Arcadion - no spoilers, but...

best part about the raid is no wuk lamat

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

They gave actual justification for the WoL to be there and participate aside from just wanting to fight.
And the main characters involved so far have shown more depth than wuk ever did during the entirety of the MSQ.

My biggest issue is one that's even present in the MSQ is the WoL's absolute refusal to share relevant knowledge with people, or bringing in others to the story... Although I suppose what are the chances of the WoL knowing about an individual who's extremely well studied into the topic of souls we could go talk to about the problem with Eutrope...

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LOL yeah I wanted to hold up a hand to Eutrope, put a finger to my ear and go "Hey Shtola? Yeah I need some smart people here stat. Bring the whole crew, it's something chewy."

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Holy...

People really make their whole personality about hating Wuk Lamat.

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Holy ...

People really make their whole personality about hating people who hates Wuk Lamat.

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Holy...

People really make their whole personality about hating Wuk Lamat.

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"I not center of universe!?!? THAT CHARACTER BAD!!!1111!!1"

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Holy...

People really make their whole personality about hating Wuk Lamat.

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When the game makes its entire personality about being Wuk Lamat, are you really surprised?

Nah. In Stormblood, by favorite story bits were the Alliance raids. This raid series is just... Fun. More or less professional wrestling, complete with ring commentary, and so far alliance set

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Originally Posted by Isala

When the game makes its entire personality about being Wuk Lamat, are you really surprised?

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Sort of. I feels like only the official forums and Reddit actually hate her. Twitter seems to like her and at worst in any of my discords, folks have a more neutral opinion on her, but more tend to like her.

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Originally Posted by lolnotacat

Going forward can we replace Wuk Lamat with the new superior catgirl?

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No joke. I did more mentoring of that character by the third raid than I did of Wuk Lamat for the whole MSQ.... and she isn't even friendly until after raid 2.

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Originally Posted by Derio

Why is it that the girls they introduced in less than 30 minutes have a more compelling story than the 30+ hours we spend with Wuk Lamat.

Arcadion is good and a breath of fresh air to the game.

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because they have actual purpose to fight, (without going into spoilers) and peace was never an option.

Spoiler:
In the last fight of the raid, WoL is being beaten by the boss. As the countdown is about to reach 3, WoL sees Wuk Lamat and tags her hand. The screen then fade to black and, in the final instance, the message box appears and says "You are now playing as Wuk Lamat"

The fact that people, even on a side-content, are talking about Wuk Lamat is comical to me. You are not the center of the universe and you are experiencing someone's else story. Oh no, the horror. Of course story is going to be centered on her, it's *her* story.

As for the Arcadium? Best raid tier in the game. Amazing and fun fights, delightful theme songs for each that represent each fighter, amazing arenas, and voice-acting mid-fight alongside the Narrator which just make it even more fun. I finished the 4 fights, got my loot, and I still revisit the fights for no reason but the fun out of it.

Makes me curious in a few years, what beast will come of out this for Ultimate.

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Originally Posted by OMGJesuis66

The fact that people, even on a side-content, are talking about Wuk Lamat is comical to me. You are not the center of the universe and you are experiencing someone's else story. Oh no, the horror. Of course story is going to be centered on her, it's *her* story.

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https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...awntrail-s-MSQ

It was a bad story. It failed at storytelling and characterisation. It was the biggest part of the expansion, how can you not expect people to be disappionted and want to vent their frustrations? Like it or not, Wuk Lamat is a meme, and memes get brought up everywhere.

With that said, Arcadion is cool af. It doesnt make up for the MSQ, and Ill be doing the fights every week for tomes and rewards and maybe a few times for the funsies, but they aren't enough to keep me subbed. Hopefully we get more like it going forwards.

Bee Lady ------> Thunder Witch -------> Black Cat, fight me!

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Originally Posted by OMGJesuis66

The fact that people, even on a side-content, are talking about Wuk Lamat is comical to me. You are not the center of the universe and you are experiencing someone's else story. Oh no, the horror. Of course story is going to be centered on her, it's *her* story.

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I think I missed in the advertising of DT and the Fanfests that it would be her story. Silly me.
Can you point me to where they said that DT would be Wuk Lamat's story? Man I can't find it. Is it the cover? Hmm no she's not there...

