Why you can't kick people in combat?

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Originally Posted by SomeRandomHuman

Just a friendly reminder that if someone is intentionally afk and/or uses mobs/loot to avoid being kicked that it is a reportable offense. Just make sure you file the report before you leave the duty.

And to those that will challenge that: it is a very clear violation of section 3.2 of the user agreement. You're playing party content and effectively forcing the remaining players to play without the person(s) partaking in this deplorable act. Doesn't matter if they can clear without the person(s) or not. The fact that you're refusing to ether perform the duty or leave is also barring other players from completing the content for whatever reason.

tl;dr - do at your own risk. people can and should report all violators before exiting the duty server for GMs to dish out appropriate punishment.

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As someone that had a GM respond me to for not looting to avoid a kick and pulling mobs as a tank.

Based off the questions they ask you can easily talk your way out of them. Sorry group chat is turned off, and oops I always forget about the loot since I no longer need anything I sort of zone out.

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Originally Posted by ZedxKayn

Think about the tank's feelings!

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Sticks and Stones may break my bones.
But no armour is thick enough to protect my feelings.

I know it doesn't rhyme.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It's not a problem. You know why? Because you were able to clear.

You take issue with someone being carried, but the problem with that is they could just unsync most content and get "carried" that way anyway. So what does it matter?

It's only a problem if it's preventing you from clearing the fight. It's only preventing you clearing the fight... if everyone wipes. If everyone doesn't wipe, then obviously the fight isn't difficult enough to require this "lazy" tank.

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I swear, ffxiv is the only game I know where people will actively defend strangers AFKing in content while others play the game for them and get them rewards. I don't see this type of mentality anywhere else.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It's not a problem. You know why? Because you were able to clear.

You take issue with someone being carried, but the problem with that is they could just unsync most content and get "carried" that way anyway. So what does it matter?

It's only a problem if it's preventing you from clearing the fight. It's only preventing you clearing the fight... if everyone wipes. If everyone doesn't wipe, then obviously the fight isn't difficult enough to require this "lazy" tank.

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I wish they would put enrage timers on all non-savage content regularly again to prevent Balmung mentality like this.

This is also why players with this mentality can't cut the mustard in real end-game content.

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Originally Posted by technole

I wish they would put enrage timers on all non-savage content regularly again to prevent Balmung mentality like this.

This is also why players with this mentality can't cut the mustard in real end-game content.

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They probably don’t give a hoot about said end-game content.

I have played games where people would get kicked for no apparent reason . and i am sure that would happen here as well. People can get elitist attitudes ,

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

True those should be added too. No reason to not have a kick feature for those who AFK or DC on purpose. We had a tank the other day DC on start of DR only to come back during the duty and see we were at the 4th boss, leave again and then return once more for the last boss. Party kicked him from the party but he was still in the instance.

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this just happened now to my party in Delubrum. player went offline on the start and came back at the final. nobody tell about kicking them but when they came back i was like ugh. how it is possible to be offline and then miraculously come back after 40 min back just when final boss having 10percent of health ? o.o

If you would get kicked mid combat you could report the **** out of that group and they would get banned if there was no good reason for the kick.
It would be nice if they'd decrease the loot timers at least in old alliances, nobody needs 3 minutes to roll there..

Because that can be abused, get kicked out on boss 0.1% and steal loots.

I’m to new to the game to really comment on this but wouldn’t adding the ability to kick during combat also allow kicking those who wish to watch cut scenes?

I love watching the scenes, I do try to be conscious of others and skip a lot of the scenes for the sake of other players time. That said, I’d hate to be kicked for watching a cut scene. It happened in wow so you could only watch if it was a guild run and they where ok with watching those things.

A reason for 'no kick during combat': griefing.

It's the perfect griefing tool. When that kick comes up in combat, are you going to ignore it, or click on it? Do you do so automatically, paying no attention to who/what/where? You bet you do.

