New NMs

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

And they are revamping the Repop times for all NM's in FFXI so even if you wanted to camp a monster in XI it probably wont take you more then 2 or three hours to go, see them pop a few times and get your claim, kill it and leave. Even Argus might be a 5 hour affair for most people afterwards. When before it was a 24/7 5 days in a row camp fest fighting against bots to hope you even see argus before their botskills kicked in.

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This doesn't really mean anything in terms of direction.

You can go from level 30 to 99 in one day now. The whole game is easier in general.

First: Threadnaught post! yay!

Second: Want a good hardcore way of spawning NM?

MAke NM a random respawn for kiling reqular mobs. 0.00001% chance to spawn with each respawn of trigger mobs. Full hardcore, no boring wait, kill, loot and profit.

24h hours wait will only spawn 666 sites with exact trimers for NM spawn, and will make NM killing a sport for 2 LS who will camop spot forever. Where is fun in it?

Yes haviong gear noone else have is good, especially for e-peen, for everyone else
http://www.thenoobcomic.com/index.php?pos=373

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

You will never see another Chains of Promathia and you will never see another bottleneck circus like Fafnir.

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Which is sad in my opinion because CoP missions were very challenging and required skills and teamwork!

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Originally Posted by Lamhirh

First: Threadnaught post! yay!

Second: Want a good hardcore way of spawning NM?

MAke NM a random respawn for kiling reqular mobs. 0.00001% chance to spawn with each respawn of trigger mobs. Full hardcore, no boring wait, kill, loot and profit.

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Lotto spawns where in XI with usually an hour or so cool down. But it would make it easier and give people more of a chance if it was a 21-24 hour spawn rather than a 0.00001% chance, it could not spawn for a month lol.

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Originally Posted by Carmillia

Which is sad in my opinion because CoP missions were very challenging and required skills and teamwork!

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CoP was the most fun I ever had doing missions. At first I hated them but when you finished and looked back it was amazing what you went through. The game wouldn't be complete with out something like this I feel. :(

Agreed that CoP was awesome, and is probably the best memories I have of playing FF11, if they had something like that in this game I would be very happy, Komoto make it so!

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Originally Posted by Visch

Lotto spawns where in XI with usually an hour or so cool down. But it would make it easier and give people more of a chance if it was a 21-24 hour spawn rather than a 0.00001% chance, it could not spawn for a month lol.
(

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You wanted hardcore <_<

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Originally Posted by Lamhirh

You wanted hardcore <_<

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I would be fine with it if that is what they did but I think that would upset people more than 21-24 hour pop lol

there is other way. give every player(or part/LS) personalise counter, that will spawn NP after like 10 000 kills of specific mob. No camping. HArdocores get their NMS more, casuals get less, but still are able to get them <_<

I hope the New NM's only drop key item for entrance to a dungeon just to piss all of you off!!

i hope NMs will only drop cookies. I am against drop-only items in a game which puts so much stress on crafting <_<

I am not sure if anyone has stated this, but these may not even be rank 50 NM's. Yoshi did mention awhile back adding lower rank NM so we may even be seeing those. As for spawn times I do agree they need to be longer, but not 24 hours. A 8 hour with a 30 min-1 hr window would be plenty for me, or maybe spawn conditions like dodore where it has to be certain weather to, if these will be rank 50 ones. Just my opinion, but I really dont even think these will be rank 50 ones.

Have to say, I am not a fan of 21hr+ spawned nm's. It took me about a week to realise the hnm thing was not for me in xi. but hey if waking up in the middle of the night and doing the intricate sub window dance is your thing then who am i to say any thing against that. if you want to be a video game Flagellant i aint going to stop you.

