Crafting and Gathering need a QoL change asap.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

Because those things aren't actually worth anything to begin with. That's why so many people got in a tizzy with world visit because their little monopolies were in danger of being made nothing. That's the problem though, things are too expensive and everyone thinks things should sell for way more than the time or effort put into this is worth, and the reason they are expensive is because there isn't enough competition to shove down prices. And people hate competition so they are all for not improving things so more people will want to do something. It's greed. Ya'll can call me greedy for wanting everyone to not get pissed at crafting but the real reason is you guys just want to keep prices high and keep making money. Nothing is worth as much as you yourself think it is.

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"Things people make aren't worth the effort/cost ratio" but also "crafting requires way too much effort and should be made easier/simpler"??

You're still not saying what you want crafting to be, OP. Push button, receive stuff, make profit? Nah, hard pass.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

Because those things aren't actually worth anything to begin with. That's why so many people got in a tizzy with world visit because their little monopolies were in danger of being made nothing....

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Baloney. I just checked a bunch of Rakshasa items, and the prices on all worlds are not that far apart - 20% or so at most. If there were any monopoly fiefdoms on some worlds, it was because of population imbalance mostly. But what it really comes down to is that I want it to be easy for ME, not anyone else.

If everyone could make iPhones in their garage, how much would they be worth?

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Ya'll can call me greedy for wanting everyone to not get pissed at crafting but the real reason is you guys just want to keep prices high and keep making money. Nothing is worth as much as you yourself think it is.

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Things are worth what buyers decide to pay for them, nothing more than that.

The primary reason things get as expensive as they do is because many people, much like yourself apparently, cannot be bothered to put in the effort to obtain/produce it themselves.

Crafting and gathering is super easy tho.....

Honestly, the only thing about crafting that bugs me is how long it takes to mass produce stackable items like materials and infusions that are needed in large quantities.

Being able to increase the yield on stackable items by using more mats and maybe increasing the quality requirement for 100% HQ would be a really great QoL change and keep HQ mats relevant even after you've gotten the best gear.

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Honestly, the only thing about crafting that bugs me is how long it takes to mass produce stackable items like materials and infusions that are needed in large quantities.

Being able to increase the yield on stackable items by using more mats would be a really great QoL change.

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Here is an example of what an actual QoL proposal looks like, OP, if you're taking notes.

On a side note, just saw this from the last producer letter "This new quest system is based on Custom Deliveries. For instance, quest progression has been streamlined by making the required items and materials exclusive to these quests.".

Seems to me that this will kill one of the exploits (that I have used..) to level up crafters by just buying Leve turnins from the market board. Not much info there, but seems like custom deliveries will take the place of leves for 71+?

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Originally Posted by Windsun33

On a side note, just saw this from the last producer letter "This new quest system is based on Custom Deliveries. For instance, quest progression has been streamlined by making the required items and materials exclusive to these quests.".

Seems to me that this will kill one of the exploits (that I have used..) to level up crafters by just buying Leve turnins from the market board. Not much info there, but seems like custom deliveries will take the place of leves for 71+?

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Was he specifically referring to leves? We're sure he wasn't talking about crafting job quests?

git gud skrub

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

So.. are you saying it should be 1 button presses?

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It does need to be simplified a bit. Either limit the actions to maybe 10 max, or cut the ingredients to 4 or less for anything.
Many of the higher level cooking recipes take 20+ ingredients, which eat up bag space, and take hours to gather, especially if you want to make HQ stuff.

And, food items last only 30 minutes, after spending 5 hours gathering the mats for a batch of them. They should last at least an hour, and persist through death given the time it takes to craft or the extreme gil needed to buy them.

Plus, if you're at max level CUL, the buffs should last 4 hours.

Another good QoL change would be to change all the hidden items in the HW areas to be normal, as they are no longer really required and only serve to annoy people who are going through HW crafting on their way to SB/ShB content. Another huge QoL change I'd like is to be able to craft using mats stored in my retainers inventory, and some sort of menu where it can tell me what I can craft with what mats are in my inventories, and finally, something where I can select a bunch of items and it'll tell me what I need to gather in order to make them. I can do this using third party websites, but I'd love something in game.

Other than that, Crafting/Gathering is Cool and Good.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

[...] and the FACT that you need to use something from basically every other damn class to make one thing is absolutely obnoxious.

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Yeah, 90% of crafting is crafting stuff for other crafters.

Try Culinarian, it's the only crafter who is not dependant on other crafters and his buffood is actually used in real content, not just to keep other crafters busy.

