Healers need an overhaul

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Originally Posted by PirateRyanG

Because, once again, IT IS A FIRST DUNGEON.

The first dungeon is ALWAYS like that in any MMO.

Stop basing the entirety of healing on the very first dungeon that you enter.

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I linked the video in response to what Puc wrote (just above my reply where I linked it) but I just realized I never actually quote’d them (smh mobile reply) so if that confuses you, then my apologies.

But still: we minimize as much healing as possible to contribute elsewhere (dpsing) while making sure all unavoidable damage does not kill players, doesn’t matter whether it’s first duty or endgame. The ratio between healing vs damaging is unimaginably lopsided and THAT is ‘being in a good spot’? C'mon... Doesn't matter if the example given is more toward a hyperbole than anything, the point still stands. It's not overly complicated to read between the lines after this much pages.

I find healing really engaging once you get to the more challenging content like savage, unreal, criterion and whatnot. Below that I think all the jobs are pretty boring, I just go on dps for a change of pace since I raid on healer. The only thing I want for my healing experience is more damage to heal; the thought of more healing tools gets me more excited than the thought of getting more damage stuff tbh.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PirateRyanG

Because, once again, IT IS A FIRST DUNGEON.

The first dungeon is ALWAYS like that in any MMO.

Stop basing the entirety of healing on the very first dungeon that you enter.

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You say that as if that doesn't happen all the way up to lv90 dungeons (yeah, those dungeons that are easily farmed with 1 tank and 3 dps) when even in high end content unless the battle literally doesn't allow you to hit the boss the nuke is across all healers over 50% of their total actions and the percentage goes way higher if we count only GCDs

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

At certain gear levels you'll be able to avoid those bleeds entirely if you plan enough though, If you don't suffer any damage from a boss' attack (read: Critlo + buffed Shake it off) you don't get the bleed applied.

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True, but that's a matter of flipping a switch (requires damage to apply, y/n; complete absorption completely prevents DoTs, y/n) or changing the applicator into an aura instead of a damage-taken event.

My point was simply that DoTs innately provide less stress of something that must be preempted (else limiting one's only available reactions to Raise) compared to other ways of offering similar increased healing load.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PirateRyanG

Because, once again, IT IS A FIRST DUNGEON.

The first dungeon is ALWAYS like that in any MMO.

Stop basing the entirety of healing on the very first dungeon that you enter.

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Do you need me to put up the like 2hr ish vod of me running Smileton over and over on my AST the "hardest healer" in the game to prove this goes all the way up to 90?

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Originally Posted by ASkellington

Don't even have to go all the way back to Pagl though I'm surprised it actually is that bad.

Smileton? I think is one of the 90 experts? Yeah the second boss is a friggin joke. I have video footage of that boss and specifically that boss for a reason:

Did you know that boss has a tank buster? I didn't! Cause majority of the time my group kills the thing before it goes off!!!! The boss opens with an AoE that you ALSO only see once on my usual runs.

...WHAT?

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And if I recall, I made that during 6.08.

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Originally Posted by ASkellington

Do you need me to put up the like 2hr ish vod of me running Smileton over and over on my AST the "hardest healer" in the game to prove this goes all the way up to 90?

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...isn't Scholar the hardest healer? AST is all about preparing safety nets o,o

Still, yeah, even as an AST I'm just casting Combust and Malefic until stuff dies. If I press anything to heal it's bound to be Essential Dignity and Earthly Star (for damage too, no less). Maybe Exaltation, Intersection and a regen, but only so I don't get nasty surprises from tanks that don't use cooldowns/is undergeared. It's otherwise stupidly straightforward even at higher levels. To really make use of your kit and feel like you must use everything, you'd need your team to properly suck, massively. But unfortunately, even a mediocre team is really easy to handle. And AST especially has tools that just outright laugh at damage (Macrocosmos).

This is a bit toxic on my end, but often when my friends are learning how to tank and I heal them, they sometimes say "Sorry if I'm doing poorly" or so. I tell them "If I didn't press Synastry or cast Benefic 2, you're doing a good job". And while it's daft that I have to confirm they did a good job on whether or not I felt pressured to use my kit at all, it does go to show that the class can handle the bare minimum with a minor part of its kit.

Hell, I already had this mindset back in Shadowbringers anyway. I had friends who were skeptical of how strong Scholar and Astro were, especially in dungeons, "because they're not like White Mage whose heals are so strong". I'd run dungeons asking them to never once press a single cooldown. And again I would say "Didn't even cast Benefic".

While a bit of a braggart move and obviously I wouldn't do it to randoms, it proves the point. Healers are just so straightforward. There's no difference between going into Sastasha and pressing Malefic until you need to use a Benefic vs going into a higher level dungeon, spam Gravity until you need to use a charge of Essential Dignity.

