Dawntrail was great. More like this, please!

Damn, you really all fell for this troll.

Good job, OP.

Agreed, OP! This expansion gave me a very strong impression of what I'm likely to experience in 8.0 in 2028, which is the real expansion of Tural, right? It gave me an unbeatable single-player experience--as in, I can play other single-player games which are far better than this one. It also gave me a great multiplayer experience because, for the first time in years, I'm actually touching grass because of how boring (excuse me, "low stakes") the story is. Overall, Yoshi-P hit it out of the park yet again just like the post-Endwalker quests and I can't wait for more opportunities to keep playing all of my other games!

https://files.catbox.moe/oohxz0.jpg

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

I think this is a bit disingenuous as the entire setup for the expansion was "hey come by on my team". This was known going in. It was a major point of the MSQ for 6.55, and expecting that your WoL would instead traipse around doing their own thing feels like going in with the wrong expectation. We also weren't "constantly pushed into the limelight" - much of what we did was more low-key side errands or helping Wuk Lamat in a mentorship role and only bringing strength to bear together. The only solo duty that the WoL had in the entire first half of the expansion was to fight Gulool Ja Ja on his own request. The only time the WoL's reputation was brought to bear was when it was relevant as part of a dungeon or trial.

The WoL was in no way the star of the show for the first half, and in the second half they only showed up to provide martial support.

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We kind of are tho? Everything, and I mean literally everything (beside catching a an Alpacha), Wuk Lamat accomplishes in DT couldn't be done without the sledgehammer that we are.

And I don't get the mentor argument. Going through the msq I haven't felt like a mentor to her, but rather a bystander who would help her out again and again as soon as a challenge / obstacle arrived. I also didn't see her grow in any particular way based on our "mentorship".
If anything else she was dead set on bringing happiness and peace to her people from the get go? We are just an errand boy who accompanies her on that set goal.

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Originally Posted by Galvuu

Seems to me that's also what they're doing... any thread is open to discussion. You can actually find quite a few posts defending DT in the threads where people are openly criticizing it.
That is, after all, what discussion means. Turns out, irl people don't all agree with you unconditionally after you lay down your thoughts like they do ingame with Wuk Lamat :)

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That's fine, I just don't understand why they saw my post going "I thought this was really great!" and then they feel the need to post here saying i'm wrong and it sucks actually, instead of making their own thread. If people want to say DT is bad, that's fine, I have no obligation or desire to correct them. That's their thread, left for feedback.

For threads meant to be discussions? great. have at it. but people really saw this and went "i must correct this person".

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Originally Posted by genuine_stranger

We kind of are tho? Everything, and I mean literally everything (beside catching a an Alpacha), Wuk Lamat accomplishes in DT couldn't be done without the sledgehammer that we are.

And I don't get the mentor argument. Going through the msq I haven't felt like a mentor to her, but rather a bystander who would help her out again and again as soon as a challenge / obstacle arrived. I also didn't see her grow in any particular way based on our "mentorship".
If anything else she was dead set on bringing happiness and peace to her people from the get go? We are just an errand boy who accompanies her on that set goal.

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So she didn't beat Bakool Ja Ja on her own in a solo duty that you played through? Weird, that happened to me. She also definitely took the lead in the second half of the MSQ.

If you didn't see her grow from a hotheaded and impulsive person who didn't often consider the needs of others when solving their own problems, then I don't know what to tell you. The Wuk Lamat in the 90 quests and the Wuk Lamat from the 100 quests are different people.

Every expansion is "X person that we are trying to help could not have done this without us" but that doesn't make it any less their accomplishment. The Eorzean Alliance beating the Garleans in ARR was impossible without the WoL but that's still something they organized, they just told the WoL when to bring down the hammer. The entire point of the MSQ is that together we are stronger and we can accomplish things that no one person could do on their own. This is a constant theme in XIV and is always present, in every expac. Why is it a problem here all of a sudden?

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Originally Posted by Nitelancer

Exactly. And other people shared their thoughts in this thread. What you need to understand is that a thread is not your space. It is not something you own. A post, whether it’s one that starts a thread or a reply to a other, is a prompt for other people to reply to. So you saying no one asked for your opinion is completely nonsensical in the context of a forum. If you don’t want to see other people’s opinions, you should make your post and leave or not visit the forum at all.

