Why isn't housing priced higher? (why is housing random luck)

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

but would that mean that I'm still not allowed to sell it?

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the thing is, you can't actually sell it at all. the game has no mechanism for you to sell a plot to another player. you're not selling the plot, you're selling inside information so that someone can line up to buy it first the minute you relinquish it. so as far as the game is concerned, that's still not allowed no matter what the intention is.

As long as you ask money for leaving the plot, it's reselling.
Of course you're not selling it to another player directly but charging him for leaving the plot is considered as making the game less pleasant for others (sorry did not know how to formulate it in english propely ^^") Thus you can be reported and have to deal with a GM

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Originally Posted by Azurymber

if RMT is an issue why not just make 1 or 2 wards where you buy houses through the mogstation.

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it's currently not an issue but more people would feel like they have to RMT to get houses if you raise the plots to $200M.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

Completely missed the point, being that it's unfair to anyone not able to be on when the servers come up since they'll all be scooped up fast like each other time there's been new houses.

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no, i didn't. who has 200M in the game and can't afford to wake up 1 day at 4 AM or take a day off work/school. if you have that little control of your life that's just too bad but i can't imagine those people would be able to afford 150-200M gil for the plots.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

Just out of curiosity, I have a medium in Mist at the moment, and if someone I know grabs a large plot, I'll be living there and will no longer need my plot. Now it's in a current ward, so it's obvious I'm not buying and reselling, but would that mean that I'm still not allowed to sell it? Would people actually prefer that I wait out 45 days (from whenever the counter restarts)? Or are we directing this solely to people who are buying for the sake of reselling?

I am fine with waiting it out, but it seems like a shame to keep an abandoned plot (especially in Mist) when someone out there could have one.

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Right now you can't wait out the 45 days, it has been suspended due to the storms that wreak havoc in Japan recently with no date on when they will restart the reclamation system.

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Originally Posted by Bixillarla

Right now you can't wait out the 45 days, it has been suspended due to the storms that wreak havoc in Japan recently with no date on when they will restart the reclamation system.

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The patch notes say 3.35. That would still be more than a month away though.

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Originally Posted by Bixillarla

Right now you can't wait out the 45 days, it has been suspended due to the storms that wreak havoc in Japan recently with no date on when they will restart the reclamation system.

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It was suspended because of the Japanese Earthquake that occurred. Not the storms.

Patch notes say that auto demolition will return with patch 3.5 whenever that is.

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Originally Posted by Celef

well, i'll get my little fingers ready to report then



Fine, in that case, why should someone who does not have a house pay the same sub that someone who does ? If we can't all have access to the same content because some of it is "exclusive" we should get a discount on the sub. -snip-

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That's like saying that people who don't have ponies or birds yet should get a discount on their sub. Housing, like these is not exclusive. It's available to everyone in game. Sure more populated servers fill up fast-they took some measures to get rid of inactive's holding houses. And it all depends on the server you play on. Our server had a lot of houses around for a long time. It was only a few months ago that the last plot was sold. Housing is not a requirement and you aren't gonna be gimped if you don't have one. It's purely cosmetic (except gardening which..well theres still a marketboard and if u really need it, why not ask to joint someone's personal?)

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Originally Posted by birdy_reene

This must be a big server issue. Cause all us little servers never see this issue. On Zalera it took weeks for all the houses to sell that became available durning the inactivity purge that started.

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Same with us in Cactuar.

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Originally Posted by neoxdeciple

i think the biggest problem is solo players being able to buy houses. At present I'm in the same bout as some others and i COULD by all rights go buy 3 large houses with my main and a large for my guild and that's 4 houses gone to one player with this limited amount of plots, but I wont. Plots should have never been made to be able to become personal houses. Should have been a completely separate feature.

I don't feel bad for solo players not being able to get a house but i DO for the guilds that all work together to get one just to see they cant and miss out on the multiple features available for them.

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Personally, I completely agree with you here. While a personal house is cool..it should be seperate from FC housing or nonexistant altogether. Housing has more value to an FC

I'm baffled that a resource so limited as plots is not limited one per account.

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Originally Posted by Celef

Fine, in that case, why should someone who does not have a house pay the same sub that someone who does ? If we can't all have access to the same content because some of it is "exclusive" we should get a discount on the sub.

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Sorry but I just found this response absolutely hilarious.

