Cash shop confirmed

Vanity stuff counts as content, now?

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Yeah, but you're tying in the Optional "Vanity stuff" as some of the direction of the game. It's not even close to the direction of the game. P2W stuff would be, but not Optional Vanity stuff.

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Optional items for a game are still part of the game, having those items only be available from a cash shop is a very conscious decision about the direction of the game.

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Originally Posted by Fayto

Again, get off your high horse. Luxury items does not harm your enjoyment, this is what we call being greedy.

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I love that you keep saying it because the only person coming across as being on a high horse here is you.

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Originally Posted by Mholito

Vanity stuff counts as content, now?

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Yes, how does it not? Would you be okay if the game was just textureless flat polygons with stick figure skeletons for characters and that you had to pay optional to see each race and zone the way it's supposed to look?

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Originally Posted by charlemagne

We've paid our subscription, always thought that mean't we'd already bought it.

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This! Exactly.

All of these items were developed using our subscription fee. We have already paid the money to develop them. How is it OK for us to be asked to pay an extra fee for them?

If these were NEW items developed by a separate team especially for the cash shop then that would be fine. But these were developed by the live team using the money we already paid them. That is NOT OK.

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Originally Posted by Amused

I love that you keep saying it because the only person coming across as being on a high horse here is you.

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You're the one complaining about a non necessary luxury item ruining your enjoyment of a game. Not only do you have a high horse, but you are extremely greedy.

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Originally Posted by Mholito

Vanity stuff counts as content, now?

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Did it ever not?

What do you think the word "content" means, exactly?

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Originally Posted by Amused

I love that you keep saying it because the only person coming across as being on a high horse here is you.

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I would like to buy a high horse please, oh look at that I can in 2.4

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Originally Posted by Fayto

You're the one complaining about a non necessary luxury item ruining your enjoyment of a game. Not only do you have a high horse, but you are extremely greedy.

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As a collector, every item is necessary. Part of my fun is collecting as many items in game as I can.

It's hilarious that you think I'm the greedy one here, and not the S-E double dipping on top of their subscription fee and game/expansion/character service sales.

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Originally Posted by Tsukino

Did it ever not?

What do you think the word "content" means, exactly?

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I consider content to be actual gameplay, not optional caracter customization. Some people seem to have a problem understanding that not everyone needs to have absolutely everything in the game.

Seriously an official micro-transactions shop has no place in a sub-based game, the whole "pure vanity cash shop" belongs to b2p games that don't charge you a monthly sub, because they do make a lot of money off vanity, but this company wants both the money from vanity AND the sub money, it doesn't work like that, that's way too much greed.

But using people's arguments here, just make it p2w, since more money for SE is always a good thing for you huh?

VIP pass to bypass all coil limits, all tele destinations free, new recipes could be sold in the CS instead of added for free, the housing area of Ishgard could be exclusive for players with VIP status, I mean none of this makes you stronger so who cares? More money for SE is always a good thing, huh?

Here is the big kicker. Once you buy the mount, thats it! its not a re-occuring fee. So you can save up for it if it is so important to your gaming experience. Do you people not have Christmas or Birthdays? While typing away on your computers and/or cellphones?

And I love the "Way too much greed" for an international company who throws fan festivals (rental and setup fees are on their bankroll) in three different countries. Yeah, they are greedy.

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Originally Posted by Amused

As a collector, every item is necessary. Part of my fun is collecting as many items in game as I can.

It's hilarious that you think I'm the greedy one here, and not the S-E double dipping on top of their subscription fee and game/expansion/character service sales.

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But wouldn't a TRUE collector dig deep into their pockets for all the things if they really wanted them badly?

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Originally Posted by charlemagne

We've paid our subscription, always thought that mean't we'd already bought it.

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You could spend a lifetime trying to get some of the rare rng items in this game. Time = money. Your buying it either way. This just gives people options.

If you don't like it, quit. But good luck finding another MMO that doesn't do this. Hell even *that other MMO* offers optional mounts and services for real money.
It's just business, and it's completely optional. If it's not profitable, they won't do it.
And I would REALLY like someone to explain how a freakin' horse affects your enjoyment of the game?

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Originally Posted by charlemagne

Feel somewhat let down by this. The subscription model with no cash shop was one of the major reasons I stuck with this game from 1.0 launch.

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100% this. Not having a cash shop was one of the reasons I played this game in the first place :c

i remember a thread couples months back that there was people complain about square charging extra for retainers, which had no impact on the game whats so ever and neither will this.

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Originally Posted by Mholito

I consider content to be actual gameplay, not optional caracter customization. Some people seem to have a problem understanding that not everyone needs to have absolutely everything in the game.

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Some people also have a problem understanding that different people enjoy the game for different things. Did you know there are people that enjoy collecting vanity items? *Gasp* I know, someone who plays for a different reason than you. But as long as the new cash shop doesn't impact what YOU play the game for it's all good right? So selfish.

i am posting in this trainwreck simply to say that i was there that day

EDIT: Also to point and laugh at everyone whining about cosmetic items.

