Regarding the Atmas, yes, another one of those.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

The point that the OP, and several responding - even in opposition to her - are making here is that the content isn't fun.

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So why do it? Especially for multiple characters.

Novus for your main is a reasonable goal but are the Levi & Soldiery weapons not good enough for your alts? You don't need Animus/Novus to progress in this game at all right now, can't see why anyone would force themselves through content that they apparently hate when there are plenty of alternatives out there.

Guess it's dat glow right?

EDIT: Reading back on the OP, their problem seems to lie with the FATE system. Still struggling to see why anyone would feel they have to force themselves to do that content if they dislike it so much :/

Another atma rant when this game has bigger problems, there must be like 3 more threads like this one which are liked by the same 5 guys in the next 10 pages.

I enjoy atma farming, i dislike tome grinding and in expect SE to do more things like atmas, if you don't like them just get another weapon, all of them are the same, yes that's a bigger problem, gear makes no difference in this game, so why do ppl work on relics if they dislike fate grinding?

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Originally Posted by Codek

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Heya Codek ^^

Nice charts you've been making there, kudos!

9 fights
PvP grinds (I am a PvE person, even if the glamour is tempting, I don't want to 'grind' for it, like wintrading..)
Sightseeing log (load of .. very disappointed, so nty)
Master books for crafts (Waiting for 2.3 since new stuff for DoH and DoL will come, and then I'll continue them)
Achievements (working on them, GC one almost complete, ready to switch allegiance)
More Achievements (More working on them ^^)
Collection of gear sets for all classes (at least the primal weapons because they generally look cool) - nty I am waiting for CT2 to show better stuff that what the looks we got so far.
Chocobo leveling (waiting for chocobo stables in one week! - That is one thing i'm waiting for)
Housing/Gardening (our FC got it already - gardening a little bit, not that interested)
Become a Gilionaire (In time, I'm in no rush)
Role Play Theater (I RP on Table à la Old D&D, not in MMOs)
Recruiting worshipers (lol people call me king cause it's been like that for ages, but i'll never pretend to be one, as a god is out of proportions hehe)
Try to take over Eorzea (hmmm nty, Eorzea will take care of itself plenty, hopefully with the expansion and new classes, cause that's what I dig in games)

So yes, even if there's a little bit of everything left to do, I think a break for a week until next patch is a good thing, after playing non-stop since it's Launch.

Have fun!

http://i.imgur.com/dOh0K.png

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Originally Posted by Gallus

But I like the game, and I want my relic weapon, do I deserve to be put killing level 5 sprites with fast blade + savage blade for the next 100 hours because of that?

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If that's the way the devs of the game choose to do it, then yes. I don't know about you, but I'd take the current means than rely on Atma to drop from raids with the equal chance that Levi mirrors have. Let's see you folks QQ moar on that.

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Originally Posted by Renik

Another atma rant when this game has bigger problems

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These "bigger problems" and the poor quality of the atma grind are not mutually exclusive.

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Originally Posted by Grembo

So why do it? Especially for multiple characters.

Novus for your main is a reasonable goal but are the Levi & Soldiery weapons not good enough for your alts? You don't need Animus/Novus to progress in this game at all right now, can't see why anyone would force themselves through content that they apparently hate when there are plenty of alternatives out there.

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I don't do it frequently. Like I've been saying - I don't grind the content because the content is not enjoyable.

I feel like your question can be reversed on the devs. If the content isn't fun, why implement it? In this case the point is clear, it was to get us into lowbie areas to help PS4 players with FATES, and to draw the high level content out. My point is that content can be drawn out in more potentially fun, challenging, and most of all equally obtainable ways, and that I would prefer that future high level (or even low level) content not be reduced to mindless grinding and dice rolls.

note - I realize that my saying that the content "isn't fun" is subjective, but I have not talked to a single in-game or irl friend who has enjoyed it, and most of them have been straight up frustrated by it to the point of ignoring the content all together, which suggests to me that I am in the majority regarding those who dislike it. The closest to praise that I've heard for it is that it's not nearly as terrible as the Novus grind, which is hardly praise at all if you ask me.

