Is Twintania beatable yet?

Uhhhhh no it doesn't for Coil. Coil's Echo is a flat percentage increase, unlike the scaling increases during Primals. Hence why the flying text at the beginning is entirely different.

Reading comprehension, {Do you need it?}

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Originally Posted by subteraneanbird

Uhhhhh no it doesn't for Coil. Coil's Echo is a flat percentage increase, unlike the scaling increases during Primals. Hence why the flying text at the beginning is entirely different.

Reading comprehension, {Do you need it?}

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Read your chat when you enter turn 5, today, and make sure your filters are all off, and you will see, the echo at 15%, when it used to be 10% like not too long ago, and it will be increased to 20% soon


Maybe you need it? O.o yoshi has even said that it will increase over time, read the forums more

Next Thursday it will up to 20%

Reading comprehension includes reading what I say. "Increases over time" means a time period, which can be weeks. You assumed I meant like the primals where you have to fight 3 minutes before a wipe to get an increase.

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Originally Posted by subteraneanbird

Uhhhhh no it doesn't for Coil. Coil's Echo is a flat percentage increase, unlike the scaling increases during Primals. Hence why the flying text at the beginning is entirely different.

Reading comprehension, {Do you need it?}

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It is getting increased about every two weeks. Hence, it increases over time. Which is what she said...

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Originally Posted by GalaxyGirl

2.2's ECHO INCREASES OVER TIME!

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Originally Posted by Pooky_Pasha

It is getting increased about every two weeks. Hence, it increases over time. Which is what she said...

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Haha, owned.

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Originally Posted by GalaxyGirl

Next Thursday it will up to 20%

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It should go up to 20% this Thursday. So there should be a maintenance sometime Wednesday evening or early Thursday morning depending on your timezone. Just a friendly fyi I guess.

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Originally Posted by Asael

It should go up to 20% this Thursday. So there should be a maintenance sometime Wednesday evening or early Thursday morning depending on your timezone. Just a fyi I guess.

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Thanks, I asked a fc friend and they said "next" but i believe you because he isn't exactly reliable :)

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Originally Posted by Asael

It should go up to 20% this Thursday. So there should be a maintenance sometime Wednesday evening or early Thursday morning depending on your timezone. Just a friendly fyi I guess.

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Disclaimer:This comment is obligatory, someone else would have said it if I did not.


So this means Thursday the First Coil of Bahamut will be 20% cooler.

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Originally Posted by GalaxyGirl

Tbh I don't think you know this, but 1850 dps is enough to skip phases in turns 8 and 9, those bosses have double the HP that twin has. With echo buff you're adding 400 dps with someone dead the whole time, and if no one is dead 700+ dps. Add the fact that the hp pools of all adds have been lowered in turn 5

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I have turn 9 on farm, we have multiple high-allagan weapons in our group and I still don't know what you're talking about when you say skipping phase. Do you mean stuff like skipping a meteor, ravensbeak or heavens fall? That's skipping a mechanic or pushing phases, skipping a phase is saying you nuke it's hp so fast that it doesn't even have time to start its rotation, like what happens when you nuke the brayflox boss before it can spawn the super bomb.

You can push phases lightning fast on twin now, it's at the point where we would carry 2 at a time if there were enough customers. But you would always see divebombs and at least one twister + dread which are the things that kill you no matter how much echo you have. It's besides the point anyway because I still see people do pathetic dps even with the buff and seeing a tank out dps them.

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Originally Posted by GalaxyGirl

Yes it's been nerfed to the ground. So even you could probably down it

Hp pools of enemies reduced, insane echo buff that increases over time which increases your HP, damage, and heals.

Mechanics have always been easy.

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Though would be nice if we could see where she will be divebombing, with lag there is not enough time to look in the air to spot her.

If you can dodge twisters you can beat t5. IDK how to dodge twisters though, group always wipes when dreads are spawning

HP pools of the adds and Twintania remain the same as they were in 2.1. They may seem smaller cause of the echo buff though.

