Atmas - Unfair for low level players

SE designed this quest for the usage of Lvl50s. You can't forbid lvl50s from using it, or low level people either. Eventually things will quiet down and fates will be easily accessible to lower level people.

I agree with the OP.

I don't personally care to farm my Atmas right now on my main, at most I'll spend maybe two hours in a farm party and just sit around doing the FATEs closest to the nearest aetheryte, but I've definitely seen the hoard that sits in every single low-level area. I've been leveling an alt character for my next 50 (yes I'm one of those weirdos who prefers to have a different class on a different character), and it was damn near impossible to get even a few enemies killed off in lowbie fates before the hoard descended on the scene like a pack of rabid vultures and utterly destroyed anything in the area.

I wouldn't care so much if I was just doing the FATEs for xp, since I could just mindlessly spam levequests given all my alts have 100 allowances by now, but I was attempting to do FATEs for seals for my chocobo. Yes I can get them from leves or guildhests, but FATEs are the fastest way to get a large amount, from my experience. And I figured since I was having to level Lancer to 22 for Invigorate and then Pugilist to 15 for Bard unlock, that I might as well level a bit off FATEs and kill two birds with one stone.

Boy was I wrong.

On one hand I like that more people are doing FATEs, since it CAN potentially help lower level players who, before 2.2, would never have been able to finish a FATE due to literally NO ONE doing FATEs anywhere. But the majority of the time now, it's actually hurting lower level players due to them not even being able to get enough damage done for their contribution to count higher than a bronze. Something needs to be fixed. Atmas can drop from FATEs, I'm certainly not asking that to be changed. But the way FATEs are working or the Atma drop or something, something's gotta be changed so low level players aren't getting left in the dust of a pack of rabid hunting dogs.

Funny thing..

SE recently advertised the current state of the game so new players will know what it is like if they join FF14ARR today :p

www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcOkSurxz3c

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Originally Posted by StarHate

Are people in this thread really arguing that low level fates aren't for low level players? I know ya'll feel some weird urge to defend everything SE does regardless of how horrible it actually is, but still, at some point it has to click that your arguments are insanely ridiculous.

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lotta folks still hoping if they do a good enough job defending their favorite jrpgs then sephiroth will show up to whisk them away to a land of adventure where their mom doesn't bug them about filling out job applications all day

presumably

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Are people in this thread really arguing that low level fates aren't for low level players?

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For people on their first combat class? Yes, I'd argue it's not for them.

FATEs are for when you just happen to see one on your way to do quests, or AFTER you get your story and sidequests out of the way. By which time you should be like, lv 40+. Or for 2nd/3rd/4th/etc classes.

Also, to get better queue times, join a newbie-friendly FC, and queue with a healer or a tank.

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

Funny thing..

SE recently advertised the current state of the game so new players will know what it is like if they join FF14ARR today :p

www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcOkSurxz3c

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LOL that is a horrible ad. Doesn't even seem finished xD
But I did get excited. I yelled "FAT CHOCOBO!" I wants it. >_<

On Topic: I think square should change the levels of the lower fates to higher levels. There really is no point if the lower levels won't ever get to experience them until they get into higher levels. It's extremely ridiculous for a level 50 to be at lvl1-25 fates. xD

This was clearly a rushed attempt at gating content, they screwed up on so many levels here... if anything, it should have been level 30 fates or higher, with an increased drop rate (10% sounds more reasonable)

Let's trick all those new PS4 players into thinking all our areas are always this populated by screwing them over out of content they most likely will need to be doing to get extra EXP and GC seals, let's also screw all our existing players in the process by having them become the guinea pigs that will carry out our master plan by having them do a badly planned out quest that's gated entirely by luck. Surely this will increase our retainment rates in the end, I mean what could possibly go wrong?

They should have made this only on high level FATES...oh god imagine having to do some of those FATES...better be a ton of people in the zone or forget it. That in all actuality would have made it take even longer to grind because you could never solo any of them if you are a late night player like me.

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Originally Posted by Aldotsk

This is a game where EVERYONE is allowed to try something for a change. This isn't a game for 50s. No new players should deserve to be doing something different because of us veteran players hunting for stupid items.

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This isn't a game for sub-20s either by that argument.