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Originally Posted by Raldo

I enjoyed the Atma grind far more than the process of grinding myth for Animus/Novus, but you won't find me complaining about it except in response to other complaints.

Different strokes for different folks. I've obtained 3 full sets of Atma now.

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The novus balances this much better. Fates for those who choose it, daily quest for those who don't have the time to grind but don't mind waiting longer IRL to get it, and myth for the hardcore grind folks.

Having a stage of advancement where your only option is an absymal drop rate that will vary wildly from player to player is a problem.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

I don't mind grinding, at all, I could spend another thousand hours playing this game.

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Well just grind it out.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

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Or you could be in a noisy minority!

Fact is, SE has the data, we do not. So just stick to stating what you don't like and the reasons, while keeping the "majority this and minority that" nonsense out of your post.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

These "bigger problems" and the poor quality of the atma grind are not mutually exclusive.



I don't do it frequently. Like I've been saying - I don't grind the content because the content is not enjoyable.

I feel like your question can be reversed on the devs. If the content isn't fun, why implement it? In this case the point is clear, it was to get us into lowbie areas to help PS4 players with FATES, and to draw the high level content out. My point is that content can be drawn out in more potentially fun, challenging, and most of all equally obtainable ways, and that I would prefer that future high level (or even low level) content not be reduced to mindless grinding and dice rolls.

note - I realize that my saying that the content "isn't fun" is subjective, but I have not talked to a single in-game or irl friend who has enjoyed it, and most of them have been straight up frustrated by it to the point of ignoring the content all together, which suggests to me that I am in the majority regarding those who dislike it. The closest to praise that I've heard for it is that it's not nearly as terrible as the Novus grind, which is hardly praise at all if you ask me.

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The devs have clear reasons to make things require RNG with low chances, which are usually just one piece of the puzzle. Often, the first reason is because of gating. Before going into that, you have to also include the reason of opportunity. Is this intended to be something that everyone can do? Would it be too much to ask of the intended target players to continue raiding for these random drop goods, given that they just finished raids and grinding myth tomes (which originally were the Soldiery equiv, with less options)? Do we want this to be their "go-to" option, like the first 2 relic stages, instead of doing things like Levi Ex or Coil turns?

Then there's the standard reasons of time, lore, etc. All of this cannot be looked at separately, but rather as a whole. It has to blend and fit together for it work. You don't have to be a game dev in order to figure out what is a necessary evil and what isn't. Sometimes they might take it too far, that's normal... we're all human, we make mistakes. Atma, given how it's done, isn't taking it too far. Especially if you include a potential design intent that they weren't doing so with the intent that people get multiple Atma/Animus/Novus/etc relics, but will allow you the chance to do it if you choose to do so.

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Originally Posted by ShinkuTachi

Or you could be in a noisy minority!

Fact is, SE has the data, we do not. So just stick to stating what you don't like and the reasons, while keeping the "majority this and minority that" nonsense out of your post.

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Potentially! I guess I should say "everyone that I know" instead of the "majority", which is to say dozens of players that play frequently - from all demographics (from players who regularly run high level coils to players who just started the atma quest) all dislike, or hate the atma quest.

I'm interested in hearing why you like it, if that is the case! I personally have not heard a single person give any kind of reasoning behind liking it, so I'm genuinely interested.

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Originally Posted by ShinkuTachi

http://i.imgur.com/dOh0K.png

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damn capitalists

i think it would be better if after we got are atma for our first class the rate of atma increases by 10-20 percent per class we have the atma weapon.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

Potentially! I guess I should say "everyone that I know" instead of the "majority", which is to say dozens of players that play frequently - from all demographics (from players who regularly run high level coils to players who just started the atma quest) all dislike, or hate the atma quest.

I'm interested in hearing why you like it, if that is the case! I personally have not heard a single person give any kind of reasoning behind liking it, so I'm genuinely interested.