T5 in DF? *grabs popcorn*

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Originally Posted by ArianneMartellMateus

If you can dodge twisters you can beat t5. IDK how to dodge twisters though, group always wipes when dreads are spawning

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Post-nerf, just run when Twister begins casting and do not get too close to other people or cross over where they/you have already been (during that cast). Don't stop moving until a second or two after the cast finishes, to ensure you don't stand on your plume.

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Originally Posted by MercuryAcetylene

don't come back.

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As snide as this post sounds, I can do no more than agree.

You're saying you're not bothered with the game, you only want a Twintania win for the achievement and you don't have a static or an FC/LS to carry you.
You're going to get frustrated.

The Echo made Twintania easier, yes, but the mechanics are still the same.
You still have to deal with Conflags, Divebombs and Snakes and if you manage to pass those phases you get juggle the combination of Twisters and Dreadknights before you finally reach the final stage of the fight.
Oh and there's Death Sentences giving your healers heart attacks every 30 secons throughout the fight.

Note:
Most DF/PF "practice" groups won't even make it past Conflags, even with a beefed up Echo.

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Originally Posted by BillyBones

And if its still hard, when would be a good time to come back and finish it?

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Two options, either you have 7 friends willing to carry you, or have pile of gil laying around to pay mercs.
If you have neither, don't bother unless you're willing to pick the game up in its entirety again.

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Originally Posted by Zaft

Post-nerf, just run when Twister begins casting and do not get too close to other people or cross over where they/you have already been (during that cast). Don't stop moving until a second or two after the cast finishes, to ensure you don't stand on your plume.

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It gets easier the more people do it and better as a team, but I've seen a lot of killer twister moments even with complete understanding of them.

-Greatest offender is the melee. If he ever crosses with the tank, that's it, most likely wiping.

-2nd greatest offender is the dreds. People are so busy staying away from dreds they hit a twister, or they move in to hit the dred, and then when twister happens, they cross each other, or kill each other, etc.

-3rd offender of twister is the 2 or 3 dred, usually 3, when you get dred with twister, you have to dodge a twister while dealing with a dred. Melees really screw this up, as a single cross or derp is pretty much tank/melee/OT(if you have one) and anyone else.

-last offender is the healers, which are so worry about DS and the plumet that they completely derp on twister. Worse if you have no OT, and your melee is getting squashed by plummet.

I've seen a good amount of common mistakes in twin these days since she is getting to the point where almost lvl50 can participate(and want to).

Strangely most people spend a long time on dive bombs and snakes but very short time on twisters. It usually helps to have one or multiple members to be time keeper on that phase can <call> out the important stuff.

I suspect with 20% twin and 25% twin and even better gear, there may be more improvised brute force tactics much like the way used in titan ex.

-conflags you can actually have someone die, and raise them again, to not affect the fight much anymore, even double weakness maybe enough to survive phase changes.

-dive bombs. stand in the middle and eat it and heal up, or spread out and just raise as needed?

-snakes you can down 2 snakes before dive bombs, and 2 more snakes after dive bombs. But then that's asking a lot of dps from people who obviously are not doing lots of dps if they can't do dive bombs.

-twister... well..not clue how to brute force this one, just gotta do it.

somebody stated this before but said encounter is a memorization game taken to an extreme.
you will have to learn it through painfull trial and error still.
even the maximum echo (30%?) will do absolutely nothing for you and it will still be beyond the capabilities of pretty much the majority of this games community to clear it.

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Originally Posted by razzgrizz3

somebody stated this before but said encounter is a memorization game taken to an extreme.
you will have to learn it through painfull trial and error still.
even the maximum echo (30%?) will do absolutely nothing for you and it will still be beyond the capabilities of pretty much the majority of this games community to clear it.

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Sad thing is, it'll only get harder.

unless SE nerf some of the mechanics to the ground (like divebombs, deathwall, conflags, fireballs, twisters, dreadknights, any instant death mechanic really) then you'll still have to learn it like it was 2.0.

