So, how is Pagos?

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Originally Posted by Alucard135

Is Padang up?

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Padang is the true religion.


Also, today I finished my WHM weapon and hit 35. Pagos still sucks. Gonna probably do it for two more weapons after a bit of a break mostly because I'm a masochist and really want the shiver emote so I'd be farming boxes anyway, but I'm still just mentally checking out of Pagos. My fingers can keep up a workable RDM rotation without any real attention from me and it's very noticeable that I'm not mentally present because of how slow I am to react if something disrupts the normal flow. Like I am hovering just above the threshold of sleep while I do this. If you just tossed the Dusk Vigil music in Eureka, I'd be face down on my keyboard for sure. Is this the sort of content Square Enix is proud to stamp its name on? I sincerely hope not.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

If you just tossed the Dusk Vigil music in Eureka, I'd be face down on my keyboard for sure.

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Come now, don’t insult Dusk Vigil like that!
Honestly, we better be glad they didn’t put Snorecloak’s music in there. You wanna talk about face down on the keyboard... imagine Pagos with Snowcloak BGM. Zzzzzz.

I've almost made it to 28 so far. I still really hate it but I've always done 1 relic and I want to finish the story. I'm hoping these upcoming hotfixes enable us to board the fate train again.
The levelling, light and crystal farming fit with the train method of completing pagos allowing us to work on these 3 tasks simultaneously. I think the pagos crystals are going to be tough, ive seen so few nm spawn I only have 56 and im told I need 500. Glad im running this for my off job. Do the weapons even glow as promised?

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Originally Posted by K1tt

Do the weapons even glow as promised?

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The weapons do not glow with this step, if I recall; they just get a new design.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

Come now, don’t insult Dusk Vigil like that!
Honestly, we better be glad they didn’t put Snorecloak’s music in there. You wanna talk about face down on the keyboard... imagine Pagos with Snowcloak BGM. Zzzzzz.

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Oh, it wasn't an insult toward Dusk Vigil. I actually quite like it. I just find that the music is just a very effective lullaby and it is very hard for me to stay awake in that dungeon as a result. Paired with the truly mind-numbing gameplay of Eureka Pagos, there's little doubt I'd literally fall asleep at my keyboard.

Also, just listening to shout and party chat makes it clear far more people are having to release when they die and lose XP as a result in Pagos than I ever saw in Anemos, likely because we don't all cluster around the train and groups are penalized for being helpful with the loss of the chain. I played Archeage for a while, which also has an XP penalty upon dying, but at least there that stopped once you hit level cap and you were therefore safe. Eureka really should have something similar if SE feels they simply can't compromise on the incredibly stupid death penalty, especially when they make obvious death traps, like the swarm of level 40 griffins around the level 35 quest item. I have never lost XP in Eureka because I play it very safe, but I've had to rely on random passers-by for a res here and there, and I'd be monumentally pissed if I was suddenly no longer 35. While I've been relatively tolerant of Pagos up to this point, suddenly being 34 again is the sort of thing that stands a good chance of making me walk out the door and not come back.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Oh, it wasn't an insult toward Dusk Vigil. I actually quite like it. I just find that the music is just a very effective lullaby and it is very hard for me to stay awake in that dungeon as a result. Paired with the truly mind-numbing gameplay of Eureka Pagos, there's little doubt I'd literally fall asleep at my keyboard.

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Fair enough! I did have to be in voice with a friend to keep me from losing my mind the 6 hours I did Pagos day one. Between the mind-numbing gameplay of chaining and listening to the same music from Anemos on repeat, I was beginning to lose my mind.

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Also, just listening to shout and party chat makes it clear far more people are having to release when they die and lose XP as a result in Pagos than I ever saw in Anemos, likely because we don't all cluster around the train and groups are penalized for being helpful with the loss of the chain.

