I love beautiful animations.. but I think they're too slow for this game

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Originally Posted by Adam

This is a giant wall of text that only makes you seem like you know what you're talking about. First off you haven't put enough time in any other MMO that much is apparent. Most MMOs do not truly begin until you hit the level cap. It's the same thing in FF. Nobody cares about small NMs or AF quests as far as accomplishments go. It's all about what have you beaten, this HNM or this dungeon. Same thing in WoW you haven't raided in wow or PvP'd because the way you described it is completely wrong.

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Hardly. If you're a DPS you can faceroll a raid. That is a fact. The only ppl that feel pressure are the tank and the healer.

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Now you say it's just finger dexterity and knowing your rotation. Isn't it the same in FFXIV?

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No its not because of animation lock. You seem to forget my post was about animation lock vs no animation lock. Animation lock means that even tho you do have a rotation, you have to constantly think about when to use/stop your rotation for of being locked and countered. This mechanic exists in all competitive action games, most notably fighting games. This also means you are constantly forced to adapt your rotation as the situation changes. Your rotation for Ifrit >50% is gonna look a lot different for Ifrit <50%. This does not happen in WoW or games based on the WoW system. Why? Because you can always run away in the middle of any action you are doing; therefore, you never have to *think* about your rotation.

As far as PvP goes I would not consider WoW PvP exemplary of twitch skill combat...because gear really does own all. You are not beating anyone with gear *far* superior to yours. Period...unless you get the jump on them and they are unable to fire back. Also WoW had horrible class balance for a while as far as pvp went. I do know what im talking about.

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Originally Posted by Riaayo

So you're saying that a culture in which DDs have to move out of mechanics requires less skill than a culture where DDs don't move at all, eat damage, and have the healer hold their hand even further? The second is XI and XIV, if you did not know.

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Are you kidding? Try not moving on Ifrit and see how that works for your DDs. Have fun eating cracks/lava plumes/charges. In both games DDs have to move, thats not the point. The point is that in one game (WoW games) moving is a lot easier than in FFXI/XIV because of the whole animation lock thing. Animation lock forces you to think before you do *anything*. You do not have to do the same thinking in other games due to the fact that you can move freely at will. I will be the first to admit it is very hard to move and spam buttons at the same time. Very hard. But as I said at the bottom of my post, which BOTH of you failed to read or comprehend, is that both game types require skill, but different kinds of skill.

WoW = physical.
XI/XIV = mental

One is not automatically superior over another. I have no idea why you turned this into a WoW vs XIV debate in the first place. My point is that animation lock is a real game mechanic that exists in many games that require a high degree of skill (Street Fighter is the most notorious). Everyone saying its a problem, or a bug, or a mistake is flat out incorrect. It is an intentional game design based on how SE wants players to utilize their skills. Obviously they decided against WoW twitch combat, and focused on mental pre-planning/adaptation. WoW built its game on reflex and fast fingers, SE built their game on intelligence and forethought. Two different skill types, but skill nonethless.

The problem with WoW is that it is all overshadowed by elite gear. No matter what gear you get in XIV, you will still get pwned if you dont use your brain.

A couple points...

1. With less server and positional lag at 2.0... even if there is still animation lock... it will be a lot less deadly... and a lot less annoying
Anyone who says that it involves skill now, its a game mechanic... no.. just no... dealing with lag is temporary... having to account for lag should not be a long term mechanic of this game... its a right now.. pre-2.0 mechanic... this kind of lag/latency after 2.0 will indeed kill the game... no matter what

2. Regarding the actual animation lock, it does feel awkward. I can do a weaponskill, and then a flash, going by my chatlog and action bar... the Flash goes off even though my weaponskill animation has just started
It makes it feel weird that my animation for 1 weaponskill overlaps 2 abilities... so at that point I am backed up on animation locks... And it is dangerous when you have multiple animations queued up

I don't want animations changed, but it would be nice to not be locked so often.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

Hardly. If you're a DPS you can faceroll a raid. That is a fact. The only ppl that feel pressure are the tank and the healer.

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You have 1 battleclass at level 50 (and it's lancer), and have not finished the "current content" of FFXIV (Cutter's Cry and Aurum Vale). Also have 8 times as many forum posts as I do. I think you should play the game a bit before you argue what good and bad aspects of the game is. This game is not that much fun there is nothing more or less physical except that you either play on keyboard or controller. Mentally? You must process everything much faster on WoW in my opinion. If you disagree fine, keep telling yourself you're having fun playing FFXIV. Meanwhile i'll continue to give it an unbiased look with my personal experience on BOTH MMOs.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

Hardly. If you're a DPS you can faceroll a raid. That is a fact. The only ppl that feel pressure are the tank and the healer.



No its not because of animation lock. You seem to forget my post was about animation lock vs no animation lock. Animation lock means that even tho you do have a rotation, you have to constantly think about when to use/stop your rotation for of being locked and countered. This mechanic exists in all competitive action games, most notably fighting games. This also means you are constantly forced to adapt your rotation as the situation changes. Your rotation for Ifrit >50% is gonna look a lot different for Ifrit <50%. This does not happen in WoW or games based on the WoW system. Why? Because you can always run away in the middle of any action you are doing; therefore, you never have to *think* about your rotation.

As far as PvP goes I would not consider WoW PvP exemplary of twitch skill combat...because gear really does own all. You are not beating anyone with gear *far* superior to yours. Period...unless you get the jump on them and they are unable to fire back. Also WoW had horrible class balance for a while as far as pvp went. I do know what im talking about.