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Originally Posted by Wolwosh

It can be a problem actually. We had a person afk in the second Nier raid on the second boss during the fight, and guess who got the line stack AOE, aimed it at the other group and killed a whole bunch of people in the alliance? ^^"
A lot of people are somehow okay with this kind of behaviour, because a lot of the time people will actually say no to the votekick, even when you say this person has been afk for the last 2 fights.
They sometimes even port in as well after the 15 seconds message, to indeed not get kicked for not being active, but will get mechanics that way.

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It might surprise you.. but someone is allowed to vote no on a votekick, even if you don't agree.

Honestly the amount of fear of griefing does not seem to line up with the narrative of gcbtw.

Something seems off. :P

I think they should add a form of contribution system , similar to how fates and Limit break has a contribution system . Not exactly how you currently contribute to them both ,but contribute none the less.

So for prae and castrum if you were to just set yourself on follow , or do nothing at all, then once the final boss is done and exp is awarded you get little to nothing .
It needn't be a dps or heals done/damage taken lookup , perhaps the detection method would be that you are actively using skills against enemies , perhaps a fairly reasonable amount decided by the devs as passable that you are active in the duty , so as not to alienate some people that may not be very fast with spell usage, which happens .

A skills used per checkpoint method so to speak.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Honestly the amount of fear of griefing does not seem to line up with the narrative of gcbtw.

Something seems off it is as off. :P

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Perhaps it's because you assume everybody who disagrees with you believes it's a "Great Community By The Way", and you use that phrase like a curse word?

There is no such narrative coming from Square Enix, but it sure comes up a lot by folks with a, shall we say, less than generous view toward other players.

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

I think they should add a form of contribution system , similar to how fates and Limit break has a contribution system . Not exactly how you currently contribute to them both ,but contribute none the less.

So for prae and castrum if you were to just set yourself on follow , or do nothing at all, then once the final boss is done and exp is awarded you get little to nothing .
It needn't be a dps or heals done/damage taken lookup , perhaps the detection method would be that you are actively using skills against enemies , perhaps a fairly reasonable amount decided by the devs as passable that you are active in the duty , so as not to alienate some people that may not be very fast with spell usage, which happens .

A skills used per checkpoint method so to speak.

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And how, exactly, would this get reported to the player? Does it provide valuable feedback, or is it simply another method of discriminating others (as in, you only got Bronze in this instance! What were you possibly thinking?! Git gud!)? Would you then ask for a screenshot of such a report in order to join a party? How is this any different from providing a Personal Parser?

FATEs give you a 'medal' based on the amount of time you spend in the FATE, as well as the number of mobs you help take out. It's their way of letting you know that "You joined the FATE with 30 seconds to go and killed 3 mobs ... you get a silver medal and 900 XP".

Limit breaks are not broken down into "who did what, when". It is not meant as a 'ruler' to show how much you've contributed in getting from trash mob A to Boss Z. You can auto-attack and still contribute to the Limit Break in an instance.

I suspect that if you've missed every single Boss fight in Castrum/Praetorium, someone would notice and force a vote-kick, so that reason is out. Same for someone setting themselves on follow. They'll be dead somewhere around the next mass mob pull. Notice they never rez, or rez them and the 'follow' no longer applies. Force a vote-kick. Rinse. Repeat.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

Perhaps it's because you assume everybody who disagrees with you believes it's a "Great Community By The Way", and you use that phrase like a curse word?

There is no such narrative coming from Square Enix, but it sure comes up a lot by folks with a, shall we say, less than generous view toward other players.

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To be fair I use it as a meme that it is. I am the type if player that would gladly use and abuse an in combat vote kick feature. I do not buy into the hype of FFXIV community because end of the day human nature is human nature no one is above that.

Though not 100% certain what you mean by disagrees with me believes it is a great community. I have no issue with people disagreeing with me hell I welcome it. Also I do not think anyone who disagrees with me feels it is a great community. What I am saying is if FFXIV community was as great as many like to shape it SE would not have to restrict tools and features that are ripe for abuse. Thus why I find the meme funny, because you have people say what a great and friendly community we have then when act pops up nope cannot have that since it will be abused. In the end I just find that funny cause if the community was as great and mature as many like to frame it the few minority of players that would abuse the feature should not matter since according to many such things are not common occurrences.

