Please Stop Crying About Personal Gil Insufficiency Issues.

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Originally Posted by Ruprect

One thing you forget OP is that if everybody crafted there would be no one to buy your wares and the market would be so swamped with crafting/crafted items nothing would sell for more than a gil.

The other thing is that you do not understand that it is not the lack of personal wealth but the lack of way to make gil on the server as a whole. Once everybody finishes their story and gets their 200-250k gil that is it, there is no way to make more gil to put into the economy. And numerous gil sinks to remove gil from the game. At some point there will be no gil left to trade as it has all gone back into the vendors via repairs/market fee's/ etc. IMO repairs cost far to much for how hard it is to make gil in game and it will cause a huge collapse at some point.

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I have made 2 posts on ways to generate gil all it takes is a lil work

@ OP When you need to spend that entire amount you saved for 2 just items on the black market and you have exhausted all quests you will be in the same boat as the rest of us. The game set up is encouraging all of us to race level our classes just to get what we need rather then contend with market prices. How is that sustainable for the future? Every man and his dog is going to have leveled up all his classes to make ends meet and what are they going to do? Move on...

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Originally Posted by JPPILIP

I have made 2 posts on ways to generate gil all it takes is a lil work

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Lol so your solution is to DoH stuff to sell to NPC's lol. Does that make sense to you? I have no problem with work and no problem with gil, but I forsee a huge problem coming with no other way to make gil vendoring gathered items. There should be numerous ways in game to make gil. Not everyone is going to craft/gather. That being the case there will not be enough gil coming in for the amount going out. You are so confused by this, why?

Have people complaining about gil ever played another MMO? Correct me if I'm wrong but World Of Warcraft's AH removes Gold from the game. World Of Warcraft has Gear repairs. About the only thing I Can think of WOW has for Gold income FFXIV is missing is profitable dailies.

Money has to be taken out of the game to keep the economy healthy. Otherwise it will just inflate till everyone is rich and the rest are wealthy. A commedian once said "Rich is something you can loose on a vacation to cancoon overnight, Wealth is something that get's passed down for generations" so you get the difference.

However, I will admit that gear repair costs are too high. Secondly I will admit that the games Dol and Doh design is bad. You should not have to change out of your main class to craft or gather. We can't craft in dungeons (no cooking/fishing etc), and we can't switch to do repairs. All though we don't really need to switch to do repairs in a dungeon because I never break in a dungeon by repairing before I que.

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Originally Posted by JPPILIP

All the people complaining just wanna run dungeons all day and QQ cus they have no money there are ways to make money in this game best example is what I use.
Iron ore mine 100 20 min elm lumber 100 20 min makes 50 iron saws sells for 70 gil 50 x 70=3500 gil to npc vendors and this is done by just having 3 DoH Dol classes at lvl 15 now imagine those same 3 classes at lvl 50.

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No offense to you... but you make playing a game sound like... a job.

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Originally Posted by Ryios

Have people complaining about gil ever played another MMO? Correct me if I'm wrong but World Of Warcraft's AH removes Gold from the game. World Of Warcraft has Gear repairs. About the only thing I Can think of WOW has for Gold income FFXIV is missing is profitable dailies.

Money has to be taken out of the game to keep the economy healthy. Otherwise it will just inflate till everyone is rich and the rest are wealthy. A commedian once said "Rich is something you can loose on a vacation to cancoon overnight, Wealth is something that get's passed down for generations" so you get the difference.

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WoW and most MMO also give more than 1 gil (or equivalent) on killed mobs. There is no need for a lot of changes, just some light modifications:
- more gils on killed mobs
- or chances for allagan coins on killed mobs
- or allagan coins in chest are given to all members of the party, not only one

Either of these solutions would probably be enough, and at the same time, it would solve the Amdapor Keep speed run "problem".

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-game-economy

It really is crying about personal insolvency, not an underlying problem with the game itself. There is no evidence to back up reports that there are problems with the economy...

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Originally Posted by Cycloptichorn

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-game-economy

It really is crying about personal insolvency, not an underlying problem with the game itself. There is no evidence to back up reports that there are problems with the economy...

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A link to your own thread that only 1 person has bothered to post in. Is that your evidence?

