develop barriers that take teamwork to overcome.

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I think you are confusing Japanese players with ants. This is a video game sold all over the world, we can leave out made up stereotypes.

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Originally Posted by Osirus

So many tears.

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...including yours.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

Is he seriously trying to tell us that they didn't design their system in such a way that, should they so choose, everyone could access housing? That is just...


... not entirely unexpected but still absolutely infuriating. Their incompetency with servers is staggering.

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Tanaka never charged me a 625 million entrance fee to enter my Mog House in XI >:

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Originally Posted by Raagnar

I think you are confusing Japanese players with ants. This is a video game sold all over the world, we can leave out made up stereotypes.

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This kind of proves you know nothing of JP society...especially when it comes to gaming lol.