The Unspoken Rudeness

I think my fav time this happened was I was in an Ifrit ex party way back in the day. 8 people joined, go to queue. Error message someone does not meet requirements. Everyone is on the job and ilvl appropriate. "So who doesn't have IEX unlocked?" Silence. We pass around lead and ask each person to queue up for IEX to see who doesn't have it unlocked. Each time same error. Finally on the 7th person, he takes his time queuing... And bam up comes TEX. With a "Can you help me do this?"

Seriously.... Not even the same duty as was advertised in PF.

Unbelievable. That's a PF story for the ages.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

You wanna know why these people join farm parties?

Because if they join/form a learning party, it'll take them more than 2 hours to get a tank, and he'll leave after the 3rd wipe saying "this is a waste of time, u fu***ng noobs"

Simple as that.
It'll all be fine once people realize nobody has an obligation to know T10 just cuz it's been out for a month.

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So an inexperienced at (insert fight) person has trouble making a learning party so they should just be carried by 7 people in a farm party? Blunt answer: that's not the farm parties problem. If I want to farm t9 for weapons and 3 players join because they can't successfully do a learning party and make me wipe for 2 hours, to bad. They get the boot.

You don't show up to taco bell and demand a hamburger just because there's no McDonalds in your town.

just because you struggle doesn't give you the right to crap on other people's groups. I can sympathize with struggling to learn. Doesnt make it ok demanding other people teach you just because they are there. That's just spiting random people because your situation sucks. Not cool.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

You wanna know why these people join farm parties?

Because if they join/form a learning party, it'll take them more than 2 hours to get a tank, and he'll leave after the 3rd wipe saying "this is a waste of time, u fu***ng noobs"

Simple as that.
It'll all be fine once people realize nobody has an obligation to know T10 just cuz it's been out for a month.

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I agree with you to an extent, but... If you haven't downed the instance before, or at the very least seen the fight to the last phases, don't go for a farm party. At the very least have the decency to look at clear parties and send a tell to the PF lister explaining your situation. "Have seen it up to X%, but parties keep disbanding, can you give me at least one chance to see if it's me or just really bad luck with DF/PF?" For example. And if the PF party is ok with that, be grateful. If they're not, don't get upset with them.

(And no, I'm not an expert raider... Still haven't set foot in T6 -- cleared T5 just the week after the nerfs or something XD tough luck with finding people, basically -- but now that we finally have enough people we'll go at it a bit more regularly. But while I sympathize with the learning parties sittng open for hours not finding enough people, or finding them just as the first joiners go "crap, out of time, good luck guys", it doesn't mean I don't sympathize with those who put up PF listings and expect people to read and follow instructions before joining ^^; )

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

You wanna know why these people join farm parties?

Because if they join/form a learning party, it'll take them more than 2 hours to get a tank, and he'll leave after the 3rd wipe saying "this is a waste of time, u fu***ng noobs"

Simple as that.
It'll all be fine once people realize nobody has an obligation to know T10 just cuz it's been out for a month.

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deal with it, like everyone before you did. bad tank is bad tank, you will go through plenty of bad players in learning runs because that is where the detritus of the player base tend to clot. you shake it off and keep trying. just like everyone else did before you.
simple as that.
Not really sure what that last sentence had todo with the topic. over my head maybe.

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Originally Posted by KaedrianLiang

Ok.

the solution is to find 7 other people you trust that are online with a common interest.

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Good luck with that.

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Originally Posted by Talia_Hailwind

Good luck with that.

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I lold. had the same thought first time i read it.

I'm not telling that me MYSELF join farm parties like this. I even created a LS in my server meant to be a meeting place for ppl with no static groups to hook up and do content. Just telling you I understand why it happens. If learning parties weren't so damn hard to make and bullied, people woudn't have any reason to crash farm parties (pun intended).

I would like to offer a reverse point of view from the OP

I have finished T5 about a month or 2 ago and have started trying T6

don't have a static group and all the static groups on my sever run outside of what time i have available to be in an evening (8pm to 12am GMT).

I have watched the Mr Happy video to death on you tube.