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Originally Posted by Cycloptichorn

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-game-economy

It really is crying about personal insolvency, not an underlying problem with the game itself. There is no evidence to back up reports that there are problems with the economy...

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lol at another level 30 come to bump its own ignorant post. I'm not near level 50 and it is obvious that lack of gil is a huge problem. It was a huge problem back when vanilla wow launched as well, get your head out of the sand.

people generate money all the time with all the accessible leve rewards and countless players producing money from quests and allagan peices. The economy is fine, even so, since when is everyone all of a sudden on board of trying to make the game more community based? just because you don't like it doesn't mean its bad. i just so happen to enjoy the fact that once im level 50, i gotta work hard to keep up with the bills, because this way it will give me the mindset of having to only play with good players, and that good ole' missed ff11 mentality of never wanting to die and play at my A-game. Take this as a good feature of the game because just about everything else in this game holds your hand harder then an over protective mother in a mall.

stop whining and enjoy the game, of course everyone just wants an excuse to call someone ignorant and stupid because thats just the way how this generation we live in works. But the only truth of the matter is, is that we are all impatient and lazy.just get off your butt and farm gil. Just because your lazy shouldn't have to ruin it for everyone else.

Another thing.... IF REPAIR BILLS ARE TOO EXPENSIVE THEN MAKE SOME DANG FRIENDS IN THIS "COMMUNITY" THAT CAN REPAIR THE GEAR FOR YOU! ITS MUCHO CHEAPO! GATHER THE DARK MATTERS YOURSELF!

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Originally Posted by DwightParkman

The economy is fine

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And still you talk out of your butt. Nice. Don't let actual level 50s telling you how it is dissuade you from your imagination of what it will be like. I just got 45 and noticed a stark increase in repairs and thats just 45.

I am making gil fine, but soon I cannot find any more noobs to rip off from market place and the gil will dry up

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Originally Posted by Ryios

Snip

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There are ways to make gil in other MMO's that allow you to make more than your repair costs. Most other MMO's do not make you repir unless you wipe. This MMO requires you to repair for just playing the game. One run of castruim with no wipes costs me over 1k gil to repair. I make like 20 gil for doing the instance. I can run levequests but that would also require me to repair and you can only get 3 a day. The instances give you almost no money for running them and you do not get rewarded for not wiping as the repair cost will be almost the same, it seems wiping adds like 2% to the cost. So in other MMO's if you did not wipe you made some money as you would get gold drops from trash/bosses/chests, if you wiped a few times you still made a bit but not as much, in FFXIV you have to repair no matter what. So you are always fighting a downhill battle.

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Originally Posted by Ruprect

There are ways to make gil in other MMO's that allow you to make more than your repair costs. ...

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Castrum Meri is about 1.5k~1.8kish for a successful no deaths run for my drg. I repair all my stuff myself since I have 5 stacks of DM from 1.0, but if I were using the npc that would be a ton of gil destroyed seeing as I run it about 8+ times a day.

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Originally Posted by soulrot

Please do not talk about personal wealth or ways to earn gils. All of us know how to do that, you are not smart or anything to figure that out. What we are talking about is server economy as a whole.

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But he is talking about server gil. If he can mine, chop and craft and sell to NPC (and I say NPC vendors, not the Market, not to another player, NPC), and make money, he is increasing the overall gil in the economy.

The trick is can you mine, chop, and craft HQ items to turn into HQ leves at high level with efficiency to make money. As I am not 50 yet, I reserve judgment. I suspect you will make money this way overall net (remember, not to other players, that is a net gil loss). However, i do not suspect it will be very efficient or a big money maker based even on level 35 mining/smithing repair bills and HQ tradecraft leves. This coupled with the higher repair bills means you would spend a ton of time just to break even.

I am also not claiming that I know how to make money over level 50's. I am just explaining the difference between selling to NPC's/leves (possible net gain based on repairs) vs. selling to other players(net loss guaranteed).

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Originally Posted by Galindon

But he is talking about server gil. If he can mine, chop and craft and sell to NPC (and I say NPC vendors, not the Market, not to another player, NPC), and make money, he is increasing the overall gil in the economy.