I sometimes feel bad. I know that things will be fine. I have regens on, Earthly Star ticking, two charges of Essential Dignity that are more useful at 30% or lower health, regens, some shields and I could have Macrocosmos'ed if I wanted to. And so many other spells that I'm just not bothered to use. The point is that the tank will be fine.
But I feel like if I don't pretend like I need to heal a little, the random tank on Roulettes will get mad and accuse me of not healing. Some people aren't comfortable with me playing ping pong with their health.
Even when the tanks can self-heal now, I still feel pressured to do something, because I'm scared of looking like I'm griefing.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

...isn't Scholar the hardest healer?

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Its in quotes for a reason. AST is considered "hard" or "complex" because of the card system and weaving.

And I'm over here going like: "it is literally no harder than any other healer even considering your opener lmao".

If I ever press Lightspeed (because I am stubbornly refusing to use it to finish off being optimal and thus "done" with AST not going to bother using it for my opener outside of EX and Savage I am not doing) to spam Benefic 2 something's gone wrong.

Of my toolkit in 90 content with W2W pulls for AST its usually Macro/Exalt for first pull with ED and/or CI as needed and then ES CI/ED for second pull provided dps slays adds in seconds. Otherwise well if I need to press Benefic 2 I will. /shrug

Neutral Sect? Never heard of them.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

[...]I sometimes feel bad. I know that things will be fine. I have regens on, Earthly Star ticking, two charges of Essential Dignity that are more useful at 30% or lower health, regens, some shields and I could have Macrocosmos'ed if I wanted to. And so many other spells that I'm just not bothered to use. The point is that the tank will be fine.

But I feel like if I don't pretend like I need to heal a little, the random tank on Roulettes will get mad and accuse me of not healing. Some people aren't comfortable with me playing ping pong with their health.
Even when the tanks can self-heal now, I still feel pressured to do something, because I'm scared of looking like I'm griefing.

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This is so me, too. At least first few couple of months trying to polish my healing gameplay. Eventually I learned the beauty of that quippy remark: "But did you die though?". People can dance in disco panicking but if they aren't dying, I know that I'm healing enough. For the most part, health bars are MY resource, after all.

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Originally Posted by ASkellington

Its in quotes for a reason. AST is considered "hard" or "complex" because of the card system and weaving.

And I'm over here going like: "it is literally no harder than any other healer even considering your opener lmao".

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This is a painful realization that I ended up after picking up AST to flex for my previous static. No, it's not hard. It boils down to the same 1 button press ad nauseam for 105s after dumping down all that many superfluous weaving into a tight 15s window. Wall pulling? It's as you've described & it's not even an esotericism to switch from lightspeed'ing Fall Malefics into lightspeed'ing Gravity II to proceed with the carpa tunnel inducing 15s window.

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Originally Posted by Rein_eon_Osborne

This is a painful realization that I ended up after picking up AST to flex for my previous static. No, it's not hard. It boils down to the same 1 button press ad nauseam for 105s after dumping down all that many superfluous weaving into a tight 15s window. Wall pulling? It's as you've described & it's not even an esotericism to switch from lightspeed'ing Fall Malefics into lightspeed'ing Gravity II to proceed with the carpa tunnel inducing 15s window.

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I remember in the healing forums there was a post asking which healing tools we'd axe and with how I played AST you could literally give me nothing but ES, Exalt, ED and CO along with A.Benefic, A.Helios and Benefic 2 and I would be ok.

CI? I don't use outside of W2W pulls unless I don't have access to Exalt or the boss is alive long enough to where tank busters are faster than 60s.

CU? Don't use outside of instances where I don't have ES/CO.

Macrocosmos? Its a lv90 skill. I rarely get lv90 content.

Neutral Sect? I don't need it and would rather have Noctural back as a battle stance.

Horoscope? I love the ability but damn if I never need it for anything. I just use it because I can and because I like the ability.

My level 70 kit is more engaging than my level 90 kit. That is so backwards its beyond unfunny.

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Originally Posted by Rein_eon_Osborne

I linked the video in response to what Puc wrote (just above my reply where I linked it) but I just realized I never actually quote’d them (smh mobile reply) so if that confuses you, then my apologies.

But still: we minimize as much healing as possible to contribute elsewhere (dpsing) while making sure all unavoidable damage does not kill players, doesn’t matter whether it’s first duty or endgame. The ratio between healing vs damaging is unimaginably lopsided and THAT is ‘being in a good spot’? C'mon... Doesn't matter if the example given is more toward a hyperbole than anything, the point still stands. It's not overly complicated to read between the lines after this much pages.

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To emphasis this particular point. I have an Aglaia run, on content, where I pressed Dosis III over 500 times. Every other ability combined wouldn't equate to that many casts. Is Aglaia too easy? 144 of my 243 casts in P4S were on Dosis III. And before anyone tries to argue I chadded. My co-healer and I had an combined 97%

There is absolutely no justifying this level of "gameplay". Even Abyssos, which is a step forward, still has a ridiculous lopsided healing to DPS ratio. That wouldn't be a problem if your DPS rotation wasn't pressing a single button until your 1 key/X button breaks.