Requiring a lot of in-game currency for something does not make something "exclusive". Anyone can make gil. It is just a matter of how much time and effort they are willing to spend on making that gil. Some of the richest people on the server do nothing in the game but craft and make gil. That's why they are so rich. If you want that amount of wealth then that's what it takes.

You pay for sub, and if you "choose" not to partake in a certain piece of content, does that make you eligible for a cheaper sub? Hell no.

That is effectively what you are arguing here though..

(I do sense a hint of sarcasm in your post. Apologies if there isn't any).

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Originally Posted by Celef

As long as you ask money for leaving the plot, it's reselling.
Of course you're not selling it to another player directly but charging him for leaving the plot is considered as making the game less pleasant for others (sorry did not know how to formulate it in english propely ^^") Thus you can be reported and have to deal with a GM

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I kind of get that, but at the same time what are people meant to do if they don't use their plot and the demolition is also on hold? If people have, and are willing to pay, the gil to make such a deal, surely it will be the opposite of making the game less pleasant for them? I'm definitely not giving up my plot for free, but I'm personally not trying to make profit either, I would be happy receiving what I paid for it only.

It's similar to people who risked demolishing their plots in the hopes to get a larger/better plot for 3.3. I highly doubt they freely gave up their plots, they must have sold it. And I see that as acceptable because SE have yet to give us any other solution to getting rid of plots.

(Please note that buying solely to resell is not something that I am condoning. But it doesn't take a genius to distinguish between those people and people who geniunely have no use for their plot anymore.)

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

I kind of get that, but at the same time what are people meant to do if they don't use their plot and the demolition is also on hold? If people have, and are willing to pay, the gil to make such a deal, surely it will be the opposite of making the game less pleasant for them? I'm definitely not giving up my plot for free, but I'm personally not trying to make profit either, I would be happy receiving what I paid for it only.

It's similar to people who risked demolishing their plots in the hopes to get a larger/better plot for 3.3. I highly doubt they freely gave up their plots, they must have sold it. And I see that as acceptable because SE have yet to give us any other solution to getting rid of plots.

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You do realize they have to pay you and then pay the price again right. You don't have the right to sell them. You risk a ban. Now whether or not SE will enforce that strictly is another matter. They plan to implement transfers and how that will be done is yet to be seen. Will you be able to upgrade a small to a medium that way? Hard to say.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

You do realize they have to pay you and then pay the price again right. You don't have the right to sell them. You risk a ban. Now whether or not SE will enforce that strictly is another matter.

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I do know that, and my point is that some people have the gil and would be okay with spending that much for a plot. Yeah it does suck for people who aren't that rich, but if SE have made no other options then what exactly do people expect?

The one, somewhat flawed, option of auto-demolition is also on hold. So there literally is no other option at the moment.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

I do know that, and my point is that some people have the gil and would be okay with spending that much for a plot. Yeah it does suck for people who aren't that rich, but if SE have made no other options then what exactly do people expect?

The one, somewhat flawed, option of auto-demolition is also on hold. So there literally is no other option at the moment.

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Well you do have the option to wait. You also have the option to risk a ban if reported and a GM decides it's something they want to do. Now if it's done privately the chances are perhaps small that would happen but if you advertise in party finder you're taking a big risk in my opinion. I wouldn't risk my account for a few million gil.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

They plan to implement transfers and how that will be done is yet to be seen. Will you be able to upgrade a small to a medium that way? Hard to say.

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This feature should have been added before new wards were being released. As it is not, it's not really a solution for anyone at the moment as the likelihood of plots even being available then will be very slim.

Honestly the whole "rich buying plots to sell for more later" comes from SE's poorly designed system of not being able to sell off your land to other players in a hard coded system.

I am sure a lot of people would be willing to put their plot up for sale if the minimum price was hardcoded. Players should be able to "put their plot up for sale", however the easiest way around it would be to cap the price at the maximum for the plot, or simply hard-code it similar to how plot prices depreciate while they are on the "market".

For example.. (using the 3.3 prices just to make it easy).
House owner of a Mansion wants to sell their house, and flag it as "For Sale".
House buyer can immediatly buy it for max price (50 mil), and house seller receives the minimum price for the plot (25 mil). 25 mil goes in the sink.
The longer the house is "for sale" the more it depreciates, until hitting the minimum price (25mil).

Basically the difference between the minimum and the actual purchase price disappears into the sink, and the original home owner gets the minimum price back for their land, regardless how long it takes to sell..

