Inventory Increase, New Satchel, Infinite (sortable) Item box in MogHouse

[Shipp]

Oh? Because I thought I remembered you saying it's not the game's fault. You seem to mix up your arguments.

Not responding to everything, because you still don't understand my position on the matter. I said it's not the game's fault that you feel you need 500 gear swaps. I never said it's not the fault of the engine's limitations that you can't have those 500 gear swaps.

Also, I don't feel my opinion is more valid than yours. I feel you're pissing into the wind though since there is no way you are ever going to have more than 80 inventory spaces to carry around gear. This argument is akin to walking into a grocery store and demanding that they carry lingerie simply because they have some seasonal jackets for sale. It's not going to happen, no matter how much you complain. SE has said 80 is the limit due to hardware. Insisting that people need more is not going to do anything. Meanwhile, I'm trying to explain ways to work-around the problem and you are just stomping your feet saying that you should have more space when it's not even an option.

Then how are we playing right now? Or do you think we're all on a strike and sitting in Port Jeuno crowding up Horst with angry shouts directed at SE that we can't play anymore? Newsflash: we do manage. But we'd manage better if the game would let us. Now you don't seem to understand for what we're asking. We're not asking SE to increase the inventory limit, because we already know that that's the physical limit. We're suggesting different ways to bypass this, different systems to work around that shortcoming. This is the part you seem to be confusing with whining. Sarick, for example, has posted his idea on a new system that would completely bypass the 80 limit imposed by the PS2. So what, are you saying we shouldn't even bother, because it is how it is and we should just be fine with it? Then what exactly are these forums for, if not for feedback and suggestions?

The game will NEVER let you, so get that out of your head. That is what I'm saying. You can keep making rants on this thread about how the game SHOULD let you, but the problem is that the hardware behind the game CANNOT let you, and no amount of ranting is going to change that. So, you can either keep managing like the rest of us and get on with your life, or you can keep managing as you are now and keep complaining about something that cannot happen. Seems a bit futile to me, but it's your time. Sarick doesn't know the hardware that SE is working with. Sarick doesn't know anymore about the inventory problem than we do. While his suggestions might help, only SE knows it that could actually work or not, and so far, I haven't seen them agree with him. Anyone else parroting his response as if it's 100% doable without the knowledge of how things are coded in XI just looks like a whiner.

No, I don't care enough to go through all my gear in my different storage locations and on my mule just to convince any random stranger as to why he needs to get his facts straight. And it's funny you're saying you didn't see that post when you even quoted it. Here it is again, the relevant parts bolded, so you don't skip over it again

I didn't skip over it. When you said you had listed them, I thought you might have actually listed a bit of gear with them, not just, "Healing set, DD set, HP set, haste set," etc. There are also pieces that overlap between sets, so it's not as if you're changing every single piece of equipment between every set.

[Shipp]

Right, so when you say:




Your not saying that your against more inventory.

Your saying that you are way better at managing inventory than I am, but you still think they should add more inventory.

Man sorry for my poor reading comprehension. It's just that when an amazingly well thought out and eloquent post like yours comes along, it stumps my somewhat inferior mind.

Thanks for straightening us laymen out on how to manage our inventory. It's great to hear that you want better / more storage too. I guess we have nothing left to argue about huh?

EDIT: I know your not good at catching this, so I'll just spell it out for you. All of that was sarcasm.

Don't get your panties in a knot just since you assumed I was against more inventory/storage and attacked a position I never held to begin with.

Also, I understand sarcasm perfectly fine.

[Arcon]

Also, I don't feel my opinion is more valid than yours. I feel you're pissing into the wind though since there is no way you are ever going to have more than 80 inventory spaces to carry around gear. This argument is akin to walking into a grocery store and demanding that they carry lingerie simply because they have some seasonal jackets for sale. It's not going to happen, no matter how much you complain. SE has said 80 is the limit due to hardware. Insisting that people need more is not going to do anything. Meanwhile, I'm trying to explain ways to work-around the problem and you are just stomping your feet saying that you should have more space when it's not even an option.

[..]

