The HORRENDOUS State of Housing

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

How about you take that cancerous elitist attitude elsewhere? Maybe WoW, I hear that's for children.

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How about we go back to before the rng timer where your only chance to get a house is to buy it to a RMT for 10 times its price?

Adults don't complain about not getting a house in a video games either so you can join him wherever he goes.

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Originally Posted by Kamome-chan

How about we go back to before the rng timer where your only chance to get a house is to buy it to a RMT for 10 times its price?

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Hasn't stopped RMT or abusive house flipping sales. They've simply removed it from the private sales category to the FC category and what's worse is that they allow these people weeks if not months of exclusivity when it comes to buying houses while those wanting a private have to sit and wait and hope there are houses left when they finally open them up for private sales.

You can be sure these FC sellers aren't clicking on placards for hours with 20 other people. They simply walk up to the placard during the period of FC only purchases and buy it.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Hasn't stopped RMT or Abusive selling. They've simply removed it from the private sales category to the FC category and what's worse is that they allow these people weeks if not months of exclusivity when it comes to buying houses while those wanting a private have to sit and wait and hope there are hoses left when they finally open them for private sales.

You can be sure these FC sellers are clicking on placards for hours with 20 other people. They simply walk up to the placard during the period of FC only purchases and buy it.

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You can get a house now its not perfect but it's way better.

And maybe its an issue in NA but in EU I've never seen that.

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Originally Posted by Kamome-chan

You can get a house now its not perfect but it's way better.

And maybe its an issue in NA but in EU I've never seen that.

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I have a house and on more than one server. I'm not in the race but the current system needs reform not only from a timer perspective but they need to stop these FC sales and empowering of those who buy entire wards. There is no reason a timer needs to be 12 hours or more or that FC's should have more than a week to buy a house when new houses are released to the community.

This took place during the FC exclusivity period in the 3 new wards on Spriggan in the EU when what private purchases had to wait like 3 months before they had a chance. You can be sure that person didn't have to compete by clicking a placard. They simply walked up to the plot and purchased it outright.

https://i.imgur.com/2jopshK.png

This is a super old topic of debate. I'm not going to repeat all the stuff that has been said over and over again in similar threads.

On the other hand I'll say this :
- Housing in ff14 has a pvp connotation, getting a house is only as hard as the other players want to make it for you. It's meant to be a challenge, it's meant to reward people who put more time/effort than others. (Raffles wouldn't work, in part, because of this). So if you want to make worthwhile suggestions, it'll have to be a system that statistically rewards players who spend more time than other players while also allowing people that have jobs and lives to come on and have a chance of getting lucky. This eliminates raffles, it eliminates turnins as those would exclusively benefit hard core players and push away more casual players. There's no easy solution here (no instanced housing is not a solution either)
- You may be doing it wrong if you got sniped by a relocation. Your first house should almost always be a small plot in goblet and/or mist. If you spent 16h in a lavender bed or shirogane ward, you set yourself up to get sniped. It's not to say that nobody ever gets their first house there, but you should know going in that you'll be forfeiting that time more often than not.
- Housing as it stands in FF14 is a fight of attrition. It's not something you should bash your head against. It's about using your time wisely, not quantitatively. Currently, demo timers are off, so simply don't house hunt. Do other stuff and wait a few months for the timers to go back up. Make sure you come on when they turn timers on again and make sure you log in 45 days after that as well. You'll get another chance after that when Ishgard hits as well. The most successful people with housing are smart about it and play the game over large periods of time instead of hitting their head against it day in and day out.

Yeah, It only has that PvP connotation BECAUSE of the hidden timer that forces people to mash for 12 hours and pray a bot doesn't show up (like what happened to me three times this weekend alone). Or a transfer after 16 hours or waiting. Sorry to say but you have been jaded to just accept the BS "system" that is its current state. You cannot even begin to say that its not 100% RNG based already because of the hidden timer. There is literally no skill involved it that, pure luck. Spending more time does not equal privilege to SE that is obvious as they would have implemenetd a reward system based on proximity or interaction time with available placards (also a bad idea).

