The problem with the mentor system

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Originally Posted by EaMett

You can be a mentor in full gear on an unfamiliar class

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On an unfamiliar class 80 lvl, ok.

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Originally Posted by EaMett

and be tunnel visioning so hard you miss mechanics. Not only can this be a thing but I'm pretty sure every mentor and player knows exactly what I'm talking about, first hand.
I personally can't BRD for the life of me. Keeping my eyes on the procs = eating mechanics consistently. I still enjoy playing it and won't stop because some elitist expects a certain level of play out of me because I'm a mentor. (see what I did there)

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If you 're feeling insecure in your class, a good solution would be not to wear the crown, right?

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Originally Posted by SoranRigel

Really?
Ok, let 's go back to the official definition of "mentor":

In connection with this definition (sorry, it 's not "my expectations") I ask the question again: what can these people teach with crowns on their heads if they don 't know the simplest game mechanics?
These people became mentors because the system allows them to do so.
Because they go to farm recommendations to purchase a beautiful badge and winnings.
Not to help.

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Even veteran players make mistakes, you are not making any sense...you realize that right?

I raid savage and even I get hit by random aoes sometimes or forget a mechanic and get hit or die. It doesn't mean I don't know the mechanics normally, but distractions happen, forgetfulness happens, mistakes happen.

If I get hit by a ground AoE does it mean I don't know how to dodge it as a veteran player? No, it just means I was distracted, or I just plain messed up, or I lagged. Plenty of reasons for even veteran players to make mistakes for even simple mechanics. People mess up because we are human and humans are fallible.

Go watch some savage or ultimate videos clears and prog. You'll see even the people doing the hardest content sometimes get hit by things or die by their own mistakes for a lot of different reasons.

Perfection doesn't exist. For anyone. Veteran player or not.

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Originally Posted by SoranRigel

If you 're feeling insecure in your class, a good solution would be not to wear the crown, right?

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Just because a mentor might not be super experienced on a job they are playing doesn't mean they can't help with OTHER jobs that newbies might be playing, or help with knowledge of mechanics in dungeons etc.

They can still help people with many things, so why turn it off?

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Originally Posted by Miste

Even veteran players make mistakes, you are not making any sense...you realize that right?

I raid savage and even I get hit by random aoes sometimes or forget a mechanic and get hit or die. It doesn't mean I don't know the mechanics normally, but distractions happen, forgetfulness happens, mistakes happen.

If I get hit by a ground AoE does it mean I don't know how to dodge it as a veteran player? No, it just means I was distracted, or I just plain messed up, or I lagged. Plenty of reasons for even veteran players to make mistakes for even simple mechanics. People mess up because we are human and humans are fallible.

Go watch some savage or ultimate videos clears and prog. You'll see even the people doing the hardest content sometimes get hit by things or die by their own mistakes for a lot of different reasons.

Perfection doesn't exist. For anyone. Veteran player or not.

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Trying to explain with logic to someone whose arguement was created without any logic doesnt want unfortunately

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Originally Posted by Miste

Even veteran players make mistakes, you are not making any sense...you realize that right?

I raid savage and even I get hit by random aoes sometimes or forget a mechanic and get hit or die. It doesn't mean I don't know the mechanics normally, but distractions happen, forgetfulness happens, mistakes happen.

If I get hit by a ground AoE does it mean I don't know how to dodge it as a veteran player? No, it just means I was distracted, or I just plain messed up, or I lagged. Plenty of reasons for even veteran players to make mistakes for even simple mechanics. People mess up because we are human and humans are fallible.

Go watch some savage or ultimate videos clears and prog. You'll see even the people doing the hardest content sometimes get hit by things or die by their own mistakes for a lot of different reasons.

Perfection doesn't exist. For anyone. Veteran player or not.



Just because a mentor might not be super experienced on a job they are playing doesn't mean they can't help with OTHER jobs that newbies might be playing, or help with knowledge of mechanics in dungeons etc.