Time sink =/= Difficulty
Difficulty = Difficulty

If you ask me, And people generally dont. The best nm they ever put into xi was hakutaku. Gathering the eyes, Getting the cluster crafted and then going down to pop and fight that sob. now that was a challenge with a darn good pay off. and it could be done on the players time. The sky gods, The jailers, limbus, salvage, assaults, Stronghold nms, hell znm's and i guess abyssia (mind you i quit xi sometime after the first abysia hit). all of these offered challenging fights nice to epic rewards, involved short spawn nms if at all, runs could be scheduled and done at the players convenience. I would bet dollars to donuts that were going to see similar things here.

If you want a repeats of Di, Sandworm, or the Kings. keep calling for them and i'm sure you will be able to rally enough support to garner developer attention. heck the rate at which this thread is growing might do that for you. Like i said who am i to define what fun is to some one else. just dont expect the rest of us to think your any better for garnering gear that way. Let your freak flags fly fellas.

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Originally Posted by Ranka

I am not sure if anyone has stated this, but these may not even be rank 50 NM's. Yoshi did mention awhile back adding lower rank NM so we may even be seeing those. As for spawn times I do agree they need to be longer, but not 24 hours. A 8 hour with a 30 min-1 hr window would be plenty for me, or maybe spawn conditions like dodore where it has to be certain weather to, if these will be rank 50 ones. Just my opinion, but I really dont even think these will be rank 50 ones.

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Yeah, there has been some discussion on what levels these new NMs are going to be, unfortunately I think the news that new NMs were coming was a bit of a surprise. The only issue is, I don't think they can get away with putting in ONLY low-level NMs due to how many people are reaching max level now. They have to put something in to keep the high level people busy so I hope we see at least 1 new high level NM.

Another thing is that high level players are going to rape these mid ranged NM's just because they can, so good luck if your mid ranged and want a challenge.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Another thing is that high level players are going to rape these mid ranged NM's just because they can, so good luck if your mid ranged and want a challenge.

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That's assuming there's anything worthwhile for a high level player to get from the midrange NMs.

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Originally Posted by Ranka

I am not sure if anyone has stated this, but these may not even be rank 50 NM's.

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Yeah about 50 times. And I honestly do hope they're lower level NMs.

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Originally Posted by Ranka

A 8 hour with a 30 min-1 hr window would be plenty for me.

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People have said this too and I don't have any idea why. If you have such a problem with camping why would you want an NM that is on a timer like that??

It would make tracking the ToD a nightmare, not to mention organizing people to show up.

Would you rather show up once a day for 0 to 3 hours and be able to come back the next day? Or spend 5~6 hours waiting to see the NM and get ToD just to organize people to show up for a pop or 2?

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Originally Posted by Griss

but hey if waking up in the middle of the night and doing the intricate sub window dance is your thing then who am i to say any thing against that. if you want to be a video game Flagellant i aint going to stop you.

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No one is forcing you or anyone else to do anything. It's not about how much you want an item, it's the rarity of items.

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Originally Posted by Griss

Time sink =/= Difficulty
Difficulty = Difficulty

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If you haven't noticed every MMO is a time sink. It's what keeps people playing everyday and not getting a "THE END" screen after 2 or 3 days of playing.

This has nothing to do with difficulty. Difficulty plays absolutely no factor if the NM is actually killable (AV). If an LS can kill something once then they're capable of killing it over and over and over. The only factor making it's drop rarer is the limitations placed on how often it can be killed.

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Originally Posted by Griss

If you ask me, And people generally dont. The best nm they ever put into xi was hakutaku. Gathering the eyes, Getting the cluster crafted and then going down to pop and fight that sob. now that was a challenge with a darn good pay off. and it could be done on the players time.

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Everyone had an O hat. It wasn't anything special. While I agree the system is a good one, it doesn't make the drop rare.

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Originally Posted by Griss

The sky gods, The jailers, limbus, salvage, assaults, Stronghold nms, hell znm's and i guess abyssia (mind you i quit xi sometime after the first abysia hit). all of these offered challenging fights nice to epic rewards, involved short spawn nms if at all, runs could be scheduled and done at the players convenience. I would bet dollars to donuts that were going to see similar things here.

