Battle Balance Adjustment: TP Gained through Use of a Weaponskill

[Mirabelle]

The reason that we're adjusting the specifications for save TP is that we're working to prevent weapon skills from being executed non-stop when stacking save TP, store TP, and conserve TP. As such, there are no plans to increase the effect of Miser Roll because it would cancel out the point of the save TP adjustment. Miser Roll's save TP effect will still stack with other effects and equipment.

Strange how this didn't matter when they introduced an atmacite of 20 Save TP, knowing full well it would stack with other Save TP effects. Then they are shocked when people get 1-2 hit builds.
Listen SE, COR's spent money on this roll only to have it made less useful than SAM roll, a roll we got 4 years and 35 levels ago at a lower cost. If you do this, you might as well remove the roll, give us our Gil back and introduce a haste roll.

The whole population is asking for a cap on TP returned. Just tell us why that is impossible when almost all the players are in agreement it is a superior option.

[Motenten]

The reason that we're adjusting the specifications for save TP is that we're working to prevent weapon skills from being executed non-stop when stacking save TP, store TP, and conserve TP. As such, there are no plans to increase the effect of Miser Roll because it would cancel out the point of the save TP adjustment. Miser Roll's save TP effect will still stack with other effects and equipment.

All right, Rukkirii -- Direct question.

Player understanding is that Save TP and Conserve TP do not stack. That is, if you have any sort of Save TP buff present, Conserve TP cannot activate. As such, it cannot and should not be a factor in any decision related to Save TP adjustments. Are the devs working from the assumption that they stack? Are they misapprehending the mechanics, or is player testing faulty?

I can understand a concern about TP return if someone not completely familiar with the interrelations between the effects looked at the combo and thought, "25 TP return on the weaponskill, 25 Save TP from Miser's Roll, 20 Save TP from Atmacite, and a possible 20 TP Conserve TP proc gives back 90 TP! Add a couple ticks of Tactician's Roll and regain Atmacite and they could weaponskill non-stop!" Except that that can't be the case; the maximum would be 70 TP plus the regain. Still substantial, but not to the extreme that seems to be the concern of whoever came up with this decision.

And, as has been suggested, simply placing a cap on the total TP return would also be fine. 50 TP would require two additional hits to reach 100 TP even for the extremes on sam, and 3 hits for most other two-handers (never mind the one-handers and H2H users who are nowhere near the lofty heights of TP return that the two-handers are).

[Yinnyth]

Not sure if devs oblivious...

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Or intentionally making miser's roll worthless.

The overwhelming player reaction on this thread so far has been that the nerf is indeed needed for VW, but pwnhammers one of COR's best rolls everywhere else. No one would ever use miser's roll outside VW after this update, and even inside VW it's usefulness is open to debate.

Considering Rukkirii's answer seems to focus only on its use in VW and not anywhere else, I'm starting to get the feeling the community reps are under instructions to dodge the obvious and painful answer: "We know it will be worthless outside VW. That's intentional."

Still, I hope it is something they're simply overlooking.

[Babekeke]

companion's roll
pets? maybe? =p

Wow, I re-read the effects of this roll several times to see if I was missing something, and every time missed the word pet ><

{Please forgive me}

[saevel]

Not sure if devs oblivious...

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       QGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG                                   
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               /@@@BB@@@7OOCO#@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@BBR#                      
               7@@B@B@@BC    /RB@@@@@@@@@@@@B@@@BBBBB 

Or intentionally making miser's roll worthless.

The overwhelming player reaction on this thread so far has been that the nerf is indeed needed for VW, but pwnhammers one of COR's best rolls everywhere else. No one would ever use miser's roll outside VW after this update, and even inside VW it's usefulness is open to debate.

Considering Rukkirii's answer seems to focus only on its use in VW and not anywhere else, I'm starting to get the feeling the community reps are under instructions to dodge the obvious and painful answer: "We know it will be worthless outside VW. That's intentional."

Still, I hope it is something they're simply overlooking.

So COR's use one of the other rolls instead, like the +Attack or +DA one.

[Insaniac]

So COR's use one of the other rolls instead, like the +Attack or +DA one.

You're assuming a COR without Miser's has any place in an event that doesn't need them for procs. CORs won't use other rolls they will be replaced by BRDs with double march just like they were at 75 cap.

[Seha]

10 bloody pages(now 11)of people saying put a cap on tp return instead of this and it's completely ignored(with a wrong justification nonetheless). Just what are these forums for? We would all go back to posting on bg, ah and zam only if we just wanted to discuss between us. Unless the jp section is all over this update cheering and clapping, is it the case? Or is it just someone in the dev team sayin "oh snap I didn't think about that...better pretend it's no good".

[Mirabelle]

So COR's use one of the other rolls instead, like the +Attack or +DA one.

Then why did we bother with raising the level cap at all if COR's are just supposed to use the same old rolls from 75 cap and be considered second rate to BRD's. Miser's roll was one of the rolls that put COR on a somewhat even footing with BRD at least in VW.

They advanced all the jobs with new abilities as the levels raised. COR got several new rolls of which 2 were useful (Tacticians, Misers). Now we are down to only one of the new rolls being useful. Given the cost of Die at the higher levels its pretty inconsiderate.

[Vivik]

The reason that we're adjusting the specifications for save TP is that we're working to prevent weapon skills from being executed non-stop when stacking save TP, store TP, and conserve TP. As such, there are no plans to increase the effect of Miser Roll because it would cancel out the point of the save TP adjustment. Miser Roll's save TP effect will still stack with other effects and equipment.

This is a load of crap. I have lost all confidence in this development team at this point. They obviously don't think about anything before they decide to adjust it. It's seems to me they are just throwing adjustments out there to see what the player reaction would be on fixing it because they have no clue how to fix it themselves. I mean come on you don't know how your own game mechanics work?

Gimping Misers Roll is obviously the easiest thing to do, but it's not the right thing to do. The development team is just showing us how inept they have become (or always were). Take your time and do it right the first time. Put a hard cap of 50% in for any TP gained through WS, problem solved...

[Chamaan]

Everyone's so angry they're going to end up retaliating by revisiting the multihit WS TP nerf from back in the olden days. Now the first hit in a WS will also give only 1 TP. *dusts off hands* Soblem prolved.