The game will NEVER let you, so get that out of your head. That is what I'm saying. You can keep making rants on this thread about how the game SHOULD let you, but the problem is that the hardware behind the game CANNOT let you, and no amount of ranting is going to change that. So, you can either keep managing like the rest of us and get on with your life, or you can keep managing as you are now and keep complaining about something that cannot happen. Seems a bit futile to me, but it's your time. [..]

That's not news to anyone. I told you I know it's the hardware limit. But hardware limites can be avoided and bypassed by smart implementation. That's how SE managed to give us 400 places of active storage, despite the PS2 only being able to ~170 at a time (176 I believe was the number, not sure). We're not whining about something impossible. We're suggesting something very possible from our current understanding. And yes, none of us know that it's possible because we don't know the implementation exactly. But we can give educated guesses. And I can say with reasonable certainty that certain measures could be taken. Sarick's suggestion, for example, would work to some extent and provide different options for situational storage. Another suggestion that was brought before was to let us equip gear straight from sack and satchel, thus tripling our equippable inventory. That would also work, if SE wanted to implement it.

And yes, we don't know if they want/will, but again, that's what this forum is for. We wanted higher inventory, they said PS2 limitations prevent them from increasing it and they'll look for other ways to alleviate storage issues. So we moved on and stopped asking for higher inventory. Now we're asking for smarter inventory, and if they happen to come in and give us a valid reason for why it won't happen, we'll think of other ways it could work and we'll suggest those. And there's nothing at all wrong with it. You're calling it whining, but it's just feedback, nothing else.

I didn't skip over it. When you said you had listed them, I thought you might have actually listed a bit of gear with them, not just, "Healing set, DD set, HP set, haste set," etc. There are also pieces that overlap between sets, so it's not as if you're changing every single piece of equipment between every set.

I've marked situational pieces with an x instead of a number, all others are numbered in order of appearance. There are multiple entries, which haven't been counted twice though (unless I made a mistake somewhere). This list was compiled manually and it's possible I missed some items. I also left out a few more sets (like HP, MP and resting set), but it should give you an initial idea of where the issues come from. Many of these gear sets are out dated and there are new items that could fit in now where previously were none. Yes, I was that bored.

Haste:
1. Zelus Tiara
2. Creed Gauntlets +2
3. Velocious Belt
4. Creed Cuisses +2
5. Creed Sabatons +2

PDT:
(x. Eisen Grip)
6. Angha Gem
7. Valhalla Helm
8. Wiglen Gorget
9. Colossuss's Earring
10. Ethereal Earring
11. Grim Cuirass
12. Melaco Mittens
13. Patronus Ring
14. Jelly Ring
15. Shadow Mantle
16. Nierenschutz
4. Creed Cuisses +2
17. Jingang Greaves

MDT (Shell down):
18. Verthandi's Gem
19. Valhalla Helm
20. Twilight Torque
21. Merman's Earring
10. Ethereal Earring
22. Avalon Breastplate
23. Iron Ram Dastanas
24. Merman's Ring
25. Merman's Ring
26. Lamia Mantle +1
15. Nierenschutz
27. Inmicus Cuisses
28. Askar Gambieras

MDT (Shell up):
17. Verthandi's Gem
18. Valhalla Helm
19. Twilight Torque
20. Merman's Earring
21. Ethereal Earring
22. Avalon Breastplate
23. Iron Ram Dastanas
29. Shadow Ring
25. Merman's Ring
26. Lamia Mantle +1
15. Nierenschutz
30. Iron Ram Hose
31. Iron Ram Sollerets

Melee:
1. Zelus Tiara
32. Fortitude Torque
33. Suppanomimi
34. Brutal Earring
35. Creed Cuirass +2
2. Creed Gauntlets +2
36. Keen Ring
37. Rajas Ring
38. Atheling Mantle
3. Velocious Belt
4. Creed Cuisses +2
5. Creed Sabatons +2

Attack:
39. Twilight Helm
32. Fortitude Torque
40. Aesir Ear Pendant
41. Grim Cuirass
42. Creed Gauntlets +2
36. Keen Ring
38. Atheling Mantle
43. Anguinus Belt
44. Hecatomb Subligar
45. Dilaram's Sollerets

