Swiftcast/Quelling Strikes/Blood for blood etc. are slightly different. They are very useful skills to have, but all content CAN be beaten without them, if people don't need to be raised often, then you can hard raise just fine, and quelling isn't needed if you have very good tanks and watch your enmity. I'm not saying these skills are not highly recommended for high level play, but the point is that tank swaps are impossible without provoke, meaning that most of the time no provoke means an instant wipe, and this is the only skill where this is the case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Krazymagic
I don't mind what level they give it at, but level 50 would be fine, as 8-man content is not accessible until level 50, which is the where provoke is required most (before that it is only helpful in a few situation).Quote:
Originally Posted by Krazymagic
Something need to be done in how tanks acquiring Provoke
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08-19-2016, 03:04 AMLambdafish
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08-19-2016, 03:43 AMKrazymagicI understand where you're coming from, but I don't think you're going to see anything changed here. I also don't personally think a change needs to happen, mainly because there is no need for it. Everything is working as intended here. Every class has stuff they need to level other classes for, all with varying levels of importance. While you make a case for provoke being the most important of these, and perhaps that is true, I still dont think that necessitates any change. The game is built around a system that requires you to level multiple classes. Do you know the last time SE made a change to cross class abilities like is being suggested here? Never. What has changed to require a sudden change of course? Nothing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lambdafish
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08-19-2016, 03:49 AMFreyyy
I personally think that the whole class and cross-class system is boring and should be scrapped if they don't want to improve it (and I already have every single class high level enough to have every single cross-class options available for every single job so I'm not saying this because I'm lazy). They never added any cross-class, there is no job that can cross-class rogue skills, and the new jobs from now on won't ever get a class so they'll never share any of their skills to the other classes. We didn't even get an extra slot at level 60. The 5 cross class skills we have now just feel like a product of laziness from the developpers who, instead of giving each class 5 more unique skills, chose to just give them all the same thing to complete their kit (every physical DPS gets the same Lancer and Pugilist skills with the exception of MCH who gets archer instead of Pugilist, and both DRG and MNK have the same Marauder skills since they don't cross-class with themselves, both caster DPS get the same Archer skills, etc... there is absolutely no originality or even "choice", since the 5 skills we take for each class are the only 5 that are somewhat good, the other options being completely useless shit). The basic idea of having the possibility to get skills from other classes as a reward for levelling every class was good, but the result in game is really lame. And since they show all the signs that they aren't willing to improve it in any way, shape or form, I think that they should just delete this system and replace the 5 missing skills with 5 new skills for each job, while also changing the levels at which we learn most skills since a lot of them make no sense (PLD being the derpest of all the jobs in that matter, learning ShO at 40 while the other tanks have their tanking stance at 30, or the fact that they learn very basic DPS combos only at 54 and 60 even tho it would make more sense to have them a lot earlier to help with solo questing... Sheltron being an incredibly basic block skill too, only learned at 52 while he can learn to be outright Invincible 2 levels earlier).
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08-19-2016, 06:56 AMJandor
I'm hoping a decent rework of classes/jobs/advanced jobs in general come 4.0
They seriously can't be planning on just tacking 5 new skills onto every job and calling it a day. I hope. -
08-19-2016, 12:03 PMADVSSbe fine with them being cooldowns, not looking forward to 4 skills only being available when a strict timer on a medium recast is up...Quote:
Originally Posted by Jandor
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08-19-2016, 05:00 PMTaranTatsuuchiWell, the one with the simultanious death enemies can't be ignored.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cakekizyy
If you don't do it properly they just keep resurrecting each other.
Also, I like the bubbles one....
The NPC keeps insulting you when you do it wrong, would only be better if it was actually voiced. XD
OH god... had one time I did that one as a scholar and the tank wouldn't bring him to the herbs...Quote:
Originally Posted by AnaviAnael
I actually stopped healing him, and dismissed my fairy, hoping the turtle would kill him so it would aggro onto onf of the rest of us standing near the smoking herbs.
It was that day that I learned the herbs have a time limit.
They go out after a certain amount of time and another sprite spawns.
We had to light the patch three times! -
08-19-2016, 07:50 PMFreyyyHuhh this sounds like a bad idea, why would they force a DRK to spend a Dark Arts for taunting while PLD just spends a free 20sec CD which has almost no other utility anyway ? Sounds completely unbalanced. It's just like if the WAR taunt forced you to spend 5 stacks of Wrath (or even 2-3 since a DA isn't worth 5 stacks when you compare the two jobs). And Plunge already has two utilities, being a gap closer and a damaging oGCD. If you make it required for tank swapping, we'd have to keep it for these instances, defeating the purpose of the skill in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zojha
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08-19-2016, 08:05 PMZojhaSo does WAR having to consume 5 wrath stacks for Inner Beast mitigation, where DRK and PLD can just pop shadowskin/bulwark which have no other use and be done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freyyy
Nobody really complains about WAR being underpowered, tho. -
08-19-2016, 08:42 PMFreyyyLol IB has way more uptime than any other PLD and DRK CD. And when you use IB, you also hit with a 300 potency attack which ignores the Defiance damage penalty while healing you for 100% of the damage dealt. You can't compare IB with anything from the other 2 tanks, maybe Dark Mind is the closest thing to it, which costs a Dark Arts to be used at full power and still has 60sec CD while IB can be available every ~20 seconds or so if they decide one day to create a fight which require such mitigation, and without counting Infuriate. Speaking about Bulwark; WAR has Vengence which has 60sec less CD and is more efficient in every possible way, while granting them DPS and a stack. It's also more efficient than PLD's Sentinel since it lasts 15sec for 2min CD and only reduces 2% less damage when both tanks are in their respective tanking stance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zojha
Your comparison is completely out of place here, we're talking about taunting a target. It's completely free for PLD, it shouldn't cost a friking DA for DRK, and shouldn't cost anything to WAR aswell. -
08-19-2016, 09:12 PMlvlagmarinkI'm just gonna leave this right here, dunno if our suggestion will bear any fruit with this changes..Quote:
Originally Posted by Luxpheras