A smart player will either find a way to get the best out of an over-camped area, or find another place to camp.

Logic.

Agreed... I was hanging out with a friend in Central Shroud the other day (we were both lv5, so Duty Finder wasn't an option), and we attempted to do the FATE with the funguars... managed to claim just one, and I didn't even get credit because I only casted 1 Aero and cure on my friend before everything ended. That horde of lv50 savage wiped all the monsters in a blink >_<!

the low lvl fate will get clear fast even w/o high lvl player. I gotta remind that high lvl player when do fate got their lvl and gear drop down to that lvl of fate so their gear should be equal with low lvl player or weaker.The complain is invalid

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Originally Posted by Duuude007

This isn't a game for sub-20s either by that argument.

A smart player will either find a way to get the best out of an over-camped area, or find another place to camp.

Logic.

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OR, 50s should not grief other low level and new players from leveling in FATEs. Since it's technically their zone prioritized comparing to high levels farming for Atmas. Your argument is absolutely invalid. "Smart player"? Excuse me? New players are never going to figure out which places will be -over camped- or -new camp- area. They try everything out at the first time in-game before they start googling stuff to know where to go. That's like saying you are reading strategy guide RIGHT before you start the game and trying to ruin your true game experience.

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Originally Posted by Aldotsk

I already have my Atma

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If you already have your Atma, then you are part of the same group of veterans that spammed FATEs that you are complaining about. As far as I'm concerned your complaints are invalid at this point.

Regardless, just wait a few weeks. Even now there are only 2-4 people running FATEs on off peak hours.

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Originally Posted by Shneibel

the low lvl fate will get clear fast even w/o high lvl player. I gotta remind that high lvl player when do fate got their lvl and gear drop down to that lvl of fate so their gear should be equal with low lvl player or weaker.The complain is invalid

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And that's why Atma farming ONLY people group get gold and regular low level players who can't join any group get bronze and the balance is STILL invalid enough for players to not get full fun game experience. I swear, people are so ignorant these days, and this is one reason new players quit less than a week.

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Originally Posted by Aldotsk

And that's why Atma farming ONLY people group get gold and regular low level players who can't join any group get bronze

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I am group with my chocobo or w/o my chocobo and your point is ? I have already got my atma wep by solo farm fate and I got gold 99% of the time even compete with 2 full atma group. Even my FC memeber who do fate on DRG still get his gold too and he do it w/o group or party

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Originally Posted by CruxisSeptentrion

If you already have your Atma, then you are part of the same group of veterans that spammed FATEs that you are complaining about. As far as I'm concerned your complaints are invalid at this point.

Regardless, just wait a few weeks. Even now there are only 2-4 people running FATEs on off peak hours.

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If I didn't get Atma, it'd be the same cycle of people saying "You are complaining in this thread because you couldn't get your Atma". So I instead got Atma and at least stood up to say something about it. Because I do understand new player's perspective. It's not fair literally and I do not disagree with their complaints. In the most part, I had been doing this Atma, and I was not feeling well of doing it.

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Originally Posted by Shneibel

I am group with my chocobo or w/o my chocobo and your point is ?

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The POINT IS - that players with or without chocobo and can't get into any groups to level up in FATE cannot do anything but see 50s hog up everything. Honestly, the game needs to be fixed to have FATEs that will only accept 50s in certain areas instead of having all high-end players to just go to every single low level FATEs and ruin players experience.

I think PS4 players don't have much to worry about XP-wise since they not only have the lucrative storyline quests they will have a huge pool of new players to pull from when queueing for dungeons. On top of that they are getting the challenge log right of the bat.

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Originally Posted by Estellios

I think PS4 players don't have much to worry about XP-wise since they not only have the lucrative storyline quests they will have a huge pool of new players to pull from when queueing for dungeons. On top of that they are getting the challenge log right of the bat.

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So just because challenge log exists in the game, doesn't give the low level players and new players the right to do any FATE when they step into this game? That's a bit ridiculous for any veteran players to say, no?

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Originally Posted by Duuude007

This isn't a game for sub-20s either by that argument.

A smart player will either find a way to get the best out of an over-camped area, or find another place to camp.

Logic.

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Hey... buddy? you know ending a post with the word "logic" doesn't make what you said actually make sense... right? You're just parroting the same "low level content isn't for low level players" stupidity and adding in "they'll find something else to do!"