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This is concerning. Between this and the difficulties I’m hearing about when it comes to finding chain parties at lower levels, it certainly isn’t tempting me to even attempt to go back in there. I stopped at halfway through level 22 to 23, and it would take forever for me to find a group for even the Challenge Log at this point. If the NM train doesn’t return, I don’t see Pagos doing well in the future until it’s significantly nerfed.

I’m also wanting to echo what Laura said above: just because I want the train back doesn’t mean that I want to AFK. I frequently participated in Anemos with spawning NMs; when I was below level, I came on RDM just to raise those who died. When I hit 20, I began helping with Wraiths for Pazuzu. I just liked that I could chose to take a break and rest my wrist after several minutes of killing mobs and not have to worry about things like “dropping the chain and losing EXP”. Plus, /shout was fun and sociable in Anemos. The day I was in Pagos, it was nothing but salty; I can’t say what it must be like now, but I haven’t heard anything good about it.

Having read through this really makes me worried. I've only been in a few times, and while the place was active, the parties were scarce. Second time in I waited 1 hour for party before abandoning. What's more worrying is that this seems to be something common.

The past 2 weeks I have gone into Eureka:Pagos. Like a good minion I went in there with the optimism and glow of a adventurer with a new challenge in their hands. After experiencing the wonders of Eureka:Anemos where missing the midnight train was considered a disaster. Where Pazuzu had a midnight snack of low levels and people were fighting in unsynched groups to get Fate XP. in 3 days you could be 20 if you committed yourself to this. Oh how I remember fondly the days my corpse was raised 200 times a day cause of an AOE in the fate or a mob sniffing my bad cologne from 2 miles away. But the friends i made in there made it all good!

Upon further examination I realized that Pagos looked more like Dynamis-Beacedine/Xacrabard it was very snowy and a grim place to withhold. Needless to say my eyes lit up when on my map I saw a fate! onwards we ran towards the fate and made a party!! only to be told this fate would not grant us any EXP but a bunny pet for a chest. Like the good ole FFXI we needed to make a party within the same levels and then I realized we got what we always wanted. FFXI in FFXIV... It took 20 minutes to form the first party , it only took the first 2 pulls for everyone to be eating the yummy snow from a very good vintage year. People left and people were upset and we decided to do the challenge log.

And then the first actual fate showed up and the train formed up with anticipation we killed the mob and got our XP and realized a few horrors. The dragons, steve, fred, bob and ed. While they were snoring they looked adorable but once the train ran past it was a survival of the fittest corpses littered the screen and people who were walking would still be triggered and slaughtered as if wrapped in bacon. If I ever wanted to experience what it was to be a lemming this would be the perfect setting for it. Zones were cut off from the low leves, protected by the snoozing dragons that i would love to make a suitcase out of but sadly none of this was possible. the sleeping monstrosity was level 40!.

As the days passed on and my level increased the tiny frustrations became big ones. The great tasting snow of Pagos became more and more salty from the tears of my fellow adventurers who died a horrible death there or cried out their eyes. It was becomming painful. From having 9 crystals with a full bar and only get 9 crystals. from the aetherytes being so far apart. from the party needing to rushto fates to get a crystals. The zone wasn't as interesting to explore as anemos was. It was a mad dash jumping off cliffs to find hidden caves where even more dragons were awaiting our anxious steps to get their morning snack.

The entire zone was a trap, the people in the zone where frustrated and irritated for having to work so hard and get so little in return. Pagos wasn't filled with snow it had turned into salt. There is no challenege to be found just the wonderous sound of despair and frustration on how this was developed.

Yesterday I hit 30, had enough light for the 1st step of relic for my main's weapon, and I just had enough. Logged off, started playing through route C of Nier which I made really good progress through. I also finished act 5 of Fire Emblem Echoes after leaving it in my backlog for far too long. Both these games have a grind. Both were infinitely more rewarding of my time invested.

The amount I accomplished in 2 other games in one Sunday afternoon highlighted so strongly the amount of time I was wasting in Pagos for minimal reward.