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Originally Posted by BillyBones

I quit before 2.2 and want to finish T5 in order to get the trophy. I don't care about the game anymore and can't be bothered looking for a static team or invest any time in this. Just want to get it done.
So whats the difficulty of T5 right now? Did they nerf it yet? Is it beatable with DF? How much do the runs cost? And if its still hard, when would be a good time to come back and finish it?

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Na, t5 probably won't be beatable for you until 2.4

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Originally Posted by kukurumei

Sorta Sorta. Not really, is the final answer.

The buff does nothing to every major mechanic, and we have tried brute forcing it. Doesn't work as of 15%.

Buff helps: Death Sentences, Infirmary, fast conflags, 12minute enrage
Buff doesn't help: Conflags in general, Fireballs resets, dive bombs, snakes, twisters, dreds, liquid hell, pretty much all the hard stuff.

So basically no, echo doesn't help clear twin.

What echo does help is training. You don't have stupid stuff happening. If someone is caught in a conflag they shouldn't have, no big deal, If a tank is caught in a unprotected DS, not the end of the world. If you have someone dead on dreds, not the end of the world.

But
Not doing conflags the 2.1 way wipe.
Not doing dive bombs the 2.1 way is a wipe
Not doing snakes the 2.1 way is a wipe (though it's a lot more lax in now) [Nah!!, it is sooo much relax now, if dps is alive and can't kill it, then they are so bad at their role.]
Not doing twisters 2.1 is a wipe
Not doing dreds 2.1 is a wipe
Not doing hatches 2.1 is a wipe

Basically, 2.2 is twin 2.1 without an enrage timer

Twin is win is not going to come to those that couldn't beat twin in the first place.

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But I think what you said is opposite. Those dps stuffs, healing stuffs is basically the hardest part of the fight that limited only people who skilled in their role to win. Those mechanic about general conflag, dive bomb, dreds, twisters are all the easy part of the fight, as long as people are not so slow in learning.

Yeah, don't come back yet.

Echo doesn't help that much on T5. The better advantage is that makes easier is to sell runs ,so they shoud not be very expensive right now.

But... DF? With 8 random people? No. I don't think that will happend in months.

Beatable? Yes! With Duty Finder? No, with Party Finder? 50 - 60% Chance. ( People still died at Dive Bomb and Twister. ) The fight is really easy if everyone know the Mechanic and how to Dodge. It not that high of a DPS check due to the huge buff. Conflag shouldn't be a problem anymore if you form a soak party and everyone know when to run in or unless everyone is severely under gear. If you can get pass all Dive Bomb and ovoid Twister, it a Win everytime. Twister can still one shot you.

I managed to kill Twintania using the DF. Judging from the achieves, there were 3 new players. Don't know if the others were friends or strangers.

All the echo in the world won't save you from twisters when it's an instant kill. (Hallowed Ground won't even stop it) It's avoid it or die and likely kill multiple people in the process.

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Originally Posted by ArianneMartellMateus

If you can dodge twisters you can beat t5. IDK how to dodge twisters though, group always wipes when dreads are spawning

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That's where i'm stuck too!!! Does anyone know when the next scheduled buff is?

**Edit I CAN dodge them but others not so much. We fall apart during that phase. Practice practice prac....*throws controller

Twisters is a one shot mechanic, I don't even know if it's assigned a numerical damage value. Even if you had 99,999 HP it would still instantly kill you, that's how it's designed. All the buffs in the world won't save you if you can't learn how to dodge them.

Twister is a very easy mechanic to dodge. All you have to do is watch Twintania's cast bar when she starts using twister you just start moving and not cross paths with anyone else and don't stop moving till the cast goes off. Back when it was current content the hardest part for us was getting past dive bombs, twisters were a joke to dodge though post nerf almost nobody ever died to these.

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Originally Posted by Alise

But I think what you said is opposite. Those dps stuffs, healing stuffs is basically the hardest part of the fight that limited only people who skilled in their role to win. Those mechanic about general conflag, dive bomb, dreds, twisters are all the easy part of the fight, as long as people are not so slow in learning.

