Do something about the AH and lower level gear????

[Sparthos]

No one thinks that they will be low level forever. It's simply a matter of enjoying the experience as you go and maximizing your character's ability as you progress.

Thinking FFXI will be around forever and spending a ton of time on any gear is short sighted ;o


I know it hurts to lose all of that free EXP, but raising the cap on Abyssea to 76 would go a long way in fixing this problem.

Forward ever, backward never.

The cat is out of the bag, the horses have bolted, the rubicon has been crossed and there is no going back. If SE pulls an "Abyssea is for 70+ only", people will quit because frankly setting up a grind as a roadblock for content already beaten to death is silly.

SE took a gamble on Abyssea and this is one of the unintended (?) consequences. Either SE can create low/midlevel content of challenge, completely leave pre75 content to rot or somehow through a high level content involve the AH more readily.

Either way, the solution is never to take away something that wasn't an exploit to begin with.

[Selzak]

Forward ever, backward never.

The cat is out of the bag, the horses have bolted, the rubicon has been crossed and there is no going back. If SE pulls an "Abyssea is for 70+ only", people will quit because frankly setting up a grind as a roadblock for content already beaten to death is silly.

SE took a gamble on Abyssea and this is one of the unintended (?) consequences. Either SE can create low/midlevel content of challenge, completely leave pre75 content to rot or somehow through a high level content involve the AH more readily.

Either way, the solution is never to take away something that wasn't an exploit to begin with.

I guess you haven't been around long enough to see half of the jobs on the game be nerfed at some point?

While I agree that there would be some backlash (I've taken advantage of Abyssea leeching myself, especially for subs), I think that the overall balance of the game has been damaged far too much to just count our losses. This is different because it effects everyone and not a single job, but the game's history does include comparable situations that at least provide some insight into how big the impact would be.

Taking Abyssea away completely, yeah that would cause a lot of harm. Taking away the ability to readily leech a job from 30-90 would only upset people who already take this game so seriously that they probably wouldn't quit anyway. At the end of the day, the game would be much better off if it was structured so that people actually play in parties for the bulk of a job's progression again.

You do bring up a good point when you talk about content that has already been beaten to death, and this is why more needs to be done (ontop of raising the cap on Abyssea) to revamp but not eliminate the traditional experience. Whether that is incentive based, new content, or all of the above...people need reasons to do it. The EXP boost was great, but not quite enough.

[RAIST]

http://www.ffxiah.com/browse/2/daggers

Okay let's say you are a level 40 dancer... on catsith... Which dagger are you going to buy? There isn't a single dagger for sale on the AH between level 31 and level 43. You already have the BEST level 25 daggers... but you are out there trying to solo - and it is getting really hard cause your level 25 daggers don't do so well against level 40 prey...

How can anyone argue this isn't a problem?

Thank you, an example we can discuss.

You have the Best 25 daggers... would that be the upgraded CP item?

Federation Knife - 13 dmg, 180 delay, 2 ACC, 5 Attack (4.33 DPS)
Crafted as HQ synth, Smithing (26): Fire Crystal, Merc. Knife (2000 CP, Rank2 Windy), Iron Ingot


Simpler options:

lvl 30 Merc. Capt. Kukri (4000CP , Windy Rank2): 13 dmg, 194 delay, 3 ACC (4.02 DPS)

lvl 31 Mythril Knife: 12 damage, 195 delay (HQ is 13 dmg, 190 delay) (3.69/4.11 DPS)
Smithing(34): Fire crystal, Mythril Ingot, Chestnut Lumber
Estimated cost to synth: @10k if mats from AH, less if some farmed/crafted
NPC sells for @ 14,500 in Upper Jueno (Coumuna)

lvl 34 Mythril Kukri: 14 dmg, 200 delay (HQ is 15 dmg, 194 delay) (4.20/4.64 DPS)
Smithing (42): fire crystal, Mythril Ingot, Oak Lumber, Raptor skin
Estimated cost to synth: @ 11k if mats from AH, less if some are farmed/crafted.

lvl 34 Wind. or Fed. Kukri: 14 dmg, 188 delay, 3 ACC, 5ATT outside nation control
(HQ is 15 dmg, 182 delay, 3 ACC, 7ATT ouside nation control)(4.47/4.95DPS)
Smithing (38): Merc. Capt. Kukri, Steel Ingot
Estimate cost to synth: @4100 if kukri bought with CP(20k gil from AH), rest from AH

There are more advanced synths also with harder to obtain mats, or requiring additional synths to complete. Here is one example:

lvl 30 Thug's Jambiya: 13 delay, 210 delay, 1 dex (hq: 14 dmg, 194 delay, 2 dex)(3.88/4.33 DPS)
requires 3 crafts to make, mats run about 22k on Caitsyth, but can be farmed/crafted for less

There are also things like Archers Knife and Chiroptera dagger that can be farmed.