What would this mean? Seller gets the minimum price for the plot back, buyer only spends as much as they should (if they were to buy a new plot from the server). Only difference is the amount of gil that gets sunk is smaller.

I believe this system is better as it doesn't totally stuff over the buyer by having to effectively pay double, the seller still gets a portion of what they paid back, and it would encourage more plot fluctuations when people come and go from the game which would potentially end up being a better gil sink as this would be more frequent then someone completely relinquishing their house or risking the ban hammer for selling..

Basically my point is a lot of the problems come from the system itself. They could simply improve the buying/selling system where none of these issues would be a problem, and there wouldn't be anything to ban in the first place - as the system could quite easily be fair for all parties involved, and still sink some gil in the process.

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Originally Posted by RoseOfTheRaven

That's like saying that people who don't have ponies or birds yet should get a discount on their sub. Housing, like these is not exclusive. It's available to everyone in game. Sure more populated servers fill up fast-they took some measures to get rid of inactive's holding houses. And it all depends on the server you play on. Housing is not a requirement and you aren't gonna be gimped if you don't have one. It's purely cosmetic (except gardening which..well theres still a marketboard and if u really need it, why not ask to joint someone's personal?)

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No

You can farm birdies if you want / have the time because there is enought birds., You can't farm houses if there is not enough plot so it is exclusive cause a lot of players can't have access to it, not because of time / money issues but because SE did not add enoough of it for everyone.
And yes, no houses means no gardening, no stabble for chocobo and, for FC no airship so no, housing is not just cosmetic, it envolves features

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Originally Posted by RoseOfTheRaven

Our server had a lot of houses around for a long time. It was only a few months ago that the last plot was sold.

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Fine, if SE won't add enough plot for everyone to get a house on "populated servres", then just give me a free transfer so i can go to a less populated server. Why should i pay if SE does not want to give the opportinity to EVERYONE to play the same game ?

Let's take an example you got to a restaurant and take the menu with cake as desert but....no more cake so no mor desert.
Won't you ask for a discount cause you don't want to pay for the food you cant' have because not enough supplies ? here is the same

Well they ARE adding a ton of plots like in two days, so it's not like they're ignoring the issue.

And they also know that won't be enough considering the tone of players trying to get a house cause they don't have one and those buying just to resell

Part of the appeal of housing is it's lack of constant availability and they are working on it with several methods. Adding more plots and returning unused houses. That's enough for now. If you really want a house and you have Gil to burn you can make a pf asking for someone willing to sell. That's fundamentally and morally different then someone seeking to sell. It changes from "I'm out to make a profit" to "I'm out to make someone a profit and get something in return."

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Originally Posted by Celef

fine, in that case, why should someone who does not have a house pay the same sub that someone who does ? If we can't all have access to the same content because some of it is "exclusive" we should get a discount on the sub. A)

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My bad, I shouldn't have used the word exlusive, but everyone do have access to get a house. The way you say things, sounds like 90% of the crafters should pay less sub too, because many can't afford being 3 star crafter.

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Originally Posted by Seraphix2407

My bad, I shouldn't have used the word exlusive, but everyone do have access to get a house. The way you say things, sounds like 90% of the crafters should pay less sub too, because many can't afford being 3 star crafter.

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There is a difference. Everyone can get 3 stars at so point in the game through hard work, time and effort, SE did not say "ok guys, we only have 100 players able to unlock the 3 stars then, we lock everything"
If 10 players want a house but SE just add 6, 4 players won't have one because not enought plots, that's a fact, it has nothing to do with crafters who don't have the time / patience / wish to get to 3 stars

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Originally Posted by Celef

There is a difference. Everyone can get 3 stars at so point in the game through hard work, time and effort, SE did not say "ok guys, we only have 100 players able to unlock the 3 stars then, we lock everything"
If 10 players want a house but SE just add 6, 4 players won't have one because not enought plots, that's a fact, it has nothing to do with crafters who don't have the time / patience / wish to get to 3 stars

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To be fair though, there's always someone willing to sell their plot for the right price. One could argue that you (and your FC) could put in some of that hard work, time and effort to get yourselves a plot. Yeah you'll be paying extra, but that doesn't mean to say it's a feature that is unavailable to you. It's not completely fair on the buyer, but at the same time it's also not fair to say that you're being completely excluded from housing. Put in the work, get those millions, and start looking for people willing to sell.

