Current State of ENDWALKER DNC

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Originally Posted by Jennah

Basically, Dancer's *supposed* to have the lowest personal dps ... which is fine, IMO? But its currently sitting too far below everyone else.

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This is true, but even when you add in additional DPS granted by its party buffs, its still the lowest by a considerable margin.

I think they should have reduced Florish's CD if they're gonna decrease 4 GCD procs to 2 GCD procs.
I don't mind the low potency but the downtime is horrible than BRD and MCH with new Florish.

Improvisation is the biggest head scratcher for me. Now there isn't anything wrong with an ability that requires you to standstill and charge up; the issue is the DPS loss vs Reward.

I have two ideas for that:
1) Have an AoE zone around the dancer that provides a small regen/barrier while the dancer builds up a 4 stack DPS bonus for the party.
2) Flip it and have an AoE zone around the dance that provides a DPS bonus while the dancer builds up the current 4 stack Regen/Barrier.

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Originally Posted by kejakalope

So, as a fellow controller user, your problem here is bad button layout, not bad job design. Dancer is incredibly controller-friendly now. Here's what you do to make your life much much much much easier:

Remove all your AoE rotation buttons from your controller binds. Just take them all off. Design the crossbar entirely for boss fights. This means you will have some stuff that is also incidentally AoE but which you need in a single-target fight too, like Saber Dance, Standard Step, and Technical Step, that's fine-- just take off the dedicated AoE buttons that have a superior single-target equivalent.

Now go to Hotbar 2, which you can access by flicking RB+B/Circle.

Replicate your first hotbar exactly, but replace the single-target attack buttons with equivalent AoE attack buttons.

The shared proc design now works in your favor. Just stay on Hotbar 2 during dungeon pulls, then flick RB+Y/Triangle when you reach a boss and fight with the single-target Hotbar 1.

There isn't QUITE enough space to replicate everything so you'll have to judge where to put some of the utility buttons (I keep Curing Waltz on bar 1 and Improvisation in its place on bar 2, for example, and just flick over if I need Improv during a boss fight), but overall this should make your bar much cleaner and your life much easier than trying to crowd both single-target and AoE functions onto a single crossbar.

As a general thing, the longer you play the game, the more you'll discover that as your skill with a job grows, periodically redoing your keybinds or crossbar layout can drastically improve your performance. If you try this out, you should have much better results with Dancer and will find it goes from feeling bloated to feeling very responsive and elegant.

Cheers!

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Appreciate your advise! though I can let you know that the problem itself, as I stated, is clipping. Having multiple hotbar for different situation is a good improvisation for the current shared CD of flourish but it would not eliminate the problem itself: you need to use AOE for AOE, single for single which is not align to what 6.0 DNC intention. If you miss click to an AOE for a single enemy, not its a dps lost. During intense movement and button mash, like burst, your chance of clipping is quiet high when compares to SHB. Hence, I believe it's a bloat.

I believe we can buff the AOE to same dmg as single but dmg drop off higher. I played DNC since SHB and the 4 CD of flourish gives you room to maneuver around the field.

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

I wish the new procs weren't just pseudo 60/120s cooldowns
I want more procs in my proc based job, make them come from feather dance 3 or something so our rotation is more interesting
Though sadly we'll just get a 10 potency buff and they'll call it a day because "ranged physical tax" oh well

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Im keeping my hope to moderate too. Buffing has always been somewhere around 10 to 30 potency. We'll see what they want to do with DNC

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Originally Posted by Escalon

I dont main DNC, but right now I'm leveling it (on the road to all lvl 90) and after using a calculator on my combat log, I see the numbers, and yah, its bad, on avg. I'm bellow most people by 1/4. I cant even imagine how that feels when you main it. :C

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You're very kind Escalon. I am not a DNC main myself but I run DNC from time to time to change flavors. Yes, me too, I do feel the DNC main.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I don't understand what the problem is. The single and AOE attacks are still separate skills and you can choose to use one or the other as the situation requires, instead of always following a single attack with a single attack.

I also play on controller and I haven't had to rearrange anything. There's no need to put the AOE buttons on the top hotbar – the fact that the single attacks are available to use tells you that the AOE versions are available too.

I have combo step 1 on O, step 2 on X, then the two flourishes on Triangle and Square. Single target set on the top hotbar, AOE underneath when I press R2-L2.

Have you set up your controller to use R2-L2 combo and double-tap to have additional hotbars available?

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The problem itself is, like I mention, we need to use AOE for multiple enemies only. AOE on single is a huge lost. If they buff AOE up to single and has a higher dmg falloff, the dmg may be equivocal. It's not align to what 6.0 DNC hoping to be: to able to use flourish in any kind of situation. Let say they buff up to be as high as single, during intense choreograph fight, you won't have to double tap cross tap trigger to use flourish single. An AOE version is just as good for you as single. Just for the fun sake, now you can either melee or range.

Yes, I do have double tap trigger Hotbar. Though as of now, it's not as intuitive like SHB DNC.

If they give us 4 CD of flourish like SHB, from my perspective, it would be more fun to dance around the field anyway. I do not believe 4 CD of flourish was a problem back then. Even if the fight is intense and you need to stay far, the 4 CD allow us to used whatever best for us first. Now if you miss click, that's it. So I am scratching my head on why they make this drastic change.

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Originally Posted by Connor

I know people like that sort thing but I really don’t like that Improvised Finish is only ever usable when there’s literally no enemies present to fight (transition/downtime). I mean a skill that’s good to use during those times is great, but developing a battle skill you’re only supposed to use when you’re not fighting anything seems like a bit of a waste to me.

I do kinda miss Flourish proc’ing both single target and aoe together too. It feels like the job is much less ‘fast-paced’ and more ‘spammy’ than it was before. It still feels disappointing using Devilment, Technical Step, Tilana (which is just plain weird lol), and Flourish, then once you’ve use your two single target procs it’s like ‘oh well I guess that’s it lol’

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Indeed I miss the 4 flourish CD too. It's fun to see us dance around the field. You are right, it's becoming a little fast pace with Endwalker.

Since they reduced the potency of the AOE attacks there is actually very few occasions outside dungeon mob pulls when I actually use AOEs at all. It is just not worth it. It is faster to dps enemies one by one honestly.

You can no longer use your AOEs from 2 target as we used to.

I also have no idea why we have improvisation. Very few times can I use it and even then it feels kinda underwhelming...

I hope they will do some great changes as they promised DNC will see some buffs due under performance...

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Originally Posted by justinhuang

The problem itself is, like I mention, we need to use AOE for multiple enemies only. AOE on single is a huge lost.

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Yes, but you don't have to use AOE skills on single targets. You have a choice whether to spend that flourish proc on a single or AOE attack. It works exactly the same as it did pre-EW except that Flourish triggered all four skills separately instead of two choices of single or AOE.

AOE skills are always weaker per enemy than single-target skills, as far as I'm aware. I'm not sure why you need an exception here.