DEX:
39. Twilight Helm
46. Love Torque
47. Twilight Mail
48. Hecatomb Mittens
49. Thundersoul Ring
37. Rajas Ring
44. Hecatomb Subligar
50. Rutter Sabatons

VIT:
51. Bibiki Seashell
52. Hero's Galea
32. Fortitude Torque
53. Koenig Cuirass
54. Koenig Handschuhs
55. Spiral Ring
56. Terrasoul Ring
57. Valor Cape
58. Warwolf Belt
59. Koenig Diechlings
60. Koenig Schuhs

Fast Cast:
(x. Vivid Strap)
61. Incantor Stone
62. Creed Armet +2
63. Loquacious Earring
64. Homam Cosciales

Regen:
39. Twilight Helm
8. Wiglen Gorget
65. Sheltered Ring
66. Paguroidea Ring

Refresh:
67. Creed Collar
47. Twilight Mail

Enhancing:
(x. Fulcio Grip)
68. Colossus's Torque
69. Augmenting Earring
70. Merciful Cape
71. Olympus Sash
72. Gallant Breeches +1

Enmity:
52. Hero's Galea
73. Invidia Torque
35. Creed Cuirass +2
74. Valor Gauntlets +1
75. Hercules' Ring
76. Odium Ring
57. Valor Cape
77. Creed Baudrier
30. Iron Ram Hose
78. Dornen Schuhs

Shield:
62. Creed Armet +2
79. Shield Torque
80. Creed Earring
2. Creed Gauntlets +2
81. Boxer's Mantle
82. Gallant Leggings +1

Cure:
(x. Apollo's Staff)
39. Twilight Helm
83. Hospitaler Earring
47. Twilight Mail
(x. Cascade Belt)
84. Valor Leggings +1

Rampart:
85. Valor Coronet +1

Sentinel:
84. Valor Leggings +1

Cover:
86. Gallant Coronet +1
87. Valor Surcoat

Shield Bash:
88. Knightly Earring
74. Valor Gauntlets +1
89. Fenian Ring

Movement:
90. Blood Cuisses

RR-Set:
39. Twilight Helm
47. Twilight Mail

Convert DMG to MP:
10. Ethereal Earring
62. Creed Armet +2

Magic Attack:
39. Twilight Helm
91. Hecate's Earring
92. Novio Earring
47. Twilight Mail

Dark Magic WS:
93. Shadow Gorget
94. Shadow Belt

(Stoneskin:
x. Stone Gorget
x. Earthcry Earring
x. Stone Mufflers
x. Siegel Sash
x. Haven Hose)

[Sarick]

Why exactly not? How would it be anything but their interest?

Now you're mixing something up. One drawback of bitwise storage is that it's only an on/off switch, meaning you can't store multiples of one item (like the 250 healing potions you mentioned earlier). If you want that kind of storage then you'd really just need very little space, but in addition to the metadata restriction (no augmented/trial items, charged/signed items, etc.) you also couldn't store more than one of any given item. You'd have to choose between bitwise storage and regular storage, one for a checklist-type of storage (for rare armor, for example) and the other for stacking various amounts of items (like craft materials or trial items).

The whole concept of it not being in their best interest involves them losing a lot of monthly mule subscriptions. This was already made clear by other posters on this topic.

I'm not mixing things up, you've totally forgotten previous post I'm made. Go back and re-read everything. You seem to bring up things that have already been discussed as though no discussion was done. I keep explaining bit wise was the way slips may store data. If you look up one or two back post you'd see something like.

"Let's consider If each item on the list used 8 bytes of data to store it even an old 64kb computer could manage hundreds of items in list forum."

When I made this comment I was grossly over exaggerating the bytes per item. I know that it takes more one bit to store items with amounts. A byte is 8 bits and is 0-255. You could store an item in on a single bit as an on/off but the amount would need a separate byte for it to remember the amount.