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Originally Posted by Edax

Funny how Anemos was a bit dull yet people still made sure to complete all their sets and brag about how many weapons they upgrade through Pazuzu. Even if the content was easy, it still took a significant commitment of time to do all that so clearly Anemos was an experiment that succeeded. It was the perfect casual content, not to hard, but was worth logging for and burning up your time in.

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Its not hard to get something in Anemos thanks to the train. Thus even though I only went into this to get the mount I still got two basic Anemos weapons out of this, simply because the NM dropped so many items. And that was only me being lvl 12, going to the train after maybe 1 or 2 days and also only staying in there for a couple of days too. (Not even one week) So the train alone made it possible to get a lot of stuff quite fast. But does that mean that the content itself is good or even fun? For me its not. I greatly dislike Anemos (and Eureka as a whole) and found even the train boring (but at least it got me progress).

So people may have gotten a lot of weapons or gear by simply leveling up to max level and farming a bit. Now if we had the same rules as Pagos this would have been way worse. And thats the problem: You need to go through the whole Eureka to get the final relic weapon and that means Pagos. So even if Anemos was more casual friendly, Pagos is not thus they will hit their wall there. And seeing how the devs did not like the train and did everything to stop it..I cant imagine how the last two parts would be better.

(And some people might just simply get every relic because they dont have anything else to do but I do wonder how many relics the true casual players own)

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Originally Posted by Zanmato

Having read through this really makes me worried. I've only been in a few times, and while the place was active, the parties were scarce. Second time in I waited 1 hour for party before abandoning. What's more worrying is that this seems to be something common.

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And it will keep becoming common as more and more people give up. A good portion of the casual playerbase will try Pagos for a little bit, some may stick it out longer than others, but the grind becomes so much I don't see many wanting to bother, especially with 4.4 likely less than a month away. It doesn't help high levels have virtually no reason to help lower level players anymore. And even less of them enjoy Pagos. I know some who got their relic for their main and have no intention of ever touching Pagos again.

I eventually gave up, especially considering the weapon only upgrades to 370 which I already have one due to the 24 man trade in items. If Eureka is the last thing that launches in the patch cycles then doing the relic this expansion is not worth it. The relic was suppose to be used for me to catch up to the raiders, but with how Pagos is I am better off just waiting until the next patch or running some EX primals for a weapon.

There used to be a vast amount of options to progress in the relic questlines. With Eureka there is only 1 way. Eureka is in no way casual friendly and requires at most a 3 hour minimum to gain any noticeable progress outside of the challenge log.

I didnt mind diadem in 3.0 because despite it being the first open area fail, it was not tied to the relic questline.

If the point of Eureka was to push players away or push the casual playerbase into raiding, then I think they have succeeded in both.

The dev have to realised,they miserably failed on eureka,and even worse on pagos,dont know if the dev want to make the game crash and have peace or if they are really not doing it on purpose

How is what? Oh that thing that requires me to slog through Anemos for an even bigger slog, all while pretending it is as interesting as ffxi?


Haven't touched it.

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Originally Posted by Edax

Funny how Anemos was a bit dull yet people still made sure to complete all their sets and brag about how many weapons they upgrade through Pazuzu. Even if the content was easy, it still took a significant commitment of time to do all that so clearly Anemos was an experiment that succeeded. It was the perfect casual content, not to hard, but was worth logging for and burning up your time in.

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Well I didn't do the bragging bit but I did go into Anemos quite a lot after getting my first relic and the dyeable gear. I'm not saying Anemos was perfect (I had plenty of issues with it before I joined the train) but I always felt my time in there was well spent and decently rewarded. I never had trouble getting groups and the train meant I could go in with low-level friends and help them level up.

So yes, despite this stage being far easier to complete than previous relics, I think you may be right about it working well as casual content. If Pagos had been similar, I'd probably be spending most of my time in there and working on a second or third weapon upgrade. As it is, I am level 23 and have no intention of going back unless significant changes are made. Considering they appear to have deliberately derailed the train, I'm not really expecting that to happen.