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Seeing as there already are NMs that have a spawn time that you have to fight for claim I don't think it will ALL be that way. It's just they drop 4 items and pop like spook so people don't complain. :/

And while those things did have good rewards and offered a challenge it didn't make the items very rare.

Look at defending ring and E body (before Odin). That is the kind of rarity I am talking about. Something that people will try to get and obsess about for years giving the content longevity.

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Originally Posted by Griss

If you want a repeats of Di, Sandworm, or the Kings. keep calling for them and i'm sure you will be able to rally enough support to garner developer attention. heck the rate at which this thread is growing might do that for you. Like i said who am i to define what fun is to some one else. just dont expect the rest of us to think your any better for garnering gear that way. Let your freak flags fly fellas.

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I completely respect were you're coming from on everything there dude, it's just at the rate things have changed in this game...

Everyone has everything from all the NMs they released in December in 4 months. Some items in 11 were amazing and rare from when they came out to 6 years later. I'm not saying the items from the current NMs are going to become worthless anytime soon but EVERYONE has them! There is no rarity at all.

What I'm really against here is seeing an update system like WoW that makes working for gear pointless because it will just become outdated way too quickly. But with the way people complain about not being able to do small things it just makes me think this game will just get easier and easier with content spoon-fed to casual players to keep them interested. Some items in 11 were amazing and rare from when they came out to 6 years later. That is what I want.

You really just need to give it up. There is a reason why SE never came out with NEW 24 hr spawn NMs even back in FFXI. It's an old mechanic that has no place in modern gaming.

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Originally Posted by Visch

People have said this too and I don't have any idea why. If you have such a problem with camping why would you want an NM that is on a timer like that??

It would make tracking the ToD a nightmare, not to mention organizing people to show up.

Would you rather show up once a day for 0 to 3 hours and be able to come back the next day? Or spend 5~6 hours waiting to see the NM and get ToD just to organize people to show up for a pop or 2?

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Well if you have long term spawns that are 24 hours, or close to it, it makes it unfair to a internationally played game. The reason leve reset are 36 hours is to alter the time from the west and east so both can get a prime time reset.

If we have a 24 hour time spawn it will make it unfair to one side regardless of the spawn time. Now I am not against 24 hour spawn times, but neither am i for them. i rather have a 36 hour respawn then a 24 just so it would alter like the leve's between early morning and night. I can see where your comming from for a 24 hour spawn and it would make sense and probably take less of your time, just saying that for a lot of players that single window it spawns may not work.

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Originally Posted by Corrderio

That's assuming there's anything worthwhile for a high level player to get from the midrange NMs.

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You always get those that will kill it because they think its makes them look leet "look I'm fighting this NM all by myself", plus whatever they drop can be sold no doubt, first few days especially prices will be high and the item will be in high demand.

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This has nothing to do with difficulty. Difficulty plays absolutely no factor if the NM is actually killable (AV). If an LS can kill something once then they're capable of killing it over and over and over. The only factor making it's drop rarer is the limitations placed on how often it can be killed.

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Thats not the only factor, drop rate is a massive factor also.

You can do BCNM in FF11 as many times as you have orbs but the drop rate will always be the main factor in whether you get the item you want or not.

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Everyone had an O hat. It wasn't anything special. While I agree the system is a good one, it doesn't make the drop rare.

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Everyone did have an O-hat, it didn't make the item any less useful, I don't understand why people have the need to parade around with rare items on, does it really make you feel that much better ?

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Originally Posted by Ranka

Well if you have long term spawns that are 24 hours, or close to it, it makes it unfair to a internationally played game.

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/sigh Did you play XI?

There was never a 24 hour spawn window it was a 0 to 3 hour spawn with a 21 hour cooldown. So it could respawn in 21 hours. Making the respawn window move. It might be in your time for a few days or a week then slowly go into JP time. It's fair.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

You really just need to give it up. There is a reason why SE never came out with NEW 24 hr spawn NMs even back in FFXI. It's an old mechanic that has no place in modern gaming.

