Free hand-outs?

[Diavolo]

Most of you are missing the point - you're arguing that it doesn't matter if we get free UNM items everyday because they aren't a big part of the economy. Well, at what point do you stop and say "Ok, that IS a big part of the economy" and maybe we shouldn't be getting it for free? Escha abjurations are a big part of the game. Cursed gear is a big part of the game. Yet here we are getting even the nicest of that gear given to us on a silver platter and you don't think it has an impact? Ok, so why not just have an R/E/M/A dial next month where we run the chance of getting completed weapons? If end game gear doesn't have an impact on the economy and the game as a whole then I don't see how the weapons will either.

I mean, really...

[Olor]

It has an impact, what people are disputing is your assertion that it's a negative impact. People have said above that one of the things that keeps them playing is the dial. This is *good* for the economy.

When I got a jugo kukri from the gobbie box I went and bought all the items to upgrade it from the AH. That's *good* for the in-game economy. I would have bought nothing otherwise.

It's also clearly increased the supply of 1-75 equipment on the AH. Anytime I get some bizarro gear and go to put it on the AH there has almost always been one put up already. That's good, it means people are participating in the economy.

Obviously you're meaning to be ridiculous with your REMA dial idea up there, but as long as they weren't completely finished it would probably increase economic activity in game because more people would want to buy the currencies/items they needed to finish those items. There are actually a lot of players that entirely forego making super weapons because they are so hard to make so... yeah, making them easier would probably increase the people doing it, at least for some time.

At any rate no one is suggesting they put superweapons on the gobbie dial (obviously) - but for causal players the gobbie dial is something that keeps people playing and paying for the game. Maybe they aren't playing it the way you'd like them to, but that doesn't mean their money isn't worth the same amount to SE.

[Diavolo]

Obviously you're meaning to be ridiculous with your REMA dial idea up there

No more or less ridiculous than receiving top tier abjurations, cursed gear and UNM weapons/gear. We already get the currency given to us via goblin chests.

Serious question: at what point do you consider the rewards too much?

[detlef]

No more or less ridiculous than receiving top tier abjurations, cursed gear and UNM weapons/gear. We already get the currency given to us via goblin chests.

Serious question: at what point do you consider the rewards too much?

Abjuration dial was probably too much but I think the Unity dial is harmless.

[Shirai]

No more or less ridiculous than receiving top tier abjurations, cursed gear and UNM weapons/gear. We already get the currency given to us via goblin chests.

Serious question: at what point do you consider the rewards too much?

As long as it stays a gamble it's all the same to me. Your chances of actually recieving something good are pretty slim as it is.
The Unity thing is a double roulette already, you're not getting the gear/items directly from the gob but a reward chest, which may contain a high level item but usually contains crap.
As for the abjuration dial; Even if you get a top tier abjuration you'll still have to buy the cursed item and most of the time the gob'll hand you worthless level 75 era abjurations to use as toilet wipes.

I'll probably go "Hold on, wait a second" once moogles and goblins start handing out free R/E/M weapons, or when you can use that dial more than once a day per character.

[Diavolo]

That doesn't quite answer the question, Stompa.

Some players spent months farming the items we're getting for free from the gobbie dials. Given your words about handing out RMEs, would you think it was safe to assume those players aren't happy either?

[Stompa]

That doesn't quite answer the question, Stompa.

Some players spent months farming the items we're getting for free from the gobbie dials. Given your words about handing out RMEs, would you think it was safe to assume those players aren't happy either?

I camped Spurrer Beret NM from 2009 to 2012. It dropped at 1/500~ after three years of soloing that angry fungaloid and kiting it up and down the tunnels on my PUP. I was so proud of my Spurrer Beret.

Spurrer Beret drops all the time from Gobby Special dial now, and I believe it was added to one of the seasonal costume events too.

Do I complain about this? No! I don't care at all. I enjoyed the solo battles. And this is my point. If I heard you shouting for Unity or Escha/Reisen NMs, I would join you even if I had the gear. Because I like to play the game. I like to battle mobs. I join events just for the thrills and the triumphant win feels.

Similarly, you mentioned earlier how LS members won't join LS events because they already have gear. What kind of LS member is that? When I was on a busy and high-quality Linkshell, if they did an event that meant I was doing the event too. If I had the gear, it did not matter. If I was getting any treasure, it did not matter.

I was very proud to be on the LS, and very happy to support all of their events whenever I was online. That is what a good LS should be. You are part of a team, you are proud to be part of that team, and you will do events because of loyalty to your LS friends, not because you don't have the gear already.

RME is different, because people who spent seven years building a Mythic, were doing nothing else. No fishing, no crafting. Just working on that Mythic constantly for many years. This is completely different to doing casual LS events for a month, or camping a stubborn funguar NM for a few hours a week for three years lol.

RME required 100% devotion, at the expense of everything else in the game. It was completely tunnel-vision "no time to talk!" busy busy busy. This is unlike anything else in the game.

[Shirai]

As far as I am reading the things you post, you seem to be under the assumption that noone has to do content anymore because you can get whatever you desire by speaking to the goblins.
Far from it, the chance of getting something nice is incredibly small and getting the exact item you want is less than 1%.
It's really not the magical bacon button you make it out to be.

