The Voice Acting. . .

The problem with TC's argument is that these characters do have accents. They are just very subtle.

Which begs the question. What kind of accents where you expecting tc? Full on Engrish? "Ooooh, Herro worriol of right." Seems a bit culturally insensitive and a bit stereotypical to me.

You're asking too much, English is not the only language here, if they were to spend extra hiring people outside the UK to conform to different accents they would have to do the same with French, German and Japanese. This game doesn't even have full voice acting, which would be higher priority than chasing VAs with different accents through different countries through 4 different languages.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I haven't played FFXIII so I don't know what those characters are like, but voice actors doing "Australian" accents usually sound terrible to an actual Australian.

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Which is ironic since the VA for Vanille is Australian. Fang sounds much more convincing to me and her VA is American.

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Originally Posted by Razard

The problem with TC's argument is that these characters do have accents. They are just very subtle.

Which begs the question. What kind of accents where you expecting tc? Full on Engrish? "Ooooh, Herro worriol of right." Seems a bit culturally insensitive and a bit stereotypical to me.

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Yeah, I think this is the real issue. Trying to "fake it" with accents is just going to result in something that's over-exaggerated that will probably come across as offensive to a native speaker. Trying to do something more careful/subtle is going to be hard to achieve consistently with the recordings done in spurts. So it's better, when possible, to actually hire actors that come from those cultural backgrounds and bring a natural/subtle accent to the role without being blatant. It'll probably mean that in many cases a lot of the audience won't be able to detect it, but that's okay.

As an Italian, if we ever get an "italian" region I demand everyone talks like Mario.

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Originally Posted by Nandina

And if we were to assume the Echo was a universal translator, it wouldn't explain why characters without the Echo are able to converse, despite being from foreign lands, which means that the language is the same.

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What is if the language is the same? Origin back to the alagan empire?

As I'm going through the entirety of the game again, I switched the audio to Japanese. I will say that the native tone is much, much better - though I hate that some of the dialogue said in-game doesn't match what's written in the dialogue box (looking at you, Midgard!). Characters that I absolutely hated or cringed at, I find somewhat more appealing in ARR because the Japanese audio does something that the English VAs rarely do in a lot of dubbed games/anime - properly convey tone and emotion without overdoing or underdoing it.

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Originally Posted by Nandina

Just because they're Japanese, doesn't mean their accents differ. There are plenty of Asian-Americans with typical American accents for example, so you're missing the point I'm making. Have you heard someone who's native language is Japanese speak English? While they may have proper grammar and perfect understanding of English, they don't sound like your typical American. That's what I'm referring to. Let the foreign characters sound foreign.

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umm.... what? this sounds stupid. they dont even sound american, they sound British in some, and you can tell they aren't English first. besides that japan teaches English. so this is very very very wrong. unless they pick up someone from the middle of no where in japan. or someone who refused to learn another language.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Voice acting is a very expensive undertaking. Would it be nice to have each in-game region have a distinct accent? Sure - but it'd cost an immense amount of money, especially when you consider that they're already paying to have voice acting for many different languages.

The English voice acting improved considerably as of Heavensward and beyond. As a British guy, it's very nice to see the various different accents associated with the UK reflected in such a prominent game.

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Expensive yeah, but this is FF14 we're talking about. It's probably the second biggest MMORPG on the market. Pulling in so much money through subs alone, mog station, people still buying the game.

SWTOR is practically dead but gets pretty decent voice acting on everything. WoW for the past few years has been getting tons of cutscenes/voice acting and it's pretty good quality.

SE just lazy

The dev team doesn't seem to get a lot of money. Like after the rest of the company saw how expensive THE cs from post T12 was Yoshida got told not to make anymore like it. So while yes the game seems to rake in a lot those who hold the purse strings seem to be stingy at times.

One thing I see *a lot* is when people say "Oh, the Japanese voice acting is better" or "I hated the voice acting so I switched to Japanese."

What I'm curious is that do these people *understand* Japanese, or does it just sound better because they can't understand what they're saying?