Most of these knifes are close in ther DPS ratings. Only 3 exceed your current weapon, one of which sacrifices your ACC/ATT bonus and requires an HQ synth to make. The only guaranteed improvemnt is to get the level 30 CP item and have it crafted to the level 34 Wind/Fed Kukri. This is an easy synth to get someone to do if you can get the mats to send, but you are looking at spending upwards of 4k per knife for less than a 10% increase in DPS.

Which begs the question, is it worth it to you to upgrade now, or wait to hit 46 and invest in the bone knives (which btw you might actually get for free while leveling):

lvl 46 bone Knife: 17 dmg, 195 delay, (light -5), 3 ACC, 3 ATT (523 DPS)
(HQ is 18 dmg, 190 delay, (light 05), 5 ACC, 5 ATT (568 DPS)
Bonecraft (41): wind crystal, Walnut Lumber, Giant Femur
Estimated cost on caitsyth: @1800 if mats from AH
***can also appear in chest in Xarcabard and W. Altepa Desert***

tldr: there is a CP knife that can easily be upgraded for as low as 4k on your server if you can get the mats and the knife. Otherwise, almost every other dagger available to you until 46 is on par or lower DPS rthan your current weapon. The dagger at 46 can be obtained while you are leveling in W. Altepa for free, or you can easily get it crafted for around 2k worth of mats on your server.

[Selzak]

Thank you, an example we can discuss.

You have the Best 25 daggers... would that be the upgraded CP item?

Federation Knife - 13 dmg, 180 delay, 2 ACC, 5 Attack (4.33 DPS)
Crafted as HQ synth, Smithing (26): Fire Crystal, Merc. Knife (2000 CP, Rank2 Windy), Iron Ingot


Simpler options:

lvl 30 Merc. Capt. Kukri (4000CP , Windy Rank2): 13 dmg, 194 delay, 3 ACC (4.02 DPS)

lvl 31 Mythril Knife: 12 damage, 195 delay (HQ is 13 dmg, 190 delay) (3.69/4.11 DPS)
Smithing(34): Fire crystal, Mythril Ingot, Chestnut Lumber
Estimated cost to synth: @10k if mats from AH, less if some farmed/crafted
NPC sells for @ 14,500 in Upper Jueno (Coumuna)

lvl 34 Mythril Kukri: 14 dmg, 200 delay (HQ is 15 dmg, 194 delay) (4.20/4.64 DPS)
Smithing (42): fire crystal, Mythril Ingot, Oak Lumber, Raptor skin
Estimated cost to synth: @ 11k if mats from AH, less if some are farmed/crafted.

lvl 34 Wind. or Fed. Kukri: 14 dmg, 188 delay, 3 ACC, 5ATT outside nation control (4.47/4.95DPS)
(HQ is 15 dmg, 182 delay, 3 ACC, 7ATT ouside nation control)
Smithing (38): Merc. Capt. Kukri, Steel Ingot
Estimate cost to synth: @4100 if kukri bought with CP(20k gil from AH), rest from AH

There are more advanced synths also with harder to obtain mats, or requiring additional synths to complete. Here is one example:

lvl 30 Thug's Jambiya: 13 delay, 210 delay, 1 dex (hq: 14 dmg, 194 delay, 2 dex)(3.88/4.33 DPS)
requires 3 crafts to make, mats run about 22k on Caitsyth, but can be farmed/crafted for less

There are also things like Archers Knife and Chiroptera dagger that can be farmed.

Most of these knifes are close in ther DPS ratings. Only 3 exceed your current weapon, one of which sacrifices your ACC/ATT bonus and requires an HQ synth to make. The only guaranteed improvemnt is to get the level 30 CP item and have it crafted to the level 34 Wind/Fed Kukri. This is an easy synth to get someone to do if you can get the mats to send, but you are looking at spending upwards of 4k per knife for less than a 10% increase in DPS.

Which begs the question, is it worth it to you to upgrade now, or wait to hit 46 and invest in the bone knives (which btw you might actually get for free while leveling):
lvl 46 bone Knife: 17 dmg, 195 delay, (light -5), 3 ACC, 3 ATT (523 DPS)
(HQ is 18 dmg, 190 delay, (light 05), 5 ACC, 5 ATT (568 DPS)
Bonecraft (41): wind crystal, Walnut Lumber, Giant Femur
Estimated cost on caitsyth: @1800 if mats from AH
***can also appear in chest in Xarcabard and W. Altepa Desert***

...Are you saying that because something is obtainable in the game, that the AH is irrelevant? You could make that argument about absolutely every item in the game that can be sold, and all you'd really be saying is that it's no biggie if the game's economy is dead- just go farm, make, camp, CP everything yourself!

Are players (especially new players) expected to have a 40+ craft before their first job is level 40, or switch nations just to get a new weapon for the next few levels?

[Olor]

Are players (especially new players) expected to have a 40+ craft before their first job is level 40, or switch nations just to get a new weapon for the next few levels?

Thank you... so much.

I mean seriously. Yes, these things are technically obtainable - but gimme a break. Most players don't want to spend their first month on an MMO farming/crafting.