This could be compressed into 1 byte per item using the byte as a placeholder in a table. Like this > If you have 0 as the amount in that personal byte it's 00 and you don't have it. On the other hand if you have 1 item that byte (01) or you have 255 (FF) you have it. No need for an on/off bit because if it's 00 you don't have it. Anything more then zero you have it in that amount. Next, 1 byte (8 bit) isn't really enough to record the ID of every item on the game. I think it could be done easily with 32bits, (a string of 4 bytes.) 3 for the item ID and one for the amount.

[SpankWustler]

Haste:
1. Zelus Tiara
2. Creed Gauntlets +2
3. Velocious Belt
4. Creed Cuisses +2
5. Creed Sabatons +2

PDT:
(x. Eisen Grip)
6. Angha Gem
7. Valhalla Helm
8. Wiglen Gorget
9. Colossuss's Earring
10. Ethereal Earring
11. Grim Cuirass
12. Melaco Mittens
13. Patronus Ring
14. Jelly Ring
15. Shadow Mantle
16. Nierenschutz
4. Creed Cuisses +2
17. Jingang Greaves

MDT (Shell down):
18. Verthandi's Gem
19. Valhalla Helm
20. Twilight Torque
21. Merman's Earring
10. Ethereal Earring
22. Avalon Breastplate
23. Iron Ram Dastanas
24. Merman's Ring
25. Merman's Ring
26. Lamia Mantle +1
15. Nierenschutz
27. Inmicus Cuisses
28. Askar Gambieras

MDT (Shell up):
17. Verthandi's Gem
18. Valhalla Helm
19. Twilight Torque
20. Merman's Earring
21. Ethereal Earring
22. Avalon Breastplate
23. Iron Ram Dastanas
29. Shadow Ring
25. Merman's Ring
26. Lamia Mantle +1
15. Nierenschutz
30. Iron Ram Hose
31. Iron Ram Sollerets

Melee:
1. Zelus Tiara
32. Fortitude Torque
33. Suppanomimi
34. Brutal Earring
35. Creed Cuirass +2
2. Creed Gauntlets +2
36. Keen Ring
37. Rajas Ring
38. Atheling Mantle
3. Velocious Belt
4. Creed Cuisses +2
5. Creed Sabatons +2

Attack:
39. Twilight Helm
32. Fortitude Torque
40. Aesir Ear Pendant
41. Grim Cuirass
42. Creed Gauntlets +2
36. Keen Ring
38. Atheling Mantle
43. Anguinus Belt
44. Hecatomb Subligar
45. Dilaram's Sollerets

DEX:
39. Twilight Helm
46. Love Torque
47. Twilight Mail
48. Hecatomb Mittens
49. Thundersoul Ring
37. Rajas Ring
44. Hecatomb Subligar
50. Rutter Sabatons

VIT:
51. Bibiki Seashell
52. Hero's Galea
32. Fortitude Torque
53. Koenig Cuirass
54. Koenig Handschuhs
55. Spiral Ring
56. Terrasoul Ring
57. Valor Cape
58. Warwolf Belt
59. Koenig Diechlings
60. Koenig Schuhs

Fast Cast:
(x. Vivid Strap)
61. Incantor Stone
62. Creed Armet +2
63. Loquacious Earring
64. Homam Cosciales

Regen:
39. Twilight Helm
8. Wiglen Gorget
65. Sheltered Ring
66. Paguroidea Ring

Refresh:
67. Creed Collar
47. Twilight Mail

Enhancing:
(x. Fulcio Grip)
68. Colossus's Torque
69. Augmenting Earring
70. Merciful Cape
71. Olympus Sash
72. Gallant Breeches +1

Enmity:
52. Hero's Galea
73. Invidia Torque
35. Creed Cuirass +2
74. Valor Gauntlets +1
75. Hercules' Ring
76. Odium Ring
57. Valor Cape
77. Creed Baudrier
30. Iron Ram Hose
78. Dornen Schuhs

Shield:
62. Creed Armet +2
79. Shield Torque
80. Creed Earring
2. Creed Gauntlets +2
81. Boxer's Mantle
82. Gallant Leggings +1