Raffles ARE, IN FACT the best and only realistic solution. Random entry time, 1 entry per person, eliminates all benefits from using bots and script programs therefore destroying them.

I would LOVE TO be picky as to which ward I spend my time in but seeing as there are no more than 2 houses available at any given time, that is a luxury that I do not have. Not to mention somebody "misclicked" and "accidentally transferred back to the plot they were just at to buy time for their FC mate who spent all night botting (while I sat there clicking). He eventually got caught and left without issue.

The last bit you contradict yourself. First you say "It's meant to be a challenge, it's meant to reward people who put more time/effort than others." And now you are saying "It's not something you should bash your head against. It's about using your time wisely, not quantitatively." Literally exact opposites.

We are going to have to agree to disagree as again I sense you are simply jaded by the current system and really don't care. Irregardless the "system" in place NEEDS to be readdressed; or even addressed at all. They just seem content on doing NOTHING in hopes the Firmament will solve the issue (assuming its going to be housing). Heres my point, even IF it is and after that the other 4 districts will still be having this issue to which a raffle system will not only correct, but is easy to implement, kills botters, and LETS PEOPLE PLAY THE DAMN GAME!

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

I have a house and on more than one server. I'm not in the race but the current system needs reform not only from a timer perspective but they need to stop these FC sales and empowering of those who buy entire wards. There is no reason a timer needs to be 12 hours or more or that FC's should have more than a week to buy a house when new houses are released to the community.

This took place during the FC exclusivity period in the 3 new wards on Spriggan in the EU when what private purchases had to wait like 3 months before they had a chance. You can be sure that person didn't have to compete by clicking a placard. They simply walked up to the plot and purchased it outright.

https://i.imgur.com/2jopshK.png

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Were you even there? During that time, all other wards were already mostly empty. Also FC exclusivity posed little problem when you can simply buy a plot in any of the other wards with NO TIMER and max devalued price and simply relocate in wards 19-21, which there were already personals there. This was during a time when mediums and larges were still open and at max devalued prices.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Right, but we shouldn't want to replace an RNG based system with an RNG based system. That doesn't solve the underlying issue which is supply vs demand.

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The issue that many people have is that spending upwards of double digit hours spam clicking on a placard only to either lose the RNG house buy to someone that showed up 20 minutes prior, or to have someone just up and relocate there before anyone can even manually buy the house, is both frustrating to no end and soul crushing when you've been at it for weeks/months/years on end. I would be completely fine with a raffle, even as someone that's notorious among her friend group for having atrociously bad luck. At least then I wouldn't want to off myself because of how tedious clicking on a placard for hours on end is.

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

Yeah, It only has that PvP connotation BECAUSE of the hidden timer that forces people to mash for 12 hours and pray a bot doesn't show up (like what happened to me three times this weekend alone). Or a transfer after 16 hours or waiting. Sorry to say but you have been jaded to just accept the BS "system" that is its current state. You cannot even begin to say that its not 100% RNG based already because of the hidden timer. There is literally no skill involved it that, pure luck. Spending more time does not equal privilege to SE that is obvious as they would have implemenetd a reward system based on proximity or interaction time with available placards (also a bad idea).

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It was always pvp based, even before the timer even existed. It's part of the original design and it's that way because there are more players than plots. The timer is a recent addition that really didn't make this anymore pvp than it was before. If anything it fixed quite a few issues in the previous system

Also, that's not how RNG works. If you have a 1% chance of getting heads on an unbalanced coin, flipping it 100 times will give you more chances of getting heads than someone who flips 5 times. AKA: The more time spent on the system > the higher your chance of getting something. Thus it's not completely random, effort and time spent are a big component (not to mention that there are different strategies but more on that later)

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

The last bit you contradict yourself. First you say "It's meant to be a challenge, it's meant to reward people who put more time/effort than others." And now you are saying "It's not something you should bash your head against. It's about using your time wisely, not quantitatively." Literally exact opposites.

