“non-essential” premium content, does SE want this kind of reputation if it continue?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wilford111

I disagree that it's not an exaggeration. You are absolutely exaggerating. I thought your main complaint about this app was its supposed p2w advantages. Now it's UI features? Way to stick to your guns.

Can we just agree that it's scummy, we won't pay for it, and have that be that?

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its both... this was specifically for blocking basic UI features though. (and how that is running in parallel with what EA did) Though... reading helps I guess? It is even bolded in the first post. It is not an exaggeration, you just do not want to see what it truly is. It is to point out the parallel of defending over charge (mog station items) because "non-essential" and some evne tried to pull this for the app. I should not be paying 20 dollars a month, over 15 dollars a month, just because of a missing basic UI feature that is not there due to poor 1.0 coding. So they want to charge us more because of their poor coding? is there any truth to this? What is the real reason they have to charge more money for a basic UI feature we should of had since 2.0?

Quote:

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There have even been numerous accusations that EA and its ilk deliberately hold back game content with the sole intent of charging a fee for it at a later date. It’s one thing to support a game with new content that is worth the price. It’s another to put out an inferior — and occasionally broken — product with the mindset of “ah, we’ll fix it later and make some money for doing so.”

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I do not want to pay extra for things that should come with the base game/ (and in this case, base sub as well. Even offline games should not be doing this), that is the main point. That is exactly part of the reason why it is scummy.

Also I commented on before about paywalling basic UI features that this app is doing in other threads, SE does not reply to it, people are not commenting on that concpt, so i felt this thread is justified in showing SE why this is not acceptable.

About this idea of "waiting" why? Why should we accept a company is even think of doing this? It is greed, it is unfair, it is not getting the value for our money, it is cash grabby, they shouldn't be doing this to begin with but they try push it anyway. There should be some kind of standard of morality when doing business, not getting blood from a turnup. Sure a business is a business to make money, but not there to literally nickle and dime people to death.

When I do business with anything else we work out deals, and how both parties benefit. We give a set amount of money for a set amount of entertainment. When too much is being charged, it is only logical you speak up, only these methods of overcharging it is trying to making it appear they are not. You really can't do proper business with one side commutation can you?

I will like to add housing to the "fix it later concept, but charge people while doing so":

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

You missed the main point: Yoshida saying "you should take a break" goes completely counter to them having added house reclamation (which was added before he made that statement), which doesn't let you take a break. So him saying "you should take a break" is complete BS.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

Allow me to give you a personal example. I had to sub just so I could reclaim my stuff. I had no desire to play the game again yet. There was still no new content, I had done all the current stuff. I won't give you the entire list of things I had to resub to reclaim, but here's the short of it:

80 million gil from my mansion (bought before house reclamation was introduced, during a time when it was promised it would never be a thing), and 5 Eastern Cherry Trees, currently valued on my server as a total of 100 million gil, or going by its real world value based on the Mog Station, $25.

This is not even close to everything I would have lost, of course.


I will concede, I would not be so against house reclamation in its current state if they kept your gil and items for you indefinitely, or at least for a very long time.

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How long as housing been around? How long ago did yoshi p say "we will not do that" when it came to auto demo, but they still have to do this bandaid fix? When are they going to fix things and stop overcharging us for their shortcomings?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

My sub did end, and I do not have much time left on the forums.

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https://media.giphy.com/media/QMkPpxPDYY0fu/giphy.gif

Not sure why people are trying to stop these types of threads. One thread isn't enough, these devs need to know that we have an issue with this. It's seriously becoming a problem that almost every other glamour outfit and mount is in mogstation now. Cosmetics or not, it's going overboard.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry

Not sure why people are trying to stop these types of threads. One thread isn't enough, these devs need to know that we have an issue with this. It's seriously becoming a problem that almost every other glamour outfit and mount is in mogstation now. Cosmetics or not, it's going overboard.

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But then you gotta remember they also said multible threads don't catch the devs attention. Big threads does.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wilford111

Can we just agree that it's scummy, we won't pay for it, and have that be that?

