2.25 Balance Request Megathread

Warrior
Remove the root effect from Holmgang.
Extend the duration of Holmgang to 10 seconds.
Make the effect of Holmgang occur immediately when the player presses the button, not after it completes an animation first.

Paladin
Make the effect of Hallowed Ground occur immediately when the player presses the button, not after it completes an animation first.

White Mage
Make the effect of Benediction occur immediately when the player presses the button, not after it completes an animation first.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

Please Contribute!


MONK

1) Arm of the Destroyer – tp to 100
2) Fists of Wind – restore 20tp per auto-attack
3) Greased Lightning – duration to 14s
4) Haymaker – make off-GCD
5) Perfect Balance – retain stance upon expiration; cd to 210s (from 240s)
6) Shoulder Tackle – add Bind/Heavy, remove Stun; dur to 3s, cd to 75s, tp to 100 (from 2s, 90s, 120tp)*

*now usable during boss encounters that require a stun-rotation

{more to come}{please give minor, plausible balance changes}

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MONK IS THE MOST OP DPS IN THE GAME AND YOUR ASKING FOR THIS, TELL YOU THIS, WHY NOT GIVING YOU GOD MODE ON MONK ?? BETTER ??
oh btw srry caps.

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Originally Posted by Nouran

MONK IS THE MOST OP DPS IN THE GAME AND YOUR ASKING FOR THIS, TELL YOU THIS, WHY NOT GIVING YOU GOD MODE ON MONK ?? BETTER ??

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HELL YEAH! MNK POWAH!! ò.ó/

I'd really want a decrease in the amount of tp that we need to use "arm of the destroyer" or "rockbreak", since i ran out tp really fast if i over-use it, but... oh, well, learning to manage tp is one of the points of being dps

thread name is balance request
but tc ask for make monk more op

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Originally Posted by Gesser

2) Fists of Wind – restore 20tp per auto-attack

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Why would you want to change fists of Wind? The skill is really good in situations where you need to be fast with your feet.

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Originally Posted by Felis

Why would you want to change fists of Wind? The skill is really good in situations where you need to be fast with your feet.

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Which are.....? sorry, being monk since 1.0 (well, 1.XX, you know) and... for me is almost useless. When do you want to use it? I did it at the beginning of Titan HM when i wasn't aware of his mechanics and i wanted to be more cautious, but now i use Fist of Fire always, only changing sometimes to Fist of Earth to reduce some damage from unavoidable aoes (and usually i forget to do it lol)

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

So BRDs can "help" with healing in PTs like DPS casters? I'd rather the classes stick to the role that they are, more DPS helps healing more than crummy healing done by a DPS class with no mind.

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Did a Bard out-heal you in 1.0 or something? Lol. Is there any reason to be against an option for a Bard?

If they were to get healing back they would OBVIOUSLY get a cure potency buff, I want Bard's to be more support like they were before.

Or at least get the healing song the Bard mentor uses in his level 50 quest.

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Originally Posted by Ryans

I agree with you on avatars but completely disagree on dragoon pets. None of their lore in FFXIV has anything to do with building a relationship with dragons/wyverns and is in fact quite the opposite. Can there be a job that plays with dragons? Sure. Make a tamer class that breaks off into beastmaster and some kind of dragon tamer jobs, but leave dragoon lore alone.

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He was joking and making fun of peoples previous posts in other threads.

Basically:
- Why the hell should Summoners be able to summon a full sized Ifrit?? Absolutely ridiculous.. and you agreed lolol.
- He knows the lore. They KILL dragons. He was being sarcastic. Way to let it go over your head. :P

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Originally Posted by Gesser

[B][COLOR="blue"]
MONK

1) Arm of the Destroyer – tp to 100
2) Fists of Wind – restore 20tp per auto-attack
3) Greased Lightning – duration to 14s
4) Haymaker – make off-GCD
5) Perfect Balance – retain stance upon expiration; cd to 210s (from 240s)
6) Shoulder Tackle – add Bind/Heavy, remove Stun; dur to 3s, cd to 75s, tp to 100 (from 2s, 90s, 120tp)*

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Monk has the strongest DPS in the game. They do not need buffed.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

Please know the class/game mechanics before you cast judgment.