[Diavolo]

I camped Spurrer Beret NM from 2009 to 2012. It dropped at 1/500~ after three years of soloing that angry fungaloid and kiting it up and down the tunnels on my PUP. I was so proud of my Spurrer Beret.

Spurrer Beret drops all the time from Gobby Special dial now, and I believe it was added to one of the seasonal costume events too.

Do I complain about this? No! I don't care at all. I enjoyed the solo battles. And this is my point.

I often did Dynamis twice a week, almost every week from 2004 to 2008 with my linkshells. It took countless runs and lord only knows how much lost EXP before I had my first full relic gear set, Shadow Mantle and Shadow Ring. Much currency was farmed and I eventually got an Aegis and Excalibur out of it all. I was so proud of the progress my linkshells made.

That relic gear, Shadow Ring, Shadow Mantle and Dynamis currency drops all the time from Gobby Special Dial now and the currency even washes ashore on Mog Gardens.

Do I complain about this? No! I don't care at all. I enjoyed the battles. And this is my point - let's just add a REM Dial!

RME required 100% devotion, at the expense of everything else in the game. It was completely tunnel-vision "no time to talk!" busy busy busy. This is unlike anything else in the game.

No, it doesn't. You can spend seven years casually working your way to an RME or you can be 100% devoted to it over the course of weeks/months. No one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to work on an RME weapon when you logon. I actually have several of them in the works, no rush to complete any of them.

But again, I am curious - at what point do you think the gear/items coming from the goblin chests are too much? Is everything up to fully upgraded RME weapons where you draw the line?

[Stompa]

I often did Dynamis twice a week, almost every week from 2004 to 2008 with my linkshells. It took countless runs and lord only knows how much lost EXP before I had my first full relic gear set, Shadow Mantle and Shadow Ring. Much currency was farmed and I eventually got an Aegis and Excalibur out of it all. I was so proud of the progress my linkshells made.

That relic gear, Shadow Ring, Shadow Mantle and Dynamis currency drops all the time from Gobby Special Dial now and the currency even washes ashore on Mog Gardens.

Do I complain about this? No! I don't care at all. I enjoyed the battles. And this is my point - let's just add a REM Dial!



No, it doesn't. You can spend seven years casually working your way to an RME or you can be 100% devoted to it over the course of weeks/months. No one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to work on an RME weapon when you logon. I actually have several of them in the works, no rush to complete any of them.

But again, I am curious - at what point do you think the gear/items coming from the goblin chests are too much? Is everything up to fully upgraded RME weapons where you draw the line?

On the "7 years or a few months depending on effort" [paraphrased] you know that is not true at all. It took him seven years to build a Mythic, on level 75 and eventually lvl 99. With all the gating restrictions etc. in that era too. He put in 100% effort, despite being a parent with a full-time job, he spent all of his free non-parenting non-working time on his Mythic.

Today you can of course build a RME much easier. Mainly because of ilvl, and the easing of gating restrictions. So you are correct that if a person takes months or years building RME today, is related to effort. But it is not true of building a Mythic in the 2006-2012 years.

I farmed 1500 HMP for my first Empy, it took me almost three years of migraine War procs with a dozen weapon types lol. Do I complain when people get free HMP in Ambuscade or Gobby boxes? No. I hope it makes them happy.

You are joking obviously when you say "there is currency washing ashore so lets give away free RME weapons in Gobby dials" [paraphrased]. You know as well as I do that farming a RME involves a lot of effort, many thousands of currency items. The occasional free piece of currency is just a lucky bonus, it is a drop in the ocean compared to the full required amount of currency.

The ilvl issue keeps coming up, because if we are honest, ilvl made RME soloable. But ilvl is also relevant to things like Spurrer Berets etc. In 2013, I discovered that overnight my Spurrer Beret had gone from being "very nice!" to being "useless junk" because ilvl had arrived and scorched earth on everything from the old game. I had loads of nice lvl 75-99 stuff, which became obsolete overnight. I was actually quite /sadface about that.

Also I farmed 30~ lvl 99 Magian Weapons, including the 6000~ mob kills trials. 6000~ mobs was a lot of kills at lvl 99 without trusts or ilvl, it was very very slow work. All those Magian Weapons also became total junk overnight, when ilvl arrived. "Occasionally attacks 2-4 times" became "always misses 1-4 times!"

So what I'm saying is that many of us have farmed intensively for gear, pre ilvl, and seen it reduced to worthless junk overnight. That is why I can't join you in a big QQ session, just because some Abjurations or Unity weapons that took you a few weeks to farm, have dropped randomly to other players in lucky (and unusual) Gobby dial rolls.

Your Abjuration gear is still 119 lvl, still useful. Why should you feel sad that other people got this gear by being lucky. My Moghouse is full of Magians like WSDMG+10%, Occasionally-attacks-2-to-4-times Magian weapons that I worked really hard for, and can never use at all in any current game content. I should be upset about that but I'm not really.

I would rather have my Magians drop from Gobby Dial, as 119 versions, because that would mean that I too could finish building my Magians to 119. And I would be happy that I had those 119 items, and not being upset that some lucky people got them for free from a lucky Gobby moment.

But again, RME is a huge time-sink. It is not in the same category effort-wise as Unity NM drops, or Abjurations, or Magians - even though some of the Magians took ages to finish. RME is a legendary weapon with a legendary amount of effort involved. That is why they don't drop from Gobby boxes.