Broken/Useless BLU magic

[Olor]

I agree with everything Rwolf said. Just cause auto-attack is our best damage now doesn't mean that should be what we strive for. That path leads to mediocrity, especially since we are a light DD job. We can't afford to give up all our utility. The only thing BLU has going for it is flexibility to adapt to any given situation.

[Damane]

I think the first step to bettering the feedback community is to stop playing triage with suggestions/feedback. Just because X job is currently worse than Y job doesn't matter regarding feedback. The development team has shown with these quick bountiful updates lately, they can push things out quicker. And even if they couldn't, we should give feedback unbiased and not based on what we think they will or will not do with it. I think that defeats the purpose in and of itself.

It's counter-productive of them to try and produce new spells to make up for large amount of spells already present in the game. Blue Mage's power is in their utility and that's what the job needs to shine again. Utility comes through diverse spell setups and choices allowing quick adaptation. Having the ability to target a monster's physical, magical, and ecosystem weaknesses while also having decent hard to resist breath-type (it's not magical) damage is a huge boon. Also it is a unique form of play that shouldn't be diminished in this recent bout of keeping job identity with the count now at 22. Blue Mage is a weak auto-attack choice over other jobs and I don't agree with continuing to emphasize on that aspect. Auto-attack was meant to be supplemental and slid into being more and more dominant because of spells falling behind.

BLU is a weak autoattack job compared to monk and NIN, but its not bad by any means compared to all the other jobs. The fact still stands that the auto-attacks will generate still way more dmg then any spells BLU has at its desposal (or any other mages) in high buff situations (capped haste and hit rate). Unless as said previously mages/Blus start "farting out nuclear bombs" out of their arse while nukeing/casting spells, that isnt gonna change ever.

I do agree on more utility from our spellroster by makeing old spells work agian, but lets face it, thats never gonna happen. utility/versatility jobs never won a spot in FFXI, its allways all about the specialists that offer the most flexibility.

[Rubicant82]

here is a thought, sense we have to "Set" our spells why not make all BLU spells instant cast, but increase the recast on them to balance.
That could be a good plan. if cast time is 7 seconds and recast time is 40 make the cast time .1 and the recast 47.

[Mefuki]

[B]FFXI has gigantic flaws that need nerfing if you want to balance the jobs across the board:
1. Formless strikes, it reduces the needs for nukers or magical WSs, makeing them almost redundant
2. The miriads of buffs people can get from brds and cors swaping in and out. For ally content swaping for buffs shouldnt be possible (auto loose buffs)
for PTs: BRD should have never gotten more then 2 songs.
Reason: with the potent buffing BRD has now, there is no reason to bring other jobs that can grant different buffs, or unique debuffs to help the battle (debuffing is for me reversed buffing)
3. base dmg raising after ilvl weapon introduction was flawed, reason: mnk got a 80% base dmg increase going from 99 to ilvl 119, the rest is howevering around a 50% increase AT BEST.
4. haste, its the most OP buff, and its the reason why anythign mage like will NEVER be good enough for content unless the mage starts farting nuclear bombs out of his ass while nukeing/casting any offensiv spells. The more haste melees have the more exponential their dmg goes up. There is no buff that allows that to happen for mages or jobs that cast spells...

And I agree with you on all these points.

I also think that it's not really going to help, like Rwolf said, to "play triage" with job suggestions. A lot of jobs are hurting, just last week we had an influx of feedback from users in regards to pet jobs, and this week BLU topics have resurfaced. Clearly, you already consider BLU having issues when you said, "NOT only BLU is suffering,..." and I think most of us are just trying to come up with solutions to help create a more diverse pool of jobs and roles, etc within the battle system. And I think that just because we can say that BLU doesn't need adjustments as bad as another job doesn't mean that it's fine that a number of aspects of the job are broken and need correcting.

And given what you said in point 4., you and I both know that the solution to making a more complex battle system is not to just make BLU swing his sword faster and faster.

