Say NO to the New Possession (Claiming) Structure Being Developed!!!

This new system is just insane.

It means there will be no point for NM/HNMs ever in the future if this is true.

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Originally Posted by Visch

This new system is just insane.

It means there will be no point for NM/HNMs ever in the future if this is true.

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I am not pick on you but I fail to see your point ._.

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Originally Posted by Melian

I remember people defending fatigue with statements like that before it was out too. Yeah. Fatigue was great, thank god I got to experience it. ... From the release debacle the Devs / Management Team seem to have learned that input from their customers actually matters though, at least somewhat. So yeah. I think I will put in my input for this idea before it's actually implemented.

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Yet, this is a different team, Yoshida doesn't want to limit people's gameplay, which is why fatigue was removed. Add a /blockaid command and most of these "complaints" will be solved. Also they're not going to change much until you actually experience it anyway.

I'm actually going to give them a shot to fully flesh out this idea. Just because its different doesnt necessarily mean it will be bad. Also since first party to claim will get drops, that doesnt mean it will kill HNM because competition for first claim will still be there.

Im most excited theyre working on the exp bug for damaging unclaimed mobs.

.......................................

What's the deal?

A LOT of other MMOs have a system in place where everyone can attack the same mob, but only the one who attacked it first has the right to get loot.

This is nothing uncommon and in fact it's a better system overall. Of course it "sucks" that on NMs or whatnot, everyone could just attack to zerg it down, but do you really think there is gonna be much "uninstanced" content coming in the future? Instances is how endgame is released now, free roaming stuff is viable, but it's a thing of the past, cause it excludes other people on purpose, who either don't get a claim or don't have the time to wait for their "pop conditions".

As much as I loved Sky, Sea etc, as much I hated to fight over claims against other shells. This is just a stupid system and I rather not waste hours of my time to get a "possible" claim of something.

I'D RATHER HAVE ENDGAME INSTANCED AND SKILL BEING THE FACTOR THAT DETERMINES IF I CAN FIGHT IT OR NOT(BEAT IT) AND NOT OUTCLAIMING OTHER PEOPLE FOR A 100% WIN AFTER, LIKE IT WAS IN XI!

Just a simple question...what did everyone enjoy more(back in 2004-2006), Sky or Sea? I bet that majority will say Sea...and guess why? Because there were not 100people fighting over claims, cause majority didn't have Sea access back then...

lets not attack a system you don't understand. I want to hear what the devs have to say about this system first.

Thank god they remove the claiming. Good work FF14 team!

-1 I say yes to new system and i want to see more instanced content and a revamp of the linkshell system.

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Originally Posted by Andrien

lets not attack a system you don't understand. I want to hear what the devs have to say about this system first.

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Isn't it already obvious? If you see they are making a change you don't understand, you grab your pitchforks and threaten to ragequit and/or make FFXIV doomsday posts!!!

Make threads requesting more information so you can make a well informed decision? THAT'S CRAZY!!!! BECAUSE THE WORLD IS ENDING!!!! OMG!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Shneibel

I am not pick on you but I fail to see your point ._.

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Maybe you could if you PLAYED THE GAME.

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Originally Posted by Risae

Thank god they remove the claiming. Good work FF14 team!

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No thanks.

Know what good work is?

"After the maintenance, following requirements must be fulfilled to log in to the forums.

Possess Square Enix account with an active service account on FINAL FANTASY XIV
Have logged in to FINAL FANTASY XIV in the last 30 days (additional requirement)
"

THAT IS GOOD WORK. GOODBYE.

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Originally Posted by Andrien

lets not attack a system you don't understand. I want to hear what the devs have to say about this system first.

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yes, let's wait until they make a decision and when people get the info and do not like it they can't say anything then either because people will throw up that stupid poll result again that only a few people that still play the game were a part of.

Hi All,

There are definitely positives and negatives to both sides of the argument.

