With Apologies to Sena Bryer

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

And why in tarnation haven't the mods locked this thread like they locked the Wuk Lamat voice complaint one when this is indefinitely more TOS breaking.

---

"yo like can you please stop having a different opinion than me guys ? i am the right one here ok stop saying i'm wrong guys, close this thread moderators they're disagreeing with me !!!!"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SophiaDL

"yo like can you please stop having a different opinion than me guys ? i am the right one here ok stop saying i'm wrong guys, close this thread moderators they're disagreeing with me !!!!"

---

Except that no, i don't disagree with the VA being lacklustre. However it's quite clear that this thread often derails into irrelevant topics, even worse than the previous one since this explicitly targets focuses the VA by name rather than the character she voiced.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

Except that no, i don't disagree with the VA being lacklustre. However it's quite clear that this thread often derails into irrelevant topics, even worse than the previous one since this explicitly targets focuses the VA by name rather than the character she voiced.

---

Could it be because she's a terrible person as well ?

Wait nah, couldnt be right ?

Hmm I wonder

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

Except that no, i don't disagree with the VA being lacklustre. However it's quite clear that this thread often derails into irrelevant topics, even worse than the previous one since this explicitly targets focuses the VA by name rather than the character she voiced.

---

I dunno. I think that people actively talking about a VA calling everyone racist for not liking a notoriously fairly divisive track is something really worth discussing in the official forums in the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KageTokage

I believe her official title is "Senior lore consultant/localizer" (The role Koji Fox had occupied up until ShB) which suggests she holds more sway then that and I find that...concerning.

---

Aaaurgh. I didn't really know anything about her before looking in this thread, and all of a sudden, I understand why ALL the "diverse" cultures on the entire massive continent of Tural shared the same Tumblr-inspired verbal tic. I thought it was a poor localization job. The idea that it was done on purpose...I'm going to have to give my sub some serious thought, because I don't have enough money to spend it on Japanese games that have been hijacked to push a specific American subculture. Guess I'll see if it got wound back a bit in the next patch, since it should be easy enough to translate Japanese into standard English rather than jargon if they care to.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SwadTheFrog

I dunno. I think that people actively talking about a VA calling everyone racist for not liking a notoriously fairly divisive track is something really worth discussing in the official forums in the game.

---

And not even some bit character VA, but the "star" they propped up with the most screentime and spoken lines, the most prominent NPC we ever had in XIV in a single expansion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

And why in tarnation haven't the mods locked this thread like they locked the Wuk Lamat voice complaint one when this is indefinitely more TOS breaking.

---

S*na Br*er sucks, cope and sneed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

Except that no, i don't disagree with the VA being lacklustre. However it's quite clear that this thread often derails into irrelevant topics, even worse than the previous one since this explicitly targets focuses the VA by name rather than the character she voiced.

---

The mods have been to this thread several times now - with multiple posts removed and several people also banned.

They have made the decision that the topic is permissible. They haven't just ignored the thread - they've seen it and made their call.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

Except that no, i don't disagree with the VA being lacklustre. However it's quite clear that this thread often derails into irrelevant topics, even worse than the previous one since this explicitly targets focuses the VA by name rather than the character she voiced.

---

Qui sème le vent récolte la tempête.

LMFAO @ this thread coping that the VA will get fired because of OF and 4chan complaining when none of the dev team even read OF????

Sorry I haven't posted in a few days. Health issues and working on tracking down all of Kate's spiciest and stupidest takes. Saw a fun collection of her tweets a few pages back. Trying to compile a nice collection ranging from common ones where she forced the pixies to be non-binary in English localization only, to her refusal to translate Otokonoko (男の娘) on stage at Fanfest when Yoshi-P used it to refer to Emet-Selech. Kate and Sena both deserve to be fired for their incompetence and forcing their politics into everything. Please look forward to it or whatever, idk.

You know, I do have to thank both Sena and Kate for going full unhinged mask off with their insane takes. The people who claimed it was only "imaginary problems" made up by grifters are conveniently silent now. Still want to argue that DEI hires aren't making the things you love worse? I didn't think so.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Isala

You know, I do have to thank both Sena and Kate for going full unhinged mask off with their insane takes. The people who claimed it was only "imaginary problems" made up by grifters are conveniently silent now. Still want to argue that DEI hires aren't making the things you love worse? I didn't think so.

---

Only thing left for FFXIV now is to accelerate the en-crappening of the game. Cat's out of the bag now, so I have little hope for the game's future anymore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bananarama

Only thing left for FFXIV now is to accelerate the en-crappening of the game. Cat's out of the bag now, so I have little hope for the game's future anymore.

---

I haven't had hope for this game's future since they decided to double and triple down on the dog water Job Design from Shadowbringers. DT's so god damned boring, I'm basically already raid logging at this point. And that's only because I committed to my friends. And I'm about to hit the limit of my patience with that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karious

Sorry I haven't posted in a few days. Health issues and working on tracking down all of Kate's spiciest and stupidest takes. Saw a fun collection of her tweets a few pages back. Trying to compile a nice collection ranging from common ones where she forced the pixies to be non-binary in English localization only, to her refusal to translate Otokonoko (男の娘) on stage at Fanfest when Yoshi-P used it to refer to Emet-Selech. Kate and Sena both deserve to be fired for their incompetence and forcing their politics into everything. Please look forward to it or whatever, idk.

