Game/Job balance suggestions

[Zeldar]

No no Rooj, you don't get the point ! They don't want to bring mages, especially RED mages ! They want to do it all as nothing but a bunch of DDs and MAYBE a WHM !! Come on man, don't make them silence a mob, just make the mob not cast at all... While you're at it, how about the mob not use TP moves. You know what, I have a solution that will make them happy : how about the mob just stands there and does nothing....THAT will make for a fun game !!!!!!!!!!

[Zeldar]

I of course say this with sarcasm, but this is the direction the community is slowly moving towards. Every time something is a tiny bit difficult, people cry . So SE dumbs down our beloved game for people that cry all the time, then guess what? ITS STILL NOT ENOUGH!!!!!! So what happens? They cry some more. I mean come on, they are already making it so you won't need so much accuracy, which is silly in my opinion. "Oh , I want to fight mobs that are 20 levels higher than me, but I expect to hit with every swing in my capped haste and multi-hit gear. Make it so I don't need an accuracy set at all. Put a ton of accuracy on ALL of my gear, OK?" Then they announce that they are looking into the amount of damage that mobs do with AoE attacks so that melees can play again. Man, thats a godsend, but is it enough for the community? NO... they now want the mobs to stop enfeebling them too. Whats next, PLDs want Ochain and Aegis to be synergized together so they dont need to swap? WAR want a weapon that deals all forms of damage so they won't have to swap? Is your own TP gain rate enough for you? Probably not, so how about they raise your TP per hit to 250? I mean seriously people....do you want new battle content, or do you want them to spend all of their resources making this game so easy that its boring?

[Mookies75]

Which enfeeble spam is way out of hand? On the NMs I've fought on THF or BLU, its really a matter of my WHM getting rid of the ailment in a timely manner. Its part of the game. Yeah being slowed sucks. Being paralyzed sucks. Being poisoned and bio'd sucks. Having a great WHM that knows what he is doing fixes all of these things.

You're missing the point. The problem is that these potent debuffs have near 100% uptime. So even if they were to be removed, they would go right back up. That is essentially a flat nerf for all melee, some affected worse than others, and it is the MAIN issue melee are having right now besides getting one shot by TP spam.

You have mobs that spam stunga via spell or tp move, mobs that spam aoe stat down, aoe petrify, POTENT aoe paralyze (to the point where it takes 30 attempts to use a remedy), sleepgas, 100% uptime encumberance, 100% uptime amnesia, doomga, aoe curse, aoe status drains, etc, etc, etc. And on top of that, this is not a problem that is limited to high tier content. Even HTBF, or content that is solable for gearing purposes, suffers from the same poorly thought out difficulty increase techniques. Do you even play this game? You should know all of this if so. I feel like you're just trolling people here.

If you're going to sit there and say being slow3'd for the duration of a fight doesn't matter, then you might as well go into the fight naked. And again, I want to make sure this is very clear, the problem is the near immediate re-application of said debuffs and the near 100% uptime they have.

And this is not just a problem in group play. People who choose to, or are forced to, Solo, are heavily affected by these poor design choices. And at a point of this games life where soloing is being more and more encouraged, something needs to be done to address the fact that these negative status effects are way too harsh for EVERYONE. I'm not saying make the game easier, I'm saying stop making it unfair and cheesy.

[Zeldar]

You are being overly dramatic. Yes, some mobs can be spammy. Its the equivalent of them having an aura. Mobs in the game have doom , paralyze, and slow auras. Some have perma-spikes that cannot be removed, which have added effects of paralyze, stun, hp drain, even death. YOU are not getting the point of the game obviously: these effects were put there to add a level of difficulty ! They aren't making DDs unplayable, they are making them interesting. OK, so I get the point that this mechanic does make some groups choose a ranged approach over an up close and personal approach. A. strategy is part of the game, and B. an unwillingness to overcome obstacles is the fault of the group of players in question, not the game mechanics. If you love WAR and your group doesn't allow you to play it, find another group that suits your playstyle. Find a WHM with a Yagrush ( yes, its a difficult to obtain END GAME weapon, but arent we talking about END GAME content?).