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I'm saying that you can optimize your time and increase your odds. This in no way contradicts the fact that the more time you spend the better your odds. It's a comment on the quality of time spent vs the quantity. Think of it this way: (these numbers are fictional, to illustrate), there are strategies where getting a house has a 0.1% probability (say just coming online for a couple of hours and clicking a random placard in shirogane), strategies where it has a 10% probability (staying 16h on a small plot clicking nonstop with no breaks in the goblet), and strategies with a 30% probability (logging in on key times when demo timers are set up again and sitting the full 16h on a small goblet plot clicking nonstop). Someone who does ALL the above has a greater chance at a plot than someone who only does part of it. But if you're smart with your time you'll do something else while you wait for the demo timers to get back up and then use your time wisely there.

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

We are going to have to agree to disagree as again I sense you are simply jaded by the current system and really don't care. Irregardless the "system" in place NEEDS to be readdressed; or even addressed at all. They just seem content on doing NOTHING in hopes the Firmament will solve the issue (assuming its going to be housing). Heres my point, even IF it is and after that the other 4 districts will still be having this issue to which a raffle system will not only correct, but is easy to implement, kills botters, and LETS PEOPLE PLAY THE DAMN GAME!

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I'm not jaded, I'm just pointing out that devs have been extremely consistent with their housing goals over the past 6 years. Housing plot numbers are roughly equivalent to 25-50% of server population depending on how busy your server is. They want it to be limited and they seem to be ok with people fighting it out and it being a status symbol. It's not only normal for some people to feel left out but it's also both expected AND a measure of the feature's success when people complain in the forums about it in the sense that people obviously want in on a limited feature.. Working as intended, just not how you want.

I've been pretty vocal about a few things regarding housing: 1) if you're going to complain about the system, your best bet is to explain why limited housing is a bad mechanic, not that it's "too hard" to get a house since that was the point in the first place and you'll likely be ignored by anyone who matters. 2) if you offer alternatives they should follow the same design as the original system if you want easy adoption by the devs. 3) The placard spamming IS a horrible mechanic and it should be switched around to have plots unlock every 20mn on the hour so that people can do stuff in-between. (as a hotfix at least).

If you want an in-between, a raffle where you can add another entry every 10-20mn would be roughly equivalent. People who spend more time get more opportunities to land the house. This wouldn't change much compared to my suggestion above, it essentially just removes any quick menu clicking requirements, and gives more of a fighting chance to those who only show up for 2 hours, but that's about it. I expect this to be better on player psyches though since people generally understand why they would lose a lottery but not why they would lose at placard clicking.

I just want instanced housing, one per account. Obviously two things that are never gonna happen from the way this game is structured. At least until SE gets to that "remastered/overhaul" phase many mmos go through and even then, I'm still not holding my breath up, simply because the topic is polarized AF. You got a good chunk of peeps who wouldn't give up on open world housing no matter how much gil you paid them and then, there's everyone else. Since the former is already established, I just don't see changes coming to this system.

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Originally Posted by EaMett

It was always pvp based, even before the timer even existed.

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I don’t agree that this was the intent. Originally the price was obscenely expensive and there were huge requirements to purchase a house (minimum number of members or some such). SE originally made this with the intent that only FCs with large groups of players could ever afford a house (larges going for as much as 500,000,000 gil for example).

So it wasn’t that it was pvp, it was that they listened to the player base and reduced the prices, then listened to people whine about personal housing..so they opened it up to individuals.

They built a system intended to be X and tried to make it do Y, which it was never originally intended to do.

Moreover, it’s not a pvp thing so much as dumb luck. I’ve 3 houses (1 large, 2 S) and spent maybe 15 minutes total trying to get them. I just got stupidly lucky.

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Originally Posted by kaynide

I don’t agree that this was the intent. Originally the price was obscenely expensive and there were huge requirements to purchase a house (minimum number of members or some such). SE originally made this with the intent that only FCs with large groups of players could ever afford a house (larges going for as much as 500,000,000 gil for example).

So it wasn’t that it was pvp, it was that they listened to the player base and reduced the prices, then listened to people whine about personal housing..so they opened it up to individuals.