---

Godspeed and good luck brother. May your finds be great and enemies dumb.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karious

Trying to compile a nice collection ranging from common ones where she forced the pixies to be non-binary in English localization only, to her refusal to translate Otokonoko (男の娘) on stage at Fanfest when Yoshi-P used it to refer to Emet-Selech.

---

You know, I've always wondered how the pixies refer to themselves originally.

My knowledge of japanese it's below basic but I can't recall if I caught on that while playing through SHB.

As for the Otokonoko thing, I wasn't aware... a localizer unable to grasp the nuances of the culture they're localizing games from? Of course, wouldn't want to show that Japan accepts that men with ambiguous looks are a thing, that must be transphobic, and of course, westerners know better, right?

/s

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Midare

You know, I've always wondered how the pixies refer to themselves originally.

My knowledge of japanese it's below basic but I can't recall if I caught on that while playing through SHB.

As for the Otokonoko thing, I wasn't aware... a localizer unable to grasp the nuances of the culture they're localizing games from? Of course, wouldn't want to show that Japan accepts that men with ambiguous looks are a thing, that must be transphobic, and of course, westerners know better, right?

/s

---

There's a reason JP companies are starting to replace Wokalizers with AI in things like manga. And nobody that matters is upset about this. We're to the point where crappy AI gibberish is preferable to actual people, because they can't just do their jobs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Isala

There's a reason JP companies are starting to replace Wokalizers with AI in things like manga. And nobody that matters is upset about this. We're to the point where crappy AI gibberish is preferable to actual people, because they can't just do their jobs.

---

It's not that they can't, it's that they won't.

I work with money. My job's to count the beans, not tell people how to eat them. It's not a hard concept. I do my job, and it pays for my hobbies. I go home, play games, and build models.

These people think it's their job to tell other people what to think and feel, not to translate. Getting real sick of it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SwadTheFrog

I dunno. I think that people actively talking about a VA calling everyone racist for not liking a notoriously fairly divisive track is something really worth discussing in the official forums in the game.

---

I agree, Sena's statements and behavior are completely unprofessional and instigating a lot of unrest within our community. It's clear that casting Sena Bryer as Wuk Lamat's English VA was a mistake due to their lack of expressive range. The mistake is now being compounded by Sena's continued divisive online behavior.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karious

Sorry I haven't posted in a few days. Health issues and working on tracking down all of Kate's spiciest and stupidest takes. Saw a fun collection of her tweets a few pages back. Trying to compile a nice collection ranging from common ones where she forced the pixies to be non-binary in English localization only, to her refusal to translate Otokonoko (男の娘) on stage at Fanfest when Yoshi-P used it to refer to Emet-Selech. Kate and Sena both deserve to be fired for their incompetence and forcing their politics into everything. Please look forward to it or whatever, idk.

---

I genuinely wasn't aware of this stuff. It's frustrating how difficult it is to remain faithful to the source material for these kind of people that are so mentally fixated on their own ideology. This kind of nonsense needs to stop. It does a disservice not only to the people you supposedly work for, but for the players as well.

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squig

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

---

Think what you want.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squig

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

---

dude, i hate everyone but special case like Sena make me hate him the most.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squig

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

---

Or people don't like the voice actor because there a toxic person who also did a horrible job performing a character and only got hired because their friends with the lead localization person.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BigBoom550

It's not that they can't, it's that they won't.

I work with money. My job's to count the beans, not tell people how to eat them. It's not a hard concept. I do my job, and it pays for my hobbies. I go home, play games, and build models.

These people think it's their job to tell other people what to think and feel, not to translate. Getting real sick of it.

---

Admittedly, localizing it's not akin to just translating, that's not how it works at all.

However, when respectful, well done localization it's done, you do not change things all willy-nilly.

My only experience it's as a consumer of media, which is not much, but I'll speak about it.

When I was on my teenage years, the first publishing company to start publishing manga in my country was founded and their two first releases were Ranma 1/2 and Rurouni Kenshin. To this day, my whole collection of tankoubon of Rurouni Kenshin, that first edition, it's my treasure.

No one before had tried to publish manga here. We had anime of course, but any manga that arrived came from Spain and did so butchered by them in both format and language so, basically, that publishing company all but created their method of localization because they decided to do it right while respecting for the source material.

Each tome of Rurouni Kenshin, a manga with a historical background aside from the fictional characters, always started with a page explaining the various historical events that lead into the Edo Period in a brief manner and, in every tome, they would add or take away events depending on whether or not they were relevant to the tome. Throughout the chapters, I would see a lot of asterisk with little clarifications or saying that more will be explained in the ending section. In that ending section, it was all about culture, where the translator would go into details about the asterisks or in some cases, would go into detail on the logic behind some of the translated terms (which was also a common thing that happened with Ranma 1/2)

That was all done by one guy. A single guy who was passionate about the language and the culture and more importantly, respected it because of that passion he has.