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I know your inquiry was directed at someone else, but I can tell you why I like these grinds.

They're simple and mind-numbingly quick (to complete the task I mean, not acquire the item). It's the sort of thing to do on off-times or when nothing really matters lol. For me, Atma grinding offers additional things to be mindful in a game that is rather streamlined and systematic. On one hand, I have to deal with the low drop rate, which admittedly can be disheartening. On the other hand, I acquire a lot of seals (which I absolutely burn through too fast on), work on achievements, work on acquiring a rather useful weapon since I don't do endgame, and allows me to make the active choice of stopping my boring day-to-day gil acquisition routines for something else to change it up a bit. I feel like, for the most part, this content is specifically designed for players like me. Folks that don't exactly do endgame raids (i.e. Coil). To me, there's a lot of positive results to come from Atma grinding, even if I don't get said item. Opportunist might define that outlook.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

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Because some people just like grindy, time sinks that they can really invest themselves in. I really don't know how else to put it. I mean, why do people like Dragon Quest? Why did people like the EQ MMO formula? It's just a preference of play.

Besides, there are other options for people who don't want to put forth the time on the relic (ignoring the fact that the future will come with an inevitable nerf in drop rate).

Ah, the good old times when men were men, women were women and games were fun. Now we pay hoping to have fun and we are rewarded with endless grinds. And grinds. And grinds. I just leveled Botanist to 50. Soul-destroying.

Reason I play the game? Breathtaking landscapes and graphics (I re-tried RIFT and GW2 and their visuals, which I had thought gorgeous, seem just horrible after FF14). Practically nothing else.

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Originally Posted by Goodberry

Ah, the good old times when men were men, women were women and games were fun. Now we pay hoping to have fun and we are rewarded with endless grinds. And grinds. And grinds. I just leveled Botanist to 50. Soul-destroying.

Reason I play the game? Breathtaking landscapes and graphics (I re-tried RIFT and GW2 and their visuals, which I had thought gorgeous, seem just horrible after FF14). Practically nothing else.

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Not quite sure what you mean by the "good old times". You mean in the last 6 years or so? I can tell you for a fact that 10 years ago at most, we still had grinds in MMORPGs that required way more time investment with NO ALTERNATIVES. The "good old times" would probably fit pre-mainstream mentality of the player base than the current. The amount of luck, time investment, and social aptitude needed for even the times of D&D, which dates back a lot farther than 10 years, puts today's "grind" to complete shame.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

I feel like your question can be reversed on the devs. If the content isn't fun, why implement it? In this case the point is clear, it was to get us into lowbie areas to help PS4 players with FATES, and to draw the high level content out.

My point is that content can be drawn out in more potentially fun, challenging, and most of all equally obtainable ways, and that I would prefer that future high level (or even low level) content not be reduced to mindless grinding and dice rolls.

note - I realize that my saying that the content "isn't fun" is subjective, but I have not talked to a single in-game or irl friend who has enjoyed it, and most of them have been straight up frustrated by it to the point of ignoring the content all together, which suggests to me that I am in the majority regarding those who dislike it. The closest to praise that I've heard for it is that it's not nearly as terrible as the Novus grind, which is hardly praise at all if you ask me.

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Meh, it's grinding ...struggling to remember any instance (in any game) of grinding ever being fun.

It's about the reward at the end right? The sense of accomplishment when you finally get that item you've been grinding for. Clearly this must be the case for you, otherwise you wouldn't be grinding out another Animus and ignoring the alternative weapons :p

Personally I think they're heading in the right way with the Animus & Novus quests, we needed something to actually work towards and in Novus's case I feel the customisable stats are well worth the investment. I'll agree that there needs to be less reliance on FATE's (F*** Level Sync) but SE seems to have already acknowledged this with the Novus quest.

Zenith is still there for the folk who need a shiny weapon within two hours of hitting Lv. 50.

If anyone is trying to defend the fact that for something considered a godly weapon of legend we should obtain it by killing level 3 mobs... Explain.