People have every right to be annoyed about that and to be relieved she doesn't appear for a change.

That shady Vince McMahon Lala showed up on screen and waved gear tokens in front of me for a Hell in a Cell match and I was hooked.
Genuine low stakes fun? I get to be a pro fighter with fans and a comic about me while unraveling a manager with an abusive system that exploits their talents?
Wait, he just KO'd the ref in match 3? With a steel chair?
Man I'm just so sold on this. It's fun.

Edit: the two sisters actually backing you up and cooperating without stepping on your toes or being center stage is really good too. I even like the family dynamic they have going on, with the two elder sisters with opposing views on how to resolve their predicament. It's just cool all around. Also I liked her gym. I want the abs option for catgirls now, we getting buff working out together.

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Originally Posted by Voidmage

I think I missed in the advertising of DT and the Fanfests that it would be her story. Silly me.
Can you point me to where they said that DT would be Wuk Lamat's story? Man I can't find it. Is it the cover? Hmm no she's not there...

People have every right to be annoyed about that and to be relieved she doesn't appear for a change.

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When it was stated the Hydaleyn and Zodiark arc ended, your part as Warrior of Light also ended. No one even calls you like that anymore.
Being on the back burner for once is an excellent thing for worldbuilding and gives other characters a better time on screen, the WoL will have the main character's presence again in due time, but as foundations are being set? It is quite obvious it wouldn't be now.

Being the protagonist and a god-slaying entity that nothing in this universe can stop has been dull since Shadowbringers and as the power scale kept creeping upwards, there is no threat possibly that can defy our characters. *Not* being the WoL story is what made DT good and refreshing to me and my enjoyment, it is fairly obvious people excavate any possible issues when they find something displeased them, and not being the center of the universe is by far the main reason it impacts negatively the story for those people.

After all, given the same reason is why they overlook blatant flaws on the MSQs of other expansions which they scream with the top of their lungs at how amazing it was and all perfect it was.

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Holy...

People really make their whole personality about hating Wuk Lamat.

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Man some ppl really mad about this stuff....like they really want you to like what they lile....

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Originally Posted by OMGJesuis66

When it was stated the Hydaleyn and Zodiark arc ended, your part as Warrior of Light also ended. No one even calls you like that anymore.
Being on the back burner for once is an excellent thing for worldbuilding and gives other characters a better time on screen, the WoL will have the main character's presence again in due time, but as foundations are being set? It is quite obvious it wouldn't be now.

Being the protagonist and a god-slaying entity that nothing in this universe can stop has been dull since Shadowbringers and as the power scale kept creeping upwards, there is no threat possibly that can defy our characters. *Not* being the WoL story is what made DT good and refreshing to me and my enjoyment, it is fairly obvious people excavate any possible issues when they find something displeased them, and not being the center of the universe is by far the main reason it impacts negatively the story for those people.

After all, given the same reason is why they overlook blatant flaws on the MSQs of other expansions which they scream with the top of their lungs at how amazing it was and all perfect it was.

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You can like the story however you like. I‘m not debating that.

You didn‘t answer my question though just your interpretations.
They never said the WoL‘s story is over.
They never said DT would be Wuk Lamat‘s story.
They said it would be akin to a vacation but not stay that way.
They said the scions would be divided.
Almost no material beforehand even showed or mentioned Wuk Lamat in any kind of focus more then the other Dawnservants.
The never said we would be sidelined.
THAT‘S what I‘m saying.

And I tell you something else.
If you didn‘t try to sneak an insult in your post like „we are angry to not be the center of the universe“ I never would have reacted to your comment and snarked at you.

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Originally Posted by Zakuyia

Man some ppl really mad about this stuff....like they really want you to like what they lile....

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It's kinda creepy just how obsessed some of these people get over defending this house cat. Like, we're not allowed to dislike her for ANY reason. Every single valid reason to dislike Wuk is met with a "Nuh uh! You're just haters!"

And to that I say, "Why does it matter even if we are?" XIV is not some sacred cow, immune from all criticism. We're allowed to be vocal about things we like and dislike, just as you are allowed to be vocal about the things you like and dislike. That's rather the whole bloody point of these forums, isn't it?

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Originally Posted by Voidmage

I think I missed in the advertising of DT and the Fanfests that it would be her story. Silly me.
Can you point me to where they said that DT would be Wuk Lamat's story? Man I can't find it. Is it the cover? Hmm no she's not there...