I can't practice in a PF party as all parties what people that have cleared the turn
I can't practice in DF as people i'm grouped up with also want people that have cleared the turn with parties ending in either the healers or tanks ragequiting and DPS queues are about 30 mins+


forming my own party just takes too long and no one is interested in doing T6

yes i do know that I only need to clear T9

no i don't want the content to be nerf any further.

and watching the cut scene on you tube just doesn't cut it for me as i want to try the content for myself.

so how am i'm meant to get better at any of the turns if no one will help me (or anyone new to coil) to practice

Again, difficulty finding learning parties does not make it ok to weigh down a farm party with inexperience. That problem has had a million threads of its own. If you want hamburgers but there's only taco bell in your town, you don't go stage a demonstration in front of taco bell. Find a way to lure a McDonalds to town. Targeting frustrations at the wrong people just makes everyone piss ed off and results in angry words and kicked players. The farm party is causing no offense to learning parties. They just wanna farm. Leave them be and take up issue with making a learning party somewhere else.

Having a hard time learning has nothing to do with farm parties. Stop taking it out on them like they owe you something. If you struggle finding a means to learn content visit one of those many threads where people describe how they surmounted that challenge instead of sneaking into farm parties and starting up drama when you can't pass mustard.

I also rarely, if ever, join PF'er's these days for this reason.

And actually, when i do join PF'er's, I usually find myself specifically joining learning parties over any other. For me, it's all about what expectations are being set in the description. All too often I end up in farm parties with players trying to ninja a win. Usually clear parties play similarly to farm parties, except it's players who HAVE cleared that turn it into a wipe-fest. In other words, the expectation is not being met. So I leave. Learning parties, on the other hand, wipes are part of the expectation. I find it farm more rewarding helping a group of players learn and progress than helping 1 or 2 players clear content as part of a group of vets anyway. And then, of course, when i want to farm something i usually just try to convince my static to do it.

TL;DR: Don't give up on the learning parties, and if you can, try to find static members for the future! It makes the game so much funner. Really.

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Originally Posted by mosaicex

Oh, this thread again.

Well, you can fix the game, but good luck trying to fix people.

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oh my goodness, i bet you make an adorable little tank. think its time for a "how ridiculously cute are lala tanks" thread!

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Originally Posted by Izsha

/snip

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My issue with "Farming Parties" is that you want domain over PF AND DF parties

for Christ sake make you bloodly mind up and leave us lot that just want to learn the fight alone.

kinda wanting you cake and eat it too.

is there any point in terrorizing new people to coil just for the sake of getting your drops quicker?

in the end you are just shooting yourself in your own foot since your fellow elites have either stop subbing because they are bored or moved on to newer content and terrorizing new people from coil since you want it all to yourself.

Terrorizing party finder?
Terrorizing? Really?

PREDACONS! TERRORIZE!
https://38.media.tumblr.com/8cbde5fb...inreo1_400.gif

This just proves my point regarding people's attitudes about this. Farming parties have done NOTHING to harm a learning group. Wtf does me making a t9 weapon farming group have to do with some poor soul that wants to learn meteor placement? Statements like yours make some implication that farming parties are stealing people from learning parties or something. Terrorizing PF? Please. There's no cap I'm aware of limiting the # of pf groups. If there's 100 farm parties that doesn't prevent a learning party from being on the board. This is just truly absurd

as for df. You get to roll the dice like everyone else. When my fc wants to farm ponies or weapons and we're short 1 or 2 people, we get a WHOLE LOT of sold bonus people free wins in df with them on the floor. I capped sold 3x last weekend mostly doing runs like that. Sometimes you stumble into a farm party in df and get a free win. Sometimes you get disfunctional crybabies that rage quit after 1 wipe. I never have any expectations in df cuz it's straight up random who you get, how skilled they are, or why they are even there. I would recommend similar expectations for everyone. You can't control df so don't expect something specific when you roll the dice. If you want control of your group then use fc/ls/fist combined with pf. You want Russian roulette go df.