In the end sure it will be abused but let its be real that are what GM are for.

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Originally Posted by MiniTofu

Because that can be abused, get kicked out on boss 0.1% and steal loots.

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Outriders endgame its there to prove it! Its happens exactly as you saying!

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

And how, exactly, would this get reported to the player?.

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I think it would be best that it wouldn't should a system be introduced. Bar the patch notes of its introduction.

As for the actual contribution to receive the XP you normally get , as I said , the devs would need to decide what is considered participating , and as I said , I would expect them to make it quite lenient for you to get the regular xp , and only those that think its OK to leech by not contributing at all , or only at the very end of a roulette would be penalised with reduced xp rewards for their poor effort.

I imagine it would be tricky to implement but it would be interesting to hear their thoughts on non contributing players in roulette's , on one of their dev talks, if they were ever to consider doing something like it.

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Originally Posted by Awha

I am the type if player that would gladly use and abuse an in combat vote kick feature.

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What a thing to admit to


How does one become so miserable when playing a multiplayer game to a point that you would purposefully be an malicious nuisance to others in your group.

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

What a thing to admit to


How does one become so miserable when playing a multiplayer game to a point that you would purposefully be an malicious nuisance to others in your group.

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You are mistaken I am far from miserable I just put the enjoyment of myself and those close to me above everyone else. I generally view randoms in a game as nothing more then named NPC's.

I am just honest with myself and those around me I generally do not care much about the enjoyment of others I do not know if it comes at the expense of my own enjoyment and those close to me.

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Originally Posted by Awha

You are mistaken I am far from miserable I just put the enjoyment of myself and those close to me above everyone else. I generally view randoms in a game as nothing more then named NPC's.

I am just honest with myself and those around me I generally do not care much about the enjoyment of others I do not know if it comes at the expense of my own enjoyment and those close to me.

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maybe a single player game fits better for your style. if you enjoy prejudice others players, thinks theyre npc or tools, theres a word for this: selfish.

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Originally Posted by Fellgon

maybe a single player game fits better for your style.

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I play many types of games.

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Originally Posted by Awha

You are mistaken I am far from miserable I just put the enjoyment of myself and those close to me above everyone else. I generally view randoms in a game as nothing more then named NPC's.

I am just honest with myself and those around me I generally do not care much about the enjoyment of others I do not know if it comes at the expense of my own enjoyment and those close to me.

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Honest with yourself about what ?

If you care so little about people out of your line of sight , at the expense of others enjoyment , or even your own, are you really lying to yourself ? Have you tried to convince yourself to be this heartless , is just you being you , rather than succumbing to poor mental health?

That sounds quite like a personality disorder , of which there are many . Its is unhealthy to enjoy or pursue doing negative things for the benefit of your peers and to the detriment of strangers who many be directly or indirectly involved with you even momentarily.


Take break from these forums at the very least . Seek some medical advice , and I dont mean that in a derogatory way.

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

Honest with yourself about what ?

If you care so little about people out of your line of sight , at the expense of others enjoyment , or even your own, are you really lying to yourself ? Have you tried to convince yourself to be this heartless , is just you being you , rather than succumbing to poor mental health?

That sounds quite like a personality disorder , of which there are many . Its is unhealthy to enjoy or pursue doing negative things for the benefit of your peers and to the detriment of strangers who many be directly or indirectly involved with you even momentarily.


Take break from these forums at the very least . Seek some medical advice , and I dont mean that in a derogatory way.

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You are saying it is wrong to maximize the happiness and enjoyment of myself and those around me? What reason do I have to care about the enjoyment of faceless beings I will most likely never meet or have any desire of meeting?

Yes, I do have ASPD I am being honest with those around me generally people know exactly where I stand. I personally view it is unhealthy to pay any mind how others perceive or think of your actions end of the day if person is willing to live with the consequences of their actions that is all that matters in my opinion.

