Please Fix the Raise Animation!

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Originally Posted by squidbunny

How many MMOs have you played?

WoW alone has 3 classes with combat rezzes. I realize this is apples to oranges as WoW combat is differently paced, but it's contextually applicable: the WoW abilities are instant cast. The casting time of Raise is sufficiently long that I think there's your strategizing, right there: also, it is not your fault, as a healer, if you spend the time on a Raise and someone accepts at a stupid moment.

The animation lock is broken. Stop defending it.

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How many MMO's I've played isn't really pertinent information. WoW has 3 combat rezzes now, but for a very long time only Druids could do it. And it had a long cooldown.

If someone dies, it's either your fault for letting them die or their fault for getting hit by something they should not have. It might not be your fault that they accepted the rez at a stupid time, but again, if people are doing stupid stuff, then your group does not deserve to be rewarded with a win or even with a combat rez. Period.

I'm not going to stop defending it because I think it's a good strategic element. Playing well--including knowing when to accept the raise--offers the reward; you want the reward just because you have the ability to combat rez. That type of mentality is everything that is wrong with gaming today.

There is ZERO issues with Raise animation...


It's called learning how to raise properly, and when to accept a raise...

Please see my previous post.

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Originally Posted by squidbunny

the majority of people I've spoken to hate it to death.

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So? It's a control mechanic; they're not supposed to love it. It's supposed to be a pain in the arse.

The majority usually doesn't know jack, especially when it comes to rewarding game design. They just want what is easy.

It doesn't make sense that this specific thing is a pain when the rest of the game is, for the most part, extremely casual and friendly. Especially when your character can take damage, can be targeted, and can be healed with AoE moves (or any other AoE ability, like Protect.)

So really, Sidious, your logic falls short and comes across as mere, "I don't have to deal with it, so shut up!" forum trolling.

Its all about timing.

You can raise people just fine in fights even like Titan, you just have to do it at the correct time, there are parts of the phase where its 100% safe to accept the raise.

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Originally Posted by Kiaris

Its all about timing.

You can raise people just fine in fights even like Titan, you just have to do it at the correct time, there are parts of the phase where its 100% safe to accept the raise.

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there have been many times where raising has gone off without a hitch.. both with me as the healer and me as the tank.. I have died to a bite in brayflox, been raised, taken back hate and won the fight all fine.. but its those times that targetting and damage happens during a lock thats the problem..

animation lock is fine, like i said before.. you are raising from the dead you cant expect to be ready for a jog.. but if the enemy can hit you.. the healer should be able to heal you.. there is also no indication of the animation finishing.. the end of the animation is 2 seconds of standing still

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Originally Posted by DenzelTaru

animation lock is fine, like i said before.. you are raising from the dead you cant expect to be ready for a jog.. but if the enemy can hit you.. the healer should be able to heal you.. there is also no indication of the animation finishing.. the end of the animation is 2 seconds of standing still

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This, essentially.

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Originally Posted by Ceol

It doesn't make sense that this specific thing is a pain when the rest of the game is, for the most part, extremely casual and friendly. Especially when your character can take damage, can be targeted, and can be healed with AoE moves (or any other AoE ability, like Protect.)

So really, Sidious, your logic falls short and comes across as mere, "I don't have to deal with it, so shut up!" forum trolling.

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The guy who thinks that there shouldn't be difficult and/or tricky control mechanics because a good portion of the game is "extremely casual and friendly" is questioning my logic?

Here's a tip: You wouldn't have to deal with it either if you just played a little better.

Gonna have to side with the enemy. Raise animation lock is sooooo FFXI and even they admit it was a poor idea, so stop defending it.

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Originally Posted by Claire_Ares

so stop defending it.

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No. I like it.

Well go play ffxi, because this archaic raise animation needs to go

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Originally Posted by Ceol

...I've raised someone in Garuda HM only to have her immediately target them with Friction before I even get the option of curing them.

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This is the current fatal flaw in the system. A ton of mana gets wasted on something that is not predictable, with the healer being able to do nothing but look on and estimate when the person that was just raised can be cured.