They built a system intended to be X and tried to make it do Y, which it was never originally intended to do.

Moreover, it’s not a pvp thing so much as dumb luck. I’ve 3 houses (1 large, 2 S) and spent maybe 15 minutes total trying to get them. I just got stupidly lucky.

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There were no membership requirements. A single player leading 8 FCs on the same server could have theoretically purchased a mansion on every character. The PvP aspect was there from the start since FCs looking to purchase specific plots would resort to bluff, trash talking, attrition wars and general f***ery on the marketboard in order to prevent other FCs from being the first one to show up to the desired placard with the required funds. They didn't lower the prices because players complained about the prices, they lowered the prices because they said personal housing would be a lot more affordable and different than FC housing. Except it didn't turn out to be a different system and here we are.

Tbh, owning a house is not that exciting. You have sort of a hub, where you can do repairs, retainers, gardening etc, etc. But aside from that? It just exists.

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Originally Posted by EaMett

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It has never been PVP intended.

At the release if was FCs only and pretty expensive. Not more, not less. And the number of wards was accurate.

People were complaing it was too expensive and they dropped prices. Even after this drop, a lot of plots were still available. And seeing people who were asking individual housing, they opened it to individuals. At this time I managed to get a mansion rather easily since the prices were dropping and a lot of slots were available. According to Y-P, neither timer nor even the possibility to lose house were planned.

BUT because of a sudden rise of demand and some abuses, they changed the system. The other problem is the gardens that make wards heavy to load.

In this thread, you have a pretty accurate summarize of what happened. https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...YOU-a-Question.

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Originally Posted by Eldevern

It has never been PVP intended.

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Yes it was.

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Originally Posted by Eldevern

At the release if was FCs only and pretty expensive. Not more, not less. And the number of wards was accurate.

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The only valid thing in here beyond the very last sentence of your post.

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Originally Posted by Eldevern

People were complaing it was too expensive and they dropped prices. Even after this drop, a lot of plots were still available. And seeing people who were asking individual housing, they opened it to individuals. At this time I managed to get a mansion rather easily since the prices were dropping and a lot of slots were available. According to Y-P, neither timer nor even the possibility to lose house were planned.

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Of course people complained, they always do. FC housing was the pinnacle of teamwork and players did what they had to do regardless of the price displayed on the placard. The prices didn't drop because players complained, they dropped because Yoshi Pizza went on the record and stated that personal housing was coming and it was gonna be different than FC housing along with being cheaper. Saying that there were a lot of plots when the price reduction hit or that buying a mansion was anything but easy is a blatant lie as only 1 ward was added with patch 2.3 and then 2 with patch 2.38 for a grand total of 8 wards (3 areas). Unless of course, you're one of those on barren servers with 20 players in Limsa Lominsa during prime time, but you didn't specify.

Patch 2.4 is when they added subdivisions to address the demand for personal housing. Get your facts straight.

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Originally Posted by Eldevern

BUT because of a sudden rise of demand and some abuses, they changed the system. The other problem is the gardens that make wards heavy to load.

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No, there was no "sudden rise of demand" and you'd have to explain what you mean by abuse, because it's pretty difficult to abuse something that ultimately takes your money. You would also have to explain what you're talking about when it comes to making changes to the system, because nothing in that sentence made any sense. Auto demolition? Temporary restrictions?

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Originally Posted by Eldevern

In this thread, you have a pretty accurate summarize of what happened. https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...YOU-a-Question.

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Yeah, it's pretty accurate, unlike your story.

If you have a limited resource that players compete for then it's pvp. It doesn't matter whichever way you twist it. If the limited resource isn't available free plots, it's desired locations, desired wards. etc. etc.
Reality is that if you buy a plot, that plot is no longer available to other players > pvp.

The model has changed over the years, from a first come first serve to a more RNG based model. But it was always a pvp system.

your sub is not enough to maintain the housing server, thats real

Dude u should have been here back in the day, compared to what u guys got now, back in the day was the golden years.