Though people tell me I should care about others that I have no interest in caring about but no one has really ever gave a compelling reason outside it is the right thing to do. Right by maybe your and others standards but my own I really only care about what I care about. Not to say I do not think people should live by my standard they should live by what ever standard they feel most comfortable just be ready to live with the consequences of your actions. That is how I go about things.

Personally I do not have the headspace or desire to care about so many people, I get others do but for me it is generally not worth it.

I saw this when it was initially made and didn't really care about it but a simple solution is: Allow for queueing the vote kick during combat and loot. So you are allowed to initiate the kick but not allowed to vote until combat and loot is rolled.

This way it doesn't feel like you're fighting everyone in your party to click the kick before someone opens a chest or hits something.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

Because it would be far too easy to kick players who have done nothing wrong during the last boss to hog all the loot to yourself.

From the sound of things, not everyone agreed with you that the tank was leeching.

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I'm so tired of this attitude in the playerbase - as if everyone is so eager to abuse mechanics, and, concurrently, that there aren't bad apples out there, every day, making life obnoxious for everyone. There's this wrongheaded notion that we should all just carry these people who are guiltlessly griefing the entire community because the alternative is 'mean.'

Well, I'd prefer mean to stupid any day.

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

Honest with yourself about what ?

If you care so little about people out of your line of sight , at the expense of others enjoyment , or even your own, are you really lying to yourself ? Have you tried to convince yourself to be this heartless , is just you being you , rather than succumbing to poor mental health?

That sounds quite like a personality disorder , of which there are many . Its is unhealthy to enjoy or pursue doing negative things for the benefit of your peers and to the detriment of strangers who many be directly or indirectly involved with you even momentarily.


Take break from these forums at the very least . Seek some medical advice , and I dont mean that in a derogatory way.

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Just...let this one go. Trust me, it's for the best. Having had this sort of debate with them before it's really not worth the headache it induces.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Just...let this one go. Trust me, it's for the best. Having had this sort of debate with them before it's really not worth the headache it induces.

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In truth I do not understand why how I treat others is even a concern of others. Cause the reality is I doubt many really care much about others outside of their personal scope or think how their actions may negatively impact those around them in the future.

:P

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Originally Posted by TeraRamis

I'm so tired of this attitude in the playerbase - as if everyone is so eager to abuse mechanics, and, concurrently, that there aren't bad apples out there, every day, making life obnoxious for everyone. There's this wrongheaded notion that we should all just carry these people who are guiltlessly griefing the entire community because the alternative is 'mean.'

Well, I'd prefer mean to stupid any day.

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Who's saying everyone is eager to abuse game systems? Not me.

But I'm not going to act stupid and deny that it doesn't happen. I've seen it happen many times over the years I've been playing MMOs (one memorable occasion in WoW the raid leader disbanded the raid just as the boss hit 1% and the dots already on the boss would be enough to kill it). It's another one of those "it's why we can't have nice things situations" - there are enough untrustworthy players that developers have to put restrictions on everyone so those few have less opportunity to abuse the rest.

Laws and rules exists because some, not all, choose to abuse things for their selfish personal benefit at cost to others. Societies over the centuries have found that's not a good thing to allow and so laws/rules get created. Those who do the right thing are rarely negatively impacted and they've got protection when faced with those who choose to do the wrong thing.

If someone has been griefing your party, then initiate the vote kick as soon as combat has stopped. You've got a brief period after a wipe on a trial/raid boss to accomplish this. As long as the vote gets initiated before combat starts back up, others can cast their vote after it begins (I have seen the vote kick pass after the boss gets pulled).

If the rest of the group doesn't want to kick the troublemaker, then leave the group. I've done that myself on a few occasions. It's not worth the headache of sticking around and it's not like I'm going to lose my only chance to do the content.

I don't like part where have to wait so many minutes before can kick them. Had duty start and guy instantly logged out and we couldn't kick him think for 5 minutes.

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Originally Posted by Awha

In truth I do not understand why how I treat others is even a concern of others. Cause the reality is I doubt many really care much about others outside of their personal scope or think how their actions may negatively impact those around them in the future.