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Originally Posted by DoctorPepper

It's different because it makes people who haven't completed something feel less important. Like I said before, the tools are there to manage this already, why would SE want to piss off their casual player base by adding a feature that belittles them? You might not care about them but I'm sure that SE's wallet cares.

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First, this has nothing to do with a casual vs hardcore player base, as casuals can go into learning parties the same as anyone else. I go into learning parties all the time to learn new content, hell i even go into learning parties when going on a different role because tanking something isnt the same as healing or dpsing it.

Its the people who don't want to watch the video or try learning it without getting carried AND LIE about it, that i couldn't care less about.
Its real simple: If they don't have the time to learn their job in that specific fight, then i don't have time for them!

Second this doesn't belittle anyone. if they cannot join a party because they didn't clear it would be no different then not having the job or the ilvl. Both of which we can already set.

I would also like to know why the one person should be more important then the 7 others who want to have experienced players only?

I think that the greatest thing they could add to the PF is the option of 'Have cleared' that could only be selected if the party leader has a clear.

Bottom line is that if its a farm party for people with clears only, and someone joins without a clear they should be straight up perma-banned. They lied, are being underhanded, wasting the time of 7 other people and violating the requirements to join the pt.
Now if someone sends a tell saying they watched the video & know about all the mechanics IE: they did their homework and just would like a chance to prove it, i am all for that.

lol not even going to put any thought into a response for that.. no point. Go on expecting people to get perma banned for joining your farm party. I posted my reasoning after the post you quoted already. Feel like you're trolling after reading the perma-ban expectation, that just seems so silly to me, you must be a very bitter individual.

If you feel like SE doesn't care about how these players feel then go ahead and explain why everything gets nerfed for them every 3-6 months. Maybe they'll add that feature, I hope they do, but I highly doubt it.

PF is something I do my best to avoid for high-end content. For example, T9 farm parties never work because everyone has an ego and thinks their way is the best way. Because there are so many mechanics, everyone may handle them a bit differently. You don't handle them the way someone else does, you're automatically a bad player. It's a complete joke nowadays. I occasionally join clear parties when I want to help out. But, farm parties aren't worth my time. They hardly every work out.

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Originally Posted by Able

PF is something I do my best to avoid for high-end content. For example, T9 farm parties never work because everyone has an ego and thinks their way is the best way.

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T9 farm parties never work because everyone in those parties are people who still need clear or people who got their first clears through a carry.

Fixed. Most people who have beaten t9 before echo has already finished farming t9 for good.

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Originally Posted by Ageofwar

I have finished T5 about a month or 2 ago and have started trying T6

don't have a static group and all the static groups on my sever run outside of what time i have available to be in an evening (8pm to 12am GMT).

I have watched the Mr Happy video to death on you tube.

so how am i'm meant to get better at any of the turns if no one will help me (or anyone new to coil) to practice

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Literally WHY? Isn't that guy's video just barfed out as soon as content comes out? You're trying to watch a video for a content that has already changed? I don't care what echo only coil goers say, echo and nerfs to coil changes the fight significantly. Not only that, as time passes, people come up with new strategies and it becomes the new standard. Go ahead and watch a video of non echo coil guide if you want to but consult actual players before you go in. You're in EU I think? Someone in my FC is british and he raids fcob with an outside static at weird hours so I assume that EU players exist in Hyperion. I think your problem is that you're trying to find a static for scob though. Not sure that exists anymore.

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Originally Posted by Ageofwar

I would like to offer a reverse point of view from the OP

I have finished T5 about a month or 2 ago and have started trying T6

don't have a static group and all the static groups on my sever run outside of what time i have available to be in an evening (8pm to 12am GMT).

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I recommend you transfer to a server more suited for your time online. Anyway, I'm on t12 and I haven't even touched t6 yet, just skip to t7/9 and go back to it when your FC wants to do it for shiggles.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

You wanna know why these people join farm parties?

Because if they join/form a learning party, it'll take them more than 2 hours to get a tank, and he'll leave after the 3rd wipe saying "this is a waste of time, u fu***ng noobs"

Simple as that.
It'll all be fine once people realize nobody has an obligation to know T10 just cuz it's been out for a month.