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

FF14's english voice acting is so terrible I switched to japenese and never looked back.

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If you think the English voice acting is bad, you should listen to the German Voice acting. It is so emotionless and hideous that id rather have no voice acting at all. The english Voice acting compared to that is pretty decent.

I think since they need a large voice cast in 4 different Laguages, accents and dialects are an after thought, and rightfully so in my opinion, its more important for me to get the info then to get it in a more authentic manner. I am going to the park, park, i go. I get it you are headed to the park.

As for the Japanese pronunciations, they are probably being coached on a more authentic pronuncuation. The names may be written as Gosetsu and Yugiri in roman characters, but a closer spelling would be Gousetsu and Yuugiri, with an elongated O and U sounds. Spunds like that don't exist that often in English, especially to distinqish a name. As an example most people recognise Ryoko as a name, mostly from Tenchi. But which one is correct, Ryokou or Ryouko, one is a name the other means travel/trip. In English there is little to no distinction.

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Originally Posted by Andevom

One thing I see *a lot* is when people say "Oh, the Japanese voice acting is better" or "I hated the voice acting so I switched to Japanese."

What I'm curious is that do these people *understand* Japanese, or does it just sound better because they can't understand what they're saying?

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9/10 times they don't. It's not the dialogue that is better, but the emotion and your conection to it. People understand the subtleties of their own language, someone could say "No" to you several different ways and a native speaker, who is paying attention, would know each is different. I said paying attention cause if you aren't you'd only notice a major difference in emotion.

When people watch the Japanese voices, or the other laguages, they are connecting to the performance on an emotional level. Combine that with reading dialogue they understand and it creates a unique experience per individual. It doesn't just happen in English either. Plenty of Japanese people dislike native Japanese voice work since it sounds stale and lifeless at times. Voice acting may be better regulated over there, but it's like casting someone cause they have appeal and are a big name, not cause they are good.

The biggest one I know of is Izaya from Durarara, Johnny Yong Bosch is said to have the more emotional performance, not better, though it is better, lol, but emotional. Most Japanese people don't really understand English, they are connecting with the emotions of his scenes.

The last thing to add, is nowadays, voice acting is regulated better and gets final approval by the creators, ie the Japanese team. Plus, in some cases its been said that the English voices are better because they are truer to the vision of that character's voice. Vic Mignagna was told his voice was what the wanted for Edward Elric, they semi hinted at settling for Romi Park. She is good but not the young male voice they wanted.

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Originally Posted by Razard

The problem with TC's argument is that these characters do have accents. They are just very subtle.

Which begs the question. What kind of accents where you expecting tc? Full on Engrish? "Ooooh, Herro worriol of right." Seems a bit culturally insensitive and a bit stereotypical to me.

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I dunno how I missed this, but imagine we get a new pair of NPCs...the conversation goes like...

" 'ey man, I'm Korg..."

(woe to those who don't get that reference)

accents is where I draw the line. its a game. some things can be over thought >.>'

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Originally Posted by Andevom

What I'm curious is that do these people *understand* Japanese, or does it just sound better because they can't understand what they're saying?

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You don't need to understand Japanese to recognise when the acting is at least tonally fitting.

Spoilers for 4.3:

JP - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pdh1_DNIFNU&t=215m5s

EN - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AW0JCOaMkpU&t=36m7s

Watch the two versions of that scene and tell me one of them isn't much better directed and acted to fit the action than the other, regardless of if you understand what is being said.

I agree that the Doman voice actors all have a subtle accent (save for Yugiri, though she has gone through three voice actors anyway, and one of those through horrible circumstances).

What I really think should have happened was every single Ishgardian character gets a slight French accent. I guess some of the Gridanians would also get French accents, but like...Canadian French, while Ishgard is Parisian French.

Meanwhile, Lominsan Roegadyns get German accents, everyone from the Near East gets, oh...Egyptian? Saudi Arabian? accents (Lyse would have to codeswitch her accents, depending on who she's talking to), Ul'dah residents get Turkish accents (I think?), etc etc.