There are a lot of people who love crafting in this game, and some who’s main enjoyment is from crafting/gathering and not battle stuff. I mean every part of the game can’t be for everyone. Personally I find the crafting and gathering system in this game to be so boring and tedious it just makes me want to slam my head through a brick wall, so I just don’t do it. You’ve gotten way farther than me though; I think my highest crafter on my main is at level 32. I couldn’t take any more past that lol.

I leveled every crafter to 70 through dailies that took literally zero effort the QoL changes are there if your willing to actually do them.

Leveling crafters is insanely easy between leves and daily quests. It only took about a week to for me to bring all of them from 60 to 70 during SB. Just abuse those easy multi-turn in leves for all they're worth and it goes quickly.

It's once you actually get into the high-end crafting that it starts getting rather tedious since it can take around 15 minutes just to do one piece of high-end gear due to all the materials that need to be crafted beforehand, plus you need to gather all the mats, as well.

Doesn't really surprise me that so many people resort to botting with how long crafts take to do from scratch, so I'm hoping they ease up on that somehow in ShB so legit players can actually compete with them. Doesn't matter how much stuff they craft if they make it faster then it can sell, so it would mainly benefit legit players to speed up the crafting process.

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Originally Posted by DumdogsWorld

Was he specifically referring to leves? We're sure he wasn't talking about crafting job quests?

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No idea - not much context in the quote. I guess we should find out more come Friday.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

Crafting doesn't need to be flashy, or contain so many complicated things like requiring you to have X from other crafters to make something. That isn't how crafting works anywhere...in irl or any other game.

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There is a reason I am not playing "any other game" and a big part of that reason is because I enjoy the crafting here as it is. You don't like it, I get it... but you can't expect to come here wanting something destroyed because you don't like it and expect people not to fire back.

I dont have much problem with hidden nodes and timed ones. I mean there should be at least something "harder" to crafting and gathering. What I do have a problem with is the use of all the crystal shards in each craft..I really wish they would take away with that or at least cut down the prices for it..I mean its a big source of income for those RMT bots so that would help against that too.

Otherwise I look forward to the liveletter.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

Crafting doesn't need to be flashy, or contain so many complicated things like requiring you to have X from other crafters to make something. That isn't how crafting works anywhere...in irl or any other game.

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When you cut out the rotations and the need for materials from other crafters... what's left then?

Crafting doesn't take much role in endgame content, besides buffood and potions (wich don't need materials from any other crafter btw). The gear you can craft is almost completely only good for leveling - but there are other options too like dungeon drops and buying stuff for grand company seals, tomestones once you hit level 50 / 60 / 70...

Crafting is it's own game. You craft because you like to craft and the people who buy your stuff are other crafters. Removing the rotations and demand for materials kills off crafting, because then the fun some people have with the rotations is reduced to press one button, the demand for materials is removed, so you don't have anything to craft anyway... really, like 90% of the crafting is just to keep the crafters busy, it's all fluff. Don't like it? Don't do it then, it has no point anyway.

Craft potions and buffood if you want to make something usefull without needing mats from other crafters. Make a macro to craft the stuff with 1 or 2 buttons in HQ - that's by the way exactly what I am doing >.>

There is no need to destroy the crafting-game for other people.

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Originally Posted by Tempest222

There are a lot of people who love crafting in this game, and some who’s main enjoyment is from crafting/gathering and not battle stuff. I mean every part of the game can’t be for everyone. Personally I find the crafting and gathering system in this game to be so boring and tedious it just makes me want to slam my head through a brick wall, so I just don’t do it. You’ve gotten way farther than me though; I think my highest crafter on my main is at level 32. I couldn’t take any more past that lol.

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Yeah I with you on this. I dislike crafting in most games on a good day (It's just. Boring. It's just so so boring...) but I have a cool and spicy zero interest in crafting in this game. So I... don't. I fish. But I don't craft. :p

I went from zerocrafter to omnicrafter and Goddess of the Land in about 1.5-2 months of casual playing, it's not that hard. Between the levequests, dailies, beast tribe quests and collectibles, you can level everything up even faster than this. There are guides aplenty online if you're willing to look. Crafting is its own thing, no one needs to do it unless they like it.

I'm looking forward to what Shadowbringers will bring in terms of crafting and recipes, but I definitely don't think these jobs need nerfing down.

As someone who enjoys crafting and gathering, I hope SE makes crafting and gathering harder.

It's way too easy to level crafters/gatherers between Beast Tribes/Collectables/Custom Deliveries/Levequests/GC Turn-ins

However, I think some of the ability bloat needs to be trimmed.