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+1

Making complaints thread and saying its P2W (when it's not) isn't going to help anyone or anything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rinuko

Making complaints thread and saying its P2W (when it's not) isn't going to help anyone or anything.

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Eeeeeh it depends. I vaguely recall Yoshi-P saying he encourages people to give them negative feedback as it helps them improve (that could just be hearsay)... however we as a community should also be civil and organised on that (one 'megathread' that talks about the pros and cons, with the OP updated every so often with quotes/bullet points other players have made. Ideas, suggestions, etc. Of course, the OP of those kind of threads would need to be on very neutral ground with those kinds of threads).

When it comes to complaints, I like to think that the 'Megathread' talking about the unplayable lag back in the 2.0 days convinced SE to get their act together and work on improving(?) server latency (though something seems to have gone wrong in Sigmascape, as I have been hit by that light when I've been out of it for a good few seconds. Also Virus in O7S). The thread had videos and gifs linked on the first page showing just how bad everything was. People getting hit by Landslide even though they were out of the AoE for a good few seconds, a BRD getting hit by ADS' laser attack despite being out of it for 2-3 seconds, etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nestama

... however we as a community should also be civil and organised on that (one 'megathread' that talks about the pros and cons, with the OP updated every so often with quotes/bullet points other players have made. Ideas, suggestions, etc. Of course, the OP of those kind of threads would need to be on very neutral ground with those kinds of threads).

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This is key. However OP in this case is hardly neutral and cherry pick quotes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nestama

When it comes to complaints, I like to think that the 'Megathread' talking about the unplayable lag back in the 2.0 days convinced SE to get their act together and work on improving(?) server latency (though something seems to have gone wrong in Sigmascape, as I have been hit by that light when I've been out of it for a good few seconds. Also Virus in O7S). The thread had videos and gifs linked on the first page showing just how bad everything was. People getting hit by Landslide even though they were out of the AoE for a good few seconds, a BRD getting hit by ADS' laser attack despite being out of it for 2-3 seconds, etc.

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Again a perfect example how it should be done. A big thread that explain the issues well.


My point was making (how many do we have on the app now, like 5 threads?) and no thread is neutral and making worst assumptions. You can't expect changes from that when we scream wolf and act like kindergarden kids.

To all the people defending this as "optional" storage space is not optional to some people.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sarynth

To all the people defending this as "optional" storage space is not optional to some people.

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It's not as if people are forced to buy it. They're not losing anything if they don't, except maybe an insignificant portion of the mb which is most likely being blown way out of proportion.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sarynth

To all the people defending this as "optional" storage space is not optional to some people.

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No1 is defending it, there's difference in opinion on what it is but no1 is defending it, the reason why ppl complain about this threads is because apparently multiple threads do not increase your visibility, but longer threads does

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wilford111

It's not as if people are forced to buy it. They're not losing anything if they don't, except maybe an insignificant portion of the mb which is most likely being blown way out of proportion.

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I'm referring to the chocobo saddlebag being doubled for premium app users. I for one use it for fishing bait, gardening and crafting supplies. However what I won't do is pay a subscription with optional microtransactions on top of another subscription.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sarynth

I'm referring to the chocobo saddlebag being doubled for premium app users. I for one use it for fishing bait, gardening and crafting supplies. However what I won't do is pay a subscription with optional microtransactions on top of another subscription.

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I can't tell how long you been playing but if we take myself as an example. I've been around since the start and been crafting since then. I never had a problem without saddlebag - it's more of a convenience but it very possible keep mats in retainers and own inventory (if you're full in saddlebag with gardening and fish baits).

Either you want the convenience and pay for it or you don't.

What amaze me is nobody seems to understand they can't turn these features on for everyone (what if server limitation/stress actually is a thing) while if a handful of people get premium then it won't stress the servers as much like 500k (figure number) players use it.

Yet another, "The sky is falling" post when there isn't enough information to prove there is a problem. - _-

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Originally Posted by Zephanoa

Yet another, "The sky is falling" post when there isn't enough information to prove there is a problem. - _-

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the app-subscription existence is a problem by itself... Like the cash shop is, or the retainer behind subscription...

the funniest thing, blizzrd would do exactly same, people would mock and spit en them. But because SE does it, it should be fine...

