Counter to Elitism

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Originally Posted by KoujiGeki

It was time centered becuase you couldn't beat CoP with only a week of effort, and CoP didnt only offer a Ring, it offered a Swift belt and Soboro and other Items that were extremely useful and were hard to get that you couldnt get one first tries escepially if you had whole groups who wanted the item and your turn finally come to pop the item and it doesnt drop your lucky by the time the whole group goes if they actually stayed to help you.

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When I say "time centered reward", I mean that no matter what you do or how you play, only time will decide when you get your reward.

In fact, missions are never "time centered". The only thing required to progess is the skill to win the mission. Imagine you're doing "United We Stand" and you only randomly gain access to "To Kill a Raven" ? Pretty stupid, isn't it ?

Soboro, Swift Belt and such are only drops from several NM. It's not so different from the rest of the Rare/Ex items (with ridiculous drop rate).

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Originally Posted by SkyeWindbinder

It's "satisfying" because of the feelings of happiness that come after you win a roll and gain a very awesome drop

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It's not called "happiness" (Yeah, I got an awesome drop), it's called "end of frustration" (At last...now I can stop doing this dungeon...):p

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

It's not called "happiness" (Yeah, I got an awesome drop), it's called "end of frustration" (At last...now I can stop doing this dungeon...):p

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That definitely describes XIV's setup. Luckily, SE is making ARR so easy that Yoshi himself stated you won't ever spam a dungeon, so that means you'll most likely get what you want very quickly if not on the first 2 run through.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

It's not called "happiness" (Yeah, I got an awesome drop), it's called "end of frustration" (At last...now I can stop doing this dungeon...):p

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lol Well, it really depends on how you personally view it. I don't know about you, but I was turning cartwheels when my primal weapon dropped.

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Originally Posted by SkyeWindbinder

lol Well, it really depends on how you personally view it. I don't know about you, but I was turning cartwheels when my primal weapon dropped.

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When my Ifrit weapon dropped...oh, well...it didn't
When my Mog weapon dropped, it was a useless one for my jobs :p

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

When my Ifrit weapon dropped...oh, well...it didn't
When my Mog weapon dropped, it was a useless one for my jobs :p

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why aren't you going for a relic? Primal weapons are so 1.0. jk. but as of right now 14 is FAR to easy for 100% drop rates all the content would be blown through in a DAY. what was the fasted time for garuda 5 hrs after release? Ifrit Extreme is like the first this besides Garuda gave us a challenge. (and the times for relic AV and CC drops but we got those done actually swimmingly). Do i think that drops rates could be better? as of now? no. If i could change anything i would say what ever job you are should highly raise the item that drops like if your a war the Ifrit Axe has a higher chance of popping.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

That definitely describes XIV's setup. Luckily, SE is making ARR so easy that Yoshi himself stated you won't ever spam a dungeon, so that means you'll most likely get what you want very quickly if not on the first 2 run through.

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In either case though, you do need the dungeons to be used enough to warrant the time needed to develop them. No MMO has yet managed to make something fresh of this repetition, and it'd probably be hard to pull off, but be it through a slow token-grind or low drop rates or both every MMO has covered their dungeon-making costs in some way.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

That definitely describes XIV's setup. Luckily, SE is making ARR so easy that Yoshi himself stated you won't ever spam a dungeon, so that means you'll most likely get what you want very quickly if not on the first 2 run through.

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http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...12/563/05d.jpg
I would love to have a link to the source of this because i have yet to see Yoshi-P say ARR will be laughable easy....all he said was drop rates will be more generous and in my understanding more effort based and not random number generator,you will only have 3 "i want this" chances per week after that you will only get tokens ..where does it say a dungeon will only have 3 different drops?
And to get said drops you have to beat the dungeon first...Raven Nevermore gave earring 100% ..but did you see 100% of your server sporting it? "The Labyrinth of Bahamut" for example will be the hardest of the dungeons ..his description sounded worse than Raven Nevermore and i'm sure the rest of the raids won't be that much easier either :D

Might as well bring back HNM camping. To me FFXIV (and from I can see ARR will) has too many instances that give out gear as opposed to content that's freely open to all players that can potentially do the same. When everything is instanced, the degree of difficulty of getting gear is quite low even if the dungeon is challenging in itself. Just my opinion, but instances are best used in moderation and if they're not there needs to be something which prevents players from spamming the instance for what they want.

Pre-ARR it was not hard to fight Garuda/Ifrit/Moogle/Whatever over and over again. Dunno why people ever complain about those fights or any other content where it's instanced. Maybe since the drop rate sucked?

So yeah, instances are cool but I think SE needs to step it up beyond them if this game is to be anything besides an extremely easy whim. Basically, back up from instanced content a bit.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

It's actually totally different from the Rajas ring. Rajas/Tamas/Sattva were GUARANTEED if you finish CoP. Does that make them less deserved or less satysfying ?
When you saw someone with one of theses rings, you probably tought "Wow, this guy finished CoP, good job". When you saw someone with a HDL gear, you think "Wow...lucky guy"

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And that is exactly it. With the RNG system its luck, not accomplishment. I personally favour a system where your rewards are the result of your efforts put forth. That being both time and skill. CoP was a fantastic piece of content, and is a good example, imo.