Auto-attacks only. Skill speed does not affect auto-attack delay. Requires time fighting outside of Fists of Fire. As mentioned, PB already works like that.

It's disrespectful to criticize balance changes for a game/job you're ignorant as to the mechanics of.

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My understanding is that GL does have an effect on auto-attack delay. Is incorrect?

Give bards heals or better songs, and make a true ranged class like Buccaneer we've all been waiting for.

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Originally Posted by Merle

HELL YEAH! MNK POWAH!! ò.ó/

I'd really want a decrease in the amount of tp that we need to use "arm of the destroyer" or "rockbreak", since i ran out tp really fast if i over-use it, but... oh, well, learning to manage tp is one of the points of being dps

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Or some MNKs could just lay off the Skill Speed a bit? The only time I'm having an issue with TP post 2.2 is in BrayFlox HM, I get some tanks (which I don't mind) that want to pull a crap load of mobs and then wants to pull the next set 3 seconds later after a big pull. Not so bad with a BLM in the party.

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Originally Posted by Felis

Why would you want to change fists of Wind? The skill is really good in situations where you need to be fast with your feet.

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This change would be in addition to its current bonus movement speed.

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

Monk has the strongest DPS in the game. They do not need buffed.

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Notice, I didn't buff ANY of their potency. These changes are minor at best.

As well, keep in mind I haven't yet listed proposed changes for any other class just yet... I would bring them up to par. Mostly via indirect buffs a la Paladin having less actions break their combos & more off-GCD, but some direct potency buffs.

Also, you can infer from my Fists of Wind change that I will be suggesting slight TP-regenerators for other classes too (Ahem, Warrior)... these are purely designed to enable a person to slowly get out of the hole if they do make a mistake with their TP or are forced into a high-TP rotation outside their norm.

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Originally Posted by eagledorf

My understanding is that GL does have an effect on auto-attack delay. Is incorrect?

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Correct. Your auto-attack timer is exactly what your weapon lists. So if using Sphairai & Fists of Wind, you would regain 80tp/11s at the expense of +5% overall damage/11s.

BRD

Swiftsong - Deactivates whenever user ATTACKS instead when mob generates aggro
Repelling shot - Removes a Heavy or Bind status (kinda like Elusive Jump)

as of right now swiftsong goes away the moment u pull aggro. If your using it to get a way from things, it's not even worth using. Especially in the beastmen areas. Repelling Shot imo was suppose to help BRDs create a distance between the user and enemy. No? If there is Heavy on a BRD it wouldnt change a thing IMO. if they repel a distance, and heavy, the target will just catch up to you in seconds.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

1 - Rockbreaker is extremely powerful in comparison, it doesn't need a tp decrease nor a potency increase.
2 - 20tp per 3s auto-attack at the expense of ALL damage being reduced by 5% is not too much.
3 - GL isn't being reduced, it's being buffed by 2 seconds.
4 -
5 - your opinion; imo a little shorter CD wouldn't hurt.
6 - the point is to keep Shoulder Tackle from hindering the Stun Rotation.

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1- Outside of needing to silence ADS I don't use AotD except in fates. I mean I could see why you would want a TP decrease cause its hardly ever used in a AoE situation.
2- I would manage my TP better before I sacrifice 5% of all damage.
3- yeah that was my bad had the twin snake increase in 2.1 confused with GL.

6- Are you talking about Steel Peak? I think maybe you are confused on the two. Either way using them in a Stun Rotation situation the player will just need to not use them (small loss of DPS from Steel Peak). I use Steel Peak to stun Lots of stuff. I also use Shoulder Tackle to stun lots of stuff- Castrum to stun Giants @ cannons, Copperbell mines HM I use it to stun Last boss when coming back from adds, and on some mobs that open with a big AoE. So again I believe both are fine as are the player needs to know when to use and when not to use them.