[Rwolf]

BLU is a weak autoattack job compared to monk and NIN, but its not bad by any means compared to all the other jobs. The fact still stands that the auto-attacks will generate still way more dmg then any spells BLU has at its desposal (or any other mages) in high buff situations (capped haste and hit rate). Unless as said previously mages/Blus start "farting out nuclear bombs" out of their arse while nukeing/casting spells, that isnt gonna change ever.

I do agree on more utility from our spellroster by makeing old spells work agian, but lets face it, thats never gonna happen. utility/versatility jobs never won a spot in FFXI, its allways all about the specialists that offer the most flexibility.

I'm not disputing the fact that currently auto-attacks generate more damage than Blue Magic. That's a well known fact. However, that was not always the case especially where we didn't have these high damage weapons in each hand, while capping haste, accuracy and high critical hit rate. Other melee jobs other than Monk and Ninja, can out auto-attack Blue Mage. And if you're counting buffs traits and abilities, then you have to do the same for every other damage dealing job.


"Utility/versatility jobs never won a spot in FFXI" is a bold claim. NIN -ni wheel tactic, RDM in its prime, BRD tanking and pulling, BLU in Nyzul Isle especially concerning soulflayers, are all examples of at one point being desired utility and versatility. Even in Delve when it was alliance level, there were jobs brought for their utility and adaptability to the different bosses. I think you're taking your stance to the extreme and far out of context to prove your point.

There is nothing wrong with increasing Blue Magic to do more damage than auto attacking, even now. Blue Mage still sits at a very limited MP pool sans Mythic, on it's own. I respect your opinion, albeit negative, if you think the development team will never do it, but it is no counterpoint. It is not fact they won't change Blue Mage, it is your own opinion.

[Tennotsukai]

Well, at least we have requiescat. Oh wait, monks have formless strikes, nvm.
same applies to nukers, if you want to change it, you have to nerf formless trikes (which is imho a good thing to do)

At least we have nature's meditation, dang nvm that, 60 seconds.
because adloqium, phalanx matter so much nowadays...

Oh! We have enfeebles we can use... but those usually don't ever land. Hmm...
you mean like all those resists RDM WHM and SCH get when yours resist? If the fight allows to stick all mage debuffs, BLU debuffs work too. Those fights tough exist rarely, and mostly mages can only stick 1 TOPs 2 debuffs (not counting in dia), because everythign else insta resists on anything remotly hard. (and dont get me started on hardmission battles on D+)

Cocoon? Other jobs can sub and use.
yeah because so many melees are subbing BLU to up their defense... only for RUN would this make sense and thats pretty situational

Breath spells? Wtf is wrong with those!? Why are they so bad?
nukes on D+ Hardmode mission battlefields, wry are they so bad!!!!! because of fucking innate 50% MDT and like obscene amounts of INT the mob has!!! nuuuuuu

Okay, so most of our spells are terribad except a few that end up being worthless in high buff situations.
EVERY spell/neglectable ability you cast in high buff situations is BAD, because you sacrifice that more DPS due to lock animations etc etc. that accounts for all jobs across the board

Honestly, I don't care for the fact they are going to neglect all our spells just please give us a significant amount of new spells with reasonable costs, job traits we'll use, and a reason to use (not broken).

Thank you.


Now dont get this the wrong, I am all for fixing jobs, but your rant sounded like a crybaby that doesnt see that NOT only BLU is suffering, there is quiet a few of other jobs that suffer the same or worse. I think actually BLU has atm the better end of the stick compared to other jobs (nukers(BLM GEO), THF, DNC, RUN, Pet jobs etc).

FFXI has gigantic flaws that need nerfing if you want to balance the jobs across the board:
1. Formless strikes, it reduces the needs for nukers or magical WSs, makeing them almost redundant
2. The miriads of buffs people can get from brds and cors swaping in and out. For ally content swaping for buffs shouldnt be possible (auto loose buffs)
for PTs: BRD should have never gotten more then 2 songs.
Reason: with the potent buffing BRD has now, there is no reason to bring other jobs that can grant different buffs, or unique debuffs to help the battle (debuffing is for me reversed buffing)
3. base dmg raising after ilvl weapon introduction was flawed, reason: mnk got a 80% base dmg increase going from 99 to ilvl 119, the rest is howevering around a 50% increase AT BEST.
4. haste, its the most OP buff, and its the reason why anythign mage like will NEVER be good enough for content unless the mage starts farting nuclear bombs out of his ass while nukeing/casting any offensiv spells. The more haste melees have the more exponential their dmg goes up. There is no buff that allows that to happen for mages or jobs that cast spells...

