I do not have a "Main" I want to gear all jobs, change weekly gatings?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Noshpan

If they didn't gate, then you would have the cutting-edge raiders complaining about there being no worthy content for them to do.

---

This already occurs now

I think the big issue that everyone else seems to be missing is that gating like 450 times per week, x number of drops from "insert raid/raid savage", etc etc in a game like ffxiv that alllows you to play any job on one character doesn't make sense. If someone wants to gear all of them equally, why the gates when gear is obsolete so quickly. And op was right ffxi offered tons of avenues to gear each of the 22 jobs if you wanted to. Gear in ffxi lasted way longer and had more value.

Edit again. I see unbeliel covered what I wanted to say, so seconding that as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sarynth

I think the big issue that everyone else seems to be missing is that gating like 450 times per week, x number of drops from "insert raid/raid savage", etc etc in a game like ffxiv that alllows you to play any job on one character doesn'tmake sense. If someone wants to gear all of them equally, why the gates when gear is obsolete so quickly. And op was right ffxi offered tons of avenues to gear each of the 22 jobs if you wanted to. Gear in ffxi lasted way longer and had more value.

Edit again. I see unbeliel covered what I wanted to say, so seconding that as well.

---

^ yep, and I liked that post as well.

I am not asking options how to gear, as said I can get all 320 if I wanted too, my issue is with the gating and the concept of the gating and why it exists. We get delta normal, then 2 weeks later, before anyone was able to get any body gear from it, since gating makes you take 4 weeks, it was obsolete. Why is normal still gated when the crafting gear makes it all obsolete?

Why does it take you 2 weeks to get a 330 gear when there is no real point in having it in the first place and obtained the same methods we use to get unlimited 310 gear. I do not understand how gating magically makes content exist.

Aaaaah okay, now it makes sense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

I am not asking options how to gear, as said I can get all 320 if I wanted too, my issue is with the gating and the concept of the gating and why it exists.

---

So you can have time to play other games, spend time with family, and not feel like you are forced to log in every day trying to keep up with your FC buddies.

Something that Yoshida specifically said is intended design for this game. https://youtu.be/ONT6fxiu9cw?t=12m58s turn on subtitles if they are not on by default.

Now the thing with the gear treadmill is that its also designed so you work towards getting a higher ilvl to be ready for the next major content patch which occurs every 3 months. The gating is done so that the next content isn't already invalidate and you got still room to grow.

SE gating us not only keeps people playing, but it also reduces artificial gating from the player base. If we had unlocked tomes, guaranteed you would have seen "ilvl225+ or gtfo" for ex and savage content PFs first week.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deathgiver

SE gating us not only keeps people playing, but it also reduces artificial gating from the player base. If we had unlocked tomes, guaranteed you would have seen "ilvl225+ or gtfo" for ex and savage content PFs first week.

---

Except that you did see that anyway then, and still do now just even worse... And there is no method by which you can catch up even if you are willing to put in the effort. If you are 3 weeks behind now, you will be 3 weeks behind until the next tier. And if you are 312 and people want 320 well, you are out of luck. And crafted is not the answer. Maybe other servers it is cheaper, or other people have more gil. But in my experience it costs an impossible amount of gil to buy and meld.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TankHunter678

So you can have time to play other games, spend time with family, and not feel like you are forced to log in every day trying to keep up with your FC buddies.

Something that Yoshida specifically said is intended design for this game. https://youtu.be/ONT6fxiu9cw?t=12m58s turn on subtitles if they are not on by default.

Now the thing with the gear treadmill is that its also designed so you work towards getting a higher ilvl to be ready for the next major content patch which occurs every 3 months. The gating is done so that the next content isn't already invalidate and you got still room to grow.

---

Then why gate??!?!?! Gating like they do encourages to feel forced to log in every day. The design of the game does not fit what is being said in that interview. Gating prevents you to from properly exploring other jobs then just one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deathgiver

SE gating us not only keeps people playing, but it also reduces artificial gating from the player base. If we had unlocked tomes, guaranteed you would have seen "ilvl225+ or gtfo" for ex and savage content PFs first week.

---

But that is exactly what happens with the gating! People will expect you to be on your main job the only job that can pass those gatings, you can't join on another job because of the gating SE makes!