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So we, who have already done our 'learning time' and feel comfortable with the content must continue to wipe for weeks because we have an obligation to let people join our farm groups to 'learn'? You do realize that the number of unskilled players is ridiculous? I mean wipes are going to be so consistent you'll be lucky to see a win at least once a week. I'm not obligated to continue wiping for the rest of my time subscribed to FFXIV because I'm the only one who bothered to use my time to make learning parties.

Yeah depending on what it is, it can take a couple hours. I don't know what people are talking about with the 'rage' as the learning parties I got going people were friendly and patient. Once you get your learning party going, be damn sure you're ready to learn so you can take EVERYTHING in and feel comfortable enough then you can find a clear/farm party, message the party leader and be like, "I got a sol bonus but I feel confident in my abilities that I can perform well. I will leave on my own if I fail." You know that usually works. Even I am willing to give people like that a chance.

Point is, you gotta put forth real effort into learning or you WILL be waiting for learning parties A LOT.

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Originally Posted by Izsha

You want Russian roulette go df.

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Yes this exactly. This is why i dont mess with df for certain things. I can bitch all day long but in the end i rolled the dice. so i make my own pf parties with the expectations clearly outlined. its not until people ignore those clearly outlined expectations that problems arise. even when getting clears for fc mates, i try to pf as much as possible for pugs. but before we can que, every single time, we have to go through the list of pugs and MAKE SURE that every one of them meets the party reqs. here is the part that gets me, being trolled by people when you are weeding them out! guess i can't blame them, getting kicked either way...

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Originally Posted by DoctorPepper

you must be a very bitter individual.

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I don't think it has anything to do with bitterness.
I almost agree with that, you are preventing other people from being able to play and you are doing it on purpose with the expectaion of forcing them to carry you... its borderline, but its damn near bannable. and it almost should be. It's getting so out of hand. i love seeing new players, but i hate how many of them are looking for a carry, and expecting you to cater to their feelings while they are getting it! F**K your feelings! and your couch too!!
http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view/7143...yo-couch-o.gif

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Originally Posted by FranSeara

Having 1 or 2 first time players in your group shouldn't/may not hurt you're chances of clears.

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DRG in my T5 says hi.
Actually, no he doesn't, he didn't even tell us he was new or said anything.
Sick of that crap, Idm if you're new or not, just damn tell us.
This is why people starting kicking people because they can tell if you're new and don't
speak up. The woe's of being stuck in T5 for months coz I roll the die in DF.
I guess I can't complain much.

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Originally Posted by Mugiawara

DRG in my T5 says hi.
Actually, no he doesn't, he didn't even tell us he was new or said anything....
The woe's of being stuck in T5 for months coz I roll the die in DF.
I guess I can't complain much.

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I main drg and i stilled lold till milk came out my nose.

Just like a previous poster said, sounds like you want full reign of PF and DF. No. all jokes aside we need to realize not everyone plays and learns the same and have the same amount of time to put in to catch up to everyone else. That's not saying people have the right to lie and such. But you need to ask yourself, why do some players lie about things like that. Maybe because they are tired of being bashed for not being good enough as others or being ousted when they say, hey I'm new.

I'm tired of the whole.."watch a video" thing with this game. I learn by doing more so than by watching. And even if I watch said video, it won't matter until i actually try. The problem isn't watching the video, its the people that think not watching it makes you a bad player. Its a game. One of the fun things about playing a game is learning from your mistakes.

Its a shame that we have this community that thinks you have to "one shot" everything and if shit gets too hard, you quit and blame others. I'm tired of waiting for df for 40 min, get in a duty, wipe once and tank leaves or healer leaves. This is not how gaming was when i was younger. And this attitude we see here just in this community of players kinda represents whats wrong with this world. The whole "I only help others if I can benefit" mentality is destroying us. So what if a new person joins your "clear party". You wanna show skill? You wanna be the best? Take that person and show them how to do it. Then brag that hey, we helped a person that never saw this before and created a monster. Not everyone is looking for a "carry". Most are just looking for the opportunity to do it themselves, learn the mechanics themselves, but you need others to even make the attempt. Just because you cleared it and someone in your party didn't doesn't mean they are looking to get carried. If anything, the casuals are carrying this game because if it wasn't for them, SE wouldn't even have the funds to release an expansion this year.