That's just my castle in the air, I guess. Mostly I wanna hear all the Ishgardians with French accents because that would be aces.

The English is fine. Characters from different countries or regions in video games never have regionally appropriate accents in Japanese. What's more, typically Russian characters speak English with a Russian accent, French characters speak English with a French accent, but you never see a French character speak Japanese with a French accent or vice versa in Japanese. In that regard, the English VA is already fine. Rather than accents they go for dialect difference (lowborn vs noble voice)

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Originally Posted by Ameela

We're not at Dragon Quest level yet unfortunately.

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I hope we never get there. The one thing I hate the most about modern Dragon Quest games and remakes is the incomprehensible and frankly pointless accents the localization team shove in there, especially since the Japanese versions don't have them at all.

I played DQ8 on Android and it wasn't voice acted--which was nice. Then I saw some DQ8 (PS2) videos on youtube and was mortified at how everyone has an obnoxious cockney accent. Horrible.

B-but I like the english voice-acting..
In fact, I prefer it over the other alternatives.

I would, however, agree that some animations don't match up at all with the english dialogue. They should consider modifying the animations appropriately so that it matches the dialogue and acting differences.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

You don't need to understand Japanese to recognise when the acting is at least tonally fitting.

Spoilers for 4.3:

JP - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pdh1_DNIFNU&t=215m5s

EN - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AW0JCOaMkpU&t=36m7s

Watch the two versions of that scene and tell me one of them isn't much better directed and acted to fit the action than the other, regardless of if you understand what is being said.

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I still prefer it in English :T

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Originally Posted by Ameela

You don't need to understand Japanese to recognise when the acting is at least tonally fitting.

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The English voice there better fits the English text than the Japanese voice does.

The Japanese version just sounds like an individual getting more and more heated as he's talking, while in the English you can hear the obsession in his whiny little voice.

Perhaps there's additional nuance to the Japanese performance...but one would probably have to know the language to pick up on it.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

snip.

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Maybe if it had been an audio book or something, but I feel like someone gesturing wildly while grinning madly with crazy eyes, capping it off with a crazy maniacal laugh, would probably not be whispering in a scheming tone.

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

I played DQ8 on Android and it wasn't voice acted--which was nice. Then I saw some DQ8 (PS2) videos on youtube and was mortified at how everyone has an obnoxious cockney accent. Horrible.

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It's hardly 'everyone'. Heck, one of the main characters is voiced by the same guy who voices Aymeric in FFXIV...and he most definitely does not put on a cockney accent in either game. I'm very thankful that there's a number of RPG's that are localised with European accents rather than the American accents that a very high number of games end up getting.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

Maybe if it had been an audio book or something, but I feel like someone gesturing wildly while grinning madly with crazy eyes, capping it off with a crazy maniacal laugh, would probably not be whispering in a scheming tone.

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This. His gestures and facial expression imply a degree of insane glee. Even the way he throws his head back wildly and laughs looks far more fitting in the Japanese delivery than the English one. His whole mannerisms in this scene could draw parallels to Light Yagami's breakdown in Death Note when he's finally cornered (which both languages do nicely). It's fine if you prefer English over Japanese, but personally I find the delivery to unfortunately be lacking in context of the scene.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

The Japanese version just sounds like an individual getting more and more heated as he's talking.

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Because... He is? Look at his face and expressions which ultimately lead up to his psychotic laugh. And I think that's the route they wanted to take his character: psychotic.

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Originally Posted by Cidel

It's fine if you prefer English over Japanese, but personally I find the delivery to unfortunately be lacking in context of the scene.

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Here is a question I keep coming back to...do the voice actors even get to see the animations? It happens a few times in a few places and I've always wondered if it's a problem with the non-Japanese actors not actually getting to see the scenes or if there's a lack of direction happening.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

JP - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pdh1_DNIFNU&t=215m5s

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Seeing that scene in JP I have to agree JP Asahi was a much better fit than EN Asahi when you take into account his facial expressions, EN was really bad imo.