We find people thinking the small WoW CS is worse than the big one on FF (yes FF CS already gone bigger than WoW one... btu one is 8-9 years old, other is less than 4years old...)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aerlana

the app-subscription existence is a problem by itself... Like the cash shop is, or the retainer behind subscription...

the funniest thing, blizzrd would do exactly same, people would mock and spit en them. But because SE does it, it should be fine...

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No one is saying its fine. However some people are perfectly fine of spending money on getting x and y features. But you also gotta remember it all optional just like the cash shop and extra retainers.

When/IF we get normal content locked behind a paywall, yeah then it justified to mock and spite on SE.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sarynth

To all the people defending this as "optional" storage space is not optional to some people.

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How is it NOT optional? You don't have it now and you are capable of playing the game and experiencing all content just fine. If you choose to be a hoarder and fill all your available storage with everything you can possibly get your hands on, that is your choice, your OPTION.

NOT optional would be SE saying "We are going to double saddlebag storage but EVERYONE's base subscription is going up $5, whether you like it/need it or not".

Just because you don't like your choices, doesn't mean you don't have a choice.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

I should not be paying 20 dollars a month, over 15 dollars a month...

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It is worth pointing out that FFXI's launch subscription fee of $12.95 is worth about $19 in today's money (adjusted for inflation). Across the board, video games have not gone up in price in real dollars for a very long time, and that applies to subscriptions as well. In realistic terms, the sub fee is lower than it ever was, and the premium fee is on par with historical MMO sub fees (well, unless you really like retainers). The fact that we kick and scream at every attempt for them to make as much real money as they used to doesn't really help anyone.

It's a good time to be a gamer. You can play stuff super cheap if you want, and let fools like me subsidize your purchases by buying all the extra crap.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Talraen

It is worth pointing out that FFXI's launch subscription fee of $12.95 is worth about $19 in today's money (adjusted for inflation). Across the board, video games have not gone up in price in real dollars for a very long time, and that applies to subscriptions as well. In realistic terms, the sub fee is lower than it ever was, and the premium fee is on par with historical MMO sub fees (well, unless you really like retainers). The fact that we kick and scream at every attempt for them to make as much real money as they used to doesn't really help anyone.

It's a good time to be a gamer. You can play stuff super cheap if you want, and let fools like me subsidize your purchases by buying all the extra crap.

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It should be mentioned those 12,99 USD was for 1 character and then 1 USD for an extra character. Any crafter knows mules was a must back in the day. Way before we had any sacks, satchels and increased inventories.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rinuko

It should be mentioned those 12,99 USD was for 1 character and then 1 USD for an extra character. Any crafter knows mules was a must back in the day. Way before we had any sacks, satchels and increased inventories.

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Hmmm I just duo Box was not worth having mules too much of a hassle. It was a nice cheap way to get more space just not as effective as actually having a back up healer at all times :P...

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

Hmmm I just duo Box was not worth having mules too much of a hassle. It was a nice cheap way to get more space just not as effective as actually having a back up healer at all times :P...

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! Then you used 3rd party applications!

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Originally Posted by Rinuko

! Then you used 3rd party applications!

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No Dual PC, two subscriptions. It's not hard when you master the art of "Tired of depending in incompetent healers so it's better to do it my self when I solo." Was doing Dynamis by myself so yeah relics will mess you up if you work on them too much. Curse my gaming addiction -.-; it keeps me away from drugs, and loyal to my GF.and then Trust came into play...Thank you SE for competent AI.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zephanoa

Yet another, "The sky is falling" post when there isn't enough information to prove there is a problem. - _-

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This is untrue, SE actually IS trending towards anti-consumer practices. They started with charging for inventory space (retainers), moved up to cosmetics (mog station) and are now headed towards sub on top of sub (premium) and if the TREND (thats the evidence) continues, then the game very well could become the worse version of p2w (the app already is going to be) OR content can be cut and placed behind a paywall.