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Originally Posted by Nixxe

Padang is the true religion.

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Amen. Padang is the true face of Pagos.

I really want to know if the devs tested Pagos hard.

Yesterday I spend 2 full lockout trying to spawn Louhi, with no success. In other words, it was SIX HOURS OF MY DAY trying to spawn him.

If leveling to 35 was not punishing enough....

Pagos needs the train. It’s horrible with out it. I hate it so much. chest drops are still bad too. And the lv20 FATE in not Soloable. I think the only way to get it changed is to just not do it.

Pagos needs the train. It’s horrible with out it. I hate it so much. chest drops are still bad too. And the lv20 bunny FATE in not Soloable. I think the only way to get it changed is to just not do it.

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Originally Posted by Dragoon4life

Pagos needs the train. It’s horrible with out it. I hate it so much. chest drops are still bad too. And the lv20 bunny FATE in not Soloable. I think the only way to get it changed is to just not do it.

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The train was not intentional. Pagos is working as intended. It is just not fun.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

The train was not intentional. Pagos is working as intended. It is just not fun.

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And as you said,the intentional way is just not fun at all,chore at best,tortur at worst.they really messed up.

I don't really like Pagos, but I'm going to try to finish it for the sake of the relic and the minimal story we get. I guess I'm just going to do the challenge log then leave until the next reset.

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Originally Posted by Dragoon4life

Pagos needs the train. It’s horrible with out it. I hate it so much.

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Y̶o̶u̶ ̶k̶n̶o̶w̶ ̶I̶ ̶t̶h̶o̶u̶g̶h̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶s̶ ̶a̶s̶ ̶w̶e̶l̶l̶ ̶w̶h̶e̶n̶ ̶I̶ ̶f̶i̶r̶s̶t̶ ̶s̶t̶a̶r̶t̶e̶d̶ ̶p̶l̶a̶y̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶P̶a̶g̶o̶s̶.̶ ̶T̶h̶e̶n̶ ̶a̶f̶t̶e̶r̶ ̶g̶e̶t̶t̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶b̶r̶a̶i̶n̶w̶a̶s̶h̶e̶d̶.̶.̶.̶ ̶u̶h̶h̶ ̶c̶h̶a̶i̶n̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶u̶n̶t̶i̶l̶ ̶I̶'̶v̶e̶ ̶s̶e̶e̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶l̶i̶g̶h̶t̶ ̶I̶'̶v̶e̶ ̶c̶h̶a̶n̶g̶e̶d̶ ̶m̶y̶ ̶m̶i̶n̶d̶ ̶a̶ ̶b̶i̶t̶.̶ ̶I̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶n̶k̶ ̶i̶f̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶y̶ ̶u̶p̶p̶e̶d̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶l̶i̶g̶h̶t̶ ̶g̶a̶i̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶y̶ ̶c̶o̶u̶l̶d̶ ̶p̶r̶o̶b̶a̶b̶l̶y̶ ̶g̶e̶t̶ ̶a̶w̶a̶y̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶o̶u̶t̶ ̶s̶h̶o̶r̶t̶e̶n̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶N̶M̶ ̶s̶p̶a̶w̶n̶ ̶t̶i̶m̶e̶s̶.̶ ̶A̶l̶s̶o̶,̶ ̶i̶n̶c̶r̶e̶a̶s̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶P̶a̶g̶o̶s̶ ̶C̶r̶y̶s̶t̶a̶l̶s̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶d̶r̶o̶p̶ ̶w̶o̶u̶l̶d̶ ̶h̶e̶l̶p̶ ̶a̶ ̶l̶o̶t̶ ̶t̶o̶o̶.̶ ̶A̶s̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶r̶i̶g̶h̶t̶ ̶n̶o̶w̶ ̶i̶'̶m̶ ̶g̶o̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶1̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶d̶o̶n̶e̶ ̶u̶n̶t̶i̶l̶ ̶i̶t̶'̶s̶ ̶s̶e̶v̶e̶r̶e̶l̶y̶ ̶n̶e̶r̶f̶e̶d̶ ̶i̶n̶t̶o̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶g̶r̶o̶u̶n̶d̶.̶