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Originally Posted by Welsper59

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If you can find joy from that then more power to you, but I do have to ask, would you be running the FATEs at all if it weren't for the potential for atma?

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Originally Posted by ShinkuTachi

Because some people just like grindy, time sinks that they can really invest themselves in. I really don't know how else to put it. I mean, why do people like Dragon Quest? Why did people like the EQ MMO formula? It's just a preference of play.

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Originally Posted by Grembo

Meh, it's grinding ...struggling to remember any instance (in any game) of grinding ever being fun.

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See, I understand the joy of a grind. I mean I play the disgaea games.. those games are nothing without the grind. But disgaea never forces me to go back and grind level ones as a high level character. In fact no matter how much I grind in disgaea I'm constantly being rewarded - whether it's levels, new abilities, loot, or powering up new and old weapons.

This system is a poor excuse for a grind because there's literally no sense of accomplishment from spending five hours grinding content that I've all ready done with literally nothing to show for it, and knowing that even IF you get the prize, you still have to do it eleven more times. It's that or run them casually and maybe get one atma per month (that's been my experience so far)? I just don't see how it's comparable to something like Dragon Quest.

I guess this is why slot machines are so popular.

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Originally Posted by Zarzak

If anyone is trying to defend the fact that for something considered a godly weapon of legend we should obtain it by killing level 3 mobs... Explain.

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well putting aside the silliness from a lore perspective, it just isn't a challenge running in and wiping level 10-40ish FATEs with a dozen other people. It's mindless busy work designed to gate us from... more busy work? Put the content behind difficult bosses, put the content behind a series of dungeons, make us assemble a golden monkey whose parts are hidden in secret locations, just about anything would be more fun than battling the RNG twelve times.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

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The whole point to the major RNG factor with this, is to prevent people from progressing too fast, kinda like the reason for coil lockouts and the soldiery cap. That's why they didn't increase the drop rate for 2.3. Likely, that increase will come in 2.4 (my guess).

Before they said they wouldn't touch the drop rate, they said they would examine player feedback concerning it. Player feedback, of course, includes the data of what people are doing and have done in the game. That's what I meant before when I said SE has the data. The fact that they are not increasing the drop rate yet, simply means that enough or more people than expected are seeing this content through and are making progression. We will likely see an increase in the Atma drop rate, and a cheaper Myth price on the books for 2.4; along with the release of BCoB3 and the Echo applied to BCoB2 (again, my guess).

Also, they already have stuff gated behind harder content, it's the High Allagan weapon (which is still better than the Novus).

Mind you, while I don't agree with the grievance, I do understand what you're saying. So I don't want you to get the idea that I'm trying to argue or that I have something against you, in case I ever came off as such.


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Originally Posted by Starrywisdom

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Do you understand how probability works?

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Originally Posted by ShinkuTachi

The whole point to the major RNG factor with this, is to prevent people from progressing too fast, kinda like the reason for coil lockouts and the soldiery cap. That's why they didn't increase the drop rate for 2.3. Likely, that increase will come in 2.4 (my guess).

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You keep using that word....I don't think you know what it means.

RNG =/= Progression Speed

Mathematically speaking - you could go 12/12. So technically -- you could have 100% drop rate. So your entire argument is flawed. I know people who've gotten all 12 in under 100 fates total; and I know people who've done over 100 fates to get just one.

All it does is piss people off. It's a terrible gameplay mechanic and should be shunned at every possible moment.

The problem with atma is not the quest itself but expectations. With each fate you do you expect to get one only to be let down. I have two atma weapons the first was Bravura which was a mess up on my part was not paying attention the second is Gae Bolg which I have seven more books to animus. Took three days to get the accident took a week to get the one I wanted. Honestly I grinded my eyes out. Do I regret it? No. I just went in and got it over with like I treat my RL job five days of the week. The more you dwell the more it bugs you.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Don't ever do something like the Atma quest, again. You'll do more harm than good to this game.