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What in god's name are you talking about? Every expansion came with newer NMs that had even longer or harder to time spawns. Tiamat and the other king wyrms, Hydra, Cerberus, and Khimaira. All the way to Sandworm and Dark Ixion that came out with WoTG.

You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Everyone did have an O-hat, it didn't make the item any less useful, I don't understand why people have the need to parade around with rare items on, does it really make you feel that much better ?

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No, it just seems a little pointless in playing when everyone has everything and there is nothing to strive for.

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Originally Posted by Visch

What in god's name are you talking about? Every expansion came with newer NMs that had even longer or harder to time spawns. Tiamat and the other king wyrms, Hydra, Cerberus, and Khimaira. All the way to Sandworm and Dark Ixion that came out with WoTG.

You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about.

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Meh. I'm just trying to keep pace with you.

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Originally Posted by Visch

No, it just seems a little pointless in playing when everyone has everything and there is nothing to strive for.

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Then don't play. PLEASE.

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Originally Posted by Visch

No, it just seems a little pointless in playing when everyone has everything and there is nothing to strive for.

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Strive to better yourself, not to be better than others ?

This thread is the biggest waste of bandwidth. 75 pages of the same thing repeated over and over. Redundancy is redundant.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

Meh. I'm just trying to keep pace with you.



Then don't play. PLEASE.

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Keep pace with what? Failing to personally insult people and making stuff up? You're just upset because people are better than you. That's the way the world is. Sorry if it upsets you so much.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Strive to better yourself, not to be better than others ?

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That's the way online games work. It's not communist where everyone gets everything. It's competition. No matter what someone is going to be better. It's a fact of life.

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Originally Posted by Isaaru

This thread is the biggest waste of bandwidth. 75 pages of the same thing repeated over and over. Redundancy is redundant.

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Then don't add more? Most of it is people like you with nothing to say or people who don't even know what they're talking about.

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Originally Posted by Visch

/sigh Did you play XI?

There was never a 24 hour spawn window it was a 0 to 3 hour spawn with a 21 hour cooldown. So it could respawn in 21 hours. Making the respawn window move. It might me in your time for a few days or a week then slowly go into JP time. It's fair.

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Played well over 5 years ago, been awhile.

I still see what ya are saying, but in this game I do not think 24 hour window is the way to go. Reason being thus far, world NM spawns all drop crafted items used to make the gear. If it was a gear drop in itself, I would agree with long spawn times and even a lower drop rate. However a lot of items now if they are made from NM drops require more than one NM drop. Not saying we need 1 hour respawns, god forbid they make it any easier, but if its a craft drop this early in the game then I believe for a majority of people a medium time spawn, 8-12 hours(at most), with a window time that is one hour, maybe two would fit most in place with this games current direction. FFXI spawn times are decreasing to and 24 hour spawns are no longer going to be around, there is no point in adding it to FFXIV. Wanting 24 hour spawns is a fine thing, just do not expect it. We are still early on in the game, do not expect everything to be long and hard at this point, be patient and that will come at the later ranks.

Seriously... this isn't about "HARD" NMs. This isn't about making all drops come from 21-24hr NMs. This isn't about botting, or camping or TIME SINKS. This is about making gear rare, and this is ONE of the ways to do it.

Difficult instances eventually will not be difficult.
Low drop rate will always remain.
Time limitations will always remain.
Competition will always remain in 21-24hr NMs.

If 10 LSs are doing the same "rare gear" instance every week.. In a month, half the server is gear out.
If 10 LSs were competing over 1 mob every 21-24 hrs.. One LS will get lucky off the terrible drop rate and claim, and 3-4 people will have gear in a month...

This is about making gear rare, for the 27th time. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Visch

Keep pace with what? Failing to personally insult people and making stuff up? You're just upset because people are better than you. That's the way the world is. Sorry if it upsets you so much.