Also, I dislike cross-class abilities because it means, all crafters have to be leveled to a certain point for the cross-class skills. Even if you never craft anything with that class. For me, it's CUL.

Lastly, make Specialists great again!

More crafting recipes should be unique only to Specialists. Because currently, there's no point to Specialists besides the extra stats.

It would be great if they did something that prevents people from botting crafts/gathering so easily (Since they're clearly never going to be banning them to any meaningful degree), but I can't imagine what that might be.

Making specialists matter again would at least make harder for people to monopolize the market, but I've already seen some of them prepping alt accounts to get around that possibility...

Wait 3 days. They completely changed the DoW/DoM jobs, I'm sure they're going to do the same to DoH/DoL

I'm just tired of having to go into ARR content from 2 expansions ago to gather an item and craft something current.

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Originally Posted by DumdogsWorld

I actually like the fact that crafting is gated behind a time-consuming and sometimes-frustrating leveling and gearing process. It means that not just anybody can be a max leveled omnicrafter. It's not difficult to become one, but every person who fits in the category has something in common - they're willing to grind.

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Only those who have been playing the game for years.
Newbies, HAH! Good luck, come back in 5 years.

A slight redesign on the 1-50 zone would be nice. If you aren't aiming for omnicrafting thats the most painful part. 50+ the design shifted a bit with specializations in a way that even without the omni skill you sort of have a semi-complete toolset and dont feel like playing half a class.

Aside from some actual QoL features mentioned above the only thing I wish is some more interactive crafting rotations. Not exactly harder, just something to think about. Non linear / hard to macro rotations? Preferably without the HW RNG.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Only those who have been playing the game for years.
Newbies, HAH! Good luck, come back in 5 years.

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Not really. The game has enough catchup mechanisms in place with Ixal, Moogle and Namazu crafting XP, challenge logs, leves, and collectibles to give boosts. The path to omni-crafter will take a month if you are dedicated. I got the omnicraft and gatherer level in Heavensward in that amount of time. I just came back to Stormblood last month and my miner/botanist is already 70 and my crafters are steadily going up.

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Originally Posted by Thagyr

Not really. The game has enough catchup mechanisms in place with Ixal, Moogle and Namazu crafting XP, challenge logs, leves, and collectibles to give boosts. The path to omni-crafter will take a month if you are dedicated. I got the omnicraft and gatherer level in Heavensward in that amount of time. I just came back to Stormblood last month and my miner/botanist is already 70 and my crafters are steadily going up.

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When can I fit in the tomestone grind, relic weapon and mount farms?

Gatherers I admit are very easy to level, especially once you get to Namazu, but crafting seems an insurmountable mountain. I've got CUL to level 40 odd and I'm sick of crafting already.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

I'm just tired of having to go into ARR content from 2 expansions ago to gather an item and craft something current.

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I like the fact that old crafting mats are still relevant and I hope future content will keep it this way.

It's a source of income for low-level Crafters/Gatherers/people who run old treasure maps/old content etc.

I do hate the inventory clutter when you have so many mats across different expansions.

But I think the clutter is the 'lesser evil'.

Overall, I think crafting is fine.

HOWEVER, OP does have a bit of a point when it comes to expansion changes, particularly for newer players.

I think we forget that most of us went through the 2*/3*/4* progression before a new expansion came out, and it can be difficult for a newer player to go from lv49 crafting/gathering to basically the equivalent of 50 3* to get to lv51+, or to go from lv59 crafting/gathering to basically the equivalent of lv60 3* to get to lv61+. A way to streamline that, particularly at the end of older expansions...wouldn't be a bad idea. (One way this could be done quite easily might be to make the current lv51/lv61 crafting/gathering gear lv50/60 instead, for example.)

As for getting rid of the rotations and skills and minigame, however, OP is way off base and can go play WoW if that's what he wants.

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Originally Posted by Endeleon

Crafting and gathering is super easy tho.....

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Yes just grindy but to me time sink actions get old to quickly.

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Originally Posted by DumdogsWorld

I actually like the fact that crafting is gated behind a time-consuming and sometimes-frustrating leveling and gearing process. It means that not just anybody can be a max leveled omnicrafter. It's not difficult to become one, but every person who fits in the category has something in common - they're willing to grind.

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OCD helps in this regard just now learning how much I like goldsmithing.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

Yep totally didn't out in effort getting to 51. Kthxbye. It's shit and you know it's shit, you just don't want to admit as some sort of "I did this and you didnt" complex.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

Annnd here comes the elitist trash to tell me all about how I am wrong. Bravo.