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Handing everything out, making most content tossable after a week or two, creating constant lockouts in order to artificially extend content life span and over simplification is what will do more harm to this game than an optional quest.

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Originally Posted by Seiryuukishi

Do I regret it? No. I just went in and got it over with like I treat my RL job five days of the week.

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I think that's kinda telling, don't you? I mean, I'm not usually one to use the "a game should be fun" argument, but. . .

Well, let me put it this way. I have five jobs at level 50. Every job that I take to 50, I do the relic quest for. That includes SMN and SCH, which I already had the Levi (and Titan, and Garuda) weapons for. Why? Because I find the original relic quest fun, even on a 5th run through. As it stands, I can't see myself doing the Atma and Myth grinds 10 times. I can and gladly will do the relic quest for each and every job as I (eventually) hit 50 with them, but to ask me to slog through 120 Atma and 135,000 Myth tomes is asking for way too much. Especially considering that, even if I fully complete the Novus step (ignoring those requirements for now), I'm still left with a second-rate weapon.

Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not asking for a top-tier weapon in the relic chain (though, really, why not eventually?). I'm only asking that the quest chain that will, for the foreseeable future, always end in a second-rate weapon not be a quest chain that saps people's will to keep playing. We're talking a quest chain where the first major improvements can be done in a single night (up to zenith), followed by what's likely a couple of solid days doing almost nothing but fates, followed by farming up nearly 7 times the cap amount of Myth tomes. And let's not forget that those 13,500 tomes could have been spent gearing up alts. I mean, just in the Myth I've spent on Animus books, I could have raised my SCH ilvl by about 20 levels to ilvl 90 average, and I'm less than half way done with Animus. I would actually even have had some left over to start gearing another class. And this is all to get to a weapon that's only about 4th-best.

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Originally Posted by Viridiana

I think that's kinda telling, don't you? I mean, I'm not usually one to use the "a game should be fun" argument, but. . .

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What's fun to you won't always be fun to someone else. When you decide to dedicate to an MMORPG or any kind of RPG that has actual goals you're expected to put in time and effort, it's not always going to be "fun". Hildebrand quests were fun, guess how long that content lasted?

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Originally Posted by Hiruke

Agreed. Instead they should say this to SE. "SE, don't do it." For every person who doesn't mind the mindless grind, I guarantee there are several more who are sickened by it, who either actually won't do it but are offended it's even there, and others who will do it and hate themselves for it. Both of these types of people get that much closer to quitting every time something like this is introduced into the game. If SE doesn't respect the players time, if FUN is not the #1 concern, it will hurt them long term.

Clearly the apologists think they're some sort of majority, but they aren't.

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Any proof to who is the majority and who is not? I would like to see those numbers, since the the Forum-Community itself is a minority with approx below 5%. SE does respect the players time, that why almost everything can be done within a short amount of Time. Zodiak Questline is for those who WANT to spend that time and do like timesinks.

If you do not like it, don't fucking do it.

It is the same as trying to force Burger King to make the same Burgers as McDonalds. Atma Threads and those complaining about it, are just not the people SE wants to cater to with the Zodiak line. Not everyone does like the same kind of content and i find it pathetic how people want SE to cater to every special snowflake out there.

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Originally Posted by Tsuga

These "bigger problems" and the poor quality of the atma grind are not mutually exclusive.

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Too many words to say nothing... the time invested in getting atmas in nothing compared with the time running dungeons ,which are easy as hell, to get the 13500 myths you need to upgrade your atma, i found that grind much more boring than atma farming.

I hate fates, i don't find fun in having to kill weak mobs, but i like atma farming because it's the only way to develop your character out of instances, and your solution to make it more fun is to instance the whole quest?

As i said this game has bigger problems, and the atma farming is not one of them, it is indeed a step in the correct direction, even if it is, as others said, bad designed because of the low drop rate.