So no it makes no sense to have gating in this game, least not the values we have.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4334155

They do it for a reason. I don't think it's ideal, but meh, it's working for them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eclipsed

And if you are 312 and people want 320 well, you are out of luck.

---

You can make your own PF with your own requirements. Even with lower ilvl requirements, they still fill up. At least on the Chaos datacentre. Problem solved.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YitharV2

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post4334155

They do it for a reason. I don't think it's ideal, but meh, it's working for them.

---

But id does not work:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DarkSlayerGrimm

thats the one thing that bothers me is we can level all classes on a single character but they put soooo many restrictive things that keeps you only having 1 job geared with the weekly limits, would it lessen the queue problems if we could properly gear a Tank/DPS/Healer instead of being forced to choose one?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

Then why gate??!?!?! Gating like they do encourages to feel forced to log in every day. The design of the game does not fit what is being said in that interview. Gating prevents you to from properly exploring other jobs then just one.

---

How do you feel forced to log in every day when you are sitting at the weekly cap? Just log in once a day and run just 1 roulette, the expert roulette, and by the end of the week of doing that, even if you only had an hour to play per day, you would be capped on tomestones. One weekend of running the raid with FC mates and that's it till next week.

The gating is not designed around people gearing up every class, its designed around letting people have breathers to go do something else and not burn out on FF. And if you want to "explore" other jobs then you got the uncapped tomestone gear and ex primal gear which is sufficient for the first couple floors of the savage raid. Only the best of the best gear is gated.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TankHunter678

How do you feel forced to log in every day when you are sitting at the weekly cap? Just log in once a day and run just 1 roulette, the expert roulette, and by the end of the week of doing that, even if you only had an hour to play perday, you would be capped on tomestones. One weekend of running the raid with FC mates and that's it till next week.

The gating is not designed around people gearing up every class, its designed around letting people have breathers to go do something else and not burn out on FF. And if you want to "explore" other jobs then you got the uncapped tomestone gear and ex primal gear which is sufficient for the first couple floors of the savage raid. Only the best of the best gear is gated.

---

You answered your own question. I am not saying I have no ability to cap, keep in mind I am questioning the concept itself because it does not let me gear more then one job. Log in in once a day to do expert roulette is still feeling forced to log in everyday, a concept that contradicts the video I was shown.

For your second point, having this gating is exactly what is happening, people are getting burned out with the gating, feeling they need to log in every day because of the gating, getting little return because of the gating, unable to gear more then one job because of the gating. The gating is burning people out. (having to do the same thing every day)

outdated gear is gated though, the delta normal is gated and it is 4th (or 5th, depending how you look at things) rate gear, 340 salvage > 330 creation <> (depends) 320 penta meld > 320 tri meld> (in most cases) 320 delta normal. Gated gear was outdated in this patch before you could even obtain it (320 delta normal body)

So I guess I have to ask again, why gate? it is pointless, harms the game, and the game contradicts itself having these gates (being able play all jobs on one character)

Ugh. Why is it, Square, that I don't have an edit button so I can edit my post and add more? Your phone forum layout sucks -.-

To tl;dr my expansive answer:


¯\_(ツ)_/¯

S-E is known for being silly as heck about their ilvl and invalidating their own gear for those who want to gear up and have a goal to play the game in the form of ilvl advancement.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

But id does not work:

---

Yes, it does. Citing one person doesn't change that, especially seeing their post is wrong. For the umpteenth time, only Savage recommends a higher ilvl than 290. Every other piece of content can be completed with the gear you receive from your job quest. If you aren't a raider, 330-340 is simply overkill. People queuing for dungeons don't care what your gear is provided you can get the job done. If, by stroke of bad fortunate, you get someone who whines you don't have 330 gear for Ala Mhigo. Ignore them because they're an idiot.

The Omega normal gear is intended only has an alternative to its crafting counterpart. It's for those who can't or simply don't want to pay the inflated MB prices. Pre-Stormblood, crafted gear remained over 1M for several weeks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

So I guess I have to ask again, why gate? it is pointless, harms the game, and the game contradicts itself having these gates (being able play all jobs on one character)

---

Do you have any kind of evidence that it harms the game, financial or otherwise? Excessive gating can to be sure, but coming from WoW? XIV has always seemed extremely lenient in that regard.