And, just for curiosity, how much do you sell your plot.....? considering the prices we saw before (100M for a small plot just to leave it, then add the price of the plot....)

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Originally Posted by Celef

There is a difference. Everyone can get 3 stars at so point in the game through hard work, time and effort

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Everyone can get 3 star, but let's be honest, are there many people who buy 220 gear much as they did back when 3.2 was out? Highly doubt it. If you want a fc house, you guys start crafting, doing things together and buy one. If it's for your own use, you know what you have to do. My fc worked hard for our fc house and we was the second large on server when they first realeased the housing. Crafting, gathering etc helped us a long way. Lot's of cool people in fc also donated their own money as well. I was giving u the crafter example because many people can't get things they want even when they pay a full sub too. You said earlier you ''want to pay less sub'' because housing isn't avaible for you, which it is. All what matter is how hard you try.

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Originally Posted by Celef

And, just for curiosity, how much do you sell your plot.....? considering the prices we saw before (100M for a small plot just to leave it, then add the price of the plot....)

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Okay, that's a slight exaggeration. I'm on the same server as you and for a very long time small plots were going for 10-15 mil. I haven't checked recently, as I already have a house, but I know of people who have recently purchased plots, and they didn't spend more than 20 mil. Now if you take that price, it's still less than what a medium would cost, and the size of the plot doesn't greatly impact the features available to an FC.

From personal experience, I can say that making up to 20 million is not very difficult if you craft alone. So if you have an entire FC saving up, you should get there in no time.

Edit: A few years ago, available housing plots on some servers would start at hundreds of millions, with small plots being around the 50 mil mark. Consider now everyone has a tonne more gil, and they're only asking for 4 mil for a small plot, there isn't much to complain about gil wise.

Edit: And just in case you were specifically asking me, I paid 28 mil for my medium plot, so if I was to sell it, I would be happy with just that.

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Originally Posted by Seraphix2407

Everyone can get 3 star, but let's be honest, are there many people who buy 220 gear much as they did back when 3.2 was out? Highly doubt it.

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I agree with you, but they "could" and that the big difference. The problem here is that SE do not add enough plots for everyone,

Same example as before you want a 220 gear ? if you have the money and see this as interesting for you, you can buy it or farm it if there is no offer on MB.
You have the 4M needed to get a plot at 3.3 but so do the all server and there is only 4 new shards so ?
Even if you want and gils speaking can, you might not be abble to get one, no matter how hard you and your FC members worked (cause yeah, we work hard to get those gils) and that's the probleme, not the players, not the amount of gils needed BUT the amount of plots available.

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Originally Posted by Celef

I agree with you, but they "could" and that the big difference.

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Well what I meant was the 3 star stuff got outdated pretty fast, when I talked about the 220 gear. That's the whole reason why people wanted 3 star to begin with, many wanted that and do it but I know most and I talk over 80% playerbase can't afford it or didn't pull enough effort to get one. My friend had 2 mil like 1 week ago, has 14 mil now, all they been doing is gathering and selling materia and want's to buy a medium house. Doesn't mean they have to pay less sub because they couldn't do it when it was at it's peak time.

Many people want's alot of stuff, but a big % of the playerbase can't get or afford. That's how it is, in any game actually. Some games require skills to obtain what you want, some games like this you require skill/time/gil to get what you want. The house is avaible for you much as its avaible for everyone else. It's up to each person how much they want it, if they clearly been ''farming'' for months but still can't afford one, means they simply didn't want it enough. People who have gil ready should be avaible to get a house in the next patch, many of them atleast, and I talk about filling up the plots each server gets. I get there are more people who do want one but cant get it and there are reasons for that, like you said not enough plots, then it's about having enough gil. I do agree there should been more plots, but my policy is if you want one so badly you should have put enough effort to get one earlier or now if you really want one. If you want a fc house and some people in your fc cant be on, what you do is put the gil in the fc chest and make it avaible for people who leads in it to buy it when you can. I got my houses early and that's because I worked hard for it. Keep in mind I bought my own personal house last year and there was over 50-100 plots still avaible on my server, around that time it was about gil than having enough plots. However many can't afford and want's one.

What I truely wish they could do is add more items on the housing. 200 is a low number for a large house.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Spending the money on mogstation isn't the solution. There are apartments coming.