Ok to this Nero guy. Let's see if we get this clear enough. We can argue about someone preferring Amdapor over Brayflox, or we can argue about someone preferring doing Titan EX over Ifrit EX, or we can argue about someone enjoying Binding Coil of Bahamut more than killing Primals.

But we CAN'T argue about using teleport 10000 times being fun, or travelling 2000 KMS with your chocobo fun, or killing 100000 level 5 water sprites with a rotation of 2 spells/skills fun. DO YOU FREAKING UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE...OR MAYBE NOT...

I'm not asking SE to magically cater all kinds of public, I'm asking them to be coherent to what they ask to their players. There are things that are arguable, others AREN'T. The atma quest is TERRIBLE, ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE. I've played the most grindy RPGs out there and spent hundreds, thousands of hours, I consider myself the most boring person in the entire planet, hell even my friends would mock me for replaying the same FFs over and over and over and over again, to the point you could argue I'm not a normal case. And the Atma quest is one of the most mind numbing silly boring things I've probably experienced in my entire life in a video game.

Snip(for rooms sake)
It is not so much that I do not find the game fun but rather due to the mistake I made and the fact that I generally only really concentrate on one job. Not that that do not have multiples to 50 I just experiment to see what is best suited to my play style then move from there. I have been behind and I do not care for coil or ex primals so I do relic. Just trying to get back on par in a timely fashion lol.

Many people have done it, but I could not find a single person telling me "I've enjoyed this". NOT A SINGLE ONE, because it's not enjoyable, and if you found it enjoyable you are flat out lying, 90% of the people that claimed the atma quest to be enjoyable was doing other things while doing the atma quest (watching series on youtube etc.). That's probably the most silly thing I've heard in a while. OH YES I'VE ENJOYED A LOT THE ATMA QUEST I SAVOURED EVERY MOMENT OF IT THAT'S WHY I WAS DOING SOMETHING DIFFERENT AT THE TIME.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Ok to this Nero guy. Let's see if we get this clear enough. We can argue about someone preferring Amdapor over Brayflox, or we can argue about someone preferring doing Titan EX over Ifrit EX, or we can argue about someone enjoying Binding Coil of Bahamut more than killing Primals.

But we CAN'T argue about using teleport 10000 times being fun, or travelling 2000 KMS with your chocobo fun, or killing 100000 level 5 water sprites with a rotation of 2 spells/skills fun. DO YOU FREAKING UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE...OR MAYBE NOT...

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There we go to that Gallus person.. Yes, we can actually. You know what timesinks/grinds even are? I don't care if i have to do 500 or 50000 Level5 Fates, as long as it is part of the Questline. Can't you understand what i said? If you do not like it, then it simply is not for you. I do like it.. i do like spending tons of time to farm enough Atma for all Weapons ( including Ninja ), afterwards going for 135000 Myth and then for 750 Alexandrites. YES, i Love that.. that is pure grind and nothing else and there are people like me, who actually like that and asked for it over and over on the Forums. SE did listen and gave people alike me, what we wanted.

There is Content i do not like, for example the wedding stuff. But who am i trying to change the content around it, just so it fits my personal taste? That is straight arrogant and ignorant towards those enjoying the content.

Is it that hard for you do understand, that not everyone wants to be that little special snowflake and share your personal view?

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Many people have done it, but I could not find a single person telling me "I've enjoyed this". NOT A SINGLE ONE, because it's not enjoyable, and if you found it enjoyable you are flat out lying, 90% of the people that claimed the atma quest to be enjoyable was doing other things while doing the atma quest (watching series on youtube etc.). That's probably the most silly thing I've heard in a while. OH YES I'VE ENJOYED A LOT THE ATMA QUEST I SAVOURED EVERY MOMENT OF IT THAT'S WHY I WAS DOING SOMETHING DIFFERENT AT THE TIME.

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See.. you are doing it again. People not sharing your opinion are lying, because they do not share your opinion? Get of your high horse son.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Many people have done it, but I could not find a single person telling me "I've enjoyed this". NOT A SINGLE ONE, because it's not enjoyable, and if you found it enjoyable you are flat out lying

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See, this is exactly why developers need not listen to the player base. How do you know they're lying if they find it enjoyable? Did you ask every single person that plays FFXIV ARR if they enjoyed it or not?