Booting low levels? I've never done this before, but I've only had one happening with a low level. She asked if she could join my pf group that was just farming atmas and I said go ahead, and it never occurred to me to kick her. She thanked the party and left on her own after a while. :)

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Originally Posted by Aldotsk

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At this point I can assume you are a bored person and try to troll or a person who hate the RNG on atma as at the start of the thread you suggest to increase drop rate or let it be at certain fate ( I think the 2nd is just a cover). I ll repeat my point and get out of this thread:

Player lvl 50 will get their lvl and gear reduce to the lvl of fate, so the fate will die fast regardless with or w/o lvl 50 ppl.
You can get gold & silver easy as now the required to get gold or silver is reduce by SE, arrive late at a fate and hit 3 mobs can easy give you a silver (depend on fate ofc)
IF you want to help low lvl that badly, you do it yourself and not force or complain about why the other 50 dont help low lvl. If a group reject low lvl and save the spot for a 50, it is their own choice and if you feel that is wrong then go a head and party with them.

peace out

First of all, if you're a new player then you should have no shortage of story and side quests to reach level 15. There's really no need to do leves or guildhests. Hunting logs and FATEs, you can do as you go, but no need to farm FATES if you're below level 15.

Second, I levelled my Black Mage primarily through dungeons. I've never gotten queue times over an hour. 40 minutes at most. If you haven't done so, then be sure to tick the other languages (JEDF) to make queue times faster. If you have run out of leves then I suggest levelling a crafting or gathering class to pass the time. You'll be able to make some gear for yourself as you level and maybe make some money in the process.

Next, you also have to consider the alternative. Look back to pacth 2.1. Nobody did FATEs. The maps were barren.

And without Atmas, the low level players have to solo FATEs if they want to do them. Or find a FATE party which isn't very likely.

I always thought this Atma quest was a GOOD thing for lower level players because at least they have a chance to realistically do fates for their EXP.

The mount is obtainable at level 20, which between quests and quest required dungeon runs, and hunting logs is EASILY achievable without even stepping foot in a FATE. The only slight issue is company seals, but if you've been doing guildheists at least once up to that point, you should be pretty much there. I'd say the OP is making mountains out of molehills, but there aren't even any molehills. Just more "The Sky is Falling" rhetoric that infests MMO message boards.

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Originally Posted by Norondor

Hey... buddy? you know ending a post with the word "logic" doesn't make what you said actually make sense... right? You're just parroting the same "low level content isn't for low level players" stupidity and adding in "they'll find something else to do!"

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Um... no. Notice i gave 2 options, either or. Option 1 was to find a way to adapt to the situation.

Seeing that the only advantage fate farmers for atma has is "transit" (as they levelsync before they can deal damage), I already suggested that leveling players should hang out where the largest concentration of fate spawn points are. This can be easily determined by xivdb, for example. Then, they have fair odds of getting completion credit in that quadrant of the map.

The busier the atma farmers are, the faster nearby fates will respawn. Doesn't sound bad to me.

End game players doing low level Fates all day. Who thought that would be fun content?

The only problem for low levels, is that their target dies before he even can cast a spell on it. I'd suggest tab-target everything and use the instant spell you have, if any, as debuffs or other.

Then, there is no need for have a party. I got one ATMA just doing a FATE that popped near me while I were doing other things.

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Originally Posted by Aldotsk

The POINT IS - that players with or without chocobo and can't get into any groups to level up in FATE cannot do anything but see 50s hog up everything. Honestly, the game needs to be fixed to have FATEs that will only accept 50s in certain areas instead of having all high-end players to just go to every single low level FATEs and ruin players experience.

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So since you got your atma now it needs to be fixed?

I agree for the over run, I am a lvl 50 and I see this happening day in and day out, I dont even want to do my Atmas because of it, groups run like mad people, sometimes there are so many people that is even impossible to target a single mob...is discouraging to be honest.

I am not sure what the solution would be... right now is kind of packed....too packed to even want to do the fates...I understand Atmas must be hard to get but using fates isnt in my opinion in the current state not a very good solution....maybe force people to do dungeons outside the daily roulettes...and assign points based on participation and contribution inside the dungeon and etc etc etc..not sure really ....right now even for me levelling my summoner is just impossible using fates...