Whenever this topic comes up, people always seem to act as if gearing is the only content available in game. "Oh no! Reached max ilvl! Guess it's time to unsub!".

Obviously content can be cleared in gear provided by the easily farmed Verity, so no one truly needs to go higher. However, plenty of people want to be able to bring their absolute best to the content of their choosing (even filthy casuals like myself). As it stands now, alternate jobs suffer with gearing due to the caps, and it's very easy to feel forced into playing only one or two jobs as that's all you can gear efficiently.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

But id does not work:

---

It absolutely does work. It's worked for almost 4 years for them and they aren't going to change it until it stops working for them.

A few people having a complaint about it isn't going to make them shift gears and completely overhaul the system and anyone who expects otherwise is kidding themselves. The vast majority of players have no problem with the way the game's pattern and gearing goes. It's a solid business model and they have zero reason to change it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

So I guess I have to ask again, why gate? it is pointless, harms the game, and the game contradicts itself having these gates (being able play all jobs on one character)

---

There are plenty of reasons to gate it, such as keeping players consistently playing, which in turn keeps them subscribed for longer. That's the primary reason it's there, and the primary reason it's not going to change. Because doing so would actually be harmful to the game because it would affect them financially, far more so than those who might leave because they can't gear all their jobs in a week.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Yes, it does. Citing one person doesn't change that, especially seeing their post is wrong. For the umpteenth time, only Savage recommends a higher ilvl than 290. Every other piece of content can be completed with the gearyou receive from your job quest. If you aren't a raider, 330-340 is simply overkill. People queuing for dungeons don't care what your gear is provided you can get the job done. If, by stroke of bad fortunate, you get someone who whines you don't have 330 gear for Ala Mhigo. Ignore them because they're an idiot.

---

You are stating why gating is not needed. You said yourself you only need above 290 if you do not salvage. But if you do salvage gating impacts you. So why gate if for most people it does not effect the game? for the people that want to salvage more then one job, why gate them from doing so? No one has yet proven why gating is a benefit. It only harms the game from it's own concept, being able to play any job on one character.

For picking on what I quoted, that quote was the one linked to me, so I was commenting on that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daralii

Do you have any kind of evidence that it harms the game, financial or otherwise? Excessive gating can to be sure, but coming from WoW? XIV has always seemed extremely lenient in that regard.

---

Do you have any proof it helps? it clearly is a strain to keep doing the same thing over and over again to some people. How many people that effects varies and the only way to prove one way or another in an absolute matter if SE tries to cut out gating completely for a cycle. You can theory craft either way and there be disagreements to both.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

But id does not work:

---

It works in terms of making people sub longer and making more money for the company. That's what I mean by it's working for them. What I mean is if it wasn't working financially, SE would change it. The other thing about SE is that they have to be careful because PvE is the main focus, compared to Blizzard where they have more options.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YitharV2

It works in terms of making people sub longer and making more money for the company. That's what I mean by it's working for them. What I mean is if it wasn't working financially, SE would change it. The other thing about SE is that they have to be careful because PvE is the main focus, compared to Blizzard where they have more options.

---

Make a poll, how meany people play just because their friends do vs the game itself? Has nothing to do with gating helping their subs. People play because they are invested with the time spent in the game and their friends, not on the fact of repeated gating.

I guarantee you gating is not helping SE to keep people subbed. The server I am on is proof. People want to RP, Rp with their friends, and this one became the unofficial server for that. The biggest server for FFXIV was built on "I want to play with my friends"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

-snip-

---

I am feeling burned out because of a lack of story content, not gating. If it were not for the gating I really would be burned out and unsubbed by now. Another thing is that this time around they changed how the weekly tomestone is given on the dungeons so that the expert dungeons give out good amounts of the weekly tomestones, instead of the best method being to spam grind maps for Aquapolis/Canals.

Also, outside of melee DPS we do not gear individual classes but rather we gear roles.