:P

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I hope you do eventually learn to because all I see is that you are reinforcing your strong self belief that nobody cares that much because you currently dont.

Stay safe

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Just...let this one go. Trust me, it's for the best. Having had this sort of debate with them before it's really not worth the headache it induces.

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I dont mind. To their credit at least they were open about having some form of disorder spectrum and engaged in somewhat regular commentary.

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

I dont mind. To their credit at least they were open about having some form of disorder spectrum and engaged in somewhat regular commentary.

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I have problems with it.

Crutching on disorders bothers me. Had a FC leader that claimed a disorder and jumped on anyone that disagreed with them. About ANYTHING.

I have bipolar disorder myself. I don't use it as an excuse when I'm having an incident that affects others, I accept my consequences. It takes considerable effort sometimes but I can, in fact, manage to not do something that affects others when my moods swing.

If I'm feeling particularly asocial, I avoid people. Id rather avoid people than be an ass to them.

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Originally Posted by Imora

I have problems with it.

Crutching on disorders bothers me. Had a FC leader that claimed a disorder and jumped on anyone that disagreed with them. About ANYTHING.

I have bipolar disorder myself. I don't use it as an excuse when I'm having an incident that affects others, I accept my consequences. It takes considerable effort sometimes but I can, in fact, manage to not do something that affects others when my moods swing.

If I'm feeling particularly asocial, I avoid people. Id rather avoid people than be an ass to them.

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I dont have a problem with discussing it with the poster is what I meant. It also bugs me when I see people seemingly gloating about being shit to others.

I also understand your situation . I myself have struggled with varying degrees of personality disorder for many years. There was a point in my life not so long ago that I nearly lost everything including my home and my life. Despair is a terrible thing , but nothing is worse than pity and self loathing and I swam in it.

You're like me regarding keeping my self away when its a better idea to do so. I would rather not be an arse to others either , and I could if I didn't monitor myself become extremely aggressive if agitated by menial things, especially when I was sleep deprived which happened a lot to me.


It took a very amazing person to show me that I was worth something and she helped me climb out of the hole I was in. She passed away last year but she will always be there to help me in my thoughts.

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Originally Posted by Imora

I have problems with it.

Crutching on disorders bothers me. Had a FC leader that claimed a disorder and jumped on anyone that disagreed with them. About ANYTHING.

I have bipolar disorder myself. I don't use it as an excuse when I'm having an incident that affects others, I accept my consequences. It takes considerable effort sometimes but I can, in fact, manage to not do something that affects others when my moods swing.

If I'm feeling particularly asocial, I avoid people. Id rather avoid people than be an ass to them.

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That is the thing I do not use it as an excuse I accept my consequences of my actions I just do not care if my actions have a negative impact on random people around me. Sure if it is not an inconvenience to me I will be helpful but the moment it becomes inconvenient for myself or those around me well yeah I will do what leads to the best/ more enjoyable outcome.

Not wanting to conform to a social norm or status quo is not using it as a crutch I welcome the consequences of my actions I do not do something I will regret or get upset if I get in trouble I stand by my actions. Generally speaking I just do not by my "disorder" as a problem that needs fixing I go to therapy but I am happiest when I accept who and what I am and not trying to fit in with others.

I mean by in large generally speaking I am not considered a harm to others mainly because I value my own amotomy and my own sense of self preservation is paramount. Though as a joke with my therapist if murder ever becomes legal they best run. :P

End of the day my value my own self and what makes me happy over others I welcome this makes me a "bad" person the eyes of many and I am okay with that. Sure I do not have many friends because of my mindset but I am okay with the view I have.

What happened to the days of playing a game as a game and having fun. All of you are stressed for no reason. Everyone needs to chill and be laid back lol

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Why you can't kick people in combat?

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Answer:

If it can be abused or misused..it will be.

Lalafel players all have some type of dark secret behind their ears it seems.

Allow us to go, penalty-free, 5 minutes into the duty's countdown. We shouldn't be forced to do more than giving groups a fair chance.
If there's not enough progress made in 5 minutes to make us want to stay, then let us go free.