[Feedback] Wuk Lamat's English Voice

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Originally Posted by Karious

Today I will remind them.
She's not very good.

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I respect the courage. Props to you lmao, you about to get hit by the "omg transphobia !!!!" brigade

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

I respect the courage. Props to you lmao, you about to get hit by the "omg transphobia !!!!" brigade

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People probably would not have called you for transphobia if you had not thrown around terms like "biological man" in your original posts.

So yeah I was bored in ff 14 and was searching forums reading this thread and had too see it for myself and I think that the English voice acting isn’t really the best. She has some really decent moments but in comparison too the jp voice and how it transmits emotion, the jp is just way better.

But she isn’t even the worst offender in English. Graha tia in English sounds super mega dead inside, like no emotions at all. I don’t know if he’s normally like this but in jpn he sounds also way better.

Which once again, is on the voice director and not the voice actors themselves. The actors need the director to tell them how the scene should be performed.

For example, here's how they dub Pokemon.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Which once again, is on the voice director and not the voice actors themselves.

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Amen to that. The actor had genuine enthusiasm going by their tweet announcement and performance(under the accent) for the character. Any other director could have easily led that into a fantastic performance, maybe it will be in Dawntrail. All the other actors seemed sluggish to the point that any of Wuk’s deliveries were much more expressive/lively than the rest imo. Projecting myself as the voice director, budgeting session time at the curtail of endwalker patches. I can vaguely believe it to sound like a foreigner struggling to speak the off-land tongue. Tural’s language is described a melting pot, but that doesn’t make someone verbally fluent in other languages with no practice(her older miqote brother is in academics), tonality will be hindered when communicating. So, I see her quick to the point talking in the introduction to be in character and fitting. Transfuse that into the narrative foil of her playing up an overact of confidence and I could see the nuance/motive of the choice and delivery. And I would like to see that further explored by the actress in the expansion.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Which once again, is on the voice director and not the voice actors themselves. The actors need the director to tell them how the scene should be performed.

For example, here's how they dub Pokemon.

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The same voice director that told Emet, Vauthry and Elidibus to give fantastic performances told Sena 'Just sound like crap and they'll blame it on me'. Lmao.

If only there was some well known, widespread, or otherwise credible majority backlash and/or data on negative reception that made the opinion "it was bad" worth considering for more than a few moments.

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Originally Posted by Karious

The same voice director that told Emet, Vauthry and Elidibus to give fantastic performances told Sena 'Just sound like crap and they'll blame it on me'. Lmao.

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Yes. Bad direction will make even the best actors sound/look bad. Let's use Shantotto as an example. Candi Milo has been Shantotto's voice actor ever since Dissidia on the PSP and even voices her in World of Final Fantasy. Her voice was fantastic in those games... and then for whatever reason, in Dissidia NT, I can only assume the director wanted her voice to match the Japanese voice (higher pitched), despite her voice being perfectly fine in the previous games.

Then there's also the Vanille situation where the director wanted Georgia van Cuylenburg to match the Japanese voice, rather than "Americanise" like the other voice actors, but we already went over that... either in this thread, or one of the other ones.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

If only there was some well known, widespread, or otherwise credible majority backlash and/or data on negative reception that made the opinion "it was bad" worth considering for more than a few moments.

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Show me the data that everyone loves it.

to emphasize how much voice direction matters, I want to bring up the fact that a lot of the VAs from ARR are actually pretty experienced and talented people. Sam Riegel, Alphinaud's old voice and the one that people seem to criticize the most, actually has quite the history with voice acting in JRPG/anime games (some of you may recognize him as Teddie from Persona 4, Silabus from .hack or Ky Kiske in GG Xrd) going far back before XIV.

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Originally Posted by LynxDubh

People probably would not have called you for transphobia if you had not thrown around terms like "biological man" in your original posts.

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So a trans woman is not a biological man ?

What were they then ? Please do enlighten me

The issue is that you're delegitimising trans people by saying they are biologically X. That's why you're being called transphobic.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

The issue is that you're delegitimising trans people by saying they are biologically X. That's why you're being called transphobic.

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I am calling them trans women or trans men, I have done so through the entire thread. They are trans. (And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that, whatever makes them happy)

And yet...

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

So a trans woman is not a biological man ?