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Before i post my opinions, on which i have both positive and negative on the crafting system and in regards to gathering items to craft, a couple of things to address here. Cursing on the forums, kicking off and name calling in regards to people that do not agree with you is a guaranteed way to ensure that no square enix staff will act on your thread. If you want it to be taken seriously then you need to calmly and clearly outline what you think the problem is and how you think it could be addressed in a sensible way.

On the negative side two things.
1. On timed nodes you can be waiting an hour then have a small window to gather what you need, after hitting a node you have to sit there waiting for another to spawn. If you are mass crafting for leveling then you cannot get enough and have to wait an hour again for the node timer to pop. Tbh i have no ideas to fix this since if it was removed something would need to go in it's place and i have no ideas.

2. Random node items are a pain because you click a node hoping, and if it does not have it you still have to gather from it to remove it for new spawns that might contain what you want, makes gathering random node stuff very tedious. I would suggest removing the random node element and replacing it with a system where these type only show up if you have a high enough gathering rating.


On the positive side again two things.
1. Quick synthesis is great if you are mass crafting something you can set it going and then just have a coffee or watch some netflix or something and it does it all for you. Yeah if you are below recommended stats you get some fails, but so long as you have the required you can mass craft nq and get some hq in the process.

2. The manual crafting system is much more involved, you are actually making choices on what to use to craft manually for hq items. Gives the feeling that you are actually crafting something. I did some research on the net combined it with my own trial and error then just put the abils i was going to use on my hotbar. On a max level char i can hq anything i want n i only have the 350 gear, don't even have the best stuff.

I have 14 abils on my hotbar 11 that i use regular for hq crafting, two occasional and the collectable synthesis. You don't need to cover your hotbars in the large amount available, just choose the ones that work for you to get the nq or hq for stuff you craft and leave the rest.

They are merging all cross class skills in ShB and increasing quality points per HQ item. You really don’t need any more hand outs. Really.

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Originally Posted by CookiesNCreams

They are merging all cross class skills in ShB and increasing quality points per HQ item. You really don’t need any more hand outs. Really.

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Where was that said? Source please...

If true then that s awesome IMHO

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

Yep totally didn't out in effort getting to 51. Kthxbye. It's shit and you know it's shit, you just don't want to admit as some sort of "I did this and you didnt" complex.

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With minimal effort on my part, I got to 50 on Carpenter. All I did was daily turn ins to the GC, and abused a few levemates at around lvl 30. That was it. For post 50, Imma go do the moogle beast tribes and turn ins, again, for minimal effort. When I get ot 60, it's Namazu and turn ins.

Little effort, but it takes longer. You want to speed it up, you gotta grind it. Thats the name of the game. You dont like it? Well, dont do it. I dont think the system is crap. Annoying maybe at times, but its not crap.

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Originally Posted by Vitallian

snip.

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You sound a bit burned out, did you rush the leveling of crafters/gatherers?

Why are you going the "omni-crafter" route if its no "fun" or "a hassle" for you? No one is forcing you to do this this way, you can always focus on 1 crafter and ignore the other. The way SE designed the crafting system (needing crafted mats from almost every crafting job) is so that there is a healthy economy, you can always craft your mats and sell them and buy mats from other jobs to complete your "weapon/armor or w/e". If you go the "omni-crafter" route to be "independent" from others and able to craft everything u want, then you have to put the extra effort and time to level all of those, for this comfort.

Are you doing leeve quests? Are you doing Grand Company delivery's? Challenge Log?Also with lvl 54 or 56 you will be introduced to the collectables system and rowena's house of splendors, where you can exchange collectables for exp and scripts.With 54 you gain access to the Moogles beast tribe quests.

Also don't forget to send your retainers to gather mats for you.
If you want to rush the leveling of crafters/gatherers, then play only this aspect of the game, like if you were to play a "battle job", but be carefull to not burnout while you doing so. But if you take the more "relaxed" route and simply do daily's,challenge log and some leeves (we all know its limited and we need to wait on them), then you will get every one of them on max with minimum effort and no stress,but at a much lower pace.

Why is crafting not fun or rewarding and what will make it more fun/rewarding?
Personally i like the crafting/gathering system.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

When can I fit in the tomestone grind, relic weapon and mount farms?

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Priority's...
If gathering/crafting has any priority, you'll find the time for it, if not, then you wont.

No it's a "there's nothing terribly wrong with this system and asking to scrap it entirely for a dumbed down version is not what people want" mentality.

You don't need to level all the Crafters. Mine are anywhere from 5 to 70 and I did it just fine. We don't need to dumb down another part of this game just because a few people don't like it. Not everyone needs to be able to do everything easily.