Of course, there's no way to add those sort of things in a game, so of course, they can't go into deep detail and, considering it is a full fantasy setting, I also don't think there's a need for clarifications, but all that shows from the current localization team, is a disdain for Japanese culture, specially if it will conflict with their ideology.

But they are the ones that will smack their chest and claim to be fighting bigotry in some sort of crusade.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squig

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

---

https://media4.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2...1CU/giphy.webp

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squig

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

---

Nobody in this thread hates trans women more than Sena hates women.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squig

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

---

Bro do not take that track with me, I am *the* depraved bisexual and I will have that respected. Long as it can consent I might be down.

Reducing all concerns to 'wahh they just hage trans people' was covered a few pages back. It's not remotely constructive to say.

No one deserves this treatment, Protecc Wuk Lamat

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squig

i'm not a big fan of Wuk Lamat but i sincerely believe a lot of the people in this thread genuinely just hate trans women

---

This is precisely why I think this thread is not suitable for the discussion anymore. The vast majority of it is back and forth on the ethics of transgender identity. The proper meat of the topics, i.e. the disgusting behaviour of Sena randomly occurs on page 90something. People still come in here to defend her right to self-expression and the whole thread goes off the rails, while Sena's insults towards the player base get buried under pages and pages of back and forth.

I had only posted once or twice before, to defend the use of chosen pronouns, and I wouldn't have known how horrible of a person Sena is if I hadn't been lurking at the right time.

For visibility on the true issue to be spread, it needs to be in the OP, where people would see it, not on page 90something, and this is just not gonna happen in this thread.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hesitate89

No one deserves this treatment, Protecc Wuk Lamat

---

The voice of the character is not the character. Character still sucks.

I believe she's much better than you think, the story reasons behind her character, is much deeper and important has gone over many heads to acknowledge

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BigBoom550

Bro do not take that track with me, I am *the* depraved bisexual and I will have that respected. Long as it can consent I might be down.

Reducing all concerns to 'wahh they just hage trans people' was covered a few pages back. It's not remotely constructive to say.

---

I entirely agree with you, as I'm LGBT too, but people like the guy you're quotting wouldn't know this thread is anything beyond trans bashing by just looking at it. On the surface one looks at it and it's like "aww poor Sena" - one has to have been along for the whole ride to have seen just how badly she treats the fandom.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hesitate89

I believe she's much better than you think, the story reasons behind her character, is much deeper and important has gone over many heads to acknowledge

---

I believe she's much worse than you think. The story and the characters contort themselves to make her look more powerful and morally good than anyone else.

Anyway, this thread isn't to talk about Wuk Lamat. There's at least 10 others out there to discuss that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hesitate89

I believe she's much better than you think, the story reasons behind her character, is much deeper and important has gone over many heads to acknowledge

---

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand Wuk Lamat. The story is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of peace and happiness most of the plot will go over a typical player's head. There's also Wuks's optimistic outlook, which is deftly woven into her characterisation- her personal philosophy draws heavily from children's literature, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of this plot, to realise that they're not just funny- they say something deep about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Wuk Lamat truly ARE idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the love in Wuk's existential catchphrase "Sphene! Listen to me!" which itself is a cryptic reference to Steve Metzger's "Yes I can Listen". I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as Kathryn Cwynar's genius wit unfolds itself on their computer screens. What fools.. how I pity them.

She's Seat of Deudelaphon that's why dude. Look up this character and it'll all make sense

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Isala

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand Wuk Lamat. The story is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of peace and happiness most of the plot will go over a typical player's head. There's also Wuks's optimistic outlook, which is deftly woven into her characterisation- her personal philosophy draws heavily from children's literature, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of this plot, to realise that they're not just funny- they say something deep about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Wuk Lamat truly ARE idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the love in Wuk's existential catchphrase "Sphene! Listen to me!" which itself is a cryptic reference to Steve Metzger's "Yes I can Listen". I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as Kathryn Cwynar's genius wit unfolds itself on their computer screens. What fools.. how I pity them.

---

https://media1.tenor.com/m/Uhzm8-dhs...offee-lmao.gif

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hesitate89

She's Seat of Deudelaphon that's why dude. Look up this character and it'll all make sense

---

It's a fun concept, but how can she be the seat of Deudelaphon? Deudelaphon was killed (improperly, we believe) after Wuk Lamat was born. There was no period to which Deudelaphon could have reincarnated as a sundered shard or otherwise into Wuk Lamat, she predates his fall. I'm not against your theory, I just want to understand how this can be with the facts we have on the table.

Apologies if you responded in the last reply I asked this, but I didn't see an answer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hesitate89

She's Seat of Deudelaphon that's why dude. Look up this character and it'll all make sense

---

She never appraised any architecture nor invented anything at all. And unless you think that telling the hanu hanu the equivalent of "have you tried just being happy, lmao?" counts as innovation... then I don't know what to tell ya.

Nix, saw your reply in the other thread. Not gonna engage with that further here.