People have every right to be annoyed about that and to be relieved she doesn't appear for a change.

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...I feel it's common sense to realize that she would play a major part of Dawntrail. Like, supporting her claim to the throne was the reason our party went to Tural in the first place. We were more or less being "hired" to be her muscle and getting taken to the a new place as payment. I felt this was clear in 6.55.

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Originally Posted by DreadCrow

...I feel it's common sense to realize that she would play a major part of Dawntrail. Like, supporting her claim to the throne was the reason our party went to Tural in the first place. We were more or less being "hired" to be her muscle and getting taken to the a new place as payment. I felt this was clear in 6.55.

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There's a difference between being heavily involved in a story, and being the story.

Emet, Venat, Hien, Aymeric, Estinien, Nanamo, Elidibus, Raubahn- all were heavily involved in their stories.

Dawntrail was Wuk Lamat. That's the problem. Arcadion meanwhile is going the way people expected and wanted. You're respected but not simped over, you're interacting with characters who don't bowl you over narratively, and you get to have opinions without someone instantly 'correcting' you.

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Originally Posted by Voidmage

You can like the story however you like. I‘m not debating that.

You didn‘t answer my question though just your interpretations.
They never said the WoL‘s story is over.
They never said DT would be Wuk Lamat‘s story.
They said it would be akin to a vacation but not stay that way.
They said the scions would be divided.
Almost no material beforehand even showed or mentioned Wuk Lamat in any kind of focus more then the other Dawnservants.
The never said we would be sidelined.
THAT‘S what I‘m saying.

And I tell you something else.
If you didn‘t try to sneak an insult in your post like „we are angry to not be the center of the universe“ I never would have reacted to your comment and snarked at you.

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Common sense and understanding of the story ever since 6.1.
You don't need anyone to tell you any of that for it to be a fairly obvious interpretation.
They did say the story was going to be split into two parts, they did say they wanted the player to feel more on a vacation and not be so deeply involved with matters.
It was no mystery. At all.

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Originally Posted by OMGJesuis66

When it was stated the Hydaleyn and Zodiark arc ended, your part as Warrior of Light also ended. No one even calls you like that anymore.

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That wasn't even used as much by Endwalker. People who knew the whole story like the Scions, yeah. But a lot of others used the designation we had for that particular area. Like the tank role quests in DT you aren't the Warrior of Light. You're the Savior of Ishgard and that's how they've always recognized us.

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Originally Posted by OMGJesuis66

Being on the back burner for once is an excellent thing for worldbuilding and gives other characters a better time on screen, the WoL will have the main character's presence again in due time, but as foundations are being set?

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It's like you glossed over this thread and others that discuss Wuk Lamat. Being on the backburner is not the issue. Being almost a non-entity is.

As for giving other characters more time on screen. People were begging for a bigger focus on Erenville and Krile, especially Krile who took such a backseat in past expansions. Yet they too get constantly pushed into the background because of Wuk Lamat.

Pretty nice to have a raid series that's just about fighting. Eden and pandy had ok stories but 2 melodramatic stories in a row for raids was exhausting. Glad the main idea of this one is go fight in a tournament!

Arcadion is awesome!!!

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

Pretty nice to have a raid series that's just about fighting. Eden and pandy had ok stories but 2 melodramatic stories in a row for raids was exhausting. Glad the main idea of this one is go fight in a tournament!

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This honestly. felt refreshing to just get it on and going.

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Originally Posted by OMGJesuis66

Common sense and understanding of the story ever since 6.1.
You don't need anyone to tell you any of that for it to be a fairly obvious interpretation.
They did say the story was going to be split into two parts, they did say they wanted the player to feel more on a vacation and not be so deeply involved with matters.
It was no mystery. At all.

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So you have absolutely no ground for those arguments and just use „common sense“ as a deflection.
Common sense would dictate to expect ff14 though and not a switch in narrative style.

There is no „fairly obvious interpretation“. There weren’t even any breadcrumbs to get to this argument.
That’s just a cope out.

The story being split has absolutely nothing to do with it because that was regarding the Dawnservant trial stuff and Solution 9.