The trick is can you mine, chop, and craft HQ items to turn into HQ leves at high level with efficiency to make money. As I am not 50 yet, I reserve judgment. I suspect you will make money this way overall net (remember, not to other players, that is a net gil loss). However, i do not suspect it will be very efficient or a big money maker based even on level 35 mining/smithing repair bills and HQ tradecraft leves.

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3

You also wear out your gear gathering, so if you are wearing good HQ gathering gear it is doubtful that you will make more than you pay for repairs by vendoring. I do not know for sure as I do not have a lvl 50 gathering yet.

The problem isn't everyone wants to be rich
The problem is once you hit 50 and have done every quest your money supply just starts plummeting in a tailspin to a point that you can't even do normal game content

and if the solution is everyone needs to be a crafter, what would that solve exactly?

Then everyone would be a crafter and no one would ever have any need to buy anything from anyone

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Originally Posted by Nihility

The problem isn't everyone wants to be rich
The problem is once you hit 50 and have done every quest your money supply just starts plummeting in a tailspin to a point that you can't even do normal game content

and if the solution is everyone needs to be a crafter, what would that solve exactly?

Then everyone would be a crafter and no one would ever have any need to buy anything from anyone

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But but..... You can gather and vendor what you have gathered lol. /sarcasm

Not everyone finds crafting fun. If the only way to succeed at a game is to NOT HAVE FUN, then it's failed at being a game by definition.

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Originally Posted by Nihility

Then everyone would be a crafter and no one would ever have any need to buy anything from anyone

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It's kind of plain to see that SE doesn't want everyone to maintain and run every level 50 craft. The amount of effort required for each trade/field craft is pretty high and time consuming. So, no, you won't be able to just self-maintain unless you had all the time in the world. If a good majority of players were involved in at least 1 DoH & DoL craft, business and demand would be at a constant high for different mats and everyone would be making money.

SE put together some extensive craft professions because they all compliment one another (at least from what I've seen so far). Only this past weekend have I noticed more attention being taken to the marketplace board. The first week, no one was really touching it. Use it and love it. There's more to the game than just dungeon grinding.

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Originally Posted by reaver84

It's kind of plain to see that SE doesn't want everyone to maintain and run every level 50 craft. snip

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Eventually over years numerous ppl will have all crafts at max level. Crafting is not a solution, it is a part of a solution but their needs to be other means to make gil in game. Everyone acts like everyone wants to get rich without having to craft or do anything, in my case I just want to be able to make enough to be able to sustain raiding/end game without having to spend days farming, I actually don't even mind farming if it will net me the gil tfor repairs..

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Originally Posted by DwightParkman

people generate money all the time with all the accessible leve rewards and countless players producing money from quests and allagan peices. The economy is fine, even so, since when is everyone all of a sudden on board of trying to make the game more community based? just because you don't like it doesn't mean its bad. i just so happen to enjoy the fact that once im level 50, i gotta work hard to keep up with the bills, because this way it will give me the mindset of having to only play with good players, and that good ole' missed ff11 mentality of never wanting to die and play at my A-game. Take this as a good feature of the game because just about everything else in this game holds your hand harder then an over protective mother in a mall.

stop whining and enjoy the game, of course everyone just wants an excuse to call someone ignorant and stupid because thats just the way how this generation we live in works. But the only truth of the matter is, is that we are all impatient and lazy.just get off your butt and farm gil. Just because your lazy shouldn't have to ruin it for everyone else.

Another thing.... IF REPAIR BILLS ARE TOO EXPENSIVE THEN MAKE SOME DANG FRIENDS IN THIS "COMMUNITY" THAT CAN REPAIR THE GEAR FOR YOU! ITS MUCHO CHEAPO! GATHER THE DARK MATTERS YOURSELF!

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First of all.... get level 50 before you start talking about the economy and than you will start to understand(why i am even giving you the time of day is only proof of how bored i am). I believe i said this b4 somewhere else but using the excuse of countless people are generating gil has a lot of problems with it and ill break it down

1.) People cant buy the game atm and servers are locked. This means the amount of new players coming in are non existent

2.) You logic greatly depends on the amount of people coming in. This is very much like a ponzi scheme where the business(in this case ffxiv's economy) appears to be fine as long as new people keep coming in(which is not happening currently).