EDIT: They actually reduced the number of monsters to spawn NM's per the Japanese patch notes. LONG LIVE THE TRAIN! xD

https://jp.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...71e766d37f038b

Waiting to see how the adjustments work out. I'm cautiously optimistic at this point, but this is hardly going to solve the biggest problems with Pagos. If anything, this is another bandage. I just hope it's a bandage that will stay in place long enough for me to finish the one relic item I'm interested in.

I'll wait a day (or a few hours, depending) before entering Pagos. If the NM spawn rate is back to how it was in Anemos, then I'll board the train.

Just spent two hours in Pagos. The train is viable once again and I got a level and a half in that time. I'll continue at it, but for those who like Anemos, Pagos is much the same now. Just, with different terrain and dragons to avoid.

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Originally Posted by TheGrimace

Just spent two hours in Pagos. The train is viable once again and I got a level and a half in that time. I'll continue at it, but for those who like Anemos, Pagos is much the same now. Just, with different terrain and dragons to avoid.

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And such things in need of tweaking, sch as the northwest aetheryte needing to be brought down to a lv27 requirement, light from mobs and NMs being handed a lift, even a minor one, and Pagos Crystals needing some enhancement (not too much, I don't think?).

Yeah, it's still a very big problem that the MMs between 26-30 are in the northwestern corner, but you can't actually access the aetheryte until 30. The train gets diluted in the center of the map due to all of the dragons and random aggro varieties of nearby enemies. This was a problem before the train, but now it's even more noticeable when you're trying to rush. And now they're basically trying to say that trains are okay now, but they still have all of the chokepoints. It's very awkward and screams, "we don't know what we want you to do!"

Well, looks like the train is sorta returned. Now play nice again.

Think I am done with bunnies. This has made me hate bunnies. Not solely the fact that I am not getting gold, but other people are not getting gold either. In the last ten days of doing this after I reached 35 I have only see six people get gold. There is a very low quantity eyes on market boards. I do not understand the reasoning to make things so rare with patch 4.4 Patch in 3-4 weeks. People will not go back to Pagos to do bunnies just like people barely go back into Rival Wings all but once a week which will take some people at that rate over year to get Rival Wings mount. Not saying I want things handed to me, just that there is no incentive to waste my time getting peanuts when I can do other things that i enjoy.

Since we have all of this hatemail when things are rough I think the devs equally deserve a pat on the back for doing something right. I doubt it was part of the original plan to buff NM exp so massively just 2 weeks after release so I'm taking this as a sign that they are listening to all of this feedback. The roughest part of pagos, the leveling experience, is now smoothed over and not super slow. When there's this much negative feedback they are typically fast to respond or rectify the situation. Much appreciated.

Honestly, I liked it the way it was. I do hope that SE can find a way to not make long combat sessions so repetitive, but other then that, I enjoyed the change of pace .. standing around waiting for NMs to spawn is lame.

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Originally Posted by jadan2000

Honestly, I liked it the way it was. I do hope that SE can find a way to not make long combat sessions so repetitive, but other then that, I enjoyed the change of pace .. standing around waiting for NMs to spawn is lame.

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The cool thing is... you don't have to stand around. Go make a chain party.

All the people who say chain is dead? Just go chain. They didn't take them out.

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Originally Posted by Tsumdere

The cool thing is... you don't have to stand around. Go make a chain party.

All the people who say chain is dead? Just go chain. They didn't take them out.

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This. 3 out of every 4 complaints I see is that "great now I have to go stand around and afk."