Honestly, it makes the game feel sluggish. I can't even tell you how many times I've cast Swiftcast followed immediately by Medica II only to be presented with a cast bar. It's irritating when you have to consciously slow down your rotations so as not to get ahead of the game.

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Sweeeeeeet

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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THANK YOU! I swear every time I went to raise friends in a dungeon, the moment I go to heal them, they're dead again because the monster has targeted them immediately after the raise animation is over.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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It's understandable that we can't heal people during the raise animation but what about the delay AFTER the animation ended? we still can't heal them 2-3 seconds after they got raised and started moving.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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So what about the issue where I raise someone and they begin moving and I *still* can't heal them? They are targetable and I cast a healing spell on them and I end up healing myself. This is beyond frustrating for me. Making raised players invulnerable for a short time will help, but I guess I need to be less quick on the heals still..?

Great Change. As it is, Raise during combat is often a 70/30 chance of the person actually surviving.

God! Thx for The change!

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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This is certainly a start. Any chance we could get some UI feedback on the heal lockout? Having the damage immunity will definitely be nice, but a lot of the frustration comes from the fact that healers have no way of knowing when they can heal a raised person again. I have to stare at the person being raised, wait for them to stand up straight, and then count maybe 1-2 seconds before trying a heal. Even then, sometimes it affects myself. This is really inconvenient when I need to be healing other people at the same time, as well.

If we could just get some feedback from the UI like an immunity buff icon or maybe an error message (for example, when you try to heal someone in a cutscene the server interrupts your cast and gives you a "can't use that action yet" error), I'd be much more satisfied.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Can I like this 66576537158674 times? :D

I do think it's pretty stupid not being able heal someone while at the same time the boss can damage them all it likes, but people need to realize just because I raised you doesn't mean you have to accept it right away. Look before you leap.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Can't wait. The other night I died four times in a row because of Titan's tumults, landslides, and weight of the land moves all while I was animation locked during raise. ,_,

Also, kind of sucks that even though you're locked in animation, during the raise animation landslides still knock you off the platform. So I'm being "raised" while falling to my death into a fiery pit of doom. Then breaking my knees and probably every other bone in my body when I land flat on the ground

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Originally Posted by Rex

Can't wait. The other night I died four times in a row because of Titan's tumults, landslides, and weight of the land moves all while I was animation locked during raise. ,_,

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The safest time to take a Raise during phase 3 is right after the bombs fall and he starts charging up Landslide. If you take the Raise at that point, by the time you're able to take damage again the bombs will have already exploded and Landslide will be just finishing. You'll have about eight to ten seconds before you need to move for Weight of the Land, because he'll do a Mountain Buster in between.

Even after they add damage immunity during Raise, it's good to know this because we don't know how long the immunity will last and you still don't want to be in a bad situation when taking a Raise. So just remember, always take it after the bombs+Landslide.

It's not actually even a lock out. If you play scholar, the fairy get's access to cure the player prior to other players.
This could be due to the fact that monsters can also attack the recently raised player (NPCs not affected, it seems).
Whatever is wrong here is only for players. Although, i can say i don't share the experience that casting medica II doesn't work. Medica II cast on self as well as Medica and Succor cast on self will both hit and heal a just raised player.

This is also responsible for a bug wherein a recently healed player who receives a status effect at just the right time will not be inflicted with weakness but will retain the raise status.

Additionally, a player who gets hit by an NPC enemy at just the right time with an ability which causes a status effect also "suffers" from this effect, resulting in what is more or less a "reraise" effect as a result (they will die from the attack and then be able to raise immediately without being raised again by a healer)

As soon as I see that they are walking I should be able to heal them. All to often I see them fully raised, but I cant heal them.

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Originally Posted by Takophiliac

It's not actually even a lock out. If you play scholar, the fairy get's access to cure the player prior to other players.
This could be due to the fact that monsters can also attack the recently raised player (NPCs not affected, it seems).
Whatever is wrong here is only for players. Although, i can say i don't share the experience that casting medica II doesn't work. Medica II cast on self as well as Medica and Succor cast on self will both hit and heal a just raised player.