I got a shirogane small for 3 mil cause some chick got bored of being a house owner and we negotiated a deal fair to us both, the days when u drop a house and sell it or drop it and someone could come by and buy right then and there was the good days of ffxiv housing, still had the not enough housing problem and there were times people were dicks and overcharged but from the experienced and I've been through they were way better then what u guys deal with today.

Only good new housing system is were they lock private house to your account, I feel for ya cause I been trying to help some friends get property in this new system but haven't been able to do so.

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Originally Posted by Yshtola

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1. I've always been of Cerberus with my main since the Beta (the most populated non-legacy EU server).

2. There is some kind of contradiction to admit the number of wards were accurate to pretend it was PVP intended after.
There is also some kind of contradiction to consider it was PVP intended when the prices were dropping regularly because of unsufficient demand (it be because of poorness or not).
You have nobody to fight to get the money, it is only a personal investment of time. Everything else is pure luck. RNG is not PVP, is just some arbitrary. You can blind yourself and call that a reward, it is not. There's nothing to be proud of, nothing that means as work or effort, no merit at all, nothing to be praised for.

3. It was not PVP intended since when it was FCs only the real purpose was : gil sink (since some legacy players were already really rich), team work to get the money (since, it is, you know, a MMO).

Later, it was not PVP, it was just a broken, quick and dirty way to reply to the demand for individual housing.

And I will insist about that fact it was not PVP since the real effort was not to compete with other players but to be able to play as team. Considering how it ended, it's a pure fail for most players and FCs.

PVP, team work. Sorry you failed. RNG is not a reward. You have no merit.

It was not PVP but team work challenge and now, it's a lottery.

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

This idea was throwing around in my head and I do like it. The only downside is that instanced housing would fell really empty. TBF the housing already feels empty so not much of a loss I suppose.

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Actually, instanced housing could feel LESS empty:

1. Eliminate the multiple wards, which separate players between them.
2. Instance the plots themselves, so each one can have hundreds of owners. This would result in many more players running about in the streets.

For visiting, you select which owner's contents to show on the plot via the placard. This could also be used to customize the appearance of your immediate neighborhood. Each player could lock up to 6 plot appearances around their own house if they wish. The rest just show random contents.

Ideally, displayed / selected plots would let you see their owners out in the yards as well.

wowowow, can you imagine how hard is it to actually do that programming wise!? the server for 6 lock up for EACH player... and they all need to read the customized garden and appearance... holy hell, SE even having a hard time adding glamour plate and you ask for that?

I really hope SE realizes just adding more wards each time isn't going to fix the problem on NA servers. I'm hoping that ishgard restoration creates a ward of instanced housing for everyone which could allow people who just want houses to leave the neighborhood based housing to people who want a communal living style. So it in essence would have both types of houses in the game. Obviously their housing track record isn't the best so I'm not optimistic but I'm hoping.

As for making the house buying process a raffle, I think that would be both good and bad. It would free people up to enjoy the game and not spam placards, but I think at the same time some people prefer to keep trying the placard as it helps them feel like they're doing all they can, and taking that away could be wrong to some people. Kind of like fanfest ticket queues, in Japan they have a lottery and in the US they just have first come first served. Some people prefer the lottery and some people think first come first served will put the control more in their hands, so it's really just what do the Dev team agree with?

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Originally Posted by Eldevern

It was not PVP but team work challenge and now, it's a lottery.

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Almost as if you ignored all the valid points made up until now.

You can't stroll in and claim a mechanic isn't pvp because of either the number of participants or the enrolment into the system was low. That's not how it works.
If you design a system with a limited number of plots, where users can purchase a plot and lock other users out of it, where some plots are in favored locations and some in undesired locations. It's PVP. It doesn't matter if you have 5 million plots and two users. It doesn't matter if the plots go for 1 gil or 5 billion. It doesn't matter if you set the model to be team-based, first come first serve, or some variation of RNG.
Nobody would look at a leaderboard of players and say it isn't pvp because there are only two players when the leaderboard can accommodate for 50. It's just pvp with low adoption. Same with housing at the start.
Furthermore, a mechanic design doesn't magically shift from pve to pvp without any major rework. The fact it's pvp now is already a good indication it was pvp then. Not that this argument is even needed but lets just throw that on top for good measure.