3.) Saying countless players is false because this game is currently not gaining new players.

4.) Calling people lazy and ignorant only proves that you have no real argument.

5.) Leves do not generate very much gil and also have a limit. Fates are even less and people run out of quests eventually.

6.) Take economy 101 and get yourself educated.

Edit: Do you even know how dark matter is obtained? heres a hint, its not through farming

OP is playing "tutorial" and telling people what they should do...

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Originally Posted by Krystal_Storm

@ OP When you need to spend that entire amount you saved for 2 just items on the black market and you have exhausted all quests you will be in the same boat as the rest of us. The game set up is encouraging all of us to race level our classes just to get what we need rather then contend with market prices. How is that sustainable for the future? Every man and his dog is going to have leveled up all his classes to make ends meet and what are they going to do? Move on...

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No it is, people are just in such a hurry to get to lvl 50 because then they can stand around and do nothing all day :).

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Originally Posted by Malix

First of all.... get level 50 before you start talking about the economy and than you will start to understand(why i am even giving you the time of day is only proof of how bored i am). I believe i said this b4 somewhere else but using the excuse of countless people are generating gil has a lot of problems with it and ill break it down

1.) People cant buy the game atm and servers are locked. This means the amount of new players coming in are non existent

2.) You logic greatly depends on the amount of people coming in. This is very much like a ponzi scheme where the business(in this case ffxiv's economy) appears to be fine as long as new people keep coming in(which is not happening currently).

3.) Saying countless players is false because this game is currently not gaining new players.

4.) Calling people lazy and ignorant only proves that you have no real argument.

5.) Leves do not generate very much gil and also have a limit. Fates are even less and people run out of quests eventually.

6.) Take economy 101 and get yourself educated.

Edit: Do you even know how dark matter is obtained? heres a hint, its not through farming

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I have 100k Gil from leves (you know there are 3 different kinds - some are better than others for Gil) now to the important part - you are lazy. I do not need to state a plethora of things to know that you are just plain lazy.. It's obvious for all the people that have played FFXIV 1.0 and FFXI that you are all.. Incredibly lazy.

http://narwhaler.com/original/vb/n/o...irl-vbnRG7.jpg

Edit: just gonna drop this link here: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ed-tomorrow%21 and sign off with /thread
repair cost were the issue and that issue has been addressed.

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Originally Posted by Cycloptichorn

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-game-economy

It really is crying about personal insolvency, not an underlying problem with the game itself. There is no evidence to back up reports that there are problems with the economy...

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Where did this thread go? I think it was the long, well thought out one I was reading this morning. I didn't get to finish it ><.

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Originally Posted by Cycloptichorn

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-game-economy

It really is crying about personal insolvency, not an underlying problem with the game itself. There is no evidence to back up reports that there are problems with the economy...

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S-E seems to agree that the repair costs are too high...

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post1232837

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Originally Posted by DwightParkman

yeah i figured i would see this excuse "cuz im not level 50 yet" but if i was level 50, i would make sure my crafting class was also level 50, which would undoubtly mean more money would be made, balancing out the higher repair bills, so no, that excuse is not valid. People just need to stop being lazy. Try not taking this as an attack, but as a friendly suggestion of help..

@Usotsuki

Well its part of the game, if you dont like it, then this game isnt for you.

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Oh so now those who have no interest in crafting should just quit? where is dislike button for idiotic posts like these? I beg you stop talking nonsense.

Okay analogy time. You're watching the news with your family or friends or whatever. On it, the anchor says "The DOW dropped 1.2% today due to poor employment numbers." You then respond "Oh, the economy's fine! I have a job." Your friends/family/whatever would then look at you like you're fucking retarded. That's how we're looking at you now.

When people talk about the deflation, they're not talking about personal economics. They're talking macroeconomics. The economy as a whole. Individuals are irrelevant in such a discussion.

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

i stoped reading right there.....

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I was thinking about it, but i was compelled to read on to confirm that the OP is clueless about the current economy situation. i stop reading here:

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Originally Posted by DwightParkman

i have made over 150,000 Gil without heavy effort just by basic high Quality crafting sales through one class.