Sorry if my over dramatic post displeased you in some way. I do not understand why you would want to make such a long reply to a little rant trying to get my point across which I see you do all the time.

For some of the reasonable statements:

I agree with nerfing FS, that and mnk's ridiculously higher dmg they get through skill.

Our enfeebles: First, Tourbillion/Barbed Crescent are broken so there's that. Also, any of our debuffs that do land on anything worthwhile almost immediately wear off (Benthic Typhoon, Bilgestorm, Auroral Drape, Demoralizing Roar, our slows, paralyzes, Infrasonics, and most our stuns after 5 times using, if at all). This would be for delve/delve2/AA normal. I understand AA difficult is not for mage's to feel comfortable. I know I did over exaggerate a little on this part. I know blue mages are never invited like other jobs to use their enfeebles. Maybe if Tourbillion actually worked we would be.

Now your other replies do not make much sense. Why are you bitching about my breath spells rant and comparing them to other spells specifically in AA. Breath spells...just suck in every way. Are you really against a breath spell fix?

I just don't understand this reply, dude...Thought you were with us in fixing blu, but evidently you weren't all there during this reply. I know most other jobs are in need of a fix'in, but these are the blu forums. We want blue mage to be successful here.

[saevel]

Also, any of our debuffs that do land on anything worthwhile almost immediately wear off (Benthic Typhoon, Bilgestorm, Auroral Drape, Demoralizing Roar, our slows, paralyzes, Infrasonics, and most our stuns after 5 times using, if at all). This would be for delve/delve2/AA normal.

I haven't done AA with BLU, but Delve 1.0 has zero problems with Bilgestorm and Typhoon. I use a hybrid acc / magic acc set for both of them, it's the same set I use for Sudden Lunge. Bilgestorm in particular use's TP to enhance it's duration so it's wise to have 200+ TP and use CA with UL to get max duration on the -25% defense / attack. I can confirm that it lasts well over a minute, I would guess around 90s on Tojil (wish I had more accurate info) and Shark, I can't remember what it was on Bee. BS is a really useful spell to open a big fight with, or to use right before piercing on Tojil for your AL GD spam. In between UL BS's I use BT which has decent damage and the defense effect lasts about a minute. Lots of BLU spells have issues, but BT and BS are both quite good.

[elqplau]

With all due respects to my blue mage brethern is rdm ever going to be worked on? The only reasin i can solo un most places is because of trusts and gear it has been along time sence rdm has been what it was

[Tennotsukai]

I haven't done AA with BLU, but Delve 1.0 has zero problems with Bilgestorm and Typhoon. I use a hybrid acc / magic acc set for both of them, it's the same set I use for Sudden Lunge. Bilgestorm in particular use's TP to enhance it's duration so it's wise to have 200+ TP and use CA with UL to get max duration on the -25% defense / attack. I can confirm that it lasts well over a minute, I would guess around 90s on Tojil (wish I had more accurate info) and Shark, I can't remember what it was on Bee. BS is a really useful spell to open a big fight with, or to use right before piercing on Tojil for your AL GD spam. In between UL BS's I use BT which has decent damage and the defense effect lasts about a minute. Lots of BLU spells have issues, but BT and BS are both quite good.

Oh yah. I was mainly speaking of AA normal; Benthic has an issue where it lasts like a second, same with paralyze. Frightful roar is actually quite decent there though. That's cool though about BS.

[Tennotsukai]

With all due respects to my blue mage brethern is rdm ever going to be worked on? The only reasin i can solo un most places is because of trusts and gear it has been along time sence rdm has been what it was

I always thought what blu can solo rdm could solo as well.