At least try and help people first off before going nuts. Wanting to kick people, if it was up to most of you, you would kick 90% of the player base out of the game. Try harder to be better human beings and sometimes be above that stuff. be the better person. This game is tough for newbies after you get to lvl 50, not because of content, but because of the community. That's saying a lot. Makes me ashamed sometimes reading some of you people's comments.

My FC actually had to blacklist a certain player because they kept coming into our farm parties and causing wipes MULTIPLE TIMES. This person was very clearly not capable of farming the fight in question, yet they joined every single farm party that went up for that fight. And the worst part of all? They NEVER improved, not even a little bit. They kept on making the exact same mistakes even after people pointed them out.

If you can't reliably one-shot a fight, then don't join a farm party for it. It's not that complicated.

One time a guy in a farm party kept dying to the same part in the fight -- Leviathan, shortly after railings come off -- and the leader kindly said that the player in question gets one more shot, but if they die again they're getting the boot. He was being nice about it, but then the player goes on to say how he doesn't need to be cyberbullied on a game, and will fix the problem by leaving the party himself.

I honestly can't see where some people get these outlandish perceptions from, but it's just a game. And millions play it. And we already know a majority of people aren't very bright.

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Originally Posted by DoctorPepper

lol not even going to put any thought into a response for that.. no point. Go on expecting people to get perma banned for joining your farm party. I posted my reasoning after the post you quoted already. Feel like you're trolling after reading the perma-ban expectation, that just seems so silly to me, you must be a very bitter individual.

If you feel like SE doesn't care about how these players feel then go ahead and explain why everything gets nerfed for them every 3-6 months. Maybe they'll add that feature, I hope they do, but I highly doubt it.

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interesting thing about the ban thing; account action can happen should someone lie/break contract. joining someones party thru pf that is asking for clear exp when one doesnt can end badly for that person should someone be inclined to report it. its the same with selling primals/gear.

Stop trying to twist this into another "nobody helps noobs" thread. If someone is intentionally deceitful joining my of group then a kick is warrented. Just like I would kick a smn wearing dex accessories to meet the ilvl to join a pf. Or say I specify I want a bard and a bard joins and changes to drg hoping I don't notice. If a party finder leader has explicit criteria spelled out and you are intentionally deceitful in order to skirt them, FU. This is not about kicking noobs. It's about respecting the group you are joining. This has nothing to do with watching videos or vets joining learning parties. It is really simple. Don't meet PF requirements? Don't join or petition your case with WORDS. Dont try to pull a fast one and then be butt hurt when you are kicked.

This is not some elaborate moral dilemma. If your not tall enough to ride some dudes pf, then go make your own. Not put on 6 inch stilettos and fake it.

Everyone has the right to make a pf with any requirements they see fit. If there's a lala only pf and your not a lala. To bad. Their pf, their rules. You want your rules make your own.

maybe if your pf entries are attracting rude and dishonest players, you should not use pf entry requirements that are appealing to rude and dishonest players

it's almost like, idk, the modern standard of how people act in party finder encourages scumbaggery as the most successful way to get things done because of how players treat each other in it, which begins and ends with party leaders and how they use their authority

"Stop trying to twist this into another "nobody helps noobs" thread."
well said Izsha.

putting a side silly meme's and my own raw experiences of T5 and T6 on DF

I believe the issue of "Unspoken Rudeness" is as follows :-

1) Newbie's wanting to to get though content and getting around the constant drop out after 1 try and lie and cheat there way into farming parties

2) Hardcore raider that RNG has been unkind to trying to DF to catch up or get glamor gear with thier fellow raiders abusing kick and ragequit to get a one shot runs

sadly points 1 and 2 tend to go around in circles with the problem only getting worse