1) Chaining is still viable. Make a PF group. I'm sure there's at least 8 of you on a datacentre.
2) Nobody is forcing you to join the train. If you're doing it because you say it's "fastest" you're acknowledging that it's more viable and that you're in it for the rewards and not the gameplay, which was what you were just telling everyone else we should be "enjoying".
3) It's (gasp) actually possible to contribute to the train and kill things. You can even follow the train and chain mobs in the surrounding areas. You are actively making the choice to AFK. I never once afk'd when I was in the train, nor did my friends.
4) If you are making the active choice to AFK then you are one of the problems. Stop being a hypocrite and accusing other people of doing the thing you choose to do.

How it is now I don't see ones getting there weapon before next area is out. When next area is out almost everyone will be there that already has there weapon. they didn't need to buff the exp. all they need to do was buff light and crystals from chains and nms there. Also buff the treasure chests and drops.

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Originally Posted by Rufalus

Since we have all of this hatemail when things are rough I think the devs equally deserve a pat on the back for doing something right. I doubt it was part of the original plan to buff NM exp so massively just 2 weeks after release so I'm taking this as a sign that they are listening to all of this feedback. The roughest part of pagos, the leveling experience, is now smoothed over and not super slow. When there's this much negative feedback they are typically fast to respond or rectify the situation. Much appreciated.

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It shouldn't have even been released in the initial state if they had just had a decent play test. A lot of the decisions in Pagos are mind boggling.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

It shouldn't have even been released in the initial state if they had just had a decent play test. A lot of the decisions in Pagos are mind boggling.

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I agree. While I don't mind acknowledging that they did return things back to what the majority of players were asking for, I want to be careful about too much accolade-giving. Yes, they gave us back the Anemos model - after already having proof that very few people wanted to do things Pagos-style. Let's not cheer too loudly; they made a stupid choice that started the game leaking players and tried to hastily patch the leak. Anemos still has a long way to go to be "good" content, it's just now become bearable. I don't want them to lull us into a false sense of accomplishment because we got them to give us back what we already had.

In fact, I'd definitely be wary; this feels a lot more like "You guys complain about Anemos, but let us show you just how bad it can be, now take what we gave you and stop asking for improvements." And while that falls into another "conspiracy theory" and I'm not going to buy wholly into it, businesses very much think that way. I've been in business meetings where such things are discussed. "If we withhold x, y, and z features on release, which are already created and which we know our clients want, we can announce them after a few weeks so that it looks like we've taken their feedback into consideration without having to add more to the program." "I added [terrible thing] to the design, so that when the client asks for it to be removed they can feel like they've made input into the design without actually messing with anything."

The zone seems a bit more lively due to the train making a slight comeback, but I imagine a lot of people are probably going to get bored again once they realize that the light grind is still ridiculous after AFKing their ways to 35.

I did around 10 NMs in a single session and scarcely got a single bar from it.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

The zone seems a bit more lively due to the train making a slight comeback, but I imagine a lot of people are probably going to get bored again once they realize that the light grind is still ridiculous after AFKing their ways to 35.

I did around 10 NMs in a single session and scarcely got a single bar from it.

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Meanwhile a single NM at 24 gets me 50-60% of a level bar.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

The zone seems a bit more lively due to the train making a slight comeback, but I imagine a lot of people are probably going to get bored again once they realize that the light grind is still ridiculous after AFKing their ways to 35.

I did around 10 NMs in a single session and scarcely got a single bar from it.

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Honestly the leveling to 35 part is the annoying part to me. Mindlessly grinding mobs at level cap when you have more travel options, a mount, free reign to not get one shot by 90% of the mobs in there makes the experience less annoying.

The light step has always been grindy though, granted there are barely any choices this time but a lot of people just spammed one thing repeatedly that might as well have been a hp sponge anyway. (like 500 Garuda HM for Zodiac, or facerolling A1S for anima).