Cure:
(x. Apollo's Staff)
39. Twilight Helm
83. Hospitaler Earring
47. Twilight Mail
(x. Cascade Belt)
84. Valor Leggings +1

Rampart:
85. Valor Coronet +1

Sentinel:
84. Valor Leggings +1

Cover:
86. Gallant Coronet +1
87. Valor Surcoat

Shield Bash:
88. Knightly Earring
74. Valor Gauntlets +1
89. Fenian Ring

Movement:
90. Blood Cuisses

RR-Set:
39. Twilight Helm
47. Twilight Mail

Convert DMG to MP:
10. Ethereal Earring
62. Creed Armet +2

Magic Attack:
39. Twilight Helm
91. Hecate's Earring
92. Novio Earring
47. Twilight Mail

Dark Magic WS:
93. Shadow Gorget
94. Shadow Belt

(Stoneskin:
x. Stone Gorget
x. Earthcry Earring
x. Stone Mufflers
x. Siegel Sash
x. Haven Hose)

Am I wrong in thinking you could include even more stuff if you had space and the desire, such as a few bits to optimize Sanguine Blade damage or a few MND bits to increase the TP return from Chivalry?

Which I think really drives the point home. For almost any job that isn't a straight-up melee, one can post a list of stuff that already exceeds the 80 inventory limit and somebody else can say "You could use more stuff to marginal effect if you could carry more stuff and really wanted to use more stuff."

[Arcon]

The whole concept of it not being in their best interest involves them losing a lot of monthly mule subscriptions. This was already made clear by other posters on this topic.

Then can those posters explain why SE kept increasing our inventory, gave us new storage locations and several other storage options (armor storage, event item storage, Porter Moogle, etc.) over time? I can, because satisfied customers will net them more than pissed off customers, many of which don't even use their mules for storage (like me, for example).

I'm not mixing things up, you've totally forgotten previous post I'm made. Go back and re-read everything. You seem to bring up things that have already been discussed as though no discussion was done. I keep explaining bit wise was the way slips may store data. If you look up one or two back post you'd see something like.

"Let's consider If each item on the list used 8 bytes of data to store it even an old 64kb computer could manage hundreds of items in list forum."

When I made this comment I was grossly over exaggerating the bytes per item. I know that it takes more one bit to store items with amounts. A byte is 8 bits and is 0-255. You could store an item in on a single bit as an on/off but the amount would need a separate byte for it to remember the amount.

This could be compressed into 1 byte per item using the byte as a placeholder in a table. Like this > If you have 0 as the amount in that personal byte it's 00 and you don't have it. On the other hand if you have 1 item that byte (01) or you have 255 (FF) you have it. No need for an on/off bit because if it's 00 you don't have it. Anything more then zero you have it in that amount. Next, 1 byte (8 bit) isn't really enough to record the ID of every item on the game. I think it could be done easily with 32bits, (a string of 4 bytes.) 3 for the item ID and one for the amount.

See that's why I asked you to detail how you wanted to implement it. All your answers were so vague that I couldn't guess that was what you'd use the byte for (which you only mentioned in a different post). You never explained why you needed that. I thought you meant one byte to store the entire item, by ID. Which didn't make sense, as earlier you went on about bitwise storage, which is contrary to that. And it's still different to what you're saying now because this isn't the "on/off" switch, but an extension of that.

Anyway, the more I read about your idea the less it seems like anything new at all. You just want special storage for items with no metadata. Nothing unlimited, not even much bigger than currently possible when it takes up that much space. It's a valid suggestion, despite some limitations when implementing it, such as only being able to retrieve fractions of items at once because of stack limitations in the inventory or the fact that it will be something entirely new to display both at the same time, unless they modify the current item menu to be able to send items there via a submenu. It's basically an extra storage location, trading a restriction on space for a restriction of items that can be stored, only harder to implement.

Am I wrong in thinking you could include even more stuff if you had space and the desire, such as a few bits to optimize Sanguine Blade damage or a few MND bits to increase the TP return from Chivalry?