Some people despise coil, some enjoy it, are the ones who enjoy it lying?

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Many people have done it, but I could not find a single person telling me "I've enjoyed this". NOT A SINGLE ONE, because it's not enjoyable, and if you found it enjoyable you are flat out lying, 90% of the people that claimed the atma quest to be enjoyable was doing other things while doing the atma quest (watching series on youtube etc.). That's probably the most silly thing I've heard in a while. OH YES I'VE ENJOYED A LOT THE ATMA QUEST I SAVOURED EVERY MOMENT OF IT THAT'S WHY I WAS DOING SOMETHING DIFFERENT AT THE TIME.

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The game itself is not fun, "it goes beyond the grind" forcing you to play the same content with no changes at all over and over to get pieces of gear which are worth nothing, because of the little impact the gear has in this game, the only fun part is coil, but it's fun just because you can't spam it, and for most ppl w/o access to a static it's not even content, no one is currently having fun in this game we are just chasing carrots on sticks instead of playing content because it is really fun.

The only reason you and others find it less funny it's just because it requires less concentration than other content, and that way you can realize how boring it is.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Many people have done it, but I could not find a single person telling me "I've enjoyed this". NOT A SINGLE ONE, because it's not enjoyable, and if you found it enjoyable you are flat out lying, 90% of the people that claimed the atma quest to be enjoyable was doing other things while doing the atma quest (watching series on youtube etc.). That's probably the most silly thing I've heard in a while. OH YES I'VE ENJOYED A LOT THE ATMA QUEST I SAVOURED EVERY MOMENT OF IT THAT'S WHY I WAS DOING SOMETHING DIFFERENT AT THE TIME.

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Your asking the wrong question.

I very much enjoyed receiving my Novus! I'm sure as hell not going to say I enjoyed farming Myth to get it but the enjoyment for obtaining the reward was worth the effort (if it wasn't no one would do it...).

It's the drop rate of the atam that bugs me. It took me over 24 hours just to get one atam. I for one not able to play every day for 8 hours a day.

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Originally Posted by Renik

The game itself is not fun, "it goes beyond the grind" forcing you to play the same content .

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Welcome to the genre. There's apparently around a million others who would disagree. (Please don't quote me as trying to pass the number as fact, as no one knows the real amount of subs) Also, fun is a relative term...I don't do Coil or Ex primals and I'm still having fun. I'm also the type of person who enjoys grinds, though I won't sit here and defend the Atma grind. If you're so unhappy then...I don't know, stop playing? ^^; Perhaps MMOs simply aren't for you and there's nothing wrong with that.

I only have 1 atma which I got when I wasnt even farming. Exited an instance saw a FATE next to me and just did it. Im pretty much ignoring that content till it gets nerf. I would rather farm levi for hours in hope of a mirror or wipe a gazillion times on second coil than farm atma. Why? Cause im actually doing content that is fun and challenging.

Mirror probably has worst drop rates than the atma, and on top of that I have to roll need against 7 other people. But atleast Im not doing super boring content. I grinded my jobs to 50 so I could use all their abilities and take on challenges. Not to sync down and and lose half my spells/weapon skills that I worked so hard to acquire. But thing is Novus Omnilex is second BiS for SCH due to the customization, CRIT! -_-

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Welcome to the genre. Also, fun is a relative term...I don't do Coil or Ex primals and I'm still having fun. I'm also the type of person who enjoys grinds, though I won't sit here and defend the Atma grind. If you're so unhappy then...I don't know, stop playing? ^^; Perhaps MMOs simply aren't for you and there's nothing wrong with that.

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don't cut the sentence, the other part is important to understand my point <.<

Grind = good, boring grind = bad, grind must be fun or at least rewarding, in this game it's just annoying and the reward is useless.