As much of a thrill it was to claim Nidhogg or King Behemoth legitimately in the original days of FF XI, looking back on it, it's outweighed by how many times you've lost the claim or got the claim but had no drops. It's staggering how many hours / days of one's life were wasted just *standing around* for hours and hoping you outclaim other groups, and have the whole experience ruined by Claim Bots.

That's just not fun.

On the other hand, having an open claim system does have its problems as well. As Darkstar pointed out, if it's based on the amount of damage everyone contributes, a high powered LS can stroll in to any HNM fight and out-damage the original claiming party and end up with the drop.

Perhaps a "Tiered System" is necessary. As an example:

* 1st Hit = Access to Loot Pool 1 (which has certain rare items / drops)
* Most Damage Done to HNM = Access to Loot Pool 2 (other rare items)
* 2nd Most Damage Done to HNM = Access to Loot Pool 3 (some other item(s))

So that way, even if you won the initial claim, your party has a Loot Pool 1 chance regardless of if anyone else comes along to help. Others, then, have incentive to try and win access to Loot Pool 2 or 3.

But that still won't solve griefing problems as Meowie and others brought up (like triggering Spike Flail / some Boss Attack to wipe out your party on purpose)).

Ultimately, though, I think Tirion and others brought it up best:

* It should be about the challenge, excitement and skill of defeating some End Game Content, instead of standing around for hours every 3 days and seeing who has the fastest spamming fingers (or fastest claim bot).

Is competition good? Sure. But unless SE can 100% Guarantee that they have programmatic defenses in place to detect Claim Bots and ban them on the spot, I'd rather have instanced content that requires us to plan, strategize, challenge us with the fight itself (and the accompanying journey to get there), rather than have a flashback to Nidhogg of XI's early days.

Let's see what they have in store for us; and hopefully our friendly Community Rep can bring up our questions / concerns to Yoshida-san.

Not sure what to think of this really, i always loved giving the RMT a run for their "Money" so to speak.
I found it rather fun outclaiming RMT's in FFXI.

Besides FFXIV could use some competition.

Anywayz, this type of #Suggestion" seems to lead to more freeroaming NM's etc,
hopefully with drops that arnt just Rare/Ex. (BoP if you like)

Event though most of us can go from previous experience and reject this idea before is even implemented, We dont know how it will be implemented or to what extent. Jesus!, how can you say no to something you dont even know how its going to work....

Wait until we have more details, and then provide feedback on how to improve...

I honestly dont know if I am wasting my time here... /sigh

My only thing is-- who will actually be fighting to claim those NMs or what have you when there is so little demand for rare item and their benefits?

Aesthetics are nice, but until the stat's are fixed, a real battle plan worked together, and actual difficulty is assured in the game, groups of people fighting over a shiny axe or helmet seems completely superficial. **Whether it's convenient or not, open-world or instance based or not. It makes no difference to me if there's still no real reason for desiring that piece.

Before saying yes or no, I'd still like some idea of Square's Endgame plans. Not necessarily endgame as in what you do after you hit the capped level, but just the general direction of XIV's unique play experience. So far I'm still pretty unclear about where the real gratification is supposed to be coming from. I'm not being negative or trollish, I know you have to put one foot in front of the other to walk, and I think this is clearly one step of many. But I don't understand what direction it's supposed to be taking us.

**One thing about XI (sorry I know people hate this) is that the devs were clear in the early stages that they didn't want everyone to have an excalibur. It's funny and ironic but I enjoyed that. I can see how many wouldn't. This seems to me the exact opposite of that kind of logic.

I am also with the guys that want to wait for a response from the dev team, simply because the translation has no context as Reinhart has said it in the past. Right now everyone's arguments are based on a translation that's taken out of context...

So yes I'll wait till I get an official answer.

I say wait until you have an official translation to freak out.

But maybe that's just me.

I can just hear new players coming in to FFXIV for the first time asking themselves "Where is everyone?" "The towns are empty, no one is out in the lands doing things, hunting things." "Oh, their all tucked away in their little instanced zones where no one can see or watch the action." So much for 'outside linkshell' play. This game is starting to sound like guild wars not Final Fantasy. I remember when they introduced the Buffalo to this game, everyone was standing around watching the fight as it went on. Good stuff. We need more of this. We need an audience, spectators. It's what an MMO community is all about. Not hidden away in instances all the time.