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Again: They have other threads. They can make their own threads. This obsession with going into threads that they know they won't like and then posting something is insane person behavior to me. There are dozens of other complaint threads they could join in. Why do they post here? Why do you even care about taking the position of 'educating' me? You could've gone on with your day instead of posting here to raise a point I already knew and give me an argument neither of us needed.

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Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Damn, you really all fell for this troll.

Good job, OP.

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you're welcome, it's so cool that the state of the internet these days is when people are sharing their genuine thoughts and opinions, in a space the devs made and encourage people to use to share their thoughts and opinions, they are accused of being trolls and they have lots of people come in and tell them how they're wrong and they suck actually.

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

you're welcome, it's so cool that the state of the internet these days is when people are sharing their genuine thoughts and opinions, in a space the devs made and encourage people to use to share their thoughts and opinions, they are accused of being trolls and they have lots of people come in and tell them how they're wrong and they suck actually.

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Just take the compliment, mate - you are even making me reply to you despite realising what you are doing!

Everyone's entitled to their own opinion. I respectfully disagree and dread the thought of "more like this" going forward, but I'm really glad you enjoyed your time with it much more than I did.

At the very least I really do hope they realize having an entire expansion revolve around one character to the point that her spoken dialogue is quadruple the amount of everyone else is a bad idea. There's having a new central character, and then there shoving a new character in at every opportunity with little room for anyone else. It's a huge reason why the community is divided right now.

Did you like Wuk Lamat? You're probably going to enjoy your time and be less critical and optimistic of the overall story.

Did you hate Wuk Lamat? You're probably going to find everything tedious and you're going to be viewing the entire story from a negative lens.

And yes, I can report that I saw people complaining about the story and Wuk Lamat in shout chat, which is sad but also kind of funny.

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

Again: They have other threads. They can make their own threads. This obsession with going into threads that they know they won't like and then posting something is insane person behavior to me. There are dozens of other complaint threads they could join in. Why do they post here? Why do you even care about taking the position of 'educating' me? You could've gone on with your day instead of posting here to raise a point I already knew and give me an argument neither of us needed.

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Maybe your thread is the first they saw. Maybe you raised some specific point that they didn't see elsewhere and they wanted to reply. There are any number of reasons why someone would feel compelled to reply to your thread. And you certainly do need the education. Otherwise, you wouldn't try to make nonsensical arguments about why people shouldn't reply to your thread. That type of reply does not reflect a healthy mindset and is no good for a forum participant.

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Originally Posted by Nitelancer

Maybe your thread is the first they saw. Maybe you raised some specific point that they didn't see elsewhere and they wanted to reply. There are any number of reasons why someone would feel compelled to reply to your thread. And you certainly do need the education. Otherwise, you wouldn't try to make nonsensical arguments about why people shouldn't reply to your thread. That type of reply does not reflect a healthy mindset and is no good for a forum participant.

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omg wow thank you soooooo much for educating me :) i'll expect people to just behave like wild animals instead of doing the perfectly normal thing of 'staying in their lane' or 'not contributing to a conversation they have nothing to contribute for' and instead just being fine with the fact that xiv players genuinely cannot read and feel like they need me specifically to know what they think :)

good lord

very funny to me you think comments like "5/10 at best" and "3/10" are, in any way, a reply to a specific point and not a sign that the person replying thinks their opinion is the most important one in the room. be real.

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Originally Posted by Voidmage

I already answered you in another thread about exactly this point about your MCS stance on the playerbase. You actually answered part of it yourself here.
You just don't do a 180 turn of this kind in an mmorpg. Because players liked being the MC (and its even more important because we are silent).
I will ignore your attack on those with criticism (no one else can enjoy it) because I repeatedly say that I am happy for those who like either this here or the BLM changes. But this is a forum so feedback from others on a topic is to be expected.

Also there was no real adventuring this time because the path was either written in stone (the first part) or escalated (the second part).

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its a MMORPG...you can write the story however you want whether we are the MC or not, a RPG doesn't require us to the MC of the RPG just requires us to play a role in the story with we do and they can....as we see they did whether you like that or not now that is on you. Also there is no adventuring ever in the story....everything is written in stone how and when you will experience something there is the illusion of a path but in the end you are following scripted scenarios now the triggers are different.