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Oh I'm not trying to insult anyone, but you're constant nonsensical arguments for a system that has no place in the game is keeping me here. People constantly disagree with you to which you reply with the same arguments over and over again and then defend your flawed logic with statements that make even less sense than... well, less sense than a 24 hour windowed NM!

P.S. Don't mistake being upset with being bored. I'll be here adding my input to every ridiculous post you make until 5:00 and then I will get back to doing what I do best: getting shyte done. And there are plenty of people better than I am, no doubt about that; but don't count yourself among them. I have completed everything this game has to offer and I will continue to do.

I just hope that the devs don't look at the number of posts and say "LOOK EVERYONE WANTS THIS, DO IT". This is literally an elitist LS who wants VS everyone else who don't. >_>.

In any case, you want rare loot? Okay.

Use the exact same time windows as the current NMs, put some incap only ridiculously low drop rate (0,0001%?), profit. At the very least people will still be able to schedule the time THEY want to do NM runs, be sure they will do the actual fun part of it (fighting the NM / playing the game, not just keep in the same spot for hours hoping for a pop) and the item will still be rare, done.

Geez.

Let's try to think from the SE view:

If SE make a lot of easy NM spawn 21hrs with incrediable equipment so player want to camp it...

-> EU players, US players, JP playsers will camp it try to voke it, a lot of frustration from loser but eventually some hardcore player will get it.

-> Hardcore will prove they're good by equiping it, also sell extra copy on AH/Ward with expensive price

-> Most Player who can't camp the NM will try their best to buy the rare drop, try makeing gils by crafting, farming, grouping with LS to fight HNM, event, to gain gil... or even skip the whole thing and buy gil on the web.

-> then a lot of RTM player will show up and camp for it,

In summary, hardcore player will play, regular player will play, RTM player will play.

Who benifit? SE and the whole community becuase a lot of player keep online to make the game more lively.

So, Why not :) ?

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Originally Posted by Scarface

Seriously... this isn't about "HARD" NMs. This isn't about making all drops come from 21-24hr NMs. This isn't about botting, or camping or TIME SINKS. This is about making gear rare, and this is ONE of the ways to do it.

Difficult instances eventually will not be difficult.
Low drop rate will always remain.
Time limitations will always remain.
Competition will always remain in 21-24hr NMs.

If 10 LSs are doing the same "rare gear" instance every week.. In a month, half the server is gear out.
If 10 LSs were competing over 1 mob every 21-24 hrs.. One LS will get lucky off the terrible drop rate and claim, and 3-4 people will have gear in a month...

This is about making gear rare, for the 27th time. Thanks.

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What makes gear rarity so important over challenging content? It's a ridiculous argument for the sake of being ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Blair

Let's try to think from the SE view:

If SE make a lot of easy NM spawn 21hrs with incrediable equipment so player want to camp it...

-> EU players, US players, JP playsers will camp it try to voke it, a lot of frustration from loser but eventually some hardcore player will get it.

-> Hardcore will prove they're good by equiping it, also sell extra copy on AH/Ward with expensive price

-> Most Player who can't camp the NM will try their best to buy the rare drop, try makeing gils by crafting, farming, grouping with LS to fight HNM, event, to gain gil... or even skip the whole thing and buy gil on the web.

-> then a lot of RTM player will show up and camp for it,

In summary, hardcore player will play, regular player will play, RTM player will play.

Who benifit? SE and the whole community becuase a lot of player keep online to make the game more lively.

So, Why not :) ?

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I'm sorry, but your entire post makes me question if you even play FFXIV. There isn't even an Auction House, nor RMT, because everyone is rich....

Moving on.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

What makes gear rarity so important over challenging content? It's a ridiculous argument for the sake of being ridiculous.

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Because CHALLENGING Content will eventually (1 month) not be a challenge and will be come routine, just like the mobs we have now. Make sense?