As for the lottery comment, I've said it before and I'll say it again. The more time you spent placard clicking, the more likely you are to get a house. Period. That alone makes it different from a lottery. It doesn't matter if "Sasuke Weeb" came in at the last second and sniped your house with the power of luck, it doesn't matter if "Kistune Fox" has no arms and managed to get it with her feet and no skill. Effort is measured in time spent and upon ward release some skill. There is indeed a rng component that levels the playing field but it is not the main factor.

I'm not saying this to support the current system. I'm not saying this because I think people shouldn't argue the current system either. I'm just saying you should call a cat a cat. ESPECIALLY if your goal is to foster a conversation about changing a system the company has backed consistently for years now.

People also need to remember that at least 30% of players have access to a house in some form or another. That's a HUGE level of adoption when compared against other aspects of the game (ultimate is 5%, Eureka was something like 15% iirc, etc.).
If you're going to evangelize major changes you'll need to make an amazing case as to how SE can benefit from it more than leaving things as they are (various flavors of instanced housing for example). Because that 30% of the player base could hate the change as much as you hate the current system.
If you're aiming for minor tweaks you need to try and stick to the current flavor of the implementation (limited resource, rewards time spent with an RNG component so hardcore players don't completely lock out other players). Because that's clearly the model SE is backing at this point.

You could ignore that and just yolo your complaints. But people have been doing that for 6 years already and if you somehow think you're the chosen one about to lead your people into a new era of FF housing.. Well... I'm sorry, I wish you well but your prospects are looking grim.

PS: Used a pretty generic "you" for a good chunk of this post. Not targeting the quoted op specifically.

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Originally Posted by Renato

This is one of the best ideas I've ever heard. I lost my house 4 months ago when I unsubbed. I recently began to dabble in apartments and honestly, they really aren't that bad especially once you start utilizing the glitches. I turned a small room into what seems to be a larger, loft-style apartment with multiple rooms. And I don't have to worry about losing it if I get bored and unsub.

The two issues I have with apartments are the size and the fact that you have to use glitches to place furniture on the lofts. I feel like the apartments should offer different sizes but instead of having players just outright buy the larger rooms, (because we all know there are douchebag players will buy up EVERYTHING just because) everyone should be given the opportunity to buy the smallest apartment at 500k gil and have the option to spend more to add to renovate it. Upgrade to a medium adds a loft for another 1M gil. The largest room would be 1.5-2M. Wanna add a garden to your balcony? 200k gil.

I also feel like players should only be allowed 1 room per character on that data center. That way people aren't just making alts to buy them.

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Yep I agree and can expand the inside wouldn't have to worry about what the outside looks like.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Alts have rights too. They can't share a house so at the least they sure are welcome to buying apartments if they want to.

And relative to giving people their gil back and scrapping the housing system... I wouldn't hold your breath.

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I don't think they should, if you own a house and a private house, I believe your alternate characters should also own the very same houses that's my opinion.

Though my 1st opinion is what I think should really happen I think they should scrap housing, if everyone keeps getting emergencies which will happen they are going to shut down the auto 45 demolish off every single time this happens and people are still paying for subscriptions waiting for a house to free up it's never going to happen as long as they keep it off and like I said a emergency happens.

At this point you gotta say well it's like not having a auto demolish and the only reason people are against getting rid of it, truthfully is they don't want to see a dip in their profits because they garden someone told me before in a party he owned a lot of houses to make the GIL and doesn't care if anyone else complains about him owning houses then said you snooze you lose.

I get they just want to corner the market and not others in on a crowded Auction house to me its a bit of a greedy statement but why would I care I didn't care about housing to begin with I settled for a apt.

Just wish they would stop pushing the housing now and focus on the apt's make the insides bigger and like I said add gardening inside you'll see people giving up houses for apt's and just maybe SE will decide to scrap this whole idea.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Alts have rights too. They can't share a house so at the least they sure are welcome to buying apartments if they want to.