i'm waiting for stat giving, and attack up items to be implemented. then i will be outraged. but this app. the fetures where asked for a long time ago. so i dont care, as its basicly just a tonnnn of drama by people not even reeaadding correctly what has been said. they just want to jump the gun on everything that involves real money / also this : woe be you you who buy retainers you feed this! bad bad bad bad person stop buying emotes. bad bad bad dont buy that outfit! cash grab cash. money money money. all i hear is cash shop isnt allowed cosmetics. cash shop isnt allowed jumps? okay so go start a protest on the wow forums too now. oh wait a minute let me sulk and cry cuz $$$. oi you in the dungon with the cash outfit, get out! better yet, "i can barley afford this game and now they want me to pay x ammount for that glamor peice?" oh wait, its under optional.... nah ima complain and yell because it should be free to me!!!!! meee !!!! meeee!!!!! entitled rant over here. another entitled rant over here. someone claims rmt can use this over here. another jump down the throat of people who asked for it. ah wait we got something we wanted b4 in game, nah dont like it, not what i wanted. soooo basicly. drama post~

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Niraye

i'm waiting for stat giving, and attack up items to be implemented. then i will be outraged. but this app. the fetures where asked for a long time ago. so i dont care, as its basicly just a tonnnn of drama by people not even reeaadding correctly what has been said. they just want to jump the gun on everything that involves real money / also this : woe be you you who buy retainers you feed this! bad bad bad bad person stop buying emotes. bad bad bad dont buy that outfit! cash grab cash. money money money. all i hear is cash shop isnt allowed cosmetics. cash shop isnt allowed jumps? okay so go start a protest on the wow forums too now. oh wait a minute let me sulk and cry cuz $$$. oi you in the dungon with the cash outfit, get out! better yet, "i can barley afford this game and now they want me to pay x ammount for that glamor peice?" oh wait, its under optional.... nah ima complain and yell because it should be free to me!!!!! meee !!!! meeee!!!!! entitled rant over here. another entitled rant over here. someone claims rmt can use this over here. another jump down the throat of people who asked for it. ah wait we got something we wanted b4 in game, nah dont like it, not what i wanted. soooo basicly. drama post~

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This is the problem and why the title is titled as such, it is also why companies get away with stuff like this for so long. Some people simply do not care about being ripped off or cost of things, just as long as they get what they want they will be happy. If it cost 1000 EUR a month to play this game there still people defending that.

People are not asking for the game to be completely free, they are asking for a fair value. SE has been crossing the line with paid retainers and I thought so back then. The only difference back then is that it was tolerable, oh only 1.50 extra a month, no big deal, maybe that will go help fund a better solution while this is bandaid fix for now. As the "heat" (someone referenced reaction to boiling a frog) increased little by little it went unnoticed. With this app though, it is clear as day, SE has became to cash grabby, keeps increasing the price on mog station items to unfair values so now it is the time to speak up. No it is not too soon, too soon would been way back charging for the first retainers.

This app is the "stat giving" to full time crafters and money makers, just because it does not effect you, does not make it any less P2W

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rinuko

I can't tell how long you been playing but if we take myself as an example. I've been around since the start and been crafting since then. I never had a problem without saddlebag - it's more of a convenience but it very possible keep mats in retainers and own inventory (if you're full in saddlebag with gardening and fish baits).

Either you want the convenience and pay for it or you don't.

What amaze me is nobody seems to understand they can't turn these features on for everyone (what if server limitation/stress actually is a thing) while if a handful of people get premium then it won't stress the servers as much like 500k (figure number) players use it.

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I'd take option C, having a full game for what I pay for originally, not leave in bugs to fix later and charge extra for it because dev team wanted rush out 2.0

You pay for each expansion like new game, you pay a sub already, no reason to keep charging more. This game is not showing being worth charging some people a max sub 36 dollars a month, it is the same thing every patch some new tome, some new primal and 12 - 8 man dungeons. If they where showing true effort in making a very nice game maybe, but it is always "x is fun if you do it with friends" that can make anything good.