If you get the fending set its for your PLD, WAR, and DRK. The only point different for them is going to be the weapon which just makes you run Susano EX a lot (which is easy for tanks). Aiming for Bard and MCH. Casting for BLM, SMN, and RDM. Healing for AST, SCH, and WHM.

Which means depending on your choice of class you are gearing up to 3 jobs at once excluding weapon. This means you can have savage geared tanks, creation geared healers, and omega normal/crafted/verity geared DPS. A lot better then back in HW where you were spending tomestones on your artifact ilvl 200 set per class.

In every MMO, even those that let you change jobs on the fly, people will (almost) always choose a main. They used to encourage you to play every class with the prerequisites for job unlock, cross-class actions, and the armory bonus; players complained and they took those out, so now there's less reasons to try another job that isn't your main. So if the problem is you don't have a main (and you've only mentioned BLM and MCH), maybe try another job? maybe try another role altogether? Buy the tome chest piece or pants and you'll have it for RDM/BLM/SMN, anyway.

They're not getting rid of the gating for many reasons that have already been said; do I wish I could have gotten my weapon on the second week after the tomestone dropped from V2S? Sure! (maybe increase the weekly cap to 500, pretty please?) Did I throw a fit? No! Hell, a part of me was thankful I only needed to do expert, omega/savage for a few days and then stop worrying about it until tuesday... We've even had posts up from people saying "I can only play around 1 hour a day, so if the tank is harassing us in expert and then rage quits, I just lost the entire day of playtime and am behind on the weekly cap!" The gating insures that the guy who can only play on weekends, or an hour or two after work, isn't completely left behind by the guy who capped on reset day, and even then the hardcore raider will get their 340 gear earlier than the casual, since the raider's likely to clear Savage before the casual can get their tome pieces.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

You are stating why gating is not needed. You said yourself you only need above 290 if you do not salvage. But if you do salvage gating impacts you. So why gate if for most people it does not effect the game? for the people that want to salvage more then one job, why gate them from doing so? No one has yet proven why gating is a benefit. It only harms the game from it's own concept, being able to play any job on one character.

---

Why do you need 330? Because you want it? That isn't an argument against gated content since you have no need for Creation unless you're a raider. As I cited earlier, we have an example of what happens with an uncapped tomestone in Verity. Within a month, most people completely geared the jobs they prefer playing, thus they have no incentive to keep running content. If I can freely obtain 330 gear at my leisure. Why am I going to run Omega normal? Why am I going to buy or make inferior crafted gear? Why would I run the upcoming 24 man raid more than once or twice? Why would I queue into roulettes? Short answer, I wouldn't. And that is why the gate exists. It's to incentivize players like me to continuously run content so others have shorter queue times.

Quote:

---

Do you have any proof it helps? it clearly is a strain to keep doing the same thing over and over again to some people. How many people that effects varies and the only way to prove one way or another in an absolute matter if SE tries to cut out gating completely for a cycle. You can theory craft either way and there be disagreements to both.

---

The burden of proof is on you. You're the only calling into question the validity the system, thus you have to provide evidence why it's hurting Square.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

Make a poll, how meany people play just because their friends do vs the game itself? Has nothing to do with gating helping their subs. People play because they are invested with the time spent in the game and their friends, not on the fact of repeated gating.

I guarantee you gating is not helping SE to keep people subbed. The server I am on is proof. People want to RP, Rp with their friends, and this one became the unofficial server for that. The biggest server for FFXIV was built on "I want to play with my friends"

---

You contradict yourself. If people only want to roleplay and play with friends, well, why do you need the highest level gear for all your jobs?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Why do you need 330? Because you want it? That isn't an argument against gated content since you have no need for Creation unless you're a raider.

---

Even raiders don't need higher gear. It simply makes doing higher level content run smoother, but this can be applied across the board. So why does anyone bother gearing? Because we want to.

Unfortunately I don't think this argument ever will come to a good conclusion as the same arguments constantly get tossed around with everyone being completely blind or unsympathetic to anyone's situation other than their own.

You have the group of people that already have a great static and fc, that already have a raid spot, all the support they need, and have no issues accomplishing anything they want in game. Nothing is wrong to these people as they have no issues. They say, "make friends and join us!". While being oblivious to the fact that when it comes down to putting their money where their mouth is they are cliquey and aren't looking for new friends (or at least the majority of others aren't). But hey... they are living the high life and everything smells like roses... right?