I hope SE doesn't listen to people who claim new players that don't want to level every craft to 60 before leveling up their character are just lazy - or this game is gonna die fast.

[blowfin]

All the examples in the world of how to acquire items arent going to change the fact the the Auction Houses are empty.

[Olor]

All the examples in the world of how to acquire items arent going to change the fact the the Auction Houses are empty.

No, no no... According to RAIST people should just level Smithing to 30+ in order to get a knife... nevermind that the materials to level the smithing are probably not very affordable/available. If someone doesn't want to spend 100K leveling a craft so they can have a knife over lvl 25 to solo with... they are lazy!

And then when someone wants some level 30-40 gears to go with that knife they should go level clothcraft and leatherworking to do so... as well.

Yeah. I mean come on. That's just not reasonable. The learning curve in XI is steep enough - having no gear on the auction house drives away new players.

[RAIST]

...Are you saying that because something is obtainable in the game, that the AH is irrelevant? You could make that argument about absolutely every item in the game that can be sold, and all you'd really be saying is that it's no biggie if the game's economy is dead- just go farm, make, camp, CP everything yourself!

Are players (especially new players) expected to have a 40+ craft before their first job is level 40, or switch nations just to get a new weapon for the next few levels?

No, no no... According to RAIST people should just level Smithing to 30+ in order to get a knife... nevermind that the materials to level the smithing are probably not very affordable/available. If someone doesn't want to spend 100K leveling a craft so they can have a knife over lvl 25 to solo with... they are lazy!

And then when someone wants some level 30-40 gears to go with that knife they should go level clothcraft and leatherworking to do so... as well.

Yeah. I mean come on. That's just not reasonable. The learning curve in XI is steep enough - having no gear on the auction house drives away new players.

Where did I say that HE had to craft it? I said the he could GET it crafted. Have you never seen shouts for crafting assistance? Has no one in your LS ever asked if someone can craft something for them? Did you not even see that I stated that it is an easy synth to get someone to help you with? Here... let me point it out for you:

Most of these knifes are close in ther DPS ratings. Only 3 exceed your current weapon, one of which sacrifices your ACC/ATT bonus and requires an HQ synth to make. The only guaranteed improvemnt is to get the level 30 CP item and have it crafted to the level 34 Wind/Fed Kukri. This is an easy synth to get someone to do if you can get the mats to send, but you are looking at spending upwards of 4k per knife for less than a 10% increase in DPS.

and, btw, I never said the AH was irrelevant. In fact... in that post it is VERY relevant, as for each recipe I quoted estimations for BUYING THE MATS ON CAITSITH'S AH. The point is the AH is not the ONLY WAY TO ACGUIRE GEAR. It dind't even take me 10 minutes to pull up all that information, only needed 2 links:

http://www.ffxiah.com/browse/2/daggers
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/dyn/items/job19.html

[Selzak]

Where did I say that HE had to craft it? I said the he could GET it crafted. Have you never seen shouts for crafting assistance? Has no one in your LS ever asked if someone can craft something for them? Did you not even see that I stated that it is an easy synth to get someone to help you with? Here... let me point it out for you:



and, btw, I never said the AH was irrelevant. In fact... in that post it is VERY relevant, as for each recipe I quoted estimations for BUYING THE MATS ON CAITSITH'S AH. The point is the AH is not the ONLY WAY TO ACGUIRE GEAR. It dind't even take me 10 minutes to pull up all that information, only needed 2 links:

http://www.ffxiah.com/browse/2/daggers
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/dyn/items/job19.html

Who's arguing that the AH is the only way to acquire gear?

Btw thanks for pointing something out that was contextually pointed to only one of your examples. How about this one that was posted first:

lvl 34 Mythril Kukri: 14 dmg, 200 delay (HQ is 15 dmg, 194 delay) (4.20/4.64 DPS)
Smithing (42): fire crystal, Mythril Ingot, Oak Lumber, Raptor skin
Estimated cost to synth: @ 11k if mats from AH, less if some are farmed/crafted.

...or any of the others, really? It's odd that you'd mention it specifically for one random example if you meant to imply it for all of them.

Even if you did mean to imply that we should have all of them synthed, it's still only noting that items are obtainable (in a way that is much less direct than the system that players are meant to exchange items through but is currently bare).

I don't think anyone here was asking how to obtain the items that aren't on the AH. The issue is that in a healthy economy many of those items should be there and that you shouldn't have to jump through hoops (this includes /shouting for someone who's high enough in a particular craft and who might be willing to use the materials that you looked up online to build your level 32 dagger).

[blowfin]

The point is the AH is not the ONLY WAY TO ACGUIRE GEAR.

The point is that if the AH had decent stock levels, it's a far more efficient and convenient way to get your gear than crafting it yourself or having someone else craft it for you. I'm sure people are well aware that there are other means of getting gear. You're pretty much insulting people's intelligence by repeatedly implying they don't know you can craft weapons and armor.