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Originally Posted by DreadCrow

...I feel it's common sense to realize that she would play a major part of Dawntrail. Like, supporting her claim to the throne was the reason our party went to Tural in the first place. We were more or less being "hired" to be her muscle and getting taken to the a new place as payment. I felt this was clear in 6.55.

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Common sense would be for me what I expected.
Her having the big focus on the first half of the story and not staying in centerstage the entire expansion.
You can also have a person be important without shoving our character from the stage. Estinien, Alphinaud, Crystal Exarch all did those things better.

I agree that ot was expected of us to help her with her becoming Dawnservant but I fail to see how that is in any form the same as making her the Main character 24/7.

Again, I don‘t mind people liking the story and saying they like i as long as it’s in a civilized manner.
If people throw shades and insults though I have a problem with that and the one I first responded to did exactly that.

My investment in this first Arcadion tier completely eclipses my excitement over the 7.0 MSQ.
Like, it only took the first couple of cutscenes and it felt like a breath of fresh air.

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Originally Posted by OMGJesuis66

Common sense and understanding of the story ever since 6.1.
You don't need anyone to tell you any of that for it to be a fairly obvious interpretation.
They did say the story was going to be split into two parts, they did say they wanted the player to feel more on a vacation and not be so deeply involved with matters.
It was no mystery. At all.

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the common sense is that it's fairly obvious your sense of interpretation is wrong and not resonated with majority of people

Also I just listened to the M2 and M4 fights music without SFX and HOOOLY they absolutely slap, kudos to Soken and his team because those are definitely going to be on 100% volume for progging.

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

Hard agree, she's great fun

i was honestly worried wuk lmao would be in this raid series. thank god she's not. the tournament arc being like the paper mario glitzville is a treat for sure. very fun

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The Glitz Pit is exactly the same thing I thought of too when I started the quest lol, I really hope we get a goofy wrestler name before the end of the raid. I also hope we get more groupies kinda like the characters Mario can talk to in each of the league rooms. Black Cat and her sister are already great but lets have B.Lovely join too.

I have to agree and that's a shame. It's just better written.
The pacing of the quests is really good. None of the dialogues seem pointless or contrived, every conversation seems to be there for a reason and gives us insight into what's going to unfold in the future. In fact, I was surprised they didn't hold back with certain character appearances.
To be fair, these are short quests. But MSQ didn't have that many pointless dialogues in the past, the writing was much more intentional.

Wicked thunder is cool. Been wanting a bada-- girl like that in the game years. Tho I do wish were get an Ariana Highwind type villian/rival if we can get zenes back. Wicked thunder va is also steller. She's like a better athena. I can't wait to see her other forms

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Originally Posted by Raikai

It reminded me of Yu Yu Hakusho almost instantly! I just missed seeing the Emcee with a microphone in hand during the fights and random attack thrown at the audience lol.

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Yea I also got dark tourney vibes

Found the fights to be boring, it's just like oh...I guess, maybe yea... [Mechanically] idk it was super boring an easy to read. Character design and the music is fine though :)

Story and setup I don't like at all still waiting for real raids to be made again but SQ lost their touch since Bcob/HW days every other raid series is not good at all. Cater to them casuals ya know

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Holy...

People really make their whole personality about hating Wuk Lamat.

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To counter this, I made I rule that I can't complain about Wuk Lamat more times than she mentioned her love for peace in the MSQ.

4/378

I wasn't expecting much from the raids after MSQ but holy crap am I having a blast with this. The whole aesthetic is incredible, ever track is a bop and it seems like the writers know exactly what the story is and are leaning into it. Also helps that the characters are instantly likeable, even if they are a bit shallow. They get the point across effectively and are exactly what they need to be to facilitate the story (instead of the other way around).

It's just a shame that isn't voiced. They already did VA for the in combat moments, might as well pay the actors a little bit extra to add voice to important cutscenes, like the one right before you face the last boss.

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Originally Posted by Raikai

It's just a shame that isn't voiced. They already did VA for the in combat moments, might as well pay the actors a little bit extra to add voice to important cutscenes, like the one right before you face the last boss.

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Agreed. The scene was pretty hype, would have been moreso if voiced.

10/10

Music is solid, Solid gamplay for a normal raid. Story has room to grow and had a nicely palatable introduction. (Unless you don't like the cringe Wrestling stuff.)