There are those that are passionate about changing things for the better. But they are not part of the "cool crowd" and too often divided amongst themselves. Many just quit without ever saying a word. Lack of visibility and division in how they imagine fixing the issues keeps them crippled.

Then you get the people who are fine with never doing savage. Just want social fun and ascetics. They are perfectly happy with how things are because they aren't even looking for the end of the road. They are having fun doing whatever it is they do and all is good. Stop and smell the roses right? Why have larger goals?

Which btw, all these types are fine... Nothing wrong with being who or what you are... But what is wrong is the complete lack of empathy between them. Noone cares to look over the fence and see how the other side are doing. Those who do step out of line and play the devil's advocate are vilified. So these conversations always fail to reach compromise. Everyone is right, noone but them could possibly have a valid opinion... And the cycle continues... If we had good conversations where people respected others opinions we might be able to find something that we all can live with but why be productive? It's so much easier just to keep doing this...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

You are stating why gating is not needed. You said yourself you only need above 290 if you do not salvage. But if you do salvage gating impacts you.

---

I'd hope anyone wanting to do savage knows what the content is actually called...

Player skill matters way more than the difference in ilvl between uncapped and capped gear. Savage was cleared entirely by world first groups in gear available the first week. Yes, getting higher ilvl makes runs go smoother, but lack of the capped gear on an alt job isn't realistically holding anyone back.

And, considering the difficulty of content that is in the DF.. no, weekly caps are not why DPS have long queues. Verity gear is more than enough for everything in the standard DF. I mean, come on, the new AF works for that content...

I have a question for everyone supporting this concept of gating this game does (and contradicts itself of allowing you play more then 1 job)Why where you doing delta normal after the second week? the 320 gear is cheap, cheaper then I am willing to even craft for it (meaning not worth my time to do so) This means if I was in a static, or invited to one, I would buy all the 320 gear for every slot for the job they needed and penta meld all the slots. This makes the 320 delta normal outdated on the second week of release, and this gated gear of taking 4 weeks to get, was outdated before you can obtain it. How can you support something like this? delta normal shouldn't been gated on 4.05+ because it is outdated gear, and i do not get gating 330 gear behind outdated content (running the same thing that got you 310 gear in 4.0)

So why run delta normal? How does gating help the game at all? This was never explained. I was asked why do I need 330 gear but that question can be flipped back to them. Why do you need 330 gear? people cleared salvage pena melding 320 crafted. Why do you need 340 gear? Why care what other people have? What I do not like is sometime in the near future, I would be gated from not being able to play what is needed because I chosen the wrong job to gear and would be unable play with my friends. THAT is why it bothers me, that is why I do not like it, I do not want to run in the situation I can't play with my friends because of concepts that do not fit the game. (You can play whatever job you want, but can only gear one) How are we supposed to know what to pick when it takes months to gear something because of time gates?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eclipsed

Unfortunately I don't think this argument ever will come to a good conclusion as the same arguments constantly get tossed around with everyone being completely blind or unsympathetic to anyone's situation other than their own.

You have the group of people that already have a great static and fc, that already have a raid spot, all the support they need, and have no issues accomplishing anything they want in game. Nothing is wrong to these people as they have no issues. They say, "make friends and join us!". While being oblivious to the fact that when it comes down to putting their money where their mouth is they are cliquey and aren't looking for new friends (or at least the majority of others aren't). But hey... they are living the high life and everything smells like roses... right?

There are those that are passionate about changing things for the better. But they are not part of the "cool crowd" and too often divided amongst themselves. Many just quit without ever saying a word. Lack of visibility and division in how they imagine fixing the issues keeps them crippled.

Then you get the people who are fine with never doing savage. Just want social fun and ascetics. They are perfectly happy with how things are because they aren't even looking for the end of the road. They are having fun doing whatever it is they do and all is good. Stop and smell the roses right? Why have larger goals?