[Zeldar]

I guess maybe I don't get it. Maybe thats because I play with a group of players that are good at what they do and enjoy a degree of difficulty. As most of them will bluntly say, and what I've been holding off saying is: if you are having this many problems, your solution is GET GOOD.

[OmnysValefor]

Working around these things is a part of a melee's job, just as working around removing them from you is a WHMs job. Avoiding them is a mages job. There are mechanics on mobs that make mages useless as well?

That used to be acceptable thinking when mages didn't have infinite MP. In 75 era, no matter how far a BLM outgeared the content, mp was still an issue. It no longer is between /convert, Myrkr, 3 tiers of aspir, BLM AF Body or the Meebles version that some people use, various sources of refresh, frequently temps, plentiful refresh on gear (Remember when your refresh set was ... vermy cloak?)

If the boss isn't harshly resistant to magic damage, there is no reason to favor melee over mages. Frequently, not always, magic bursting kills the boss faster, especially if it's something that is dead before the sch runs out of strats. If you incorporate the tank into closing skillchains when they can, this is very easy to achieve.

I guess maybe I don't get it. Maybe thats because I play with a group of players that are good at what they do and enjoy a degree of difficulty. As most of them will bluntly say, and what I've been holding off saying is: if you are having this many problems, your solution is GET GOOD.

I play with a group of people that are good at what they do and enjoy clearing difficult content. We don't bring suboptimal solutions because it's just inferior. Killing faster / more intelligently / safer is just smarter. I enjoy playing PLD but I'll get on another job if it better accommodates the group.

I loathe this line of thought that if people do it differently than you, they're somehow "not good".

[Shyles]

I guess maybe I don't get it. Maybe thats because I play with a group of players that are good at what they do and enjoy a degree of difficulty. As most of them will bluntly say, and what I've been holding off saying is: if you are having this many problems, your solution is GET GOOD.

The problem, Zeldar, is that what you're suggesting about going to find a Yagrush WHM is impractical in the current metagame. On this topic, Selindrile is right, and the majority of people follow the path of least resistance. To explain, let's imagine any one of the powerful endgame NMs with cornucopias of Status effects and heavy AoE damage. Yes, an excellent WHM/SCH with Yagrush that is on-point with status removals is almost a necessity if using melee jobs in the alliance. But they're not needed at all for Mage Burns. So why would one bother hunting down an exceptionally capable white mage that can keep melees alive, when they can get any random white mage, or even a whm trust, to heal for a mage-only alliance?

And please don't assume everyone here is lobbying to make the game easier. We're not. The people you are calling whiny and dramatic are pointing out major imbalances. I like challenges as much as you do, but I don't like it when there are glaring imbalances that outright discourage participation of entire job types. You were mocking people's complaints about accuracy... If a melee player has low accuracy, they miss and deal 0 damage. They also gain no TP so they can't skillchain. Magic damage always hits. It's why Scholars can skill chain so consistently on the hardest bosses. So if someone wanted to kill Schah, why would anyone bother with melee jobs when they can just go with the safe, consistent mage job?

Lastly, Monster TP gains are indeed very imbalanced in the current metagame. Magic spells feed a flat 10 TP per spell, but Melee hits Feed TP based on weapon delay. With how fast we're hitting now, subtle blow makes very little difference anymore. We feed TP to the NM very very fast while mages feed next to nothing. It literally makes taking a melee a liability for the alliance, because it will make the fight harder and more dangerous for everyone. So again, why would you take a melee to Schah?

Fixing these things won't necessarily make the game easier. It will balance the playing field. It might let people feel better about bringing their Dark Knight friend to a tough fight. It makes the game more enjoyable for more than a select few. So please don't patronize people and tell them to "Get Good". I think they're really good at their jobs, but are frustrated that their jobs aren't competitive in the current metagame. It's unfortunate that you don't understand that.

[Rooj]

I play with a group of people that are good at what they do and enjoy clearing difficult content.

How can you call if difficult content if only 1 player in your entire group is ever getting hit by anything including AOEs? lol

[detlef]

How can you call if difficult content if only 1 player in your entire group is ever getting hit by anything including AOEs? lol

So content is only difficult if you have a lot of people in range?

[OmnysValefor]

I guess content is only hard if you make it hard.

For some people jobs are fun, for others success is fun. Fun for me is contributing the best I can to success.