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I have made about 250k gil, personally by selling junk on the AH, but that doesn't change the fact that in doing so that 12500 gil has left the economy.

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Originally Posted by Pandemonium

[U]we are heading for an inevitable deflation and recession where noone is buying or selling.

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its allready happening as people get to level 50 and and they see the reality andthey either have nothing to spend on markets or are holding on to what little they have

Level 8 Goblins drop 15-20 gill each. Is there a humanoid, gill dropper at or around 50? (I seem to remember raiders in Norther Thanalan)

I'm pretty sure there is lots of gill to be found if we look.

whos going to buy your stuff when everybody is a crafter as well

I always thought this "issue's" answer was kind of obvious with the Achievements - items - currency - being all about money from leve quests but whatevah (￣(エ)￣)ゞ
Find a good leve quest and have at it.

You don't use leve allowances on DoW/M classes to level, since it seems most efficient to do that with FATES, but it is highly profitable to do leves for crafting and turn in HQ items.

Its not the fastest thing ever but it will create gil.

If you don't want to do DoH leve quests then I don't even know what you should do.

If you want to make money, you should probably take the time to level a class that's sole purpose is to make money?

Doing DoH leves actually would work to expedite the issue. Assuming you got both to 50, now you have to repair 2 sets of gear 2-3k each with that 3-5k you just made from leves. I don't know about you, but I repair at least 2-3 times a day. So at 50, that would cost me 4-9k/day, or if I add a 2nd set 8-18k/day. 5k < 18k.

Either way, they said they will be lowering repair costs tomorrow. So hopefully the issue will no longer be one.

Ignoring the arrogance an belittling tone from one poster on page 3, an a few other level 50s who seem to think if you are not 50 you cant possibly understand, the reason they are complaining is because they all exploited fates to rush to 50 in a few days, an suddenly find they are broke because they didn't take time to craft, quest explore an generally wander around making money as per normal. Now suddenly they are demanding SE pander to their impatience at needing to be level 50 in 5 mins.

You have not seen money issues till you played FFXI. When 1 piece of gear meant hours an hours of grind or els groups would refuse to allow you in. Then after all that you had to turn round next day an do it all over again. So the fact you are in need of cash is your own faults.

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Originally Posted by TasOgie

I missed the point entirely.

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It's funny, I've seen a guy with your name in the forums of almost every MMO that's launched in the last 4-5 years. You always seem to be a bit slow on the uptake.

The vast majority of gil comes from non-repeatable quests. As more people get off of the quest treadmill at the end of the ride, less gil will be entering the economy, and more gil will be consumed by repairing high end gear. Without both a reduction in repair costs, and substantial gil generation being implemented for high level players, the result is a nonfunctional economy. No one's "demanding SE pander to their impatience". They're expecting SE to implement fixes for a problem that is already evident, and will only become worse as time goes on.

The repair cost reduction is going in, thankfully - how effective it is remains to be seen without corresponding introduction of gil generation methods.

Crafting again. Some people don't like to craft and saying "if you don't like crafting this game is not for you " "you have to play all parts of the game" is unfair to the community. How would you like your mats to be locked in hard dungeons? Forcing crafters to ether spend all their money or doing something they don't enjoy. Same with people who like to raid and dungeon, right now people can't afford to do what they like. Good game design rewards people for doing what they like not punishes.

Hunters also get High quality items from monsters. So sell them at Market.

Well it will be fixed tomorrow and I know that this has already been said but.

At level 50 doing quests you'll probably have about 300K. After that you don't really have a way to generate any Gil cause the quests are done and if you have no leves (about 900-1300 gil a day) there's no way to really generate $$$ WITHOUT taking it from someone else (who also has the same issue). That being said, the repair costs for gear at 50 (all lvl50+ gear) is staggering. It's so much so to the point that you'll be looking at 6k after a good run.

All in all, the amount of money you GENERATE (not attain from other players) will be bled away from you relatively quickly while you farm for seals to get better gear that will cost more to repair.

Unless you want to run around in gathering gear and collect items that sell for 3 gil, get 20 stacks of 99 for an hour to sell for 5940gil or whatever, there is no way to make NEW money.