They can still help people with many things, so why turn it off?

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A lot of experienced players make mistakes every day: hit other players, mock beginners, rough in chat and at the same time do not make mechanics. Because of forgetfulness, probably.
I agree, we 're all human. But some people in crowns are particularly disgusting.
Unfortunately, they meet too often.

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Originally Posted by Miste

Just because a mentor might not be super experienced on a job they are playing doesn't mean they can't help with OTHER jobs that newbies might be playing, or help with knowledge of mechanics in dungeons etc.

They can still help people with many things, so why turn it off?

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You can also be knowledgeable on the class you're playing, just mechanically challenged on that job. Leveling an Nth job to 80 after not touching it for 2 years, then once at cap learning how to play it again can be challenging for anyone. Again the crown shouldn't mean that you're proficient in everything. Just in enough that you can help people and want to do so.

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Originally Posted by Packetdancer

If the issue with the NN is that people think the criteria for mentors aren't the right ones or aren't finding the appropriate mentors, then maybe the solution is to rework the criteria. But I don't think completely burning the Newbie Network and mentoring system to the ground is necessarily the best course, because then sprouts end up without anywhere they can reach out with questions if they don't happen to have a really helpful FC.

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On the one hand, I agree with you, and on the other ...

I saw three MMOs where there was no mentoring system and people asked questions and found help in world chat and in dungeons. SE tried to create a global network for helping newcomers by attracting people who like it. But something is clearly going wrong.

I know that there are good mentors and how they try, but with the expansion of the base of players there are more people who parasitize on the system. They don’t help, they farm either recommendations or a (new trend) craft mentoring for crown, and I personally now see a lot of "mentors" in the dungeons who don’t know the basic rules (don’t stay in AOE, wait until the tank pulls, kill adds as soon as possible).

I hope that in the future the SE will take measures that are not limited by the number of recommendations. The recommendations are not relevant, very subjective and do not reflect anything. People leave groups almost instantly; many of them do not pay attention to the co-players.

What I would like to see in this regard:

1. Replace the icon with something more neutral: a book, glasses, a watering can.
2. Focus on the number of completed dungeons for PVE mentors (2,000 dungeons, for example), completed role quests and completed relevant content.
3. A separate option for reporting on mentors.
4. A working blacklist that will allow you to no longer meet with these "mentors" and other bad players in the roulette groups.

The crown icon is not the problem.


1) Some people are just toxic. Having a crown or not having a crown won't change that.
2) It is too difficult for new people to get in contact with someone who may help them because the Novice Network is invite only (unless you are a returnee).


FF needs a world chat so people can get in contact with other people who may (or may not) help.


Maybe the crown system can be reworked so that you don't just need a certain number of commendations, but you CONTINUALLY need a certain number of commendations. So mentors have to keep working to keep their status. Though that would lead to commendation farming, which can be a hindrance in and of itself.

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Originally Posted by Snowdove

FF needs a world chat so people can get in contact with other people who may (or may not) help.

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Yep, or an open channel for help.

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Originally Posted by RajNish

1. Replace the icon with something more neutral: a book, glasses, a watering can.
2. Focus on the number of completed dungeons for PVE mentors (2,000 dungeons, for example), completed role quests and completed relevant content.
3. A separate option for reporting on mentors.
4. A working blacklist that will allow you to no longer meet with these "mentors" and other bad players in the roulette groups.

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Good options that will help to contain the appetite of toxic players.
Especially the "working blacklist" because, indeed, not only mentors can be toxic.

But 2,000 dungeons can you also to farm?
What do you mean by "relevant content"?

Of course, it is necessary to get rid of any icons that show "higher status."
I 'm talking about a crown and something like that.

And who is to say that only sprouts need help? Why restrict the Novice Network to only sprouts and returnees?


FF seems to go out of its way to isolate people. No method to apply to Free Companies in game, no way to talk with people in the world beyond your local area...