Are you kidding? Try not moving on Ifrit and see how that works for your DDs. Have fun eating cracks/lava plumes/charges. In both games DDs have to move, thats not the point. The point is that in one game (WoW games) moving is a lot easier than in FFXI/XIV because of the whole animation lock thing. Animation lock forces you to think before you do *anything*. You do not have to do the same thinking in other games due to the fact that you can move freely at will. I will be the first to admit it is very hard to move and spam buttons at the same time. Very hard. But as I said at the bottom of my post, which BOTH of you failed to read or comprehend, is that both game types require skill, but different kinds of skill.

WoW = physical.
XI/XIV = mental

One is not automatically superior over another. I have no idea why you turned this into a WoW vs XIV debate in the first place. My point is that animation lock is a real game mechanic that exists in many games that require a high degree of skill (Street Fighter is the most notorious). Everyone saying its a problem, or a bug, or a mistake is flat out incorrect. It is an intentional game design based on how SE wants players to utilize their skills. Obviously they decided against WoW twitch combat, and focused on mental pre-planning/adaptation. WoW built its game on reflex and fast fingers, SE built their game on intelligence and forethought. Two different skill types, but skill nonethless.

The problem with WoW is that it is all overshadowed by elite gear. No matter what gear you get in XIV, you will still get pwned if you dont use your brain.

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I'm sorry but you clearly have no idea what you are talking about, so I am done. You have not experienced more than 2 weeks of WoW by your own account, and you do not possess more than 1 lvl 50 class in this game, nor have you beaten any meaningful high-end or current content the game has to offer. So, you really have nothing to base your opinions on other than tiny, incomplete fractions of things you have seen. You may wish to broaden your horizons and be more objective about things in the future, because people generally don't listen to the opinions of those who are not all that educated on the subject they are discussing.

The animations in this game are better than any other MMORPG I've played - it would be a shame if they were lost just because some people aren't happy with their speed. The real problem is the way every ability in the game roots you; they need to change it so that the entire combat system is more fluid, and you don't need to kneecap the current animations to do that.

Hmm i can say with some confidence that all the people in this thread that are against making the actions shorter or dont mind animation locks are NOT tanks..

seriously, i think it should be enough that i am looking for the mob to use an attack so i can dodge.. that right there should satisfy your sense of skill..

oh but wait.. i saw the mob ready his attack.. i am trying to move.. DOE! animation lock.

and 50% of the time even if you arent in animation lock you get hit even though you ran the entire arena because you just knew you had to keep runing because of lag lol... but it didnt make a difference.. you still eat the damage.

the gameplay would be greatly enhanced if the controls were alot more responsive and if SE reconsidered what makes battles fun... besides AOE happy enemys and 30 mob zergs which then require the need to take atleast 3 blms to everything for AOE.

i hate this game lol.

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Originally Posted by Rogue

Hmm i can say with some confidence that all the people in this thread that are against making the actions shorter or dont mind animation locks are NOT tanks..

seriously, i think it should be enough that i am looking for the mob to use an attack so i can dodge.. that right there should satisfy your sense of skill..

oh but wait.. i saw the mob ready his attack.. i am trying to move.. DOE! animation lock.

and 50% of the time even if you arent in animation lock you get hit even though you ran the entire arena because you just knew you had to keep runing because of lag lol... but it didnt make a difference.. you still eat the damage.

the gameplay would be greatly enhanced if the controls were alot more responsive and if SE reconsidered what makes battles fun... besides AOE happy enemys and 30 mob zergs which then require the need to take atleast 3 blms to everything for AOE.

i hate this game lol.

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I tank a lot with warrior and don't mind animation lock whatsoever. A lot of the moves make sense. Auto attack is so you can move your placement while still doing damage. You root yourself to the ground by doing some crazy movements to do crazy damage. It's a trade and it makes sense. Over half the animations we have now would not work if we could move during the middle of them. They wouldn't look right and they would have to change them all... again.

I hope the dev team does NOT see this thread. We don't need them to make dull animations to satisfy people that don't like animation lock. The ONLY reason I see them catering to animation lock is from self buffs and that's it.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

I tank a lot with warrior and don't mind animation lock whatsoever. A lot of the moves make sense. Auto attack is so you can move your placement while still doing damage. You root yourself to the ground by doing some crazy movements to do crazy damage. It's a trade and it makes sense. Over half the animations we have now would not work if we could move during the middle of them. They wouldn't look right and they would have to change them all... again.

I hope the dev team does NOT see this thread. We don't need them to make dull animations to satisfy people that don't like animation lock. The ONLY reason I see them catering to animation lock is from self buffs and that's it.

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Sorry but i couldnt care less about shiny animations if the gameplay sucks.

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just wanted to add something- SE.. having to read the log to see what attack is coming is not very imaginative (allthough i know *some* enemys have special actions for certain attacks, but even then they arent very obvious)

there should be some sense of drama to battles, exagerate the enemy animations so people would know which way to dodge/move more instinctually by watching what the mob is doing.

just an idea

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Originally Posted by Rogue

Sorry but i couldnt care less about shiny animations if the gameplay sucks.

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LOL gameplay sucks? As in combat? I'm having fun, and so are the other countless number of people always on my server apparently. I mean with the server congestions on dungeons and the inn being broken in Ul'dah... but the gameplay sucks LOL.

I think you are mistaken lad..