3) People trolling and general assholes

which only makes issues 1) and 2) worse

yes i do know that DF can be rather russan roulette as to the party makeup i feel there is alot of hardcore raiders just don't get this. If you really don't want a party that will wipe 20+ times with zero progress DON'T JOIN DF

my rule of thumb i tend to work by is the following:-

DF - Practise runs
PF - Serious runs

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Originally Posted by QiLymePye

I'm tired of the whole.."watch a video" thing with this game. I learn by doing more so than by watching. And even if I watch said video, it won't matter until i actually try. The problem isn't watching the video, its the people that think not watching it makes you a bad player. Its a game. One of the fun things about playing a game is learning from your mistakes.

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The video gives you immediate familiarity to the pacing and key mechanics. It can help avoid many pitfalls right out of the gate and allow the group to gloss over what should be the small details. It's never been about learning the whole fight from the video. It's about coming in with the most basic level of research done instead of expecting whatever group of 7 gets stuck with you to explain every single little detail in a fight that's been out for over a year. Your attitude of just go in and learn it yourself 100% leans on the players around you for no ones benefit but yourself. If that's what you do then you drag them down and make the fight take forever for your own selfish reasons. There are 8 people in that fight and you are only 1 of them. It's not only about you or people like you that share this attitude. Go find a group of like minded individuals and learn it with them.

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Originally Posted by Izsha

6 inch stilettos

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http://i1.wp.com/www.retro-games.fr/...-the-night.png
I'm interested in this.

you always have a choice, but whatever choice you make is nobody else's fault if you expectations of the choice you made is not up to paar with what happens.

If you live with this..you surely will be more happy.

Downed up to T7 so far.....only exclusively via DF and once a half a pre made group that formed into a DF *lol* of perfectly unknown people never met seen or what not. Yes is possible, it takes just some will.

What is funny ? is when you run a DF let say T5, and people leave, or rage quit and you then try again you will find those same people over and over and over again, that is what is funny *lol*

Mei

If I want to get stuff done it is my right to kick the weasels who sneak join.

Why can't I do this? Please tell me. I want progress others who joined for this reason want it so why not. Yesterday I did a clear only T10 then we wer gona do T11 next some left others stayed I asked if people cleared if no what's your experience one said tethers so I put phase 3 T11 progression cleared it about an Hour later. I cleared it last week did I have to put progression ? Nooooo did I yes because they stayed so gave a chance so stop whining about pug abuse or what ever this is getting at people will take chances with you some times but don't expect to stay if you keep mesing up.

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Originally Posted by Elusana_Celah

..... "Carry me I don't want to put any effort into learning lol" attitude is so overwhelming that is permeates our culture like a stink cloud.

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That is your own false interpretation and then using it for your own false indignation and insulting everyone else. It does NOT matter if there are a select few that want to troll or want to be carried, given a large enough player population, a seven sigmas away from norm, you are bound to encounter one of these, but the vast majority of players are not like that at all.

Since clearing T9 at the end of November, I've been helping others clear T9. What you find more commonly is overconfidence, people who over-rate their skill or knowledge, and then find themselves quickly over there heads. Having watched a video does not equal "know the mechanics", and without practice no player will know or be able to internalize the timing of mechanics at all even if it is something completely scripted like T9. If you have a group of 7 are trying to work on fire-in/fire-out/thunder and someone who is dying to lunar dynamo over and over, you just have to kindly ask them to leave. If they want to be mean and nasty about it, there is always the vote kick. But the one thing that really helps, is getting everyone in on voice chat (mumble/TS/etc.) and being able to talk will alleviate any of this kind of misunderstanding, and players will usually volunteer to leave after seeing that they do not understand it as well as they think.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

....The video gives you immediate familiarity to the pacing and key mechanics. ....

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Videos can't teach you pacing at all the stuff has all been edited to point out certain aspects or point of views. And the videos typically makes no sense and often is just information overload. I encourage people to run it once blind wipe for 20 minutes or so and then go watch the videos now with some awareness as to what to look for in the video.

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Originally Posted by 2spooky

...you're costing the other 7 members of your DF party up to 90 minutes each...