You're not wrong at all. Many less important sets are filled in sporadically, because I'm already well aware that I won't ever be able to utilize them fully. I don't even bother to get gear for stuff like Chivalry, Sanguine Blade and Cataclysm specifically, I merely use what I already have (nuking stuff from BLM which happens to be equippable by all jobs, Shadow Gorget/Belt from WAR, MND from gear like Twilight Helm/Mail and some AF pieces and Morgana's Choker, also from my mage jobs, etc.).

[FrankReynolds]

WHat??? wheres all your proc weapons holy waters echos, nin tools etc? :P

Seriously though, I will gladly continue to pay for the mule, if they just move all his storage to my mog house. Maybe they could just move him to my mog house :P

[Arcon]

WHat??? wheres all your proc weapons holy waters echos, nin tools etc? :P

Speaking of proc weapons, I completely forgot to mention regular weapons: Sword and Shield (really pimp PLD even two shields). And yeah, I only use tools, food, meds, etc. before a fight, by putting one item in satchel and getting what I need then switching it back. That's also tremendously fun.

[Alhanelem]

Am I wrong in thinking you could include even more stuff if you had space and the desire, such as a few bits to optimize Sanguine Blade damage or a few MND bits to increase the TP return from Chivalry?

Which I think really drives the point home. For almost any job that isn't a straight-up melee, one can post a list of stuff that already exceeds the 80 inventory limit and somebody else can say "You could use more stuff to marginal effect if you could carry more stuff and really wanted to use more stuff."

That gear list is absurdly excessive. No normal player keeps that many sets. I also don't know anybody, even fairly elitist players, that have two different MDT sets depending on whether or not they have shell up. A lot of that gear could also be potentially ignored by receiving buffs with the same effect.

I could strike many items off that list as miniscule incrimental upgrades that are not in any way necessary or drastically helpful enough to be carried around unless you're a perfectionist completionist, not to mention few people would come close to having all of these items just because of the effort to obtain them. This is just an extreme example of maximal situational gear utilization.

[Arcon]

That gear list is absurdly excessive.

Says you. Where is the line? That's my entire point. There is none. Any line you make is arbitrary and based on your own perception of what's "needed" (a term I hate in discussions like these, btw). This is the exact same argument that people who don't gear swap at all are bringing, only their line is even lower.

No normal player keeps that many sets. I also don't know anybody, even fairly elitist players, that have two different MDT sets depending on whether or not they have shell up. A lot of that gear could also be potentially ignored by receiving buffs with the same effect.

I could strike many items off that list as miniscule incrimental upgrades that are not in any way necessary or drastically helpful enough to be carried around unless you're a perfectionist completionist [..]

Not sure what you mean by "receiving buffs with the same effect", but that again is your own perception of what's normal and what's miniscule. When would you say is an item bonus not miniscule? STR+5 on WS? Does barely anything. But stacking it all up and you will notice a significant difference. Like the enhancing items. One alone won't do me much, but all of them will not only give me a higher shield block rate on Reprisal but also put me in a new Phalanx tier.

Same for the MDT sets. If Shell isn't up you'd want to cap MDT as far as possible. If it is up, much of that gear is wasted, and MDB is actually pretty useful. So why not use both if you're capable of it? There are some situations where Shell is dispelled quite frequently, in which case having both these sets can be very useful.

This is just an extreme example of maximal situational gear utilization.

As was pointed out before, there is a lot that could be done to build upon those sets if one was going for absurd. I can tell you right now that if I had 150 inventory slots I would probably use a large portion of that. Most of the gear I listed was actually reused several times over different sets. I have no exclusive MND items for example, I just use what I get from other PLD gear. Same goes for most other things (Refresh/Regen gear, JA macro gear, enmity gear, shield gear, VIT gear, etc.). This is merely branded "extreme" because 80 is the limit. If 60 was still the limit you would call 60 items extreme. The more inventory we have, the more room we have to be marginal about our increases. If PS2 ever gets dropped and we'll have 200 inventory I assure you that many people will get over 100 items per job and having less than 60 items will be frowned upon for certain jobs.