On the other hand, people kept praising Yotsuyu's JP VA over the EN one but after watching that video I'm not seeing it, the JP voice lacks emotion, she sounds forced.

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Originally Posted by Keridwyn

Here is a question I keep coming back to...do the voice actors even get to see the animations? It happens a few times in a few places and I've always wondered if it's a problem with the non-Japanese actors not actually getting to see the scenes or if there's a lack of direction happening.

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There was an interview with Alisaie's VA a few months back where she reveals that they just give you a short description of the character and some lines, and while recording you will at most get the previous voiced line of dialog to play off of.
I know it's an MMO and ultimately this kind of stuff isn't that important but I still think it's something that should be looked into if possible, especially when this game is so story-driven.

I guess I'm interested in hearing if native Japanese speakers think the voice acting is well done for their version. Again, I find it hard to judge even on a tonal level since I don't speak the language. For all I know, they could be completely hamming it up.

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Originally Posted by Niraye

umm.... what? this sounds stupid. they dont even sound american, they sound British in some, and you can tell they aren't English first. besides that japan teaches English. so this is very very very wrong. unless they pick up someone from the middle of no where in japan. or someone who refused to learn another language.

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Seems someone isn't following along completely. Context should have told you that I'm speaking of those who were born in the States. Asian-Americans don't have an accent when speaking English because they were born in America where everyone speaks English, and they've heard it their entire lives. If you got one of these people to read a script, you couldn't distinguish them.

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Originally Posted by Razard

The problem with TC's argument is that these characters do have accents. They are just very subtle.

Which begs the question. What kind of accents where you expecting tc? Full on Engrish? "Ooooh, Herro worriol of right." Seems a bit culturally insensitive and a bit stereotypical to me.

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You would have to ask yourself, why were they able to do it for a game like FFXII where there were clearly distinctions based on where a character was from. No one complained about cultural insensitivity in those instances. There's a Youtuber called The Japanese Man Yuta. He speaks fluent English, but has a distinct Japanese accent. There's nothing wrong with the way he speaks, I understand him just fine without the need for subtitles.

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Originally Posted by alimdia

You're asking too much, English is not the only language here, if they were to spend extra hiring people outside the UK to conform to different accents they would have to do the same with French, German and Japanese. This game doesn't even have full voice acting, which would be higher priority than chasing VAs with different accents through different countries through 4 different languages.

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It's not asking too much. It's really as simple as hiring someone else for the job. Say for example I'm looking to hire someone who can speak Spanish in my business. The pay is $17/hr. It would make more sense for me to hire a fluent Spanish speaker, as oppossed to someone who can only speak conversationally. Either way, the pay is still $17/hr.

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Originally Posted by Nandina

It's not asking too much. It's really as simple as hiring someone else for the job.

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Well, except for instead of just looking to hire one person who can speak Spanish, what you actually have is a contract between your business and another separate business that specializes in a specific service that you need. You can layer on additional requests or requirements, but still have to keep budgetary (and timing, since this is a company that works with others and well and can be pretty busy) concerns in mind, and if you end up too demanding they can just opt to not do business with you any more.

Not really as simple as just hiring someone else.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

Maybe if it had been an audio book or something, but I feel like someone gesturing wildly while grinning madly with crazy eyes, capping it off with a crazy maniacal laugh, would probably not be whispering in a scheming tone.

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Not whispering, nor scheming.

Asahi, in English, was introduced as soft-spoken. That's a trait the English scene continues, where the tone is mocking, before it transitions into building intensity and obsession.

Of course, maybe what's really going on is that both work, and you've convinced yourself that only yours works. Whether it really does fit might still be up for interpretation though, since neither of us actually know the language that you think fits better.

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Originally Posted by Nandina

You would have to ask yourself, why were they able to do it for a game like FFXII where there were clearly distinctions based on where a character was from. No one complained about cultural insensitivity in those instances. There's a Youtuber called The Japanese Man Yuta. He speaks fluent English, but has a distinct Japanese accent. There's nothing wrong with the way he speaks, I understand him just fine without the need for subtitles.