Yet again new overcharging cash grabby items go up on the mogstation

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Yet again new overcharging cash grabby items go up on the mogstation

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Are outfits, barding, and a mount "pay to win" too? Or is this part of the slippery slope? Do you need these items to play? (Oh wait I forgot, your account is no longer active. But you know, if you were playing.)

https://memegenerator.net/img/instan...ou-have-it.jpg

To actually speak to the issue, it seems as though the crux of the complaints are "This is a pay to play subscription game that is incorporating more of the systems we see in free to play games" To that end, if this game went F2P or some hybrid model, would this situation feel less of a slap in the face? Because I predict that FFXIV will be heading this way starting with 5.0

Source of my prediction

I know it states "only if the majority of the playerbase wants it" but we know thats a load of crap. It will be just like the jump potions, no one (on the forums at least) wanted them, yet here we are. If this is even being said outside of closed doors, it means they have already started working towards it. So the complaint of "paying a sub on top of a sub" will no longer be valid, once this goes through. The writing for this has been on the wall since the initial mention of a cash shop back in 2.0beta. SE has recouped their losses from 1.0, have a content creation formula down pat (its all plug and play), and as a company are seeing how profitable it can be to microtransaction everything in your game (look at all their garbage mobile titles that are raking in dough).

If you think this (or any other) company is concerned about their patrons beyond dollar signs, you are only fooling yourself. Just like the loot box fiasco going on with EA, they wont care or change their ways unless their feet get held to the fire in a way that damages the brand or they start to lose money doing things the way that they have. I'm less concerned with this app and its features than I am with the loss of engagement with the content I am feeling. The two are unrelated. For the first time since 1.2 reintroduced the sub fees, I have let my subscription lapse. While I enjoyed Eureka it was short lived and over played, like every piece of content they release. I found myself logging in, looking at my screen for 15 min, then logging out because there was nothing I could do that I enjoyed doing. At this point, I dont think there is anything that can really be done to right this course. I'm going to try re-subbing for 4.35 and see if the new stuff can hold me over till the next patch but if it is all tired content after a week, I will be letting it lapse again. After that my plan will be to sub for two months at a time, one month just before the new expansion, then one month after the new expansion. Beyond that I see no reason to keep playing.

But now i'm rambling and totally off topic. Regardless, the advantage anyone has with added retainers is so inconsequential in the grand scheme of things, its the least of my issues with the game. I wish this kind of attention could be given to things like incentivizing your players better to do the content you want them to do, creating dynamic, fun, and engaging content, and make our achievements matter.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MageBlack

But now i'm rambling and totally off topic. Regardless, the advantage anyone has with added retainers is so inconsequential in the grand scheme of things, its the least of my issues with the game. I wish this kind of attention could be given to things like incentivizing your players better to do the content you want them to do, creating dynamic, fun, and engaging content, and make our achievements matter.

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Same here, mate.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NephthysVasudan

Yes because the answer is to make yet an another thread is always the best solution.

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It absolutely is. And no amount of white knighting can stop people from expressing their opinion :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MrPresident

It absolutely is. And no amount of white knighting canstop people from expressing their opinion :)

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Hmmm I don't understand this whole white Knight theory.

So people who give a perspective how things are unfair are correct for some weird reason that is more emotional than factual, label things as a scam, rip off, ect yet can't prove how ( from a logical point ) are labeled as being correct.

While a person who is knowledgeable, can back up points trough actual facts, links, and sees it as a normal business practice is labeled as a white Knight for the company while still being able to disagree in some of the companies actions?

In return creating a whole new thread is the correct thing to do? Correct me if I'm wrong, it seems more like emotional people are cornered and are really just really running away from reality. Or is this a strategical retreat and creating a new thread is just a way to make themselves think they are right and everything that does not meet their perspective is wrong?

I got lagacy, my sub is cheaper.
I pay for 1 extra retainer.

I don't have invatory issue because I sell stuff my 3 retainers, I log and make sure 20 items on retainer. before logging off I make sure they are full again. I undercut my 5%

I do agree with some of the OP issues.
But Not have extra retainers isn't effecting my enjoyment.