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Huh? No way. Just because a DS won't one shot a tank doesn't mean it won't 2 shot a tank. Just because a snake won't need massive dps during weakness doesn't mean it won't need a focus push during weakness.

How are those the hardest or even remotely hard mechanics? You learn them doing it twice.

You are doing the exact same things as 2.1 twin. It's in no way easier. It makes it easier to train for twin, and remove stupid wipes. Wipes that occurred by people that can do things correctly, but just screwed up for a split second.

Let's put it in reverse. Anyone that learns and beats 2.2 twin can go back to 2.1 twin (no echo) and beat it with a few tries.

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Originally Posted by Mergadeth

That's where i'm stuck too!!! Does anyone know when the next scheduled buff is?

**Edit I CAN dodge them but others not so much. We fall apart during that phase. Practice practice prac....*throws controller

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A few things can help with twisters:

1. Everyone should have Twintania focus targeted. If you have to, make the focus target frame SOOPER HOOGE and put it somewhere very visible (towards the middle of your screen or, if you're a healer, closer to your party frames).
2. Have someone fire off a macro in /p when the cast starts to catch those who happen to not be looking at that second (this is just a crutch thing, but it can help). Include a sound like <se.1> in the macro for added benefit.
3. Make sure to NEVER cross paths with anyone during the twister cast.

The hardest part with twisters is keeping your attention split between dreadknights and the boss. Once you can manage that, they're super easy. :)

My group finally beat it last month it was a good victory with 10% echo. Twisters and dreds took use a little while to master but the echo will not save u from twisters, dred and hatch. this is going to be something u will have to learn with a static group its still not easy.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

The hardest part with twisters is keeping your attention split between dreadknights and the boss. Once you can manage that, they're super easy. :)

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That only happens after the 3rd dred, and probably won't happen again.

For the 1st 2, you alternate DS twister dred, and they slowly get closer depending on your dps and going into twister phase, if you get a dred+twister.

but usually almost always the 3rd is a twister in the middle of dred.

The hardest part here is that you have to have a well practiced tank for DS. Since not only does he have to not cross with other melee, he has to remember to not get an unprotected DS if possible, or at worse call out a Death sentence or stoneskin himself. If there is a split second of heal stoppage, you have a dead tank

Now one says it's just DS, but no, not when you have people running from dreds and moving from twisters. Being out of heal range, or lack of timing will destroy a tank in this phase.

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Originally Posted by Shioban

For example; you're a white-mage without [...] sure-cast

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For what exactly? If you're not to stupid to time the casts around the fireballs in conflag phase, there is absolutely nothing in that fight, where you could use that skill.

Also in other contents timing is the key.

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Originally Posted by KarstenS

For what exactly? If you're not to stupid to time the casts around the fireballs in conflag phase, there is absolutely nothing in that fight, where you could use that skill.

Also in other contents timing is the key.

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Are you saying it's better to wait to cast Cure 3 after the fireball hits rather than use Surecast and cast during Fireball so it hits as soon as the damage is done?

Got a clear in an instant after i resubbed a week ago. DF is just heaven, couldn't even get to twister phase in 2.0-2.1 with everyone dying at divebombs and whatever else for no reason. Jp server(lol)

When's SCoB DF and why the hell did the new Extreme modes got locked?

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Originally Posted by Naunet

The hardest part with twisters is keeping your attention split between dreadknights and the boss. Once you can manage that, they're super easy. :)

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So far we do this to the letter minus the macro sound. We would have made it to the last phase last night buuut a twister happened while we were dpsing a dread. Said twister landed right on the pally and goon. It was all downhill from there. Not sure how to keep dps and stuns on the dread WHILE avoiding twisters.

Like i said, i have no problem avoiding them but then again i'm a bard. The issue is when one spawns while we are focused on a dread.