Which btw, all these types are fine... Nothing wrong with being who or what you are... But what is wrong is the complete lack of empathy between them. Noone cares to look over the fence and see how the other side are doing. Those who do step out of line and play the devil's advocate are vilified. So these conversations always fail to reach compromise. Everyone is right, noone but them could possibly have a valid opinion... And the cycle continues... If we had good conversations where people respected others opinions we might be able to find something that we all can live with but why be productive? It's so much easier just to keep doing this...

---

Well said

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sho86

Until said raiders come storming into dailies, with some making more than a fuss that people are slow at pulling, stressing others out with their iLvl, which in turn makes these threads. Full circle lol.

---

Literally have never seen that happen. The only time people make comments about gear/ilvls in daily content is when there is some extreme outlier. For example: an individual running Expert roulette with an NQ level 52 weapon (there was a post about this in the DF thread a while back), or a tank coming into The Vault wearing his i90 job gear and a level 5 Weathered Choker (saw this on reddit a couple days ago). Unless you're wearing something extremely underleveled for the content, reasonable people in roulettes generally do not care. I don't even examine individuals' gear unless I notice a glaring issue (e.g., super squishy tank WITH tank stance and cooldowns; a party member with suspiciously low HP compared to the others; etc.).

Now, if you're talking Ex primals or Savage, yes, people will sometimes make a comment if you come into V1S as a tank wearing an i300 body piece when you should at least be wearing the Verity body, if for nothing else than the defense boost it gives. But for all the daily content, max ilvl and full Creation is hardly necessary.



If people utilized all the gear options available to them, they could easily gear up different jobs. The 320 crafted gear, at least on my server, is far cheaper than any of the HW crafted gear ever was during its relative patch. Omega normal, if you plan your tokens correctly, can be used to gear other jobs and net you 1-2 new pieces weekly. Verity is still viable for Daily content and the two current Ex primals. Even V1S and V2S can be cleared with a mixture of Verity pieces, Creation, and Omega Normal. You don't even need crafted gear to clear it; the extra melds and stat boosts just help make clears faster/smoother.

I have 3 level 70 jobs. My main (BRD) is i320, which I raid with. AST and RDM, my two secondaries, are i315, which I do other content with (including Ex primals). I'm using Omega normal tokens to gear both my secondaries, and only Creation/Savage drops for BRD. However, if my static doesn't want any healer or caster drops, yay, free gear for my secondaries. Not to mention, I'm almost to the point where I can easily craft the i320 stuff for myself (just need a few more melds on my non-specialists to meet the crafting requirements), even though I can afford to just buy it outright because it's not that expensive compared to previous sets of crafted gear.

If people only limit themselves to one gearing option (e.g., capped tomestones) then they don't have anyone to blame for it but themselves. Use all your options, three of which don't even require gil (Ex primals, Omega Normal, and uncapped tomes).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

I can gear all my jobs to 320 + in 5 minutes if I wanted, the question is what is the point in doing that? If 310-320 is good enough for everything how can you argue there is content to do? As said I cap every week, I am a 70-2 star omni-crafter, though not top melded so I can't do it fast, with the cost of 320 on the MB, it is far more worth it just to buy from the MB as I take 30 seconds to get the same profit margins as the 320 stuff on other things, in 30 seconds. (Oh and the reason I said 320 + is because I have 1k+ in creation because I do not know what to spend them on, because I do not have a job to invest that kind of gating into. I used to just put them on BLM because I like the feel of it, now I don't)

---

Wait. If you can "easily gear all your jobs to 320+" via being an omni-2** crafter, and if you don't do any sort of Savage raids, then why exactly are you here complaining about not being able to gear all of your jobs? What would unlocking Creation tomestones do, other than give you another ungated gearing option when you literally already have one? Or are you here trying to speak for the "little man"?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skivvy

Even raiders don't need higher gear. It simply makes doing higher level content run smoother, but this can be applied across the board. So why does anyone bother gearing? Because we want to.

---

Yep. I mentioned earlier, I did V1-3 Savage with half Verity gear. A smoother run though doesn't mean tomestones should be unlocked so you can bounce jobs at your leisure. That would just result in everyone having everything within a month ala Verity gear.

Yup your problem isn't the gating, it's wanting the highest available gear right now... Which a) is gated behind time and rng only because you don't need it and b) it's the highest available so you still want it! Basically it's an extra reward, so you keep going for the carrot.