However there are things I would gladly pay extra for like a HD texture pack.

SE is a publicly traded company which means it's in it to make money, and answers to it share holders. This means when I logged in to day and did Eureka, and saw 5 people with the $24 mount that came out today. I was like they got to much money but if that's what they want to spend it on that's there choice.

I use patreon to support some project and content creators which is no difference really. I pay a little extra and get perks.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

Hmmm I don't understand this whole white Knight theory.

So people who give a perspective how things are unfair are correct for some weird reason that is more emotional than factual, label things as a scam, rip off, ect yet can't prove how ( from a logical point ) are labeled as being correct.

While a person who is knowledgeable, can back up points trough actual facts, links, and sees it as a normal business practice is labeled as a white Knight for the company while still being able to disagree in some of the companies actions?

In return creating a whole new thread is the correct thing to do? Correct me if I'm wrong, it seems more like emotional people are cornered and are really just really running away from reality. Or is this a strategical retreat and creating a new thread is just a way to make themselves think they are right and everything that does not meet their perspective is wrong?

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I do not understand how a white knight does not see they are a white knight.
Here people give a perspective how things are unfair, and how this is done in the past, repeated consistently by companies, starting small, and keep pushing how far they can go, instead of self regulating. Explaining in detail why it appears to be on a same path as others such as:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LeoLupinos

Do you both already played Fair games that become Pay to win over the time? They started with simple moves like these ones from SE. Anything more than cosmetic/glamour is somewhat pay to win. Retainers can control economy, so you pay to win at economy. You can have a lot of retainers, so a lot of ventures, a lot of gill and mats, so pay to win more. As you can see, only with these examples, it's not only cosmetic, while there's much more examples.

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only to meet a person stating things on emotion alone, pretends things are "facts" without any argument to back up what they are saying, only to wind up confused why they are being called a white knight, despite others explaining why it is said in the first place:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Remus

I see White Knighting as defending something without a critical eye. Basically always saying whatever the dev team releases is good. So basically saying something without thinking things through properly on why perhaps the person could be saying that which opposes what you think. Also if they can't give reasons as for why they defend the content when asked.

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Then in turn making threads that satire and mock those that are giving SE well deserved criticism.

I got no idea why I am even bothering explaining this to someone that does not understand they are already paying for a game only to have features gut out or missing, then happy to pay for extra. Ya real logical *rolls eyes* I guess another definition would be, white knights magically forget there is a sub cost to this game, high mog station costs, extra sub costs (retainers) only to have another sub cost to gate a sub cost, along with buying expansions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

I got no idea why I am even bothering explaining this to someone that does not understand they are already paying for a game only to have features gut out or missing, then happy to pay for extra. Ya real logical *rolls eyes* I guess another definition would be, white knights magically forget there is a sub cost to this game, high mog station costs, extra sub costs (retainers) only to have another sub cost to gate a sub cost, along with buying expansions.

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Then Free to play will be the solution for you. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

I do not understand how a white knight does not see they are a white knight.
Here people give a perspective how things are unfair, and how this is done in the past, repeated consistently by companies, starting small, and keep pushing how far they can go, instead of self regulating. Explaining in detail why it appears to be on a same path as others such as:

only to meet a person stating things on emotion alone, pretends things are "facts" without any argument to back up what they are saying, only to wind up confused why they are being called a white knight, despite others explaining why it is said in the first place:

Then in turn making threads that satire and mock those that are giving SE well deserved criticism.

I got no idea why I am even bothering explaining this to someone that does not understand they are already paying for a game only to have features gut out or missing, then happy to pay for extra. Ya real logical *rolls eyes* I guess another definition would be, white knights magically forget there is a sub cost to this game, high mog station costs, extra sub costs (retainers) only to have another sub cost to gate a sub cost, along with buying expansions.

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I quoted this to someone else, seems to fit you perfectly as well. http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-made-me-unsub.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

Do you even know what optional means? Optional means = available to be chosen but not obligatory.