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This is a game, game time is people playing together, wiping and having fun. "90 minutes each" of fun playing time is not a cost. If players are thinking about it as a cost like a job, need to paid, etc. then go do something else.

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

...
But it's not only those who join, theres many who actually start farm parties with no clue on the fight also just hoping for 7 others to join to carry them.

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This happens quite often actually. Instead of getting mad at the PF or other players, just realize you can NOT farm on the PF, you need a static to farm. You can recruit for your static and do tryouts and go from there.

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Originally Posted by Izsha

... twist this into another "nobody helps noobs" thread...Everyone has the right to make a pf with any requirements they see fit...

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That is such a false misrepresentation. First of all PF = Pseudo-Farm at best, I've seen so call farm parties with so called top players, at least in their own words, fail and wipe over and over and then get into a pissing match. If you want to farm, get your static together and farm, but do not expect the PF to magically supply you 7 other players. If you are using the PF, you are begging for others to assist you and unreasonable requires simply can not be met.

The thread was never a bout "nobody helps noobs", but rather it is about "no noobs wanted" and that is not acceptable. The OP started out on a neutral stance, but by the 3rd post, it betrayed the OP's real intent with the "stink cloud". Stop hating on the noobs. The unspoken rudeness is why people think it is ok ot hate on the noobs.

The real unspoken rudeness is why do people think it is ok to hate on the noobs.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

The real unspoken rudeness is why do people think it is ok to hate on the noobs.

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Nobody here is indiscriminately hating on all newbies. Only the ones that don't speak up.

If they don't speak up, let us know that they are new, and then proceed to waste the time of 7 other people, especially if it's a PF, that's literal unspoken rudeness. Personally, I expect people to communicate if they don't have the fight down to a T (pun intended?), and if they do I'm much more considerate, and will likely explain mechanics to the best of my ability, so long as they actually LEARN. I don't have an infinite amount of patience, and if progress isn't happening then I will start getting frustrated.

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Originally Posted by NyarukoW

That is such a false misrepresentation. First of all PF = Pseudo-Farm at best, I've seen so call farm parties with so called top players, at least in their own words, fail and wipe over and over and then get into a pissing match. If you want to farm, get your static together and farm, but do not expect the PF to magically supply you 7 other players. If you are using the PF, you are begging for others to assist you and unreasonable requires simply can not be met.*

The thread was never a bout "nobody helps noobs", but rather it is about "no noobs wanted" and that is not acceptable. The OP started out on a neutral stance, but by the 3rd post, it betrayed the OP's real intent with the "stink cloud". Stop hating on the noobs. The unspoken rudeness is why people think it is ok ot hate on the noobs.

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Again. Kicking someone from a party finder is not noob hate. The entire point of the op was people being rude by joining party finders that are obviously not aimed at them. If a pf says lala only and your not a lala, then that pf isn't for you. If it's ilvl 110 minimum pf and you i90 smn, that doesn't mean "hey ill put on my 130 dex accessories and join up on smn!". That pf isn't for your smn. If I make a pf with the only open slot is a healer and you wanna dps, don't join as healer then swap to dps. If a pf is asking for highly expert performance and you've never set foot in the fight, it's not for you. Disagreeing with the rules the leader makes doesn't matter. If pf says I get ALL the loot, then don't join it if you plan on lotting. If their pf rules are really stupid they will figure it out when no one ever joins.

If you think someone's pf criteria are dumb or unfair then DON'T JOIN IT. this has NOTHING to do with being noob hate.

Like that post pages ago when someone joined ifrit ex pf and didn't have it unlocked, but wasted 7 people's time until they figured out he hadn't beaten titan yet and got kicked. That's not noob hate. He joined a pf and didn't want to go along with the PF leaders purpose. That's frigging ridiculous. Don't be that guy. That's what this thread was about before everyone started making it some affront on newbies. It's not. But everyone would rather trot out newbs and learning party struggles as a red herring than just acknowledge "yeah joining a pf with deceitful intent to dodge the pf criteria is kinda messed up. They should just pm the leader 1st"