Really, its because of threads like this that things such as the 1.19 preview letter get delayed. Yoshi-P has to write letters for the obnoxious whiners on here, giving them a lolipop and telling them "hush now... everything will be ok.." Its pretty sad...

ffxi fans destroyed this game
they wanna obsolet and boring things in this game, for they is fun wait for hours with many bots for claim nms
for they is fun monopolize this items
really it sucks
hnms less
instance raid more yes please
in ffxi i prefer abyssea system, farm items for pop hnms is better that bot army claim the boss and tank spank strategy

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Originally Posted by Sav

I don't see what's wrong with getting outside help. If it makes the next NM pop sooner, why not? You still have to fight for the initial claim.

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Well if that outside help decides to make things more difficult for you by facing AoEs towards your mages or triggering insane attacks you know better than to trigger yourself...things can get messy.

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Originally Posted by odette

ffxi fans destroyed this game
they wanna obsolet and boring things in this game, for they is fun wait for hours with many bots for claim nms
for they is fun monopolize this items
really it sucks
hnms less
instance raid more yes please
in ffxi i prefer abyssea system, farm items for pop hnms is better that bot army claim the boss and tank spank strategy

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That's a pretty ridiculous statement. How did FFXI fans destroy this game again? Because if I remember correctly, this game was originally designed to be different from FFXI in every single way, and it still failed.

The waiting for hours for pop argument means nothing, for either side. This is FFXIV, not FFXI. NMs pop within as little as 5 seconds after defeat.

The claim war argument means nothing, for either side. With both systems we'd still be fighting for the initial claim to be eligible for loot.

The "just make a /blockaid function" argument is also somewhat ridiculous. It would be far easier and less time consuming to just add a "call for help" feature to our current system instead of redoing everything.

Aside from those 3, I still haven't seen anyone say what makes the new system better than the old. If you're in favor of the new system, cool. I'm well aware that many people would welcome it. But what makes it better? Can anyone answer that question?

I see a lot of potential good, and some things I'm just not sure about.

I'm for the change, but in wait and see mode until further comment is made about the changes.

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Originally Posted by Arcell

Well if that outside help decides to make things more difficult for you by facing AoEs towards your mages or triggering insane attacks you know better than to trigger yourself...things can get messy.

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Kind of reminds me of when I was camping King Arthro with my LS. Some RMT hacking d-bag pulled 25 mobs through a wall with a teleport hack so we couldn't target KA when he spawned. A non-RMT shell claimed him, though. As they started to get their asses kicked by him, they CALLED FOR HELP and the RMT proceeded to kill him. Yes please to more instanced content!

and people wonder why SE isnt telling us all they are planning asap when every little thing causes a riot by all those "only I know what its best for the game" douchebags...

as much as this guys like to think "tha devs only have jello for brains" alot of planning and work goes into this game so stop being disrespectful idiots, bashing stuff even before it gets out of the planning stage

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Originally Posted by ChiefCurrahee

Do you know that Guildleves are instanced events?

Just because the word "Instance" is used, it doesn't always mean "private zone"

Behest is another "Instanced event"

Mobs that can been seen and engaged only by players currently active in the event. If open world NMs were somehow done in this fashion would you still be against an "no claim" system?
like InuraBera said:



NM already function in this manner.

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I'm well aware of what instanced content is. I know it's not all dungeons.

However, open world content isn't defined only by being content available in the open world. It's content that has no level requirements, no class requirements, no party size requirements, open for everyone to do at any given time without any prerequisites, etc, etc. It's quite different compared to most instanced content.

The problem with the new system is that any new open world content would be impossible to balance and keep it difficult, unless the difficulty scales as more players engage (highly unlikely).

The probability of player griefing is very real. To combat this, SE would pretty much be forced to make all open world content simple tank & spank encounters, no special abilities triggered by certain events. This makes for very boring open world content.