And relative to giving people their gil back and scrapping the housing system... I wouldn't hold your breath.

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I think allowing players to make their own alts tenants in both houses and apartments would be great. I would say make it automatic, but there is the RP factor where some people feel their characters wouldn't share things.

Can each character currently have an apartment? What about an FC rooms?

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Originally Posted by MsQi

I think allowing players to make their own alts tenants in both houses and apartments would be great. I would say make it automatic, but there is the RP factor where some people feel their characters wouldn't share things.

Can each character currently have an apartment? What about an FC rooms?

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Multi home owners at least many of them would have been happy to have one house to share. Alts can't even teleport to a mains house without jumping through hoops given you can't use friend teleport or use any of the features at the house when there. The only way to share a house with an alt at the moment is to create a small FC where they can all share it and it's features. It was mentioned they were looking at it back around 4.2 (sharing a house and friending alts) and they talked about different size apartments too Sadly nothing since then.

And yes each character (alt) can purchase an apartment and a FC room. You're only allowed one FC house and one private per account per server at the moment.

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Originally Posted by Zeonx

I don't think they should, if you own a house and a private house, I believe your alternate characters should also own the very same houses that's my opinion.

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I totally agree. Why is it my friends can share a house and my own alts can't? Makes no sense really. Many took advantage of buying homes for alts back when it was permitted because of that.

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Originally Posted by Zeonx

Just wish they would stop pushing the housing now and focus on the apt's make the insides bigger and like I said add gardening inside you'll see people giving up houses for apt's and just maybe SE will decide to scrap this whole idea.

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I think that would make many people happy and would reduce the demand significantly for private houses. Sure many want to garden but there are many who simply want to decorate and could care less about gardening. Gardening for whatever reason seems to be something they appear to not be able to do with apartments but I'm not a developer. The issue of workshops is another issue and personally I think coupling those to GC would be something they need to do just like squads are a part of a GC assets.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Multi home owners at least many of them would have been happy to have one house to share. Alts can't even teleport to a mains house without jumping through hoops given you can't use friend teleport or use any of the features at the house when there. The only way to share a house with an alt at the moment is to create a small FC where they can all share it and it's features. It was mentioned they were looking at it back around 4.2 (sharing a house and friending alts) and they talked about different size apartments too Sadly nothing since then.

And yes each character (alt) can purchase an apartment and a FC room. You're only allowed one FC house and one private per account per server at the moment.

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That's kinda how thought it was, just don't have alts with enough money to test it. :) Maybe they have someone working on the bigger apartments. It's not uncommon for feature to take a few expacs to be implemented in mmos.

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

It already is RNG based AND ping based. This idea is perfect, find 1 problem with it and I'll shoot it down.

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No. Just because you aren't able to log-on at certain times due to work, etc. or log-on quick enough does not make it RNG. The idea you are portraying IS an actual implementation of RNG.

I was going to go in a rant but then it occurred to me that for the most part an apartament is good enough, you lack the outdoor glaming, but then if you do instanced housing you would lose that too.
The other two thing you lose is gardening and chocobo stable, I wish there were some form of internal garden for apartments.

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Originally Posted by Miminming

wowowow, can you imagine how hard is it to actually do that programming wise!? the server for 6 lock up for EACH player... and they all need to read the customized garden and appearance... holy hell, SE even having a hard time adding glamour plate and you ask for that?

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It has to load all the other houses and yards now when a player arrives in the ward anyway, so is it going to make a big difference load up 6 custom ones in place of the default random yard layouts?

If you have the gil, you should be able to get a house, period.

Anything less than that is, and will ALWAYS be, unacceptable.

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

It has to load all the other houses and yards now when a player arrives in the ward anyway, so is it going to make a big difference load up 6 custom ones in place of the default random yard layouts?

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What do you think is easier: loading 30-ish plots or loading hundreds of thousands of plots * 6?