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

very funny to me you think comments like "5/10 at best" and "3/10" are, in any way, a reply to a specific point and not a sign that the person replying thinks their opinion is the most important one in the room. be real.

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Lol I genuinely think people started using X/10 because they misunderstood my reply.

Maybe at 39 I am too old, do Gen Zs still use this way of ranking trolling attempts?

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

omg wow thank you soooooo much for educating me :)

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Glad to be of service :)

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Originally Posted by Mcg55ss

its a MMORPG...you can write the story however you want whether we are the MC or not, a RPG doesn't require us to the MC of the RPG just requires us to play a role in the story with we do and they can....as we see they did whether you like that or not now that is on you. Also there is no adventuring ever in the story....everything is written in stone how and when you will experience something there is the illusion of a path but in the end you are following scripted scenarios now the triggers are different.

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Are you serious with that adventuring take?
Of course its scripted duh. I'm talking about the adventuring FEELING. Adventuring is having a quest that lets us go into a cave exploring (maybe as a dungeon), going traveling and interacting with the people (not just three every quest for the succesor part).

Your first point. Sure they can write the story however they want. But if you change the entire premise of perspective after how many expansions into the absolute other direction then you will absolutely farm feedback on it and in this case mine is negative. They never did this before (even ARR, HW and Stb had us as a big part of the story if not even the center piece at many points like Ultima weapon, the primals, Niddhog, Zenos, Azim steppe and so on) even though we were not the hero in some of it.
Is it possible to to that and can they do it successfull? Sure why not. If it is done good then I would be happy. This MMORPG has always been to the biggest part about our silent protagonist though. That's what I'm saying.

Like I said if you like the story all the more power to you. Thats why I don't reply to OP because it's fine that they like the story and I have no problem with them. If not for some stuff like not seeing negative feedback in game (I just gave my own experience) and your stuff I would have never replied.
I'm talking to you here because of the choice of your words like Main character syndrome to belittle negative feedback.

I'm sorry but I don't think we will find equal ground in this discussion and I will end it here to not derail the thread.

Was good for a chuckle. Thanks OP!

Miss the political drama.

We need something persistent like the Garlean Empire and Monetarists again.

Loved EVERYTHING including the oh so negatively pointed Wuk Lamat, i don't have an MC syndrome thankfully, i can live fine by being a side character for one MSQ, but if there was a single thing i would say about the MSQ i wish was better it's : more combat focused quests... instead of dung fetch quests, please...

Stop trolling.

I totally agree with Bakool Ja Ja thing here, it was welcome but way too sudden for me.

Wuk Lamat should be an official Scion and join us for all future adventures. In fact maybe we can clone her and just replace all those old washed up Scions with more Wuk! And Yoshida can rework the MSQ so we meet Wuk at level 1 and shes in all expansions! And anytime a Wuk isn't on screen the WoL will say "Wheres Wuk Lamat?"

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Originally Posted by Raim

Wuk Lamat should be an official Scion and join us for all future adventures. In fact maybe we can clone her and just replace all those old washed up Scions with more Wuk! And Yoshida can rework the MSQ so we meet Wuk at level 1 and shes in all expansions! And anytime a Wuk isn't on screen the WoL will say "Wheres Wuk Lamat?"

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Why not just become Wuk Lamat ourselves? We will never have to search for her again.

Oh, I also have to add that Dawntrail expansion was a huge boost to my own creativity. While I was never into headcanons and such, already at level 93 I've developed a perfect motivation for my WoL he sometimes lacked (IMO) in the previous expansions. You see, while graphic update was kind to elezen in general, it also gave my Wol disturbing dark circles under his eyes. Those combined with constant serene smile convinced me that he'd found in Radz-at-Han someting particularly spicy and is constantly high now. I believe it perfectly explains our reactions (or a lack of them) and WoL's visible contentment with his new bestest friend and political future of Tural.
P.S. Pity there're no real romance options in game: after the amount of time my guy had spent with Wuk Lamat he probably should marry her by now.

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

I have no problems elaborating on what I said but showing up with a "actually it was 3/10" just tells me they think they're the main character and they should go make their own thread.

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The amount of projecting in this statement is crazy.

I got tired of Sphene's section real quick. I just want to go back to collecting pokemon badges with Wuk Lamat.