But overall MNK is pretty over powered as is. There could be a few tweaks but nothing major. As for other jobs I think many of them could use improvements overall.

Warrior
Let us use Invigorate from cross class abilities.

Black Mage
Let us cross class resurrection (I mean, we get physick... why not rez?)

WHM
Regen potency changed to 100+3% Target's max HP
(less effective vs. party in exchange for being more effective against tanks)

MNK
Fists of Fire, additional effect: Reduces TP generation by 10%
Fists of Wind, additional effect: Autoattacks restore 5% of damage dealt as TP
Fists of Earth, additional effect: 10% of reduced damage (so 1% of what would be taken without FoE) restored as TP
(encourages swapping of stances instead of always using FoF)


BLM
Freeze: Very high MP cost (~50%), very fast cast (<=1s), only castable under UI3. 150 Initial potency. If target is hit by Freeze again between 24-25 seconds later, adds 50 potency for 30 seconds. Max potency of 450. Resets if cast on a different target or if cast lands outside of that window.
(high-damage UI phase spell with strict requirements, fully buffed damage would be slightly stronger than an AF3 Fire 3 in exchange for difficulty of use as well as long build time)

Remember, exact numbers can always be changed.
I could come up with more suggestions for other classes but these 3 are my only 50s so wouldn't know what would be good or interesting.

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Originally Posted by Arkista

Or some MNKs could just lay off the Skill Speed a bit? The only time I'm having an issue with TP post 2.2 is in BrayFlox HM, I get some tanks (which I don't mind) that want to pull a crap load of mobs and then wants to pull the next set 3 seconds later after a big pull. Not so bad with a BLM in the party.

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I lol'd. Have you forgotten that GL is 21% skill speed increase at 3 stacks?

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Originally Posted by Arkista

1- Outside of needing to silence ADS I don't use AotD except in fates. I mean I could see why you would want a TP decrease cause its hardly ever used in a AoE situation.
2- I would manage my TP better before I sacrifice 5% of all damage.
3- yeah that was my bad had the twin snake increase in 2.1 confused with GL.
6- Are you talking about Steel Peak?

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1 - exactly why such a change is no big.
2 - exactly why this change isn't drastic & merely a worst-case redemption tool
3 - :)
6 - no, talking about how you can't use Shoulder Tackle to gap-close on bosses that require a strict stun-rotation (stun-immunization)... e.g. Ifrit HM; this change permits the use of your gap-closer during such encounters without disturbing their stun-resistance.


I would say Monk is in a slightly better place than Bard/Black Mage, but on par with Dragoon & Summoner if those two know their class (e.g. DRG knowing to weave jumps in properly).

Besides, not everything is damage... Dragoons have better generalized AoE at 50 & more tankiness, Summoners much more utility & an in-combat ress... etc.

And like I said in another reply, this Monk list doesn't include my proposed changes for other classes just yet... minor buffs are in store for others.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

I lol'd. Have you forgotten that GL is 21% skill speed increase at 3 stacks?

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That's not the point. Do you know that there are MNKs who still use 500+ skill speed? I have real low skill speed and in the coming weeks it will be lower and I hardly have an issue with TP. Like I said outside of this AoE spamfest of a dungeon BrayFlox HM (which isn't always) I don't really haven an issue with TP. Now before I had Skill Speed over 500 and I would blow through TP like a bitch. So GL is more than enough Skill Speed and when you stack Skill Speed+ you are going to burn through TP faster.

Its about managing TP I bet half the MNKs with TP issues either have 500+ skill Speed, Or they throw Fracture/Demo/ToD up on ever mob they can.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

6 - no, talking about how you can't use Shoulder Tackle to gap-close on bosses that require a strict stun-rotation (stun-immunization)... e.g. Ifrit HM; this change permits the use of your gap-closer during such encounters without disturbing their stun-resistance..

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So like one Boss where a stun Rotation is needed justifies changing the skill all together? TBH how much of a gap do you need for Ifrit? Its pretty easy to dodge and still be in range after he lands.

Dragoon - Phelobotomize off GCD - sure i don't mind a pet(pet was not the reason drg was bad in FFXI, like the above poster said, good drg can still out dps most classes).