This is also responsible for a bug wherein a recently healed player who receives a status effect at just the right time will not be inflicted with weakness but will retain the raise status.

Additionally, a player who gets hit by an NPC enemy at just the right time with an ability which causes a status effect also "suffers" from this effect, resulting in what is more or less a "reraise" effect as a result (they will die from the attack and then be able to raise immediately without being raised again by a healer)

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Exactly, Eos/Selene are free to cure the raised party member almost instantly whereas we have to wait, even when it says we can target them. If it's "working as intended" those intentions are questionable.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Hi Okipuit,

Excellent! :) That's the main thing we were hoping for. This definitely makes things more fair and reduces stress (as Yoshi P always likes to mention) in these situations. Thanks!

Thank you for the notification regarding 2.1 (though I really wish the change would come sooner). However...

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Originally Posted by Ninix

This is certainly a start. Any chance we could get some UI feedback on the heal lockout? Having the damage immunity will definitely be nice, but a lot of the frustration comes from the fact that healers have no way of knowing when they can heal a raised person again. I have to stare at the person being raised, wait for them to stand up straight, and then count maybe 1-2 seconds before trying a heal. Even then, sometimes it affects myself. This is really inconvenient when I need to be healing other people at the same time, as well.

If we could just get some feedback from the UI like an immunity buff icon or maybe an error message (for example, when you try to heal someone in a cutscene the server interrupts your cast and gives you a "can't use that action yet" error), I'd be much more satisfied.

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This, please.

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Originally Posted by Rex

Can't wait. The other night I died four times in a row because of Titan's tumults, landslides, and weight of the land moves all while I was animation locked during raise. ,_,

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And what killed you originally?

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Good. Because having to time a raise in the Titan fight just perfectly so you don't die immediately kinda blows.

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Any chance for Limit Breaks to make you invincible as well?

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Originally Posted by Okipuit

Greetings,

Not being able to heal players during the raise animation is working as intended. However, in patch 2.1 we will be making adjustments so that after you are raised you will not receive damage from attacks for a certain amount of time.

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Thank goodness. I can take not being able to heal people for a short amount of time, but...

"You die to Eruption because tank missed a stun."
"Healer uses Raise on you."
"Ifrit uses Radiant Plume while in Raise animation lock"
"You die again."

...Gets annoying after a while.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

Good. Because having to time a raise in the Titan fight just perfectly so you don't die immediately kinda blows.

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Why does that "blow"?

Having raise animation immunity only really makes sense if the healer LB3 also makes the caster invunerable for at least some of that absurd cast time.

Otherwise personally I think you are fixing the wrong thing, if I stupidly raise someone into a fireball then they deserve to die again. All I want is the ability to start topping them up during the animation so they don't die to something stupid like an ADS vacuum wave or garuda's ranged hit. I don't care if it's working as intended, it's utterly archaic and makes little sense as is.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

Otherwise personally I think you are fixing the wrong thing, if I stupidly raise someone into a fireball then they deserve to die again.

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If they died, then they deserve to stay dead. They are lucky that there's even an opportunity for them to get a raise. Combat rezzes must be tightly controlled with cooldowns and caps (WoW) or with more colorful restrictions (XIV), lest they trivialize encounters that should not be trivial.

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Originally Posted by Sidious

Why does that "blow"?

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If I get a raise, i should be able to take it immediately and not have to wait to time it just right.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

If I get a raise, i should be able to take it immediately and not have to wait to time it just right.

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If you get a raise, that means you died and deserve to stay dead. I don't think it's unreasonable that you should have to be clever about receiving this second lease on life.

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Originally Posted by Sidious

If you get a raise, that means you died and deserve to stay dead. I don't think it's unreasonable that you should have to be clever about receiving this second lease on life.

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Wile dying is probably 90% certain that the player made a mistake you shouldn't punish the party by keeping them dead for the entire fight. The issue like a lot of people pointed out is that while being raised the player nor the healer can do anything to help the raised player. Random target abilities from bosses is a classic example of e game working against itself. If a healer can't target a player neither should the enemy or its abilities.