I really appreciate Dawntrail event though to me it has its flaws:

• The pacing is a bit inconsistent at time
• Our WoL feels very useless during the cutscenes, I wish we had more dialogue options, unique animations..

Other than that, the new world is beautiful, they really outdid themselves with the graphical update, the forests the textures, the details.. ♥

* I'd like to add that Hrothgar being limited in hairstyles still today is an annoying but releasing the females counterpart with only 3 hairstyles with variants is shameful but that's an other topic.

I have Lamatitis.

An insidious condition brought on by excessive exposure to Wuk Lamat.

I was ok helping her get the throne and her growth in that regard....HOWEVER, she wouldnt go away. The zone with Erenville was my happiest moment in the expansion, because I finally got a breather from her.

But nope.

It was simply TOO much.

I felt like she was stalking me.

I'm a WoL, not her personal Yes-man, errand boy, Peace Corp worker.

I am an avatar of destruction, unleash me.

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Originally Posted by TomsYoungerBro

The amount of projecting in this statement is crazy.

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the dev team: leave comments on the forums for us
me: leaves a comment that isn't meant for a discussion and doesn't really need people to tell me it sucked ,actually
some people: lol look at this idiot, how dare they leave a comment and then get annoyed when people chime in with opinions nobody asked for that offer no substance and are just the same 2 complaints recycled

????
???????????????

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

the dev team: leave comments on the forums for us
me: leaves a comment that isn't meant for a discussion and doesn't really need people to tell me it sucked ,actually
some people: lol look at this idiot, how dare they leave a comment and then get annoyed when people chime in with opinions nobody asked for that offer no substance and are just the same 2 complaints recycled

????
???????????????

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[EDIT] Disregard anything I typed. Realized too late this not an earnest poster. Just a troll. To those that actually enjoy the story, I'm glad you had a good time.

Ok, I generally never respond directly to those I don't agree with in quote or call people out. It's a game at the end of the day, no matter how invested we are in it, and there's no need to go into full blow arguments. It's fine to just live side by side in these forums with our own opinions even if they're at odds, no need to directly call people out.

But I can't take this anymore; If you don't want people offering opinions then you should've chosen to post your feedback through the many different avenues they have besides the forums.

If you go to the support section in game, there is a section for feedback for the game. There are other avenues for you to leave feedback to the dev team. There's also a customer support section on their SE webpage where you too can leave feedback. You can also get their customer service number and leave feedback (I know I have done this, and they've said they will get it to the team). There's nothing wrong with you liking the story. Post about it. However, you're not the forum police to sit here and try to swat away anyone that disagrees with you. We have the same right to be here as you, whether it's your thread or not.

Otherwise, you're showing the very characteristics your demonizing in you're posts. You're treating your OP as if we all have to accept it quietly and not come in and share our thoughts. Wow... no reason you love this story. Kinda seems like if anyone is stuck in Main Character syndrome, it's you.

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Originally Posted by LittleArrow

Ok, I generally never respond directly to those I don't agree with in quote or call people out. It's a game at the end of the day, no matter how invested we are in it, and there's no need to go into full blow arguments. It's fine to just live side by side in these forums with our own opinions even if they're at odds, no need to directly call people out.

But I can't take this anymore; There are other avenues for you to leave feedback to the dev team. There's also a customer support section on their SE webpage where you too can leave feedback. You can also get their customer service number and leave feedback (I know I have done this, and they've said they will get it to the team). There's nothing wrong with you liking the story. Post about it. However, you're not the forum police to sit here and try to swat away anyone that disagrees with you. You have the same right to be here as us, whether it's your thread or not. If you don't want people offering opinions then you should've chosen to post your feedback through the many different avenues they have besides the forums.

If you go to the support section in game, there is a section for feedback for the game.

Otherwise, you're showing the very characteristics your demonizing in your posts. You're treating your OP as if we all have to accept it quietly and not come in and share our thoughts. Wow... no reason you love this story. Kinda seems like if anyone is stuck in Main Character syndrome, it's you.

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cool story bro thanks for the lecture

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Originally Posted by lolnotacat

She also learned to like Alpacas, that traders like trading, and how to make tacos. Clearly the best character progression ever.