They got you! Don't worry it's a very good trick, most people can't stop before they got it, it's like a red rag to a bull. Friendships have been lost over buddies winning 'your' rng loot. :rolleyes:

Calm down, penta meld away and remember the highest ilevels are always completely optional. Very nice to have, for the short time they are the highest, but not worth getting mad over by a long shot. RNG and time-gating, baby! :)

Come here for a /pet :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Noshpan

If they didn't gate, then you would have the cutting-edge raiders complaining about there being no worthy content for them to do.

---

To be honest that doesn't really work at all. All it does is have players moaning more frequently if anything.

Tuesday reset. Do omega get my drops. That's it nothing to do till next week except a few experts.. gating content doesn't mean there's more worthy content for them to do. Not does it mean they spend less time with nothing to do. Because it takes them a couple of hours a week to do everything and the rest of week with nothing to do till reset.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Yep. I mentioned earlier, I did V1-3 Savage with half Verity gear. A smoother run though doesn't mean tomestones should be unlocked so you can bounce jobs at your leisure. That would just result in everyone having everything within a month ala Verity gear.

---

Gotta stop speaking in absolutes. Not everyone would max our gear in a month. There will always be people who max out all jobs/gear at an incredibly quick pace, but I imagine most people don't go that route.

Since all content can be done in Verity, which is uncapped, why bother having a cap on gear that is optional?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

I have a question for everyone supporting this concept of gating this game does (and contradicts itself of allowing you play more then 1 job)Why where you doing delta normal after the second week? the 320 gear is cheap, cheaper then I am willing to even craft for it (meaning not worth my time to do so)

---

I can answer that! :D Not everyone has the money to buy them all (in fact, the median FFXIV player, especially a casual is under 10mil, most of the casuals (in this context meaning not crafters/raiders) will average around 3mil (here in Faerie, each piece averages 750-800k, cheaper than other crafted gear has been, still not cheap for the regular player). The stats on the crafted gear may not be what I want, unless I use it for progression. I don't want to SPEND the money, since I'm saving up for a mansion. It may not be worth it if I'm getting the 340 from Savage AND it has the sub-stats I'm going for.

There are plenty of reasons, take your pick. There's nothing WRONG with using all crafted gear if that's what you want, but I think we've agreed you don't HAVE to do something if you don't want to.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skivvy

Gotta stop speaking in absolutes. Not everyone would max our gear in a month. There will always be people who max out all jobs/gear at an incredibly quick pace, but I imagine most people don't go that route.

Since all content can be done in Verity, which is uncapped, why bother having a cap on gear that is optional?

---

That isn't absolutes. Verity is proof the moment you uncap tomestones, people will grind them. A month isn't an incredible pace either, hence why so many have Verity gear now. The cap exists for the reasons already stated; to keep people doing content. The devs want players like me to queue into roulettes 3-4 months from now when I normally wouldn't. They want me queuing into Leveling roulette so people aren't waiting, which I wouldn't do if I could grind tomestones earlier. Jumping ahead to 4.1, why are people going to run Ivalice multiple times when they already have equivalent or better gear? They aren't. Just like crafted gear and Omega normal, Ivalice would be dying content practically when it released since it's gear drops would be meaningless.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eclipsed

But what is wrong is the complete lack of empathy between them. Noone cares to look over the fence and see how the other side are doing. Those who do step out of line and play the devil's advocate are vilified. So these conversations always fail to reach compromise. Everyone is right, noone but them could possibly have a valid opinion... And the cycle continues... If we had good conversations where people respected others opinions we might be able to find something that we all can live with but why be productive? It's so much easier just to keep doing this...

---

Empathy for what? Your (generalizing) inability to have the best gear despite not raiding? Why should I care if you aren't putting forth the effort to make friends and cultivate the environment you wish to have? All I see here is an endlessly stream of excuses. I joined this game at the behest of a friend who quit shortly thereafter when she got fed up of RNG. For several months I basically played by myself until poking into FCs and meeting new people who I now keep in touch with regularly one year later. Likewise, my static formed from pugging Sophia EX and someone taking the initiative to make a linkshell so it were easier to contact people. What started as just randoms became a static that's lasted almost a year now. Nothing about that was clique-y nor do I post it to say I'm somehow luckier than most. I met these people because I put myself out there and kept in contact with those I liked. One of my friends now I met by sending a random tell to her after finding her search info funny.