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

[*]Plot becomes available.[*]Over the next X to 24 hours (still hidden) non land owners walk up to the placard ONCE and put their name in ONCE and leave.[*]During this time any current land owner can walk up and transfer at any time thus closing the raffle (as is now).[*]A winner is decided via RNGesus (or transfer) and money is immediately taken out. If there is not enough to cover the cost their name gets removed from the pool (they get a message telling them why they didn't get the land) and another pull happens. Rinse and repeat until the purchase goes through and the raffle is closed.[*]Upon the raffle closing, everyone who didn't get picked gets a friendly letter from a Housing NPC explaining why.[/LIST]

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Uh, no.

your idea is just another layer of RNG, and it adds frustration without adding fairness.

SE added the randomness for a fair reason: bash the house sellers, while you are asking a lottery.

When someone relocate, there is a free house elsewhere, maybe not the house you wanted but inside the houses are all the same...

P.S. don't worry, when SE restarts the demolition time there will be a lot of houses free.

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Originally Posted by Ihaf_Frethyme

While I disagree with you on who should be able to get housing, I think it should be ACCT based not character based. This system allows for 1 person to own 16 houses 1 personal and 1 FC for each of their 8 characters.

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This is not entirely true. If you have 8 characters on one server only 1 of those characters can purchase an individual house. It is true that all 8 characters could buy a FC house if they are in a FC with a minimum of 4 characters. This is directly from housing plot. People do get around the minimum FC membership but it's not buying the house from the actual housing plot, it's "buying" the FC from an FC that owns a house.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

What do you think is easier: loading 30-ish plots or loading hundreds of thousands of plots * 6?

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If I am reading his idea correctly you would only be loading like 7 custom plots.

There would be a single ward map, most plots would be generic. At the placard you can choose whose plot to enter which could be hundreds. When you enter a plot then it loads.

but when you come to your plot you see your stuff, but still have the option of entering other players' plots at the placard (if they are open to guests or you are a tenant). You would have the option of deciding what you see in 6 nearby plots.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

What do you think is easier: loading 30-ish plots or loading hundreds of thousands of plots * 6?

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Even XIV's archaic predecessor, FFXI, manages to give every single character created it's own moghouse (roughly an apartment-sized floorplan), a second story, a patio, a huge garden instance and monster rearing instance. Granted how XI handles the instances isn't 100% perfect, but it does the trick just fine for an 18 year old game. Other MMOs, including some that are older, have also managed to implement instanced/phasing housing without their systems imploding.

If XIV's system truly can't handle an overhaul, then that's just what it is. But I will say that the frequent limitations in this game has made me incredibly hesitant about wanting to jump into another MMO made by SE. I realize ARR had a rather unique beginning, but that was 7 years ago now and we're still dealing with a large amount of restrictions & limitations in game (Viera/Hroth is one of the more glaring, recent examples).

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Originally Posted by EtherRose

No. Just because you aren't able to log-on at certain times due to work, etc. or log-on quick enough does not make it RNG. The idea you are portraying IS an actual implementation of RNG.

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So, Random Number Generation of seconds until it can be purchased isn't RNG? Are you sure about that?

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Originally Posted by Mr_Gyactus

Uh, no.

your idea is just another layer of RNG, and it adds frustration without adding fairness.

SE added the randomness for a fair reason: bash the house sellers, while you are asking a lottery.

When someone relocate, there is a free house elsewhere, maybe not the house you wanted but inside the houses are all the same...

P.S. don't worry, when SE restarts the demolition time there will be a lot of houses free.

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It's a layer that lets people actually play the game and kills botters. I think you need to go back and reread it. It still had the random timer, existing house owners can still transfer with out entering the raffle. People can only enter once (an idea of getting 1 additional entry when you lose a raffle but I could go either way on that). This still bashes house sellers as they USE BOTS to get houses. Again you say "no" but actually fail to give any substantial reasons why. Lots of that on here; at least you were a bit more polite about it, ty.

House destruction isn't coming back for at least a year then there's the month and a half of time it takes for the hose to actually be destroyed. I'm not holding my breath for that.