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I was asleep during most of the MSQ. Did she actually learn to make Tacos? Or just do lame (with fists clenched) jokes about wanting to eat them?

As far as the expansion went.

I am dissapoint.
https://i.gyazo.com/60f31b0eda768d8b...3b16899b21.png

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

cool story bro thanks for the lecture

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Right, thanks for the thoughtful discussion. Please carry on the trolling.

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Originally Posted by LittleArrow

Right, thanks for the thoughtful discussion. Please carry on the trolling.

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didn't come here for a thoughtful discussion!

god i get why people call this place a cesspit now

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Originally Posted by ThreadOfFate

didn't come here for a thoughtful discussion!

god i get why people call this place a cesspit now

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Yep and I'm reading why it is. That's my last response to your obvious trolling.

made a forum account just to plant a seed of positivity here. out of all the ffxiv stories, this was one where I never wanted to skip a single cutscene. I had such a good time, it was a really dense story and I'm grateful I've had so much free time this week to enjoy it all. Wuk Lamat made a great pseudo protagonist, you can tell she had a totally different air about her towards the end of the story (but yes... we need to talk about the # of fist clenches, team!). Tural was breathtaking. I think the weakest part of the story was def the mini western arc, but it began to connect with me later: the conflict surrounding the shootout duels was an excellent prelude to this conflict wuk lamat faces from that point on- that some times, it's a matter of who's stronger, who can take down who. and it really really carried to the very end. i could shower this in praise and i rlly just might!! im being fr bro i got a big heart!!!!!!! bravo

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Originally Posted by Shibi

I was asleep during most of the MSQ. Did she actually learn to make Tacos? Or just do lame (with fists clenched) jokes about wanting to eat them?]

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The xibruq pibil dish in the third zone looked like tacos. Or at least the basic concept in the US. A tortilla with some form of filling.

I've just unlocked job gear and want to give my thoughts so far. Dt took way to long to get interesting and it's a shame. Because the second half is REALLY good. The trial against zaroolja. OH MY GOD amazing/10. The music the design. All that was lacking was a decent character motivation. But at the same time I like it. It reminds me of the lion King and scar. Sometimes people are just wicked and there's not much more to it. This is zarool ja. A narcissistic manchild.

As for the rest of the second half. The zone "heritage found " has great music. Neo alexandria/solution nine is simply divine. It's a crime that it will die post dt. I also really loved that knight who was reincarnated in a mechanical body. Good lord his charm is off the roof. Every time he speaks I just want to be in his radiant presence. Well done on the casting on him.


Now. Let me speak about wuk lamat. In the first half i despised her. But.. you're meant to I think, even the wol doesn't have faith in her. But I think the reason we don't like wuk is because she's real. She's afraid of everything. She's loud annoying and downright ignorant of the world. But so too would any of us in her shoes be. Imo it was a bad idea to make her a hroth. As it makes it harder to relate to her tho this may just be personal. But towards the second half... she's definitely grown and become a worthy queen.

Lastly I want to talk about the wol. Dts biggest problem and the msqs biggest scape goat. Nerf this guy please. He is simply to strong now and it is ruining the story and its potential. Nothing ever feels threatening in his presence, I'm never worried about if he's going to be OK or get through it. In endwalker I felt like the wol was so much smaller. Being only 7/14s of the guy who couldn't do anything against mention. But in dt.. he feels like an unregulated power balance. This was why I liked zenos... he kept the wol in check. Killing zenos came at the cost of all of our strength and nearly killed us too. Again the story made me care for its protagonist again. So if I ask anything its that. The game should be about everyone. Not just wol watches everyone and carries them to victory.

I'm still at the 95 MSQ, but so far Dawntrail has utterly engrossed me. I am really enjoying seeing the incredible attention to detail in each zone, and each "people" seems like a living, breathing society. It's very refreshing to see. All of the natural zones, if you turn off the HUD, feel like real and viable ecosystems. Also, the pacing, in my opinion, is definitely more polished than Endwalker. The amount of superfluous content seems very minimal, and every MSQ quest has some significance to the story / world-building.

I also appreciate how the dialogue options provided to the WoL allow the player to express the (obvious) lack of experience Wuk Lamat has as a leader, so you really aren't forced to "like" her as a character if you don't want to.

I hope that SE continues to release content like this.