Personally I don't agree with many things that SE offers players. Unlike most comments here I will give reasons on why.

Emotes; if doing emotes that are NOT quality / item based (kai arts, music, ect ) should be available for everyone in one way or another. Some of the emotes were event based and no longer available which makes sense they would be sold. It's not SE fault that people missed it.

Mounts; Personally I'm disgusted by this being sold. If anything they could of made it into some hardcore quest to collect parts also. Example the optional Magictek mounts.

Jump Potions Their excuse was to help people catch up to play with their friends...only draw back made players miss out on pretty much how the job works. Witch leave it to veterans having to carry these people until they learn it....just plain stupid in my opinion and a waste of money. If it's already in the game, as part of the main design it should not be sold. This was brought about emotional people that wanted a trophy for just trying.

Dye's; Metallic can be gather by retainer exploration does not really need to be sold.

These are just a few examples of stupid thing that are on sale.

In the end no matter how many threads pop up, how many times people argue players white knight the company, the result is the same. It is not obligatory. Big companies will take advantage of people who want games to be easier for them it's a known fact that most human-beings envy those with the haves, and don't want to be part of the have not's. As for those who claim it's not about the money or envy...lets get real it is otherwise there would not be soo many threads and would just say "oh look new stuff...nah I'll pass" and let it be. No instead people are hypocrites in one way or another rage quit...blah blah blah... I will not support this company ..blah blah blah..

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If anything people who claim to be logical just ignore the main points to begin with and fail to use the one bit of common sense when they refer to this game. It's called a business not a non profit. By the way rolling eyes to someone just shows a low level of maturity specially once their point of view has been disputed and can't make an actual logical response.

I have not forgotten about my subscription, if fact is part of my monthly expenses for my household budget. Unlike many people some of us do take money seriously, and are competent enough to balance their expenses.

Note their are several other things I can say are wrong with SE, don't agree with, yet I'm not adding redundant topics which have been covered already that SE has already tweaked or tried to fix. They did what they could and it's not important enough to keep posting small things. I can at least accept that it is a business, I pay a subscription, and it's up to me to give them money. Just because I have money does not mean I need to spend it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

only to meet a person stating things on emotion alone, pretends things are "facts" without any argument to back up what they are saying, only to wind up confused

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This made me ROFLMAO so hard, it just needed to be re-posted.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

only to meet a person stating things on emotion alone, pretends things are "facts" without any argument to back up what they are saying, only to wind up confused why they are being called a white knight, despite others explaining why it is said in the first place:

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How do you explain your over dramatic responses and lack of facts that try to contradict the principles of a business? We all agree that this is a business and the facts of what a business is, yet have called their practices a scam = a dishonest scheme; a fraud, yet fail to prove it in any logical way, instead you change the subject or focus on something else.

In psychology, emotion is often defined as a complex state of feeling that results in physical and psychological changes that influence thought and behavior. ... Just wondering don't all these responses seem like they are all penny pinching? We established services and items sold are not obligatory. Perhaps people have economical issues, therefor an emotion is triggered unconsciously.?

Not to be rude, that sentence gives you meaning based on your sarcastic remarks and expressions. A good example *rolling your eyes*. If you want facts look up the definition of business and what the purpose is.

https://gyazo.com/c371db26cfe72e660605ff005a8ccec6
soooo I think my thread is very fitting now, with what they are trying to do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

https://gyazo.com/c371db26cfe72e660605ff005a8ccec6
soooo I think my thread is very fitting now, with what they are trying to do.

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PAY ATTENTION TO MEEEE!!!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MageBlack

PAY ATTENTION TO MEEEE!!!!!

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To be fair, most people should just have them ignored by now.

if you want shaved ice. we bought stacks upon stacks of it. do the event if you want event items, im glad you have to pay for it. it makes those of us who did the work glad you have to pay for it. no freebies. this game i will support with my money. i dont want another tera. i dont want guild wars 2. i most definitely do not want star wars online. (i play the first two and refuse to pay for elite schumuk and gw2 is dying out due to content stalls for really long periods of time)