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Originally Posted by Fayto

Optional. Harms no one. It is no naive at all, it is the truth..

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Since no one else is explaining it, I'll bother to do so. All the content created for the cash shop (or literally just ripped from the current game) COULD have just been put in the game for absolutely free of charge. You could've, very easily, had access to it through the game in 2.4 or 2.5. However, instead of doing that, they are selling those items in the cash shop. What people don't understand is that this game is not even budgeted nearly as high as the sub count is currently - they are making an INSANE amount of profit out of this game by using their initial set budget and the rest of it goes straight in SE's pockets. Not only that, they are SO incredibly cheap that they have the balls to sell things not available in game in a cash shop. Yes, it is vanity, good for you and your basic understanding of the English language - however, just because something is a cosmetic item doesn't mean that it should be paid for when you are already paying the company MONTHLY to produce this game AND the models they are putting on the cash shop. I have literally already bought all those items by paying my monthly sub, I should NOT have to pay for something AGAIN that I have literally funded. You are NOT paying for just access to the servers, you and all the other subscribers are funding this MMO. Our money is meant to make this game better, eliminate the NEED for a cash shop or to go F2P. I don't know if your parents pay this sub but some of us actually have grown up and realize the value of money. I am paying a 15$ sub every month and I expect that I get all the content in the game, not have some of it pulled out from it and thrown into a cash shop where I'll have to pay more money for it - that is greedy as hell and any defense of it is laughable.

Also, I know there are going to be many of them, so I'd just like to take a second to laugh at all the people who will inevitably say "Using a cash shop is good business practice, they'll make more money!". I'm sorry, friend, but do you work for SE? Are you an employee of SE? Would you donate all your money to SE and live on the streets to support the company because apparently your consumer rights aren't important and they can strip you of all your cash since it's "good business practice"? No? Then maybe you should consider thinking about how their business practices affect you and your wallet, not how rich you can make SE. Pretending like you have some sort of business degree and sitting up on your imaginary high horse isn't contributing anything to the discussion at all, and it's frankly pathetic to read those types of posts. Please just realize that you are a consumer, not an employee of SE.

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Originally Posted by Mholito

Vanity stuff counts as content, now?

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Yes, "vanity stuff" -- mounts, weapon/armor skins, minions, etc. -- is and has always been content. Are you telling me you have never had any desire, or spent any time/effort, to get any non-mandatory items in the game because you thought they looked cool? Why would the game have this "glamour" system to change gear appearances, if it isn't content? Why can we change hair styles? Why don't we all just look the same? After all, it clearly doesn't matter, right? Only stats and numbers and being able to chart our DPS is real "content."

You yourself seem to be wearing a Slime King hat in your player avatar pic. Well, from now on you can expect all the Slime King hats to be cut out of the game you already bought and paid a subscription for. From now on, they will be blocked behind an extra cost.

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Originally Posted by Heskett

But wouldn't a TRUE collector dig deep into their pockets for all the things if they really wanted them badly?

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For real tangible items that exist in the real world? Yeah, that's acceptable. For virtual items that literally do nothing for me in real life and have no value to them outside of the game? No, that's completely unacceptable.

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Originally Posted by kyuven

If you don't like it, quit. But good luck finding another MMO that doesn't do this.

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I don't need to play an MMO.

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Originally Posted by Amused

As a collector, every item is necessary. Part of my fun is collecting as many items in game as I can.

It's hilarious that you think I'm the greedy one here, and not the S-E double dipping on top of their subscription fee and game/expansion/character service sales.

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Oh, so not only are you greedy but you also have an addiction. No, luxury items are not necessary no matter how much of a collector you are. Do you understand how MMOs, or video games in general, work? You never own video games when you buy them, what you own is a license to play them. MMOs you have to keep renewing that license, the sub fee, but that does not mean you have access to everything Square makes for that game.

Why are players crying about this?? This is the way all MMOs are going no matter if they are F2P or P2P its just the way it is. WoW is P2P and it has its cash shop with mounts and pets etc.. Archeage is F2P or P2P and it has a cash shop and now FFXIV is doing it. GET OVER IT! its the direction MMOs are going. So to cry about it or not cry about it that's the question lol

For all you doomsayers, has any present day content been cut out of the game and put behind a pay wall in the shop? like the holiday items? Anything so sinister?

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Originally Posted by Amused

For real tangible items that exist in the real world? Yeah, that's acceptable. For virtual items that literally do nothing for me in real life and have no value to them outside of the game? No, that's completely unacceptable.

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Throw in the fact that we've already paid for these with our subscription fee.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Well, if you don't like it, " Let your wallet do the talking". Words mean nothing without action. It personally doesn't bother me, but if you are hurt by this decision, just don't buy it, I am sure they will get the message.