What were they then ? Please do enlighten me

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I'm just explaining the why you're being called transphobic. If you don't want to be labelled as such, then maybe don't say those kind of things.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

And yet...



I'm just explaining the why you're being called transphobic. If you don't want to be labelled as such, then maybe don't say those kind of things.

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So you want me to basically lie ? Lol

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

I don't think you understand what Twitter has become lol.

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Twitter is a 10k gallon pool filled with a brown runny substance. Words that are far to kind for twitter since the truth could earn a forum vacation. It the substance your thinking and more. Take note of the flames, bubbling and a smell so unique and revolting, you ask how can anyone swim in this. Yet twitter users do it on a daily basis..

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

So you want me to basically lie ? Lol

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Then you can't complain if people call you transphobic. Simple as that :T

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Then you can't complain if people call you transphobic :T

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If saying the truth makes me transphobic according to this forum, so be it I guess ? Lol

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

So a trans woman is not a biological man ?

What were they then ? Please do enlighten me

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The term "biological man/woman" is commonly used by hate groups as a derogatory term. It uses the rhetoric of "science" to justify discrimination and demonization of trans people. To say it's a heavily loaded phrase is an understatement.

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Originally Posted by LynxDubh

The term "biological man/woman" is commonly used by hate groups as a derogatory term. It uses the rhetoric of "science" to justify discrimination and demonization of trans people. To say it's a heavily loaded phrase is an understatement.

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That's a you problem, not mine, the only thing I mentioned is that they were originally the other sex. And they transitioned, which makes them trans + their new gender.

It's really that simple.

There is literally 0 transphobia in that, if you see transphobia in it, that's on you.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

That's a you problem, not mine, the only thing I mentioned is that they were originally the other sex. And they transitioned, which makes them trans + their new gender.

It's really that simple.

There is literally 0 transphobia in that, if you see transphobia in it, that's on you.

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Not only it is loaded, it is just objectively wrong. Biologically speaking, there isn't a single person, animal, plant, entity on this planet and beyond that is a man or a woman -- These are genders, and by themselves, they aren't biological as they have nothing to do with biology. Sex and gender are two separate things, and neither of these are aboslute. So, actually, it is a you problem.

I'll be crystal clear about this: the VA, her gender and everything else about them personally, has nothing to do with the subject at hand. For the love of all that is good, please, stay on topic.

I did watch a lot of the cutscenes with the english dub, and to be honest, her voice didn't sound particularly odd to me. On the contrary, I feel like it goes really well with the rest of the english cast. Her accent sounds pretty different from, say, Alphinaud. And that's a great thing, I like having a more diverse range of voices in the game.

This is more aimed at SE than anything, but if you're going to have a south american inspired expansion, please, hire some south americans. That would've been a better look for a lot of people, but I am content with EN Wuk Lamat atm.

COME TO TURAL

I think that Wuk Lamat and the VA have been absolutely fantastic so far, and it's quite pleasant to get a character without having to deal with any of the "Hidalgo why dost thou protest so, let us away!" - speak that plagues FFXIV.

Amazing that this thread has 39 comments. Does this forum even have moderators?

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Originally Posted by PorxiesRCute

Amazing that this thread has 39 comments. Does this forum even have moderators?

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Why do you want the thread removed? I'd just make a new one. People need to know that not everyone is happy!

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Originally Posted by Kalaam

A lot of complaints seems to be related to her identity tho'.

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That's tells me you're specifically looking for them. There have been hundreds of comments on this and out of all of them, maybe a handful of comments on it from trolls.

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Originally Posted by Doragan

Sex and gender are two separate things, and neither of these are aboslute

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Saying sex isn't absolute is inherently anti-science.

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For the love of all that is good, please, stay on topic.

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After you attempt to get your last word in? No.

Edit: for clarity, I have no clue what the context of this argument is and I don't care. You can support trans and not refuse to acknowledge facts, likewise you can support trans and still criticize their work because being something should not make you immune to criticism. That creates an unhealthy environment for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

That's a you problem, not mine, the only thing I mentioned is that they were originally the other sex. And they transitioned, which makes them trans + their new gender.

It's really that simple.

There is literally 0 transphobia in that, if you see transphobia in it, that's on you.