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Originally Posted by JammerSidewinder

Are you saying it's better to wait to cast Cure 3 after the fireball hits rather than use Surecast and cast during Fireball so it hits as soon as the damage is done?

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it's neither better or worse because there is no other AOE damage on the party. you have sufficient time to do it either way with no risk to anyone.

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Originally Posted by Mergadeth

So far we do this to the letter minus the macro sound. We would have made it to the last phase last night buuut a twister happened while we were dpsing a dread. Said twister landed right on the pally and goon. It was all downhill from there. Not sure how to keep dps and stuns on the dread WHILE avoiding twisters.
Like i said, i have no problem avoiding them but then again i'm a bard. The issue is when one spawns while we are focused on a dread.

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The way I see it is that avoiding twisters should be the priority. For the duration of the twister, the OT should stop stunning and dodge the twister first before getting back to stunning. This is the same case for all the DPS in this fight. Bards have it easier since they can move and still maintain DPS so there's no reason for them to miss a twister. Also, this is why it's important for either your smn or BLM or even your scholar to apply some kind of slow on the dread the moment it spawns. Miasma or lethargy will give your OT enough time to dodge the twister then get back to chain stunning.

I'm not exactly sure how the fight works for a DPS since I've never played one in t5 but as a healer, I barely take my eyes off my focus target bar. I take quick glances at my party list to make sure no one is low but the focus target bar is where most of my focus is at during twister phase. I figure it should be the same for dps. As long as you're keeping your eyes on the focus target bar most of the time and only taking it off to ensure you have the right thing targetted then there's no reason to miss dodging a twister at all.

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Originally Posted by Mergadeth

So far we do this to the letter minus the macro sound. We would have made it to the last phase last night buuut a twister happened while we were dpsing a dread. Said twister landed right on the pally and goon.

It was all downhill from there. Not sure how to keep dps and stuns on the dread WHILE avoiding twisters.

Like i said, i have no problem avoiding them but then again i'm a bard. The issue is when one spawns while we are focused on a dread.

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Focus target on Twintania, put it next to current mob HP bar, your melee dps do not need to look at the current target HP bar when dpsing dread but putting them close to each other makes it easy to see both but the important thing is they need to always keep an eye on Twintania focus target. This way, they can dps dread while still knowing when twister is casting. A twister on either the OT or melee dps will usually kill both, but a dread that is a bit slow to die will only kill 1 person, so priority is on dodging twister. My group did it with OT + 2 melee dps before echo, so it was even harder since having 3 melee on dread means less space to move.

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Originally Posted by SulwynCaliope

I'm not exactly sure how the fight works for a DPS since I've never played one in t5 but as a healer, I barely take my eyes off my focus target bar. I take quick glances at my party list to make sure no one is low but the focus target bar is where most of my focus is at during twister phase. I figure it should be the same for dps. As long as you're keeping your eyes on the focus target bar most of the time and only taking it off to ensure you have the right thing targetted then there's no reason to miss dodging a twister at all.

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Again if you do twisters enough you will have a sense of the timing.
The phase starts with (possible DS) Twister DS dred DS Twister DS dred DS Twister with dred. With very little fluctuations.

so any movement on your focus bar will give you a sense of where you should be.

So you actually know when a twister is coming or a dred is coming to weave in and out. You should have no more then 4 sets of dreds unless people start dying at this echo. So you really only need to learn pattern 1,2,3 sets of dred, with the 4 set that will likely break twin into hatches.

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Originally Posted by JammerSidewinder

Are you saying it's better to wait to cast Cure 3 after the fireball hits rather than use Surecast and cast during Fireball so it hits as soon as the damage is done?

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When we was new, we used Cure3. But after doing it again and again (I know this fight with both healer classes), we noticed, its enough to recast stoneskin, maybe a medica if dmg was close to death and fairy do the rest fast enough. No need for wasting mana on cure3.

The only thing that troubles some time is the heal debuff. This seems to be a design decision to give the scholar a place in this fight. Without that debuff healing with 2 whitemages would be much easier in my eyes.