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At the rate SE goes, apartments will be here in 2019. xD

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

To be fair though, there's always someone willing to sell their plot for the right price. One could argue that you (and your FC) could put in some of that hard work, time and effort to get yourselves a plot. Yeah you'll be paying extra, but that doesn't mean to say it's a feature that is unavailable to you. It's not completely fair on the buyer, but at the same time it's also not fair to say that you're being completely excluded from housing. Put in the work, get those millions, and start looking for people willing to sell.

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How is working around the system not being excluded? The simple point is they have designed a system that does not allow everyone the SAME CHANCE to experience content.

It is pretty obvious that the person everyone is quoting just wants the ability to experience the same content. They are not asking for moogles to bring them gil or a house. Paying a second party to relinquish a house is not the same content. Unless SE steps up and says we don't want everyone to have houses fend for yourselves. But basically they mostly ignore all housing issues.

On a separate note what is with the defending of the system. It is a fail system, that they have doubled down on. Some servers have had houses available for a whole 2 mins in the last 18 months. They also can't seem to differentiate between a full server and a wasteland server. If Balmung and Gilgamesh are sold out in less then 5 mins it will mean there have been houses available for a total of 7 mins in almost 2 years.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

Just out of curiosity, I have a medium in Mist at the moment, and if someone I know grabs a large plot, I'll be living there and will no longer need my plot. Now it's in a current ward, so it's obvious I'm not buying and reselling, but would that mean that I'm still not allowed to sell it? Would people actually prefer that I wait out 45 days (from whenever the counter restarts)? Or are we directing this solely to people who are buying for the sake of reselling?

I am fine with waiting it out, but it seems like a shame to keep an abandoned plot (especially in Mist) when someone out there could have one.

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You can sell it if someone is asking to buy one or advertise in buying one.

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Originally Posted by Stormrider

H
It is pretty obvious that the person everyone is quoting just wants the ability to experience the same content. They are not asking for moogles to bring them gil or a house. Paying a second party to relinquish a house is not the same content. Unless SE steps up and says we don't want everyone to have houses fend for yourselves. But basically they mostly ignore all housing issues.

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Thank you for being the only one after all those post to understand what i'm trying to explain

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Originally Posted by Stormrider

-Snip-

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No one was actually saying that the current system is good. I'm sure all of us agree it's terrible. However we were simply stating that in this current situation, rather than playing victim just save up extra gil and go for what you want. My point wasn't that it's fair, because it's not, but there are still means of getting housing, even if it does require more effort than clicking a placard.

It would be great for SE to completely redo the housing system and make it available for everyone, but if we're being real here that is not coming any time soon. So work with what we have right now. It's not impossible to find housing, even now there are a lot of people selling plots.

its to late

Reselling of plots is a misnomer. What it actually is, is something called Racketeering. Yes, I looked it up to make sure I was using it correctly. That's why on Balmung there's a group of people we 'lovingly' refer to as the Housing Mafia.

Yes we have a group of people who are dedicated to buying as many houses as possible and then reselling almost immediately to the highest bidder. These people get together and rush houses, with one person opening trade windows with legitimate buyers so their partner can purchase the land. Because thanks to SE's coding, you can't interact with ANYTHING while you have a trade window up.

So back to Racketeering, we've all heard it before but what is it? Simply put, it is causing people to pay you for a solution to a problem that wouldn't exist if it wasn't for your actions in the first place, i.e. Protection Racket: Give us money to 'protect' you or we'll trash your place and beat you up.

People who purposely buy houses just to get someone to pay them to leave are actively participating in a Racketeering scheme. No one would have to pay them if they hadn't bought the house in the first place. They would have just paid SE the money and went on their merry way.

Everyone else are doing it unknowingly. It doesn't make you any less guilty but you don't appear as malicious as the Housing Mafia. You're just trying to get back the money you gave to SE. Except you're not meant to get it back. It's supposed to be gone, forever, unless you wait out the 45days and then you get back a portion.

If this was happening in real life, there would be arrests made. Since this is in game, I think a ban and automatic release of property with no money returned is perfect punishment for people who do this.

As I type this, I see someone waiting outside the Ul'dah housing zone in Balmung. She's level 50, in a FC consisting of two members, the other member being a Level 1 nothing. Meanwhile, she's simply level 50 in one class with Second Lieutenant in a Rank 8 FC without any housing that was founded this year, late March.

Should I suspect something? ¬_¬

http://i.imgur.com/KLKSgmV.jpg?2
Some people are just too greedy. I really hope that their internet dies on the patch day or something.

How unbelievably depressing....