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I personally don't think you were intentionally being transphobic. I just think you have a poor attitude and are speaking from a place of ignorance. All I want to stress to you is that people could assume much worse of you based on your language.

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Originally Posted by LynxDubh

I personally don't think you were intentionally being transphobic. I just think you have a poor attitude and are speaking from a place of ignorance. All I want to stress to you is that people could assume much worse of you based on your language.

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You all throw the Xphobic or Xphobe around so much, no one really cares anymore. Stormpeaks explained the comment and keeps getting attacked, if you want to assume something about someone it's looking worse for you and the other like minded people.

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

You all throw the Xphobic or Xphobe around so much, no one really cares anymore. Stormpeaks explained the comment and keeps getting attacked, if you want to assume something about someone it's looking worse for you and the other like minded people.

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Can you knock it off with the tribalistic drivel? You keep trying to spin this towards an us vs. them narrative. It's clear that you're only on this thread to bring others into your camp.

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Originally Posted by LynxDubh

Can you knock it off with the tribalistic drivel? You keep trying to spin this towards an us vs. them narrative. It's clear that you're only on this thread to bring others into your camp.

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"Can you stop defending the person I disagree with ? You have to agree with me"

At least be honest in your post.

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Originally Posted by LynxDubh

Can you knock it off with the tribalistic drivel? You keep trying to spin this towards an us vs. them narrative. It's clear that you're only on this thread to bring others into your camp.

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I don't have a camp, I'm only pointing out the nonsense.

Now you verbally lash out at me as well, considering your previous comments, should I start to assume the worst about you now?

Could we please quit attacking each other and keep on topic?

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

I don't have a camp, I'm only pointing out the nonsense.

Now you verbally lash out at me as well, considering your previous comments, should I start to assume the worst about you now?

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"No u"

Anyway, to cap off with my take: The voice direction of this patch seemed to be the overall problem as stated before. The cast in whole seemed to have a few off moments and came off a bit wooden overall.

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Originally Posted by LynxDubh

"No u"

Anyway, to cap off with my take: The voice direction of this patch seemed to be the overall problem as stated before. The cast in whole seemed to have a few off moments and came off a bit wooden overall.

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She would have been fine without the accent.

I work with a ton of people from the Central and South American, her accent is extremely grating to me, especially with how inconsistent it is.

Agreed, my friends from Brazil were very disappointed in the dubbing.

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Originally Posted by Karious

Show me the data that everyone loves it.

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The burden of proof is not on me because I did not make a claim as such. Sena being good is the default, or it may as well be, because as long as she is in the role.with her voice it is the same difference. You and others seem to have to the intention of having this person ousted. How do you anticipate you will achieve this goal when there is no notable backlash occurring from anyone in the industry or even at a consumer level? No one cares about her tweets either, not because of transphobia claims but because she didn't say a lie or otherwise do anything problematic. She listed roles, not actors, that aren't played by trans people on a day of trans visibility. Asking someone to resign and asking studios to do better is not illegal.

I've also seen the usual suspects arguing this thread's activity is evidence-- seriously? First of all humans are wired for negativity bias and forum threads, by extension, are way more likely to attract attention when they're critical / negative. This is not somethting that only apllies to Sena or this forum. Secondly despite this, I have a single post praising the performance that has almost as many likes as the OP of the thread. So I'm very comfortable saying the thread proves very little, if anything.

And with respect to your friends, thank them for their feedback but Wuk Lamat is not a Brazilian. She's from Tural.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

That's a you problem, not mine, the only thing I mentioned is that they were originally the other sex. And they transitioned, which makes them trans + their new gender.

It's really that simple.

There is literally 0 transphobia in that, if you see transphobia in it, that's on you.

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And you can explain all you want. Really all you should do is apologise and claim ignorance. Saying what you said is equivalent to introducing a gay man as someone who used to be straight. I can think of worse racially oriented examples but I won't bother. What you said is disrespectful, irrespective of if it being a fact. I'm a huge fan of truth and facts, how you apply them matters. No one was asking how Sena was born.

Overall a lot of the attitude toward trans people ITT in general is very much giving "ugh they're always complaining" during the Civil rights movement.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

The burden of proof is not on me because I did not make a claim as such. Sena being good is the default, or it may as well be, because as long as she is in the role.with her voice it is the same difference. (snip rambling)

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The proof is in the fact that complaints grossly outnumber praise. Although I see you try to dismiss that evidence because you can't refute it.

