[dev1047] Thoughts/Feedback on "Legion"

[Raesvelg]

The loot system more than anything else seems to be what will push this more towards a large-scale LS event rather than a VW-styled PUG event.

It's also notably different from a Abyssea pick-up group setting, since at least in Abyssea you have the option to kick someone who lots something they're not supposed to. For Legion, once you're in, you can lot whatever you want, for as long as you're in the zone.

So yeah. Given the fact that most people in the game now have 5+ jobs they want to have geared at all times, and often considerably more that they play on at least a casual basis, having some sort of system in place to regulate who gets what is going to be nearly a necessity.

Unless, of course, the content is very carefully scaled and a small group of 4-6 can kill just as many monsters as a group of 36. Which, to be honest, I find highly unlikely.

[Drivont]

This sounds like some top tier FOV/GOV stuff, since the Key Item is called a "Legion Tome Page"

[Tile]

This sounds like some top tier FOV/GOV stuff, since the Key Item is called a "Legion Tome Page"

more along the line of the Dioramas, you know the Ballista battle fields where the guy says hes going to cast mini on you and put you in alittle model he made.

[nomanni]

hey guys why the complaining and optimizim YOU CANT GET INTO LEGION YET ON TS . ITS GLITCHED . so i sujest u try it before knocking it

[Vagrua]

Except people work in absolutes in this XI and unless you happen to have a reason (like procs or some battlefield mechanic) to field a PUP, THF, DRK or whatever, those classes are always being told to sit back for more SAM, MNK, WAR action.

Dunno about you but even when I'm on PUP at Voidwatch im doing damage, utilizing my automaton for nukes and hitting procs when they come up. Procs get my foot in the door and allow me to occupy a slot, something old content bars you from when everyone is 'best DD jobs onry' mode for everything.

All I did before my break was PUG Voidwatch and many of the runs have far greater job variety than what existed at 75 endgame. People weren't bitching when I'd field my BLU, PUP, RNG or any of my other 'less than ideal' classes and I have procs to thank for that. I don't care for the regimented Abyssea-style procs but the opposite extreme of zero procs invites lvl75 methods once again.



We're still in speculation but if the content only requires 18 people (and isnt overly strategic) to reasonably win then this event is going to be popular in shout circles because the game will only have one true 'large-scale' event worth running. I mean it could really go either way at this point but even within the grounds of an endgame LS you have job tiering and shunning of certain classes if they aren't the ideal or have a reason to bring them.

I'd use the PUP example but I feel that RNG is a much better example of a class that at 75 got shunned even though it could do mid-tier damage. Was RNG bad? Compared to the top-tier classes haste stacked perhaps but it wasn't terrible. It didn't matter however because once people got in their heads that haste-stacking and zergs were all that mattered the job cratered in popularity and usefulness. Are people really that hungry for zerg fantasy XI again? The only reason we can zerg VWNM is fanatics drinks anyway.

Voidwatch gave RNG the ability to participate and hit a boatload of potential unique procs but the second things go back to throwing only the best DD the class will be back in the 'aw, its not a SAM' tier.

I have to agree with this. It was always my Masamune SAM for events until my linkshell started letting me come PUP to void for procs and the damage. The higher tier voids destroyed my SAM leaving it weakened most the time compared to my automaton never gaining hate while nuking.

I can imagine any other event that didn't involve procs wouldn't include other jobs like this. It would be nice to have an event that favored all jobs.

[Ravenmore]

I doubt it will bring new linkshells into the picture, but large linkshells from the past most certainly still exist today on Cerberus. ElectricMayhem, Teletubbies, KoN, and Armada can easily field the numbers for Legion unless something dramatic has changed that I don't know about. If CaptainCaveman, WhirlingWind, or the Nerfed Reshell still exist, they might be able to participate as well with some minor recruitment.

Most of these shells have survived the past year without any large group events at all. They're just a collection of people who enjoy doing events together. Most already have their own mini-groups and cliques that do lowman events, with the whole shell only gathering for large-scale NMs like Voidwatch anyways. New large-scale content only gives them something to do as a linkshell again, which is hardly a bad thing.

Besides, I can't imagine the headache it would be to try to deal with rare treasure pooled drops in a pickup setting. There's a reason people didn't do pickup Fafnirs.