Monk - Make buffs lasts slightly longer.

Paladin - Make one of the def buff into AoE defence that covers party members and adds enmity.

Warrior - Increase duration of foresight, increase parry rate.

Scholar - Allow use more stack to increase potency of Lustrate, Scared Soil and Energy Drain.

Whitemage - Lower recast on presence of Mind

Blackmage - Firestarter should stack or fix the proc delay.

Bard - Using ballad lowers their defense and HP. Foe requiem increase their attack by 2%.

Summoner - Pet should not attack anything when i'm on chocobo, should return when i run out of distance.

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Bard - Using ballad lowers their defense and HP. Foe requiem increase their attack by 2%.

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You want to remove the dmg penalty from ballad and replace it with the lower def/HP correct? Just want clarification.

There's a good chance that Bards will get an HP-over-time song to compliment their TP and MP songs once we get the level 55+ job skills when the cap is raised. Although I haven't done the Bard quests for some time now, if I remember correctly, Jehantel uses some unique songs alongside the usual Bard ones we see now (one of which restores a small amount of HP over time while active). This is quite different than most NPCs who just have access to Cure regardless of class/job, and even has its own animation and buff icon. I'm sure this will be one of the future job skills (thus, also justifying why Bard LB is an AoE heal).

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Originally Posted by ReplicaX

You want to remove the dmg penalty from ballad and replace it with the lower def/HP correct? Just want clarification.

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Yeah, to promote them to use these songs often. I met bunch of lazy fudges. heck, people are lazy to use Foe requiem, it doesn't do squat to them!

My foe requiem is constantly on in Brayflox.

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Yeah, to promote them to use these songs often. I met bunch of lazy fudges. heck, people are lazy to use Foe requiem, it doesn't do squat to them!

My foe requiem is constantly on in Brayflox.

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I agree, I rarely see songs unless I am the BRD. Only time I hold off Foe is on the Lost City sub boss with the pollen stack adds.

Either make spell speed userful on summoner, or remove it from summoner gear(expecial their job specific weapons and armor). Spell speed has 0 impact on smn.

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Originally Posted by OrganizationXIll

He was joking and making fun of peoples previous posts in other threads.

Basically:
- Why the hell should Summoners be able to summon a full sized Ifrit?? Absolutely ridiculous.. and you agreed lolol.
- He knows the lore. They KILL dragons. He was being sarcastic. Way to let it go over your head. :P

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I don't know if you played FFXI, but summoners got to summon avatars with the appearance of the primals, but in a slightly smaller form. Not exactly something that is so far fetched as to laugh at the idea of it. I don't care if HE was joking, the amount of threads started about these very same topics means it is something that people actually want in-game.

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Dragoon - Phelobotomize off GCD - sure i don't mind a pet(pet was not the reason drg was bad in FFXI, like the above poster said, good drg can still out dps most classes).

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Pet was the reason DRG was bad in FFXI, though. Under ideal circumstances, a dragoon was as good as other DDs. The problem came when your wyvern died and it had a 2 hour cooldown. Your damage was significantly reduced and unfortunately this happened a lot. Add in the fact that they had some pretty bad skill chain weaponskill and it made them very undesirable.

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Originally Posted by Ryans

I don't know if you played FFXI, but summoners got to summon avatars with the appearance of the primals, but in a slightly smaller form. Not exactly something that is so far fetched as to laugh at the idea of it. I don't care if HE was joking, the amount of threads started about these very same topics means it is something that people actually want in-game.

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Just because they want it in game doesn't mean they are going to get it. The thing that really irks me about some of the comments is that people want this from FFXI or want that from FFXI. In my opinion, if you want it that badly, then go back and play FFXI.

FFXIV is its own game with its own lore and niches. Sure it may borrow and play upon other ideas from past Final Fantasies, but that does not mean it has to follow it as an exact carbon copy.

We all know how well most squeals do in the Final Fantasy world, and last I checked this was not a sequeal to FFXI.