You're being disingenuous with using the term "ousted", of which hardly anyone here has called for her to be replaced. Why would anyone in the VA industry bother to complain about her performance and are you aware of who the consumers are? The consumers are complaining in this very thread, lol.

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No one cares about her tweets either, not because of transphobia claims but because she didn't say a lie or otherwise do anything problematic. She listed roles, not actors, that aren't played by trans people on a day of trans visibility.

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This is a lie, she specifically said those roles should go to trans VA while also grossly mislabeling characters as trans in the process, her tweets were rightfully called out because of the double standard that she herself set.

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I've also seen the usual suspects arguing this thread's activity is evidence-- seriously? First of all humans are wired for negativity bias and forum threads, by extension, are way more likely to attract attention when they're critical / negative..

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If you're going to attempt to dismiss criticism then I can dismiss praise as just people who are being blindly tribal. You can't claim you're here to genuinely discuss the topic and then at the same time, try to dismiss the entire thing with something as childish as "well people complain more".

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Secondly despite this, I have a single post praising the performance that has almost as many likes as the OP of the thread. So I'm very comfortable saying the thread proves very little, if anything.

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On page 3 while the thread was still fresh. If we take likes at face value like you would prefer, then the majority of people do not like the voice.

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And with respect to your friends, thank them for their feedback but Wuk Lamat is not a Brazilian. She's from Tural.

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With an accent based in reality. Did you also think ARR voice acting was good because "they're from Eorzea"?

Despite breaking down your aimless ramblings, it's clear you're not here to discuss anything, you're here to dismiss and attack people because you don't have any real praise to bring the table in regards to the voice.

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

The proof is in the fact that complaints grossly outnumber praise.

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Source: your backside.

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

The consumers are complaining in this very thread, lol.

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Not enough of them to affect change.

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

This is a lie, she specifically said those roles should go to trans VA while also grossly mislabeling characters as trans in the process, her tweets were rightfully called out because of the double standard that she herself

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That isn't a lie, that's just a detail I did not mention. Calling for trans VA to take on roles is not illegal or problematic. Also there's no double standard. No one is saying all trans roles must be trans actors. Sena was calling for more trans visibility in the space. That's not a problem and doesn't create any standard.

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

You can't claim you're here to genuinely discuss the topic and then at the same time, try to dismiss the entire thing with something as childish as "well people complain more".

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What is with this forum and "so ur just gonna dismiss my opinion", "so that's what you call it when I say something wrong?". Having an opinion does not mean other opinions do not exist. You have an opinion, it just isn't going anywhere. It's not gaining traction by any objective metric. As far as negativity bias, sorry but I'm right and the number of pages ITT vs a positive one means nothing. Also there may be the same 4 people or so keeping the thread going "I will remind them again it was bad", but again there is just no coverage of this criticism anywhere, no developer statements, no one in voice acting commenting, etc. If the performance was that bad or the VA was that evil I think we would be hearing something more loudly.

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

page 3 while the thread was still fresh.

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That doesn't mean anything.

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Originally Posted by Troxbark

an accent based in reality. Did you also think ARR voice acting was good because "they're from Eorzea"?

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ARR VA was universally bad. It was the direction. So is her accent a real accent or not? You guys flip flop like tuna on this subject. Which real accent is it?

If you don't want her ousted then js your ultimate goal to let us know you don't like the VA? If so ignore my ramblings I should have said "See you in DawnTrail lol". But also consider my post isn't addressed to you, not all of its content applies to you, etc. In fact the only part of it that really does is the comment on negativity bias. As a general note, I can always tell when my post has triggered someone. It's all the quotes. Like...why. another random thought is that I didn't even call anyone a transphobe but there's still a huge problem and apparently it's the fact that I'm pointing out Sena being terminated seems unlikely.

Of course there's not going to be any developer response. This is an English forum. The English mods, if they even read these posts are going to go "lol they're being problematic again" and just tell the Japanese side that everything is fine and that everyone LOVES what the English dubbing. As a consumer your opinion literally doesn't matter because people higher up hold the power.