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*Sigh*
The. Doman. Characters. Do. Have. An. Accent. They. Are. Just. A. Lot. More. Subtle. And. Less. In. Your. Face. About. It.

I don't know why you bring up FFXII. The only people who spoke in a noticeably different accent where the Vieras vague eastern european. But that was to give them a strange and alien vibe.

Again, in the Japanese version EVERYONE speaks Japanese with various dialects of JAPANESE. There's no "russian accent" in Japanese, or "british accent in Japanese". At least historically in dubbed games/anime/movies, Westerners used VA of various ethnicities to portray characters. Like in Street Fighter games, Zangief in Japanese just speaks with a scruff Japanese voice. In English he speaks with a Russian accent, Cammy speaks with a British accent, Rose speaks with an Italian accent etc. In Japanese, charactesr from other countries just speak japanese but with dialects from different cities in Japan as opposed to speaking japanese with a foreign accent (probably because of limitations of japanese voice actors only knowing japanese and being japanese natives)

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Originally Posted by Berethos

Of course, maybe what's really going on is that both work, and you've convinced yourself that only yours works. Whether it really does fit might still be up for interpretation though, since neither of us actually know the language that you think fits better.

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I've literally never seen any of the Japanese voice acting in this game aside from that scene, which I only looked up because the English version sounded so off when I played it myself.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

I've literally never seen any of the Japanese voice acting in this game aside from that scene, which I only looked up because the English version sounded so off when I played it myself.

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It doesn't change my point, which is that you've decided that one version fits better than the other without actually knowing if the version you think fits actually does fit.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

Well, except for instead of just looking to hire one person who can speak Spanish, what you actually have is a contract between your business and another separate business that specializes in a specific service that you need. You can layer on additional requests or requirements, but still have to keep budgetary (and timing, since this is a company that works with others and well and can be pretty busy) concerns in mind, and if you end up too demanding they can just opt to not do business with you any more.

Not really as simple as just hiring someone else.

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So are all the voice actors working on FFXIV a part of the same company and not independently hired based on their ability to fulfill the role?

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Originally Posted by Razard

*Sigh*
The. Doman. Characters. Do. Have. An. Accent. They. Are. Just. A. Lot. More. Subtle. And. Less. In. Your. Face. About. It.

I don't know why you bring up FFXII. The only people who spoke in a noticeably different accent where the Vieras vague eastern european. But that was to give them a strange and alien vibe.

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You clearly haven’t gotten very far in FFXII. So you’re really saying that Vaan, Ondore, Al-Cid, and Larsa all had the same accent?

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Originally Posted by Razard

I don't know why you bring up FFXII. The only people who spoke in a noticeably different accent where the Vieras vague eastern european. But that was to give them a strange and alien vibe.

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This is incorrect. Vaan and Penelo both have distinct American accents, as do a lot of the common folk you'll meet through the game. Ashe, Basch, Balthier, Larsa etc and many of the Empire NPCs all have British accents, perhaps it's a class thing (seeing as a lot of them have high social standing).

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Originally Posted by Berethos

It doesn't change my point, which is that you've decided that one version fits better than the other without actually knowing if the version you think fits actually does fit.

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I don't know about you, but in terms of looking at Asahi's mannerisms, facial expressions and gestures I can easily come to the conclusion that the Japanese version "fits" better than the English. It's not even a matter of "you think only one works;" English Asahi doesn't even laugh appropriately in that scene as he flails his head around- by that moment the English version barely even forced out a laugh. He's "obsessed," yes, but if you couldn't tell by his wide-eyed look and outstretched arms, he's also being melodramatic.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

There was an interview with Alisaie's VA a few months back where she reveals that they just give you a short description of the character and some lines, and while recording you will at most get the previous voiced line of dialog to play off of.

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This makes sense. It shows in the delivery (or lack of) often times.