You aren't going to get a better experience waiting around for it to happen.

Would also like to point out that if you really wanted to gear up extra jobs to play with them you could create alts. Even a basic account allows you up to 8 characters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Empathy for what? Your (generalizing) inability to have the best gear despite not raiding? Why should I care if you aren't putting forth the effort to make friends and cultivate the environment you wish to have? All I see here is an endlessly stream of excuses. I joined this game at the behest of a friend who quit shortly thereafter when she got fed up of RNG. For several months I basically played by myself until poking into FCs and meeting new people who I now keep in touch with regularly one year later. Likewise, my static formed from pugging Sophia EX and someone taking the initiative to make a linkshell to make it easier to contact people. What started as just randoms became a static that's lasted almost a year now. Nothing about that was clique-y nor do I post it to say I'm somehow luckier than most. I met these people because I put myself out there and kept in contact with those I liked. One of my friends now I met by sending a random tell to her after finding her search info funny.

You aren't going to get a better experience waiting around for it to happen.

---

Duh? But get off your high horse for a moment and take a look around outside your castle you have built for yourself. It is a different world out there now. Personally I have all I need, I still have an FC and several LS'es of friends from 1.0. But that doesn't mean that I am so egotistical that I can't see that there are issues and that things could be better. That there are those that want something different or more.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Snow_Princess

You are stating why gating is not needed. You said yourself you only need above 290 if you do not salvage. But if you do salvage gating impacts you. So why gate if for most people it does not effect the game? for the people that want to salvage more then one job, why gate them from doing so? No one has yet proven why gating is a benefit. It only harms the game from it's own concept, being able to play any job on one character.

---

People who raid/do Savage content generally do so on a singular job: generally speaking, their favorite job or the job they are most comfortable with. This is especially true for people who are in statics, where you don't just play roulette with jobs/roles but have set roles for each member. I don't raid on BRD one week and then switch to AST the next week, and then plan to roll RDM the week after that. No, that's not how it generally works. When the lockouts are removed the next patch, then people start to run Savage raids on secondary jobs because they are free to do so, and are usually already geared up on their main anyways. People roll a singular job for Savage during lockout to be able to roll Need on the gear they want if it drops, and for comfort reasons.

I can still roll my other jobs even though only BRD has pieces of Creation/Genji gear. Literally nothing is stopping me from doing that, and nothing is stopping others from playing all the jobs as well. You do not need max ilvl on every job not even 2 months after an expansion was released to do the majority of content. I can even take RDM and AST into Savage, and they aren't as "geared" as my main. Nothing stops me from doing that other than the fact that my designated role in my static is BRD and I am far more comfortable/would rather run the fights on BRD for the time being.

Do you have all jobs to 70? Are you picking jobs out of a hat to do your weekly Savage runs?

Semi-related; I'm still hoping one day they'll tack any uncollected tomestones onto the weekly cap. That is to say, you'll never be able to get more than 450 a 'week' still, but people can still play catch up if & whenever needed. While poopsocking is a genuine concern the devs have, the other side of the coin is if for whatever reason I miss a week or can't cap, I'm near permanently behind as far as Creation tomes go.

Really don't think that's unreasonable to ask for.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eclipsed

Duh? But get off your high horse for a moment and take a look around outside your castle you have built for yourself. It is a different world out there now. Personally I have all I need, I still have an FC and several LS'es of friends from 1.0. But that doesn't mean that I am so egotistical that I can't see that there are issues and that things could be better. That there are those that want something different or more.

---

What high horse? There is literally nothing stopping people from doing the same things I did. Instead of looking at how much better person xyz has it, how about cultivating that for yourself? That was the crux of my post, which you seemingly missed. Will it work out immediately. Nope. It didn't for me either. You just keep going and you'll eventually meet people you mesh with. You're the one trying to make it seem like there is a divide. You may have issues with progression, but I don't. That has nothing to do with my purported "castle." I simply don't cling to the notion you can only do content with the best gear.