What does this new system improve on when compared to our current system? I just see it doing more damage than good.

You know, you guys are the ones who voted for it in the polls, god dang it, I hate people. I voted no in the poll 100 months ago(dont know how long ago it was). Come on guys, MAKE UP YOUR MIND ALREADY! But I will sign this, and vote NO again.

fight the power!

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Originally Posted by Rokien

You know, you guys are the ones who voted for it in the polls, god dang it, I hate people. I voted no in the poll 100 months ago(dont know how long ago it was). Come on guys, MAKE UP YOUR MIND ALREADY! But I will sign this, and vote NO again.

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Except there was no option to keep the current system in the polls.

I was thinking of question 10. "If the current target claiming system were done away with, would you prefer for content such as dungeons and battle to be converted into instances as much as possible?" But ya, I was very upset with question 9 though. Sorry for the mistake meowy.

OMG LOOK CAPS LOCKS I YELLING AT THE INTERNET....... YOU KNOW OPEN CLAIMING DOESNT MEAN THAT RMT/OTHER PEOPLE CANT CLAIM A NM OVER YOU. IT JUST MEANS THAT EVERYONE WHO CONTRIBUTES DMG WILL GET SP NOT DROPS. FIRST PERSONS/PARTY TO CLAIM WILL GET DROPS MORONS..... ie RMT/competition will still be able to claim using a bot and get drops durp durp durp durp. This purposed system is much worse than wht we have now.

*signs the petition*

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i say yes, i prefer "Contents that drop rare items will be more instance based in future, and will also lessen where you have to fight over to claim."

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crafter are going to make better items 1.19+

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Originally Posted by Hikozaemon

OMG LOOK CAPS LOCKS I YELLING AT THE INTERNET....... YOU KNOW OPEN CLAIMING DOESNT MEAN THAT RMT/OTHER PEOPLE CANT CLAIM A NM OVER YOU. IT JUST MEANS THAT EVERYONE WHO CONTRIBUTES DMG WILL GET SP NOT DROPS. FIRST PERSONS/PARTY TO CLAIM WILL GET DROPS MORONS..... ie RMT/competition will still be able to claim using a bot and get drops durp durp durp durp. This purposed system is much worse than wht we have now.

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Not only that but an outside party could easily MPK you if they can engage the monster you're fighting. It saddens me to think that some people have had such a bad time with open-world NMs that they rather they not exist at all. In other words of the many wonderful things that all mmos have they choose to ban certain types away from their lives because they had a bad experience with it.

SE historically is a titan. I would expect more from them the solution should never be to quit alltogether. (the solution to the problems people had with open-world HNMs in xi shouldn't be to quit. I certainly hope were not quitters.

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Originally Posted by Ichi

Not only that but an outside party could easily MPK you if they can engage the monster you're fighting. It saddens me to think that some people have had such a bad time with open-world NMs that they rather they not exist at all. In other words of the many wonderful things that all mmos have they choose to ban certain types away from their lives because they had a bad experience with it.

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Or they could add a /blockaid command and problem solved.

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Originally Posted by Sonic_the_Hedgehog

Or they could add a /blockaid command and problem solved.

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Or they could add "call for help" to the current system and not waste countless development hours on a new system.

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Originally Posted by MeowyWowie

Or they could add "call for help" to the current system and not waste countless development hours on a new system.

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They could do that too, but that could "waste countless development hours" too, because we obviously know their time schedule and everything they're working on at the moment.

Open world NM's already exist. Looking forward to the new claim system. If it sucks then I will complain, but the changes they made in 1.18 has proven to me that as bad as something can sound (like auto attack and other things in 1.18 in my previous opinion), it might just work out for the better. Just give me my personal armored chocobo and some more things to do and keep me shut up.

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Originally Posted by Sonic_the_Hedgehog

Or they could add a /blockaid command and problem solved.

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ya hows /blockaid gonna help when its open claiming system even if others cant cure u it doesnt mean they cant take hate resulting in a mobs TP/AOE wipping people it otherwise wouldnt.