/my2bits

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Originally Posted by Arkista

So like one Boss where a stun Rotation is needed justifies changing the skill all together? TBH how much of a gap do you need for Ifrit? Its pretty easy to dodge and still be in range after he lands.

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That's just one example. There are a number of others... besides, they'll be including more content with stun-rotations in the future, and it'll again be a problem. It's not a big deal, but it'd be nice to be able to use our gap-closer in these fights. Also Bind/Heavy more frequently affects mobs than Stuns do in boss encounters, so it'd be a nice way to peel for that Healer that pulled even. It's not a huge deal, but it's a better alternative than the inability to gap-close in numerous encounters IMHO.

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Originally Posted by Ryans

the amount of threads started about these very same topics means it is something that people actually want in-game.

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Ppl need to stop generalizing and just state their opinion period. # of threads on a topic doesn't mean anything here. Its the feedback and opinions in the threads and they are mixed.

The "Feedback Regarding the Relic Upgrade Quest" thread is a perfect example. They merged multiple threads so they could have one thread to go through regarding Atma and Animus feedback. Yet ppl just gotta create 50+ new threads about it and now they have to go through all those threads, ignore already noted repeat opinions by the same users to collect actual new feedback.

When all the players have to do is post in the One Single Thread. "Feedback Regarding the Relic Upgrade Quest".

Imagine how many pages the Relic thread would have now if everyone posted in that single thread. It still hasn't beaten the largest housing price thread yet.

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Originally Posted by Ryans

Isn't the timer on Greased Lightning 12 seconds?

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Yes, and tbh it could use a few more; as it is you can very easily lose it just from the delay when doing limit break.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

Yes, and tbh it could use a few more; as it is you can very easily lose it just from the delay when doing limit break.

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100% agree.

OP Updated.

For SCH when I place my fairy and she gets knocked back allow her to return to her previous position, its pretty annoying to have to put her back every time.

For the most part I am happy with how SCH skills work, but obviously if they buff WHM they have to buff SCH as well :D

Edit:- For BRD they should prob make songs more like stances, instant cast and agree that the damage penalty is kind of retarded and should be abolished.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

Please Contribute!


BLACK MAGE

3) Transpose – speed up effect-application; don't allow to consume Swiftcast

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if you ever played a black mage, then you'd know posting this then you'd know the swiftcast flare transpose combo. stop posting stupid "fixes" that arent even fixes

Most people seemed to miss the PB tweak. It would make it so the last move that you performed under PB gave you the appropriate stance. Currently when PB ends you aren't in a stance (as if you haven't used any of the normal rotation moves in over 10 seconds). It mostly just means that when PB is over you can't reapply your dragon kick debuff, get the auto-crit from bootshine, silence from AotD, or use any other GCD moves regardless of what your last attack was.

The other stuff, eh, whatever. Though I do like stun on shoulder tackle myself. They should really do something with fists of wind, even if it's just making the movement speed buff noticeable.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

PALADIN

1) Flash – make off-GCD
2) Shield Lob – remove combo-breaking
3) Shield Swipe – make off-GCD & remove combo-breaking

WARRIOR

1) Berserk – add “reduces TP costs by 25%” for the duration
2) Bloodbath – add Enhanced Bloodbath Trait: converts 50% “ “
3) Tomahawk – remove combo-breaking

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Literally all of this is a bad idea or completely overpowered.

Don't change WAR or PLD. They don't even need QoL adjustments, they're fine as-is.

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Yeah, to promote them to use these songs often. I met bunch of lazy fudges. heck, people are lazy to use Foe requiem, it doesn't do squat to them!

My foe requiem is constantly on in Brayflox.

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Nobody wants to cause a wipe with it so they train themselves not to do it. Maybe that's something they could change, no requiem aggro.

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Originally Posted by KyteStones

if you ever played a black mage, then you'd know posting this then you'd know the swiftcast flare transpose combo. stop posting stupid "fixes" that arent even fixes

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Your example doesn't relate whatsoever...

Swiftcast > Transpose consumes the Swiftcast effect while other instant-casts do not.