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I know some will make fun of this, but in a capitalistic-ish system - this is the best tool. If you sincerely hate it, do not spend your money on it. "But its just a cash shop don't be baby" - said a tool to the system.. lol

Good consumers do not buy what they do not like. I did not leave WoW right away because of the shop (and it wasn't my main reason), but the shop does have a negative weight on my outlook for this game. They're smart to release expansion news first, I'm still riding the hype train... XD

+1'd btw lol

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Originally Posted by XgungraveX

i remember a thread couples months back that there was people complain about square charging extra for retainers, which had no impact on the game whats so ever and neither will this.

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Retainers actually have an effect in game, income and space.

Wow some people are looking way too into this... it's entirely OPTIONAL, buying OPTIONAL VANITY ITEMS is a choice that's completely UP TO THE PLAYER! You're not FORCED to purchase anything! Let alone anything that will affect progression!

Don't like it? DON'T BUY IT! It's so damn simple!

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Originally Posted by Alberel

Throw in the fact that we've already paid for these with our subscription fee.

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Originally Posted by Fayto

You never own video games when you buy them, what you own is a license to play them. MMOs you have to keep renewing that license, the sub fee, but that does not mean you have access to everything Square makes for that game.

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Read this.

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Originally Posted by Alberel

Throw in the fact that we've already paid for these with our subscription fee.

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You clearly didn't or else you wouldn't have to buy them off the optional shop. Sorry, but you pay a subscription fee to PLAY the game. What SE does is up to them. Get over it.

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Originally Posted by XgungraveX

i remember a thread couples months back that there was people complain about square charging extra for retainers, which had no impact on the game whats so ever and neither will this.

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Double-standards.

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Originally Posted by Alberel

Some people also have a problem understanding that different people enjoy the game for different things. Did you know there are people that enjoy collecting vanity items? *Gasp* I know, someone who plays for a different reason than you. But as long as the new cash shop doesn't impact what YOU play the game for it's all good right? So selfish.

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I enjoy getting cosmetic stuff too, but I'm not going to let myself get bothered by the existence of stuff that's not available "in-game". One can only use so much vanity gear at one time anyway.

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Originally Posted by Xairos

For all you doomsayers, has any present day content been cut out of the game and put behind a pay wall in the shop? like the holiday items? Anything so sinister?

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Are you joking. EVERYTHING they showed in the presentation other than the three minions was present content that has been cut.

The halloween items were previously all sold for 1 gil on a vendor last halloween. They have CUT those items this year to sell for real money.

The sleipnir mount already exists, used by Odin in game in all of his race forms. There's no extra development involved in giving it to players. It has been cut to sell for real money.

Man this totally kills games.

Just like offering sparkleponies and glitterlizards killed WoW when they started selling them in 2010 and the game died instantly

wait, what are we talking about here?

As much as we like to deny it, these people are running a business. If they know people are willing to pay 15 bucks to ride around like Odin, can you really blame them for giving them what customers are willing to pay for? For the people that are against this, it's only going to benefit you. If 3 million people are willing to pay an extra 15 bucks the prance around in mog suites and another 15 to ride around like Odin, most of that funding goes right back into the product you pay for. Why not find funds for the team you love so much? Would you really deny Yoshi-p a way to make an honest living?

Good job Square... The middle finger to the vanity-centered part of your P2P playerbase is the way to go.

Of course, as it's not raid content it doesn't matter. /sarcasm

I left GW2 and many others because of that, you know? I'm not willing to pay a sub and have this shit too. I'm on the line of leaving now, so the next thing that I don't like will be the last, you can take my word for it. I'll vote with my wallet, as that's what you seem to care about.

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Originally Posted by Skyl1n3

Wow some people are looking way too into this... it's entirely OPTIONAL, buying OPTIONAL VANITY ITEMS is a choice that's completely UP TO THE PLAYER! You're not FORCED to purchase anything! Let alone anything that will affect progression!

Don't like it? DON'T BUY IT! It's so damn simple!

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It boils down to people not wanting others to have the same stuff they have. Snowflake syndrome.

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Originally Posted by Skyl1n3

Wow some people are looking way too into this... it's entirely OPTIONAL, buying OPTIONAL VANITY ITEMS is a choice that's completely UP TO THE PLAYER! You're not FORCED to purchase anything! Let alone anything that will affect progression!

Don't like it? DON'T BUY IT! It's so damn simple!

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It's only OPTIONAL to the players that don't care about the vanity side of the game. For the people that do, it's essentially demanding EXTRA money from them if they want to continue collecting items in the game.

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Originally Posted by Fyrebrand

You yourself seem to be wearing a Slime King hat in your player avatar pic. Well, from now on you can expect all the Slime King hats to be cut out of the game you already bought and paid a subscription for. From now on, they will be blocked behind an extra cost.

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Tell me one item that they removed from the game and put behind a paywall!