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

Oh I'm not trying to insult anyone, but you're constant nonsensical arguments for a system that has no place in the game is keeping me here. People constantly disagree with you to which you reply with the same arguments over and over again and then defend your flawed logic with statements that make even less sense than... well, less sense than a 24 hour windowed NM!

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Flawed logic? Less sense? You're the one completely lying and making stuff up.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

I have completed everything this game has to offer and I will continue to do.

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Right...
4,275 > 16,511

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Originally Posted by Visch

Then don't add more? Most of it is people like you with nothing to say or people who don't even know what they're talking about.

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lol you're mad.

And yeah people who don't know what they're talking about, you fall in that category.

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Originally Posted by Scarface

I'm sorry, but your entire post makes me question if you even play FFXIV. There isn't even an Auction House, nor RMT, because everyone is rich....

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>Nor RMT.

Are you sure he is the one who's not actually playing?

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

>Nor RMT.

Are you sure he is the one who's not actually playing?

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Ever since the earthquake there have been no RMT. None. Can't you tell? How much are shards on your server? All makes sense now, eeh?

Anyways, back on topic please.

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Originally Posted by Isaaru

lol you're mad.

And yeah people who don't know what they're talking about, you fall in that category.

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Lol you're mad @ thread.

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Originally Posted by Isaaru

This thread is the biggest waste of bandwidth. 75 pages of the same thing repeated over and over. Redundancy is redundant.

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

>Nor RMT.

Are you sure he is the one who's not actually playing?

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Are you playing? Everyone has like 40+ Mil. You make money from leveling up. The economy is completely whaked and there is no way RMT can make any money because everyone is loaded and nothing is worth anything.

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Originally Posted by Visch

Lol you're mad @ thread.

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No I just think it's hilarious how you don't understand the concept of a challenge over having long respawn times.

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Originally Posted by Visch

Lol you're mad @ thread.





Are you playing? Everyone has like 40+ Mil. You make money from leveling up. The economy is completely whaked and there is no way RMT can make any money because everyone is loaded and nothing is worth anything.

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I see you're still doing a lot of bold and rash assuming.

Gil is definitely easy to come by, but it's all relative. You have people that have amassed more gil then others; not this "everyones rich" scenario you claim. There just isn't any gil sink in the game yet.

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Originally Posted by Isaaru

No I just think it's hilarious how you don't understand the concept of a challenge over having long respawn times.

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It's funny how you don't understand that challenges aren't challenges anymore real fast. Hence needing another layer of "CHALLENGE" IE: Limitation of spawns/kills, low drop rates, competition, etc...

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Originally Posted by Scarface

Seriously... this isn't about "HARD" NMs. This isn't about making all drops come from 21-24hr NMs. This isn't about botting, or camping or TIME SINKS. This is about making gear rare, and this is ONE of the ways to do it.

Difficult instances eventually will not be difficult.
Low drop rate will always remain.
Time limitations will always remain.
Competition will always remain in 21-24hr NMs.

If 10 LSs are doing the same "rare gear" instance every week.. In a month, half the server is gear out.
If 10 LSs were competing over 1 mob every 21-24 hrs.. One LS will get lucky off the terrible drop rate and claim, and 3-4 people will have gear in a month...

This is about making gear rare, for the 27th time. Thanks.

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Well the very first post was about 24hr HNM so we are discussing pros and cons of such content. That being said, I have to say that I agree that difficult content will eventually lose its challenge the more and more you do it but I don't think that the 21-24hr windowed HNM is the answer to that. I think that if you want some rare gears that are mostly for hardcore players, the relic system of FFXI is more the way to go.
Casuals will still be able to access to that (I said access not actually get them in any reasonnable time frame), camping haters won't be against it (as I am for example) as it is about collecting items for upgrades. Hardcore players will have them far far far before any casuals (So they feel special). Collecting those things don't seem to be a boring (although some sort of time sink) thing to me (you have to do something to get it and no need to wait for a long time even if a short cession).