It all hings on how good the point rewards are. If they are decent or are attractive niche peices people would be willing to pug it. Thats what I feel people are missing when looking at this. If the gear is on the same level as assult gear (when it was released) then pugs will do it. Now if you can only go twice a week then you will be more likely not to risk joining a pug and waiting for your LS to run.

[Alhanelem]

I can imagine any other event that didn't involve procs wouldn't include other jobs like this. It would be nice to have an event that favored all jobs.

You don't need procs to include other jobs. You need those other jobs to simply be able to perform at the level of the others. You just got lucky that someone would let you come PUP- most linkshells wouldn't do it even for the procs. You can only have 18 out of 20 jobs maximum anyway, so three guesses which ones get left out the most?

They should need to add a contrived, artificial battle mechanic to get other jobs included. Those jobs should be included because of the things they are capable of, not because someone said "OK, there's a 10% chance you're going to need Stringing Pummel to get more loot. Bring more PUPs!"

[Khajit]

I don't like the size of it at all. It encourages large scale linkshells. It puts all but about 1( can be higher due to mules/friends) at the mercy of what could be very well an absolute twat. That's not getting into the old rule of the more people you have the more likely there is a complete buffoon who will completely fuck everything up via stupidity.

I liked how VW gave you an individual chest but hated the rest of their loot implementation.(getting drops you already had and cant give it to anyone, 0.00000000000001% drop rates and logs everywhere else) They could have found a nice medium and made it so that anything not taken out of a personal chest goes into a groupwide lootpool when the chest despawns.

[saevel]

I have to agree with this. It was always my Masamune SAM for events until my linkshell started letting me come PUP to void for procs and the damage. The higher tier voids destroyed my SAM leaving it weakened most the time compared to my automaton never gaining hate while nuking.

I can imagine any other event that didn't involve procs wouldn't include other jobs like this. It would be nice to have an event that favored all jobs.

I've said it before, but there currently are only four really *broke* jobs in FFXI right now. SMN, PUP, BST and RDM. For your LS the choice is between a powerful DD (Masa SAM) vs a broken pet job (PUP), unless there is an absolute requirement for the PUP its not much of a decision. And if you for one second try to pump up your PUP vs a fully geared Emp SAM ~outside~ of abyssea, then your delusional. Until SE significantly overhauls the pet systems, all pet jobs are going to be severely handicapped in this game.

Would your LS of cared if instead of PUP vs Masa SAM it was Emp DRG vs Emp SAM, or Emp SAM vs Emp WAR? Assuming procs were not in the equation then they wouldn't of given a rats a$$. Their answer would of been "come on your best geared DD job", which would leave the choice up to you. This game only discriminates vs really broken jobs because well, their broken and high levels of skill and gear can only do so much for a broken job. As a career RDM I've experienced this, no matter what gear I get or what merits / food / subs I choose, there is an absolute cap on what I can do with my enfeebling / nuking / healing / melee and those caps are lower then what nearly every other job in the game can do.

[wish12oz]

I've said it before, but there currently are only four really *broke* jobs in FFXI right now. SMN, PUP, BST and RDM. For your LS the choice is between a powerful DD (Masa SAM) vs a broken pet job (PUP), unless there is an absolute requirement for the PUP its not much of a decision. And if you for one second try to pump up your PUP vs a fully geared Emp SAM ~outside~ of abyssea, then your delusional. Until SE significantly overhauls the pet systems, all pet jobs are going to be severely handicapped in this game.

Would your LS of cared if instead of PUP vs Masa SAM it was Emp DRG vs Emp SAM, or Emp SAM vs Emp WAR? Assuming procs were not in the equation then they wouldn't of given a rats a$$. Their answer would of been "come on your best geared DD job", which would leave the choice up to you. This game only discriminates vs really broken jobs because well, their broken and high levels of skill and gear can only do so much for a broken job. As a career RDM I've experienced this, no matter what gear I get or what merits / food / subs I choose, there is an absolute cap on what I can do with my enfeebling / nuking / healing / melee and those caps are lower then what nearly every other job in the game can do.

I just saw about 8 posts from you, and you included they're and you're as their and your in every one of them. It makes me not care at all what you have to say, and think you have no idea what you're talking about.