Mei

What? Confusing... I had been putting off leveling Lancer because I don't really like it but I need certain skills for my Bard, so when I realized people went Atma crazy and do FATE's over and over, instead of going in there with my Bard to hunt Atma too I rushed there with my Lancer and bashed away tons of exp faster than I have done in weeks, because DPS queue for dungeons is no fun.

So basically I was just super excited about insanely fast insanely easy EXP. So like..whaaaa? o.o;

What it comes down to is the OP's 'friends' are trying to get credit on fates against a large number of players, and can't seem to generate enough enmity to get gold.

This is not a coding issue, this is a skill learning curve. Maximize enmity while hastily competing with other (similarly leveled) parties. (Which can be augmented by having a full party of your own)

Even if nobody had the chocobo advantage for transit, i would imagine the OP's 'friends' would still be struggling to get golds, based on the arguments presented.

what overrun are you talikin about? on Shiva the ATMA Run is already largely over. 2-3 days people run around like mobs but now you're lucky if you find 2 more players when you start a FATE.

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Originally Posted by Duuude007

What it comes down to is the OP is trying to get credit on fates against a large number of players, and can't seem to generate enough enmity to get gold.

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Why are so many people so sure that the OP has motives other than what they've expressed in their posts throughout this thread? They simply see an outcome that probably is not what the game designers intended, and has pointed it out.

I don't think anyone (except maybe those who are halfway through the process, and probably not even most of them) have anything really invested in the current method of gaining atma. So... why are people arguing so hard that IT MUST STAY EXACTLY AS IT IS! SO SAY WE ALL! ?

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Originally Posted by JeniLinsky

Why are so many people so sure that the OP has motives other than what they've expressed in their posts throughout this thread? They simply see an outcome that probably is not what the game designers intended, and has pointed it out.

I don't think anyone (except maybe those who are halfway through the process, and probably not even most of them) have anything really invested in the current method of gaining atma. So... why are people arguing so hard that IT MUST STAY EXACTLY AS IT IS! SO SAY WE ALL! ?

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We arent?

OP is suggesting a specific change designed to limit competition, but has no clear solution on what the high end players are supposed to do if shunted out of the low zones. Should they be granted free atma in those areas? Of course not. So then, what?

Solving an issue by implementing a similar issue is no resolution at all. Its passing the buck.

"Low level players should not be doing low level FATES!"

Ok, then just erase FATES from the game entirely then, since we're not supposed to use them for EXP.

Or even better, let's just make every FATE in the game level 50, because you know, level 15 people aren't supposed to do level 15 FATEs, those noobs...trying to get EXP, the horror! pshaw!

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Originally Posted by Duuude007

OP is suggesting a specific change designed to limit competition, but has no clear solution on what the high end players are supposed to do if shunted out of the low zones.

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I don't see that at all. What I see is her offering two distinct solutions:

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Originally Posted by Aldotsk

I suggest that either you increase the drop rate a lot or just limit certain FATEs for only 50s to farm in. Because none of them are working properly.

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So she's saying there are two things that could be done to resolve the problem she sees:

1. Up the drop rate, so that those high level players farming the low level FATEs get them quickly and leave the area, which would presumably mean that low level players could resume doing low level FATEs at the rate they're comfortable doing them,

OR


2. Restrict (and publish the restriction) the Atma drops to a subset of the FATEs in the low-level areas, so that the low-level players can still enjoy the ones that the high level players aren't swarming.

I don't see that either of those solutions limits the availability of Atmas, or limits competition from those who want Atmas.

Atmas, a great desing decision to fuck high and low level players equally, hehe

I cant believe some of the arguments, people are posting here...
The point is not about if the op has her atma or not..
The point here is not what is "efficient" to do at low levels....

Its about a content DESIGNED to be for players of certain level... and now being cleared by players of high level.

Its about new players, or players who are leveling a new class.. or players who just want to do fates.

If Im a level 40 monk and I want to do fates designed for my level... EVEN THOUGH theres a better way to level up, even though I have the challenge log, dutty roullette, and ALL sorts of ways to level up... IF theres a fate designed FOR